I think the virus was a quick way of thinning out the prison group. Personally I would like to see them forced back out on the road too.
I would also like to see Carol come back when they need her. I didnt like her in the beginning, but like Daryl, she grew on me by that last episode...going from beaten wife to ass kicker was pretty good character development
I'll be honest, I wasn't expecting much at all from this season. Other than the first episode of the season I have been surprised... pretty good so far!
I think comic book spoiler should be the only reason for the tags (unless you have a show spoiler that hasn't aired yet). If the show has aired, then common sense would say people will be on this thread discussing it. Why put spoiler tags on something that should be well known, if you watched it?
Btw, the comics do not tell the future of this show (for the most part). I think it points toward future locations now, with maybe a hint of some actions, but the groups actions/timelines have been put into a blender, and sprinkled into the show.
I'm feeling the same way about the show. . Eventhough its better than a lot of other shows on sunday nights.
I'm a little disengaged because they've been in the prison for so long and its like they're not going anywhere. They've become complacent in their setting, and complacency dulls the storyline. Hopefully the disease will be enough of a boot to get them on the road again and involved in more adventures.
You know the thing that really bothers me is the predictable deaths of minor characters.
Minor character falls/is in love without having had much screentime yet? -> They die soon.
They meet some new strangers that seem OK and are super eager to be saved and join them ? -> They die soon.
Also I thought the way
Zach
was killed in the first episode of this season was so lame.. It's exactly the same as what happened to
Hershel's leg
, with the silly "zombie gnashing at leg out of nowhere" thing.
I'm curious who killed off that group, that they chose not to attack. I'm not clear if they wanted us to believe the governor did it, or if he was just pissed that someone else did it, instead of them. Because if HE did it, things wouldn't make much sense (the other 2 would have noticed him missing for that period of time).
No, he didn't kill them. I thought that for a moment too, but there is no way he could have done that in broad daylight, they were only gone for a short time. What I don't get is that they weren't that far from the other camp, why wouldn't they have heard anything?
^ Nor did they seem too concerned about any possible rival gang with lotsa guns traipsing around in their area. Coupled with the lightning fast regression of the governor back to his old self, holding office and all, this episodes plot felt a little rushed and had some plausability gaps, imo.
4-06 felt good and most of it made sense, although there was a lot of filler. Their decision to give the Governor some more character, and more perspective into his good side, was a solid choice.
It's a shame 4-07 kind of entirely shit all over that and brought him to the exact point he was and essentially wasted two episodes. And what they're setting up in the mid-season finale
by having him attack the prison, again, months later - literally the same plot as the last half of Season 3, but hey, now we have a tank -
feels kind of lazy.
Also
"You killed my brother!"
"Here, have a cigarette"
"Ok we're cool"
was tremendously silly.
Still my favourite show, they just need to keep it moving and not fuck around in prison for 8 more episodes. I figured they would have learned their lesson from Season 2 but here we are. Taking a 2 episode break in the middle of the season, right after we hear a voice on a goddamn radio and the Carol shenanigans go down, just feels so poorly timed to me.
Someone said they should have made the spinoff show about the Governor and that seems like a much, much better idea than where they're currently going. Although I do think this season has been great and will continue to be great once everything settles down a bit.
Series is looking ok, the Gov. has realised he is thinking for himself. Why make 2 eps. for it? and now he's got a tank? It seems like he must die, Governor - the conflict shoudn't continue for too long. Otherwise it'll be like Mumm-ra vs. Lion-O, for infinite.
What's so safe about a prison anyway? The idea of a prison being secure and safe comes mainly from how they are in normal society... i.e guards, fences, alarms, locks, cameras. None of which exist, surely in a post apocalyptic scenario its nothing more than brick and mortar like everywhere else. If anything it draws more attention.
At least dig a moat or something that the zombies could get stuck in, bleh.
I liked the other side of the governor they were showing but like James said they immediately shat all over that in the latest episode and brought him back to where he was, quite pointless, and a very, very rushed episode to be honest..
Also I dont understand the scene where they drove away and came across the zombies stuck in the mud, was that a flashback or something? just seems weird to go back like that.
They do have stakes up at the entrance, and the way the gatedoor is angled is clever. I think digging a moat would be beyond the capabilities of this group. The Governor could get it done though.
He's always been about fixed fortifications.
I was curious about the mud scene too. At first i thought it was a pit across the road keeping them from leaving, but then I believed that it was really a sign of what was out beyond the camp. He probably realized that if he was going to have to stay, he'd have to take over...rather than face the hordes out there.
What i thought was a great scene was when the zombie walked right past him after he had been on the road for so long that he was weak, dirty and tired.
