I love that we are getting closer to seeing how the smoke monster takes people to the temple where they get turned into Others... like Rouseau's fellow scientists did, like Locke tried to allow the monster to do waaay back in season1 even...
Really Brilliant stuff this season, can't wait for the finale!
I love how Hurley has always been and continues to be 'our' voice on the show. He has always been the character to say the most obvious thing, that the audience is thinking. Kudos to the writers for having a character like that.
People here are saying it was a filler episode, but I think towards the end it actually turned out to be one of the most important episodes in the entire show so far. I think that act of kindness from Sawyer and Kate will come back to them somehow. I am now curious to know who Illy and Charles are. The Others leaders before Richard? Either way, superb episode. That conversation on the porch between Kate and Juliette was so so good. You just knew what was coming from the stern look on her face. So, Juliette is kind of more responsible for the Others wiping out the Dharma then we thought. But doesn't she have to dissapear before the Others bring her on the island the first time? So she probably ends up in the pit.
Doh, I forgot about mentioning that. They mention Charles, which means Widmore WAS in charge before Ben. It sounds like Richard is never in charge... just forever the assistant.
this is the same type of 'paradox' (if one can call it that) that surrounds the compass given to Alpert/Locke. Where did it come from originally? If Locke gave it to Richard in the past and Richard gave it to Locke in the future, Locke then gave it to Richard <--- cycle. This is one of those self-contained loops that pops up again and again in Lost (especially in season 5). As someone pointed out (on an earlier post) it is actually the OPPOSITE of a paradox - situations/events are set up by time travel rather than unraveled by time travel.
Maybe they don't forget when they're turned. I think Ben's case is perhaps unique, as he's dying. Perhaps it takes extra voodoo to bring him back or something.
I'm still interested in seeing what's going to happen with people split on different time lines. It looks like the plane survivors have landed in a much more distant future, judging by the ragged airfield, as well as New Otherton being completely overgrown.
Looks like Ben might meet his end next week? At the very least, it looks like we'll get to see old smokey again.
Maybe she did forget, but she was filled in as to who he was post-othering. Yeah I never noticed the fact that Ben and Locke seem to have been dropped at least somewhere in the 2010's...should be really interesting to see why.
Nah , Alex was Jacob, the Smoke Monster is the guardian of Anubis' land of the dead.. well maybe.
Point being, Smokey spared Ben for the same reason he always does, because the person being judged felt guilty and wanted forgiveness. Eko was killed because he dared to decide his own sense of morality and proved himself to not be a man of faith.
I'm not sure if I spuriously espoused my notion about the Island being a bit like Eden, those that look on the island with faith and trust in a power above themselves are spared, those that don't are crushed. Thats why John has received more gifts than the others because he has already suffered more than the rest already and still looks on the world with the eyes of love and trusts in a purpose greater than himself to guide him.
Well at least that's what I've always felt is the underlying allegory of the show, the more we go forward though, the more it looks like its more than allegory to me.
Great episode. Some great dialogue between Ben and Locke. Bummer that Ben didn't get to kill Penny though.
Daaark, if you could not give away details of the coming weeks LOST episode in massive fucking multicoloured letters, I would sure appreciate it. Those irritating videos are bad enough.
I thought that was a pretty damn good episode. Charles Widmore has been explained now. Ben's injuries were not answered. The smoke monster made an appearance. We learned how Ben got Alex, and how Russo lost her. Great stuff...
It appears that several of you were right about Ben getting roughed up while trying to kill Penny. I don't know that any of us predicted who/why though, but good work
Obviously the island mysteries have existed much longer than the dharma initiative, and appears to be connected to ancient Egyptian culture, which again, connects the giant 4 toed statue. I want them to spend more time in that temple now
I agree with you guys. Jacob is an additional being/spirit/soul/god on the island and he takes the form of other people. I don't think he's the smoke monster. I think him and the smoke monster either work together, or they are battling it out on the island. The way that the smoke monster went away, then Alex appears, makes me think that Jacob wasn't happy that the smoke monster let him live. So that's why he was so angry when he warned Ben not to harm John. That was definitely not Alex though, based on her strength when she held Ben against the wall.
