Trying to learn topology, but can't find a shape quite like this for a reference. My messy attempt is in the background, but here's a quick shot on one side to see exactly what I'm trying to go for.
Also, could the top of that side edge do with less vertices, while keeping it as smooth? Optimal amount of verts is a must for game props, so learning that too would be nice as well.
i don't really understand the problem is this for your lowpoly or do you want to model your highpoly ? to get rid of the shading issues on the side you need to either harden the edge between the top and the side, or you need to create a supportedge on the side, or bevel the edge
@Markmars M8 there is no way to discern what you're trying to achieve when it comes to the first 'error'. If you don't want the sharp edge, remove those edgeloops on either side of it. The second one is ez, just add an edgeloop below that pinchy edge.
What would be your approach to model that shape? i did several of them, but just 2 didn't end up looking like garbage, and one of them has quite a messy topology.
Edit: Page 154 has something similar to that, don't know why i was overcomplicating this thing, life is hard when you are retarded.
Hey guys, I wonder whats the best way to model hull of a ship. I did some inner parts to help me achieve the shape, but I am not really sure how to do this. I tried splines but it didn't go well, nor extruding the plane , so I got stuck on this.
ure being like wayy too hard on yourself, i think what uve got is fine and you also have to consider that this piece is really small and the shape just has to be right, depending on the final res of the textures youll be baking to it might not even be possible to see smoothing errors, and even then, this piece rlly doesn't take up that much screen space so i think ure g
Hey guys, I wonder whats the best way to model hull of a ship. I did some inner parts to help me achieve the shape, but I am not really sure how to do this. I tried splines but it didn't go well, nor extruding the plane , so I got stuck on this.
Alright, tried to model it again, but its ugly as hell...
Hey guys, I'm following a grenade tutorial and have come across a problem in a hard edge when subdividing:
I'm using 3DS Max with the quad chamfer modifier in order to get the hard edge. If I decrease the value, the black pinch goes away but then I am left with a soft edge. This is the non-turbo-smoothed/non-chamfered version:
I tried having an edge loop go from the circled vertice out to the top-right of the picture but that gives me a hard edge in that direction shown here:
Is there any way to avoid a pinch without smoothing out the high poly in Zbrush? Why am I getting the pinch in this case? Should the supporting edge pull in the opposite direction as a counter-balance? IE if the bottom edge is pulling South East, the top edge should be angled North West? I know 5+ edges coming out of a vert should also be avoided. Any help would be very much appreciated guys.
If something is wrong, correct it please. Good luck!
Thanks for that. It definitely is better but because the edge closing to the camera is a smooth curve I get a slight hardened edge going to the left. It is definitely better. I think using the quad chamfer on a section like this is too heavy and just too general. Anyway to maintain the curve and eliminate the slight hard edge?
I'm using 3DS Max with the quad chamfer modifier in order to get the hard edge. If I decrease the value, the black pinch goes away but then I am left with a soft edge. This is the non-turbo-smoothed/non-chamfered version:https://us.v-cdn.net/5021068/uploads/editor/65/709cl5b1qm5e.jpg
Is there any way to avoid a pinch without smoothing out the high poly in Zbrush? Why am I getting the pinch in this case? Should the supporting edge pull in the opposite direction as a counter-balance? IE if the bottom edge is pulling South East, the top edge should be angled North West? I know 5+ edges coming out of a vert should also be avoided. Any help would be very much appreciated guys.
Hello gentlemen. I have a problem i cannot solve for a very long time already. The point is when you do chamfer between perpendicular faces 3ds Max is keeping all edges parrallel, but when it comes to an angle it starts to bring those edges together. Is there any way to keep them parallel? Thank you in advance!
Many thanks Markmars! I really appreciate your help on that. Now I am using the combination of making planar and snapping, instead of simple scaling, to perform the same action, but the idea is all yours!
However, I guess parallel-edge chamfering is much more suitable for dozens of situations, so they coulda implement it already. ☺️
Took the last 2 days to try out multiple models that were shown here and on pinterest So i wanted to say thanks for all the great tips, had a blast trying out all the different Models If anyone wants some of them feel free, it's only fair to give back a bit. model
Many thanks Markmars! I really appreciate your help on that. Now I am using the combination of making planar and snapping, instead of simple scaling, to perform the same action, but the idea is all yours!
