How The F*#% Do I Model This? - Reply for help with specific shapes - (Post attempt before asking)

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  • cromadbomber
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    cromadbomber polycounter lvl 5
    boski_miszczu You may want to add one more inner loop so it follows the shape of your object. The way how are you going to connect it doesn't really matter since it is a flat surface. But for lowpoly you may want to remove unnecessary edges.
  • mobpapst
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    mobpapst polycounter lvl 4
    Hey guys,

    i'm asking myself how to tackle this piece here. any ideas how to get these carzy forms the best way?



  • gfelton
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    gfelton polycounter lvl 4
    mobpapst said:
    -snip-

    As is customary, show us what kind of progress or attempt you have made with this piece.
  • wirrexx
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    wirrexx polycounter lvl 7
    mobpapst said:
    Hey guys,

    i'm asking myself how to tackle this piece here. any ideas how to get these carzy forms the best way?



    block it out, build the geometry as simple as possibles, without booleans, just seperate pieces. 
  • mobpapst
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    mobpapst polycounter lvl 4
    wirrexx said:
    block it out, build the geometry as simple as possibles, without booleans, just seperate pieces. 
    Hey there and thanks for your reply. I think this peace will need a lot of booleans if i want to let it look right even when i want to use it for first person
  • Pedro Amorim
    the best way to do that object is to just do it.
  • perna
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    perna ngon master
    Mob: Your question is too vague and not technical. In the context of this thread you don't model an "object", you model individual shapes. Which individual shape are you having issues with and what exactly is your issue with that shape?

    @wirrexx  says to avoid booleans not for the final mesh, but for the blockout, which is not just good advice but an absolute must. Always make a high-quality blockout before bothering with transitions and edge control.
  • dunenkoff
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    dunenkoff vertex
    Hi guys,

    I decided to up my hardsurface skills (but only after reading the entire thread).





    How did I do and what I can do better?
  • [Deleted User]
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    [Deleted User] insane polycounter
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  • dunenkoff
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    dunenkoff vertex
    the edges in the sub-d are really sharp - you might want to experiment and compare bakes after slightly softening the edge transitions so more info bakes into the maps.  you can think of it like... a razor sharp edge will be one pixel in the normal map - but something with a nicer roll will have more pixels baked out to describe the edge.  And it will mip down nicer.
    I was trying to recreate the original shape which is part plastic part pressed metal with sharp edges, but yeah, it doesn't look good.

    EDIT: Keyshot render

  • Finnn
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    Finnn polycounter lvl 2
    How do I model a circular shape around a 4 corner shape around a circular shape? I get overlapping face. Tried multiple ways but nothing worked, help please :)




  • perna
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    perna ngon master
    @FinnIsengardt  : Make the cylinders actual cylinders (12- or 16-sided) instead of spending lots of time and effort putting together awkward geometry in an effort to derive them from boxes.

    Talking of which, why do you choose that approach? It's slow, painful, subdivides poorly and carries no apparent benefits. Is this done following a tutorial or something?


  • Finnn
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    Finnn polycounter lvl 2
    ok I will try it that way. No I was experimenting, Im new to modelling but trying my best.

  • perna
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    perna ngon master
    @FinnIsengardt , that's cool. My suggestion is don't over-think things.

    Do what makes sense to you on a rational level. For example, if a shape is meant to be round, make it round, not square. Don't blindly follow any advice you're given and you'll avoid a lot of confusion.


    Below:
    1. Base mesh. 12 segments for the cylinder divided by four sides of the rectangle = 3, which is exactly how many polygons we need for control loops for the rectangular part.
    2. Here control loops are added. In this case it's done automatically with Quad Chamfer and a Vertex Weld modifier.
    3. Sub-divided wireframe.
    4. Sans wireframe.
    16 sides might be a cleaner choice as maintaining center lines is often important. You'd just route the 4 extra cylinder edges through the center of the rectangular shapes.