You may be right about Richard and Jacob being the same. Now that I think of it, it did seem like they kept switching the camera to Richard whenever someone mentions what Jacob said (like when Ben and Charles were arguing about Alex).
Damn, it's been a while since I've checked on the web clues. I thought the show had given up on these online games, due to hacking and story conflicts. Apparently they've been at it again though: http://www.ajiraairways.com/
I thought the scene with Rousseau was weak, primarily because we really don't know why they even bothered her in the first place. I am really itching to find out more about Richard, and the actual temple, seeing as what we have seen so far is only the outer wall.
And what is in that crate the new people were so concerned about? Have they been turned by the others somehow? Seems so, as they were going on about the statue.
I don't think Lost has ever been this consistantly good.
OH, yeah, I forgot about that. Them asking that cryptic crap about the shadow of the statue. It reminds me of Rousseau's group and how they acted after smoky got to them.
Maybe the crate has John's dad in it...again.
Anyone notice how Alex moved in a bizarre way? Reminds me how Ethan's movements looked when Jack got in a fight with him and Ethan leaned over him, telling him not to follow. The way he leaned over was similar. He sort of bended at the hips but kept his back very straight. He also had that superior strength that Alex/Jacob exhibited.
I thought the comping in the Smoke Monster was weak though. There should have been more of a diffusion on the imagery Ben was being shown; it looked a bit crappy and sharp how they did it in the end.
I think him and the smoke monster either work together, or they are battling it out on the island. The way that the smoke monster went away, then Alex appears, makes me think that Jacob wasn't happy that the smoke monster let him live. So that's why he was so angry when he warned Ben not to harm John. That was definitely not Alex though, based on her strength when she held Ben against the wall.
The way I see it, the smoke monster judges you in a very 'black and white' way.
I see him as the protector of Jacob and possibly similar to Cerebus as a protector of the underworld. It does what it does and does it fairly.
It could be that Jacob does have personal morals and beliefs like we do, thus why he seemed a bit frustrated when smokey didn't kill Ben.
*edit* someone on another forum brought up that the other passengers might be working for Charles Whidmore.
what did that bounty hunter girl say to the pilot? What Statue>?
Anubis statue. I'm wondering if the statue is the temple? Or more likely just the remains of the statue is the temple.
I'm thinking the shadow of the temple is where Ben was, under the temple in the shadows. I think the three women were all working for charles, who is trying to use smokey for something.
Its not a statue of anubis I don't think, it is a statue of one of the egyptian goddesses of fertility. It even has the same hat. Although seeing a 60 foot tall statue of a hippo is going to be a little weird. Explains why Juliette was able to deliver Ethan but after the statue was destroyed, all the other babies died.
Good call on the new losties working for Charles. If that is the case, their password interests me. Also so does the contents of that crate.
How can Jacob be the guy we met who lives in the tent if he exists in the same time? Or is that guy dead by the time Ben brings Alex back to the others camp? Because Jacob is definitely mentioned. Could be.
Also is the guy who lives in the tent that guy from Blade Runner?
what it seemed like to me was that the ppl who were protecting the crate were acolytes of some sort. Maybe it was their mission to find the island because they are part of some super secret egyptian god worshipping cult. And while I'm on a rant..wtf, is the smoke monster the good guy in this story?
i'm thinking jacob is anubis, he can take the form of the dead to talk to people, those that have had a near death experience, like locke and ben, can talk to his spirit, and a few special cases like hurley and miles can see and hear him too.
Seems so. Nice twist eh. I would describe it more as impartial though; it just judges people on their past deeds. I remember Locke saying when he looked at it he saw the most beautiful thing he ever saw though...what could he possibly have seen? His life's been shit!