However, I guess parallel-edge chamfering is much more suitable for dozens of situations, so they coulda implement it already. ☺️
It doesn't help you as a max user but Maya has a force parallel setting in its bevel ui. It might be worth checking that out if you have access to it to see if that does what you want.
Any particular reason you are trying to keep it a quad mesh?
Dont be afraid to use Ngons, if you understand how they subdivide. (If you don't you can always quickly do a smoothed preview and inspect the wireframe.)
If you are worried about wobbly shading because of the Ngons, you can always add another edgeloop to use as a 'stress absorption buffer' for lack of better words.
Example, notice how the green edge loops still maintain their shape when sub divided. The extra 'Buffer' edgeloops is where all the distortion and what not is happening now instead. So you basically offset the 'stress' of the uneven geo by and edgeloop.
In the example above I tried to make the 'buffer' area as dirty as possible just to illustrate my point. Also this quick and dirty trick most of the time will only work with flat surfaces. Which should work fine with your 'problem' areas as they are flat as well.
Any particular reason you are trying to keep it a quad mesh?
Dont be afraid to use Ngons, if you understand how they subdivide. (If you don't you can always quickly do a smoothed preview and inspect the wireframe.)
If you are worried about wobbly shading because of the Ngons, you can always add another edgeloop to use as a 'stress absorption buffer' for lack of better words.
Example, notice how the green edge loops still maintain their shape when sub divided. The extra 'Buffer' edgeloops is where all the distortion and what not is happening now instead. So you basically offset the 'stress' of the uneven geo by and edgeloop.
In the example above I tried to make the 'buffer' area as dirty as possible just to illustrate my point. Also this quick and dirty trick most of the time will only work with flat surfaces. Which should work fine with your 'problem' areas as they are flat as well.
Thx. Great tip!. The only reason I want to have a clear topo because I want to include it in my portfolio.
@perna Maybe I'm forgetting something obvious, but how do you deal with small areas where control loops may pinch or go crazy? I've seen you use a vertex weld mod on top which sometimes does the job, but other times that won't do it; or perhaps it'll start welding unwanted stuff.
@Filip5 You should start with the large shapes, and after nailing those down do large details, then smaller details. For fixing tho if you hide every other rib, and use the remaining ribs to shape the hull you should have an easier time getting the flow of it correct. Turbosmooth the hull 1x, then unhide the hidden ribs and size them appropriately.
I wasn't really asking about any shape in particular Thanez, just more about per's workflow. But sure, why not, here's an example. Keep in mind my end goal isn't to achieve smooth bevels and rounded corners, but how far we can get to those via automatic means.
@perna That looks cool. Thank you for the reply. Lately I have been using Maya's creases + GoZ to import stuff into Zbrush. Using this method you can have really clean geo on the base mesh aswel and later on you can use that same mesh as the lowpoly so there is no much retopo involved.
@perna - I'm wondering how did you tackle a mesh with varying detail size, for example a rifling on a barrel of a gun, it needs a tiny bit of chamfer amount otherwise it'll overlap eachother, but on the other hand, you need a larger chamfer width on different area of that barrel, on the same mesh, with a bigger detail, smoother transition?
What I did normally was just cut in support loop to the smaller detail area and put all of them into one smoothing group so it won't affected by the chamfer mod, but it required me to cut in the support loop like an era before quadchamfer came in..
Exactly, this is the kind of problem I was trying, and maybe failed, to illustrate in my previous image. The auto chamfer way works great for general, big shapes; but most of the times smaller details won't smooth correctly. For instance, if you compare the left and right shapes, AFAIK you won't be able to get 1 and 2, simultaneosly, to look like its left counterpart by only applying the automatic chamfer. You say "you have to leave enough room", and I'd be interested in hearing your workarounds, or general no-nos from you on which type of areas give you, personally, trouble when using this method.
I mean, sometimes just making the model differently is not a solution: the client wants it exactly like that. And what I end up doing is what Revel said: just DIY and apply one SG to that area so that the chamfer stays the f out from that.
@perna - I'm wondering how did you tackle a mesh with varying detail size, for example a rifling on a barrel of a gun, it needs a tiny bit of chamfer amount otherwise it'll overlap eachother, but on the other hand, you need a larger chamfer width on different area of that barrel, on the same mesh, with a bigger detail, smoother transition?