  • MaxTheModeller
    Hello, i'm new here. I would like to ask anyone for a way to solve this.

    As seen in the image 1 i don't get perfectly rounded shape in the border, and in the middle of the shape i get hard edges, which i don't want, i want hard edges in the extrude but in everywhere else i want it to be soft. Hope somebody can help me. I'm really new to this. Thanks for your attention. The image 2 shows my wireframe.
  • Finnn
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    Finnn polycounter lvl 2
    perna said:
    @FinnIsengardt , that's cool. My suggestion is don't over-think things.

    Do what makes sense to you on a rational level. For example, if a shape is meant to be round, make it round, not square. Don't blindly follow any advice you're given and you'll avoid a lot of confusion.


    Below:
    1. Base mesh. 12 segments for the cylinder divided by four sides of the rectangle = 3, which is exactly how many polygons we need for control loops for the rectangular part.
    2. Here control loops are added. In this case it's done automatically with Quad Chamfer and a Vertex Weld modifier.
    3. Sub-divided wireframe.
    4. Sans wireframe.
    16 sides might be a cleaner choice as maintaining center lines is often important. You'd just route the 4 extra cylinder edges through the center of the rectangular shapes.





    Thank you for your detailed answer, I managed to do this with 12 and 16 segments. Thanks for your adviive



    I have one more question!

    In my first post you can see the original piece. Do you think these screws are extra geometry or just modelled in one piece?
  • perna
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    perna ngon master
    @FinnIsengardt
    Nice work! On your question: what would be your approach to answering it yourself? If you were to rely on common sense and logical thinking as opposed to obscure "rules" of 3d art. Weigh pros and cons and so on.

    @MaxTheModeller
    In order to make a surface with constant curvature you need both space and angle between all the elements to be equal. Currently some of the elements break with this rule, therefore you have hard angles instead of a smooth curve.

  • NoRank
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    NoRank triangle
    @FinnIsengardt If it's a separated piece in real life, then there's no need to make it as one piece in 3d as well.
    You can do it as one piece, but it would take just too much geometry and it would be harder for no good reason (at least IMO).

    In this piece you're showing I'd actually model those white metal pieces as separated pieces.
  • Finnn
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    Finnn polycounter lvl 2
    I actually thought of modelling it one piece, because in case of seperated approach I'd have to make a hole to fit the extra piece in anyway. Then I'd just inset and extrude it out again.
    On the other hand the geometry gets more complex, so maybe making it seperate would be the easiere approach.

    I think I'll just do both ways and then see on my own which workflow is best :P
  • iacdxb
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    iacdxb polycounter lvl 2
    Hi,
    I was trying "Sachet" modeling but not finding a nice process.
    Anyone know any tutorial or its process. Thanks.
     

  • [Deleted User]
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    [Deleted User] insane polycounter
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  • NoRank
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    NoRank triangle
    It's almost a plane with a texture '-'
  • iacdxb
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    iacdxb polycounter lvl 2
    Yes... here is my attempt. Inner part I did with noise deformer to make bumpy but as reference... I think this is manually.

     
  • perna
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    perna ngon master
    @iacdxb
    Let boil for ten minutes. If you're feeling creative add some halal chicken.
  • Thanez
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    Thanez polycounter lvl 4
    @iacdxb ;You're on the right track, just experiment with it. I would model it clean, UV it, then use a cloth sim or sculpt it by hand, or do a displacement map with a cloth height map for quick iterations. 
  • iacdxb
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    iacdxb polycounter lvl 2
    @ Thanez; thanks for the update.