Seems so. Nice twist eh. I would describe it more as impartial though; it just judges people on their past deeds. I remember Locke saying when he looked at it he saw the most beautiful thing he ever saw though...what could he possibly have seen? His life's been shit!
I'm assuming a nice pair of DD's
the way they acted at the end of the episode was VERY curious though, the whole statue shadow shit.. I'm going to assume they're either, as mentioned, working for charles, or they're old islanders (which I doubt considering ben didn't recognize them or vice versa.)
Explains why Juliette was able to deliver Ethan but after the statue was destroyed, all the other babies died.
Claire's baby?
What's been frustrating me for a season and a half now is that no one ever asks Juliette ANYTHING! She was one of the others, she lived with them for a while, she understands somewhat of the pecking order. How did she get there, who recruited her, what were their greater goals? Why do they all need to speak latin? Anything else that hasn't been hinted at yet.
You know, once she moved in 'LaFleur' for three years, you'd think that at some point over tea he'd sit her down and ask for her whole story. You know, while they're falling in love and all that.
What's been frustrating me for a season and a half now is that no one ever asks Juliette ANYTHING! She was one of the others, she lived with them for a while, she understands somewhat of the pecking order. How did she get there, who recruited her, what were their greater goals? Why do they all need to speak latin? Anything else that hasn't been hinted at yet.
You know, once she moved in 'LaFleur' for three years, you'd think that at some point over tea he'd sit her down and ask for her whole story. You know, while they're falling in love and all that.
Agreed! I was thinking that myself. Oh and I dunno why Claire's baby was the anomally; maybe because Jacob wants the baby alive (Aaron was Moses' brother and interpreter as Eko pointed out; and Jacob is also a biblical character) or else the coctail Ethan injected into him helped the baby survive. I'm going for the former, as at one point it was hinted that Aaron had abilities somewhat like Walt.
I wouldn't jump the gun on the Penny question just yet. I suspect we may still see another flashback from Ben later as more of the Widmore/Ben early day stuff is explained.
Ben was much more injured than Desmond could have caused with the few blows and short time he had ( ok, hes Scottish but so what hahaha).
Funny, I was almost standing up cheering Desmond at that moment 'gin on son, gie him fucking laldy!' and so on, I was pretty disappointed he didn't take the time to leather seven shades o shite out o the prick, I mean Ben has had it coming, I hope he gets more a man beating later.
I don't think he was much more injured in the part where he called from the docks. looked like the same amount of blood to me, only his arm was hurting or whatever.
there's SO many answers I wish they would just address, like you guys mentioned with Juliet and the like. We're getting more and more but there's still way too many questions posed.
I'm still wondering who the hell made 'charles' their leader to begin with. I have to assume Jacob or Richard.
Jacob is probably the biggest thing in the show right now and we know next to nothing about him. I can't wait for a Jacob or Alpert episode. There's definitely some religious/Egyptian shit going down and I love it.
also - where the hell is everyone else from flight 815? they have to be somewhere in the 'present' timeline that sun/locke/ben returned to, the fucked up one, don't they?
also, all the rest of the original people on the plane that were looking at them funny while sawyer/kate were in cages in season 3, the air hostess and crew. damn.
and one more thing! anyone think the whole 'shadow of the statue' thing at the end of the episode maybe has to do with time travel by any chance? maybe this is how they get back to 1970's. but maybe not.. nevermind, they're following locke. damn. I'm still perplexed how that's going to happen.
and locke is TOTALLY a ghost thingy now. DEAD IS DEAD BITCH.
Yeah, I thought Widmore might be in the box as well.
As for the other 815 peeps - I'm not sure they're on either of these two timelines. To me, the timeline that Ben, Frank and the new losties are on looks too ravaged and old to be merely 3yrs vacant. Ben's house is really delapidated, the floors were wet/rotting, totally jacked. When the flashes first started, Sawyer and the others had come back to the beach only to find those boats. No Bernard, no Rose. Nobody. It's possible there's a 3-way time hump going on.