What I did normally was just cut in support loop to the smaller detail area and put all of them into one smoothing group so it won't affected by the chamfer mod, but it required me to cut in the support loop like an era before quadchamfer came in..
I do the exact same thing, when quadchamfer shows limitations I use traditional tools all in one SG
what you guys should always do is maybe try blocking the shape out with simple geo, and when you have the shapes, just use smooth by smoothing groups to get extra polygons for extra detail.
Hello, I'm trying to mesh, and I'm sure it's not good. can you tell me if the mesh is correct. If it is not the case, would have a possibility to show me by image. thank you.
Replies
Also, could the top of that side edge do with less vertices, while keeping it as smooth? Optimal amount of verts is a must for game props, so learning that too would be nice as well.
is this for your lowpoly or do you want to model your highpoly ?
to get rid of the shading issues on the side you need to either harden the edge between the top and the side, or you need to create a supportedge on the side, or bevel the edge
or are you trying to connect all the pieces ?
The second one is ez, just add an edgeloop below that pinchy edge.
Edit: Page 154 has something similar to that, don't know why i was overcomplicating this thing, life is hard when you are retarded.
ure being like wayy too hard on yourself, i think what uve got is fine and you also have to consider that this piece is really small and the shape just has to be right, depending on the final res of the textures youll be baking to it might not even be possible to see smoothing errors, and even then, this piece rlly doesn't take up that much screen space so i think ure g
for such parts typically use normal map.
Alright, tried to model it again, but its ugly as hell...
I'm using 3DS Max with the quad chamfer modifier in order to get the hard edge. If I decrease the value, the black pinch goes away but then I am left with a soft edge. This is the non-turbo-smoothed/non-chamfered version:
I tried having an edge loop go from the circled vertice out to the top-right of the picture but that gives me a hard edge in that direction shown here:
Is there any way to avoid a pinch without smoothing out the high poly in Zbrush? Why am I getting the pinch in this case? Should the supporting edge pull in the opposite direction as a counter-balance? IE if the bottom edge is pulling South East, the top edge should be angled North West? I know 5+ edges coming out of a vert should also be avoided. Any help would be very much appreciated guys.
Maybe
Good luck!
I saw this topic.
http://polycount.com/discussion/comment/2574718#Comment_2574718
http://polycount.com/discussion/comment/2594408/#Comment_2594408
Should work fine for your needs.
Does the topology look ok to you guys?
If you have any questions
Hi!
Thanks for the valuable lesson!
However, I guess parallel-edge chamfering is much more suitable for dozens of situations, so they coulda implement it already. ☺️
I am glad that this helps!
Good luck!
So i wanted to say thanks for all the great tips, had a blast trying out all the different Models
If anyone wants some of them feel free, it's only fair to give back a bit.
model
http://wiki.polycount.com/wiki/Subd#Tips_.26_Tricks
Any particular reason you are trying to keep it a quad mesh?
Dont be afraid to use Ngons, if you understand how they subdivide. (If you don't you can always quickly do a smoothed preview and inspect the wireframe.)
If you are worried about wobbly shading because of the Ngons, you can always add another edgeloop to use as a 'stress absorption buffer' for lack of better words.
Example, notice how the green edge loops still maintain their shape when sub divided.
The extra 'Buffer' edgeloops is where all the distortion and what not is happening now instead. So you basically offset the 'stress' of the uneven geo by and edgeloop.
In the example above I tried to make the 'buffer' area as dirty as possible just to illustrate my point.
Also this quick and dirty trick most of the time will only work with flat surfaces.
Which should work fine with your 'problem' areas as they are flat as well.
Maybe I'm forgetting something obvious, but how do you deal with small areas where control loops may pinch or go crazy? I've seen you use a vertex weld mod on top which sometimes does the job, but other times that won't do it; or perhaps it'll start welding unwanted stuff.
Quadchamfer
What I did normally was just cut in support loop to the smaller detail area and put all of them into one smoothing group so it won't affected by the chamfer mod, but it required me to cut in the support loop like an era before quadchamfer came in..
I mean, sometimes just making the model differently is not a solution: the client wants it exactly like that. And what I end up doing is what Revel said: just DIY and apply one SG to that area so that the chamfer stays the f out from that.
I do the exact same thing, when quadchamfer shows limitations I use traditional tools all in one SG
Thank you very much in advance!