    ...
  • anaho
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    anaho polycounter lvl 6
    wirrexx said:
    mobpapst said:
    Hey guys,

    i'm asking myself how to tackle this piece here. any ideas how to get these carzy forms the best way?



    block it out, build the geometry as simple as possibles, without booleans, just seperate pieces. 
    I hate to admit that even after years of modeling I would not know where to start easy shapes like the detached parts/knobs aside.
    There is very little information on doing blockouts with a boolean workflow in mind effiecently on the net. In result people start hacking away at the model most of the time making their lifes harder. If anyone knows a good tutorial on how to do parametric blockouts on complex objects like this, please post them. Perna once posted this http://polycount.com/discussion/106272/perplexed-still-on-low-high-poly-manipulation/p1 but to be honest I never understood what was really going on in these pictures,

  • RashedAlmetrami
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    RashedAlmetrami polycounter lvl 5
    Hey guys, been trying to model this Muzzle-break for a while now, all of which have given me pretty meh results. I'm trying to Boolean out the holes using a shape that has a slight angle to it so it recreates the slant indicated below.  The topology it leaves is hard to re-work and just generally doesn't look too good. Maybe there's a better way to approach this?

    My attempt:


    As you can see it don't look too great. Any ideas or tips on how to make something like this?

    Thanks!

  • perna
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    perna ngon master
    Rashed, if you want the shape of the yellow part, just tweak your boolean operator until it looks right as you're going the right direction. Just a heads up - none of the concept images match up with each other, and your mesh doesn't match up with any of them. It looks like the problem here is unrelated to booleans or any mesh-technical issues but is simply about reading references correctly. Can't you find a blueprint or other orthogonal images for this?
  • RashedAlmetrami
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    RashedAlmetrami polycounter lvl 5
    @perna I have a blueprint for the Panzer IV but there are a lot of versions of the Panzer IV muzzle so I'm only using the BP as a guide. I tweaked about with the topology of the boolean operator and this is my result. 


  • philipp.bogdanovskiy
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    philipp.bogdanovskiy polycounter lvl 4
    somedoggy said:
    I wanted to push myself and so made this challenge for myself and to share with others:

    First paragraph is my own challenge. The second bit should be super easy but may present a good beginner's challenge.

    Now I can do the geometry, a bit of touch up, and get it shading just fine. But I want to do it procedurally and perfectionist. Clean enough to pass as CAD or go home. I've searched pretty extensively through here, pinterest, perna's gdrive, etc, and could not find anything really quite matching this challenge. This is more a high level problem ensuring the modeling tools respect the desired curvature perfectly, not an issue of not knowing the geometry flow needed.

    Here's my first attempt, which I knew wouldn't be what I want, but helps explain why it's hard:

    The problem areas are -
    a) Creating support loops which respect shape 1's curvature, while keeping shape 2's profile constant.
    b) Drew this arrow a bit wrong. It should be nudged to the right some. Shape 2's extrusion must be constant and form/curvature respecting so the chamfering applied afterwards is also perfect.
    c) Inside dips inward due to insetting a curved surface.

    These are essentially the same issue explained with "c": Getting the curvature of 1, while keeping the form of 2. I think this is a pretty cool and difficult challenge and hope others are interested in tackling it or offering some thoughts!
    Why not to bend, and than cap it? Otherwise crease.
  • somedoggy
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    somedoggy greentooth
    Because to support the shape correctly you need equidistant support geo. Bending the bottom capsule after adding that support geo stretches it. Insetting after the bend to create the support geo doesn't work either because it doesn't maintain integrity of the flat capsule's flat surface. Quad chamfer after bending might work but I didn't have it at the time.
  • Brody999999
    Hi Guys,
    Im Usiny Maya 2016 & moddeling a character, following a tutorial & it just sais "Create Locators" it doesnt show how, was hoping for some hints
  • GuanAndOnly
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    GuanAndOnly polycounter lvl 3
    somedoggy said:
    Because to support the shape correctly you need equidistant support geo. Bending the bottom capsule after adding that support geo stretches it. Insetting after the bend to create the support geo doesn't work either because it doesn't maintain integrity of the flat capsule's flat surface. Quad chamfer after bending might work but I didn't have it at the time.
    I feel like I'm completely missing the point of the challenge, but isn't it just an extrusion straight out from the primary capsule and a bevel at the connecting ring? 
  • somedoggy
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    somedoggy greentooth
    That's what I did, but couldn't replicate the accuracy I desired. I was looking for the smoothness of the NDO example.
  • Callisto
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    Callisto vertex
    Hello guys,
    I am kinda beginner, trying to ride Blender. Could you please give me some tips how to make those holes? I've tried to make them out of quads, which I placed in the right order, but it didn't work well. I have to model a damn lot of different stuff like that with different amount of holes all the sizes. I guess, I should use something other than playing around the geometry of the primitives? Please, give me some direction to dig.
  • perna
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    perna ngon master
    @Callisto,