Replies
Really Brilliant stuff this season, can't wait for the finale!
People here are saying it was a filler episode, but I think towards the end it actually turned out to be one of the most important episodes in the entire show so far. I think that act of kindness from Sawyer and Kate will come back to them somehow. I am now curious to know who Illy and Charles are. The Others leaders before Richard? Either way, superb episode. That conversation on the porch between Kate and Juliette was so so good. You just knew what was coming from the stern look on her face. So, Juliette is kind of more responsible for the Others wiping out the Dharma then we thought. But doesn't she have to dissapear before the Others bring her on the island the first time? So she probably ends up in the pit.
wait, when in season 1 did Locke do that? Not that I'm disagreeing, but if that did happen it would give me alot more faith in the writers.
but he's so freaking bad ass.
maybe it ends with him taking charge
I'm still interested in seeing what's going to happen with people split on different time lines. It looks like the plane survivors have landed in a much more distant future, judging by the ragged airfield, as well as New Otherton being completely overgrown.
Looks like Ben might meet his end next week? At the very least, it looks like we'll get to see old smokey again.
Point being, Smokey spared Ben for the same reason he always does, because the person being judged felt guilty and wanted forgiveness. Eko was killed because he dared to decide his own sense of morality and proved himself to not be a man of faith.
I'm not sure if I spuriously espoused my notion about the Island being a bit like Eden, those that look on the island with faith and trust in a power above themselves are spared, those that don't are crushed. Thats why John has received more gifts than the others because he has already suffered more than the rest already and still looks on the world with the eyes of love and trusts in a purpose greater than himself to guide him.
Well at least that's what I've always felt is the underlying allegory of the show, the more we go forward though, the more it looks like its more than allegory to me.
I didn't hear him say Sawyer at all ... just pretty much that he promises to follow Locke blindly now.
Daaark, if you could not give away details of the coming weeks LOST episode in massive fucking multicoloured letters, I would sure appreciate it. Those irritating videos are bad enough.
It appears that several of you were right about Ben getting roughed up while trying to kill Penny. I don't know that any of us predicted who/why though, but good work
Obviously the island mysteries have existed much longer than the dharma initiative, and appears to be connected to ancient Egyptian culture, which again, connects the giant 4 toed statue. I want them to spend more time in that temple now
I agree with you guys. Jacob is an additional being/spirit/soul/god on the island and he takes the form of other people. I don't think he's the smoke monster. I think him and the smoke monster either work together, or they are battling it out on the island. The way that the smoke monster went away, then Alex appears, makes me think that Jacob wasn't happy that the smoke monster let him live. So that's why he was so angry when he warned Ben not to harm John. That was definitely not Alex though, based on her strength when she held Ben against the wall.
'I'm calling the shots here' BANG. No you're not.
I thought the scene with Rousseau was weak, primarily because we really don't know why they even bothered her in the first place. I am really itching to find out more about Richard, and the actual temple, seeing as what we have seen so far is only the outer wall.
And what is in that crate the new people were so concerned about? Have they been turned by the others somehow? Seems so, as they were going on about the statue.
I don't think Lost has ever been this consistantly good.
And yes, I loved seeing Caesar blown away
Anyone notice how Alex moved in a bizarre way? Reminds me how Ethan's movements looked when Jack got in a fight with him and Ethan leaned over him, telling him not to follow. The way he leaned over was similar. He sort of bended at the hips but kept his back very straight. He also had that superior strength that Alex/Jacob exhibited.
I thought the comping in the Smoke Monster was weak though. There should have been more of a diffusion on the imagery Ben was being shown; it looked a bit crappy and sharp how they did it in the end.
The way I see it, the smoke monster judges you in a very 'black and white' way.
I see him as the protector of Jacob and possibly similar to Cerebus as a protector of the underworld. It does what it does and does it fairly.
It could be that Jacob does have personal morals and beliefs like we do, thus why he seemed a bit frustrated when smokey didn't kill Ben.