    You ask for help, but you don't describe the problem you have, the nature of the technical difficulties you're running into, or show your failed attempts, meaning you expect whoever helps you (for free) to use their spare time to exhaustively cover the entire process.

    The general rule here is that low-effort questions tend to receive low-effort answers.
  • [Deleted User]
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    [Deleted User] insane polycounter
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  • Filip5
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    Filip5 polycounter lvl 3
    Hey guys, how do I make these edges hard ? Adding a loop also affects circle part, for which I am going to use turbosmooth. Just can't get this working. I want to make it a brick with two holes in it.


  • perna
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    perna ngon master
  • Filip5
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    Filip5 polycounter lvl 3
    @perna Thanks, it worked !
  • Michael Knubben
    I considered warning Perna for enabling such a lazy post.
  • perna
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    perna ngon master
    lolel I try not to be an asshole for once and see what happens

    I'll take my temporary ban like a men
  • [Deleted User]
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    [Deleted User] insane polycounter
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  • perna
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    perna ngon master
    @Filip5

    I'm back, and below is the reason I was banned. The idea is that this is fundamental knowledge and I encouraged a low-effort post.




  • Pedro Amorim
    banned
  • GuanAndOnly
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    GuanAndOnly polycounter lvl 3
    Hey guys, sorry if this is the wrong place to ask but I'm trying to figure out using gras/leaf cards.
    I'm reading Berker Siino's breakdown here: https://80.lv/articles/unreal-engine-4-stylized-rendering-workflow/
    From my understanding it's rendering planes onto a sheet to use as textures, and you uv cards onto the right places.
    I've tried doing that with some primitives:

    Now my question is, what is a power of 2 plane, and would (or could) I get the same results purely by painting these patches directly in photoshop or something and cutting them out afterwards? Or is there something special about baking it? :0
  • supaclueless
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    supaclueless polycounter lvl 7
    @GuanAndOnly ; when someone says power of 2 (in regards to textures, plane meshes size, etc), it usually means following the scale of units of numbers on the power of 2 (IE: 2, 4, 8, 16, 32, 64, 128, 256, 512, 1024, 2048, 4096, so on so forth). I am not well-versed enough in engine design for utilizing textures but the short hand is most game engines use ^2 resolution sizes for textures (sometimes 1/2 size on vertical, IE: (1024,512). But is mostly commonly (512,512)(1024,1024), etc etc.
  • GuanAndOnly
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    GuanAndOnly polycounter lvl 3
    @GuanAndOnly ; when someone says power of 2 (in regards to textures, plane meshes size, etc), it usually means following the scale of units of numbers on the power of 2 (IE: 2, 4, 8, 16, 32, 64, 128, 256, 512, 1024, 2048, 4096, so on so forth). I am not well-versed enough in engine design for utilizing textures but the short hand is most game engines use ^2 resolution sizes for textures (sometimes 1/2 size on vertical, IE: (1024,512). But is mostly commonly (512,512)(1024,1024), etc etc.
    Oh dang, thanks for that! I'm familiar with typical texture resolutions and whatnot, but I've never heard the term.
    Cheers!
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