*edit* someone on another forum brought up that the other passengers might be working for Charles Whidmore.
I think later in the series, we're going to find Ben, John, and Charles on the island together for a battle royale
Anubis statue. I'm wondering if the statue is the temple? Or more likely just the remains of the statue is the temple.
I'm thinking the shadow of the temple is where Ben was, under the temple in the shadows. I think the three women were all working for charles, who is trying to use smokey for something.
Good call on the new losties working for Charles. If that is the case, their password interests me. Also so does the contents of that crate.
How can Jacob be the guy we met who lives in the tent if he exists in the same time? Or is that guy dead by the time Ben brings Alex back to the others camp? Because Jacob is definitely mentioned. Could be.
Also is the guy who lives in the tent that guy from Blade Runner?
Seems so. Nice twist eh.
the way they acted at the end of the episode was VERY curious though, the whole statue shadow shit.. I'm going to assume they're either, as mentioned, working for charles, or they're old islanders (which I doubt considering ben didn't recognize them or vice versa.)
stuff is getting very interesting though.
this show freaking rules.
Claire's baby?
What's been frustrating me for a season and a half now is that no one ever asks Juliette ANYTHING! She was one of the others, she lived with them for a while, she understands somewhat of the pecking order. How did she get there, who recruited her, what were their greater goals? Why do they all need to speak latin? Anything else that hasn't been hinted at yet.
You know, once she moved in 'LaFleur' for three years, you'd think that at some point over tea he'd sit her down and ask for her whole story. You know, while they're falling in love and all that.
Yes. Yes it does.
Agreed! I was thinking that myself. Oh and I dunno why Claire's baby was the anomally; maybe because Jacob wants the baby alive (Aaron was Moses' brother and interpreter as Eko pointed out; and Jacob is also a biblical character) or else the coctail Ethan injected into him helped the baby survive. I'm going for the former, as at one point it was hinted that Aaron had abilities somewhat like Walt.
+1
not to mention Rose and Bernard. Apparently Faraday will be on next episode.
Ben was much more injured than Desmond could have caused with the few blows and short time he had ( ok, hes Scottish but so what hahaha).
Funny, I was almost standing up cheering Desmond at that moment 'gin on son, gie him fucking laldy!' and so on, I was pretty disappointed he didn't take the time to leather seven shades o shite out o the prick, I mean Ben has had it coming, I hope he gets more a man beating later.
there's SO many answers I wish they would just address, like you guys mentioned with Juliet and the like. We're getting more and more but there's still way too many questions posed.
I'm still wondering who the hell made 'charles' their leader to begin with. I have to assume Jacob or Richard.
Jacob is probably the biggest thing in the show right now and we know next to nothing about him. I can't wait for a Jacob or Alpert episode. There's definitely some religious/Egyptian shit going down and I love it.
also - where the hell is everyone else from flight 815? they have to be somewhere in the 'present' timeline that sun/locke/ben returned to, the fucked up one, don't they?
also, all the rest of the original people on the plane that were looking at them funny while sawyer/kate were in cages in season 3, the air hostess and crew. damn.
and one more thing! anyone think the whole 'shadow of the statue' thing at the end of the episode maybe has to do with time travel by any chance? maybe this is how they get back to 1970's. but maybe not.. nevermind, they're following locke. damn. I'm still perplexed how that's going to happen.
and locke is TOTALLY a ghost thingy now. DEAD IS DEAD BITCH.
edit:
OH SHIT WHAT IF WIDMORE IS IN THAT BIG METAL BOX?
As for the other 815 peeps - I'm not sure they're on either of these two timelines. To me, the timeline that Ben, Frank and the new losties are on looks too ravaged and old to be merely 3yrs vacant. Ben's house is really delapidated, the floors were wet/rotting, totally jacked. When the flashes first started, Sawyer and the others had come back to the beach only to find those boats. No Bernard, no Rose. Nobody. It's possible there's a 3-way time hump going on.