What's so safe about a prison anyway? The idea of a prison being secure and safe comes mainly from how they are in normal society... i.e guards, fences, alarms, locks, cameras. None of which exist, surely in a post apocalyptic scenario its nothing more than brick and mortar like everywhere else. If anything it draws more attention.
At least dig a moat or something that the zombies could get stuck in, bleh.
I liked the other side of the governor they were showing but like James said they immediately shat all over that in the latest episode and brought him back to where he was, quite pointless, and a very, very rushed episode to be honest..
Also I dont understand the scene where they drove away and came across the zombies stuck in the mud, was that a flashback or something? just seems weird to go back like that.
Zombies in the mud were blocking the only way out of there... at least that's what we should think. I didn't like this part since it is a Governor. He sees zombies in mud on the first road they tried and he heads back to the camp... that's just lazy Gov.
I always thought they could create some creative defenses around prison. Even with all those zombies pushing on the fence. They could create holes in the ground inside so if the zombies come in it should be easy to get rid of them. They could even think of some safe way to clear the fences. Why won't they put zombies on fire ? They won't push harder on the fence because they are in pain. They don't feel pain.
They were sitting around doing nothing. Now it's getting back at them. They had time and space to create some clever ways to stay safe. Now it's them against tank. Good luck!
Why won't they put zombies on fire ? They won't push harder on the fence because they are in pain. They don't feel pain.
This is my favourite method of killing off masses of zombies, but from a story point of few .. this could be seen as an easy way out that would create less conflict.
I suppose they could always have a fuel shortage, realizing they couldn't keep doing this...
At the very least, a ditch like the other camp have done. Perhaps adding a bit of bait to lead the zombies in there. Michonne was the only one who had a really neat way of handling herself in this zombie apocalypse. I don't know what happened to her...
The creativity shown so far for killing zombies is beyond boring. They haven't shown us anything new.
Are you suggesting using another method .. maybe a flaming arrow shot byDaryl into a zombie horde, creating a 'brush fire' type affect?
Wouldn't they burn without gasoline? Just put the first zombie on fire with a torch (which you put on fire with magic) and the clothes on the rest should burn until the flesh would start to burn.
Wouldn't they burn without gasoline? Just put the first zombie on fire with a torch (which you put on fire with magic) and the clothes on the rest should burn until the flesh would start to burn.
Flesh doesn't really burn that easily, it's mostly water after all. If a burger catches on fire on the grill all I need to do is take it off the fire & it goes out immediately.
The little girl has a soft spot for zombies but doesn't hesitate to shoot a human woman in the face. Seems legit
I'm fairly positive that won't be the last human we see Lizzie kill. I won't be surprised if it's revealed that she was the one feeding walkers & dissecting bunnies.
It seemed like the weak chain link fences where the prisons only strength. How many times did the fences almost collapse? How much time did they spend thinning the walkers?
They didn't even have an escape plan or layers of defenses even through they talked about having to defend it, constantly.
I do like how Carol was sort of vindicated by the kids saving Tyreese (that kid has some crazy accurate aim). I can see the kids that Carol trained, playing a factor later when and if Carol ever rejoins the group. It might be the only thing keeping Tyreese from ripping her arms off.
Personally I'd like to see Carol return. I couldn't stand her redneck abused wife thing in the beginning, but she became a hard bada$$ when they wrote her out. It allows her to return though...so I think we'll be seeing her again, probably with a competitive group.
Probably a leader.
*I had to watch it a second time.
It was a great way to show that little Judith might have been killed by walkers in her basket, but I'm not convinced she wasn't put on the bus or hidden away where ever the little girls went.
I like how they are all split up now. It will be interesting to see how they handle the outside dangers now that they are pretty much back at square one with no weapons and no real supply cache.
Wow, great episode, lot's of shit happening and they're finally out of that shithole, now back to the cool part of zombie survival, the scavenging/exploration! I hope. Who knows maybe they'll stumble across an identical women's prison nearby, heh.
You could see
Hershel dying
a mile off, they did that thing where they pan to him with a glimmer of hope in his eyes because Rick's trying to do the noble thing, that grin was a "pre-you's-bouts-to-get-killed-yo" grin.
I'm not sure why the other group continued to follow the governors orders after that VERY CLEAR and unmerciful act. They knew Rick about as much as the Governor, and it boiled down to their choice between:
The guy who is offering to live peacefully with them, admits to having children in the group and is caring for the sick..
oooooor...
The guy they met like... I dunno, 2 fucking days ago who takes leadership after everyone dies suspiciously and just cut an old, innocent man's head off because he didn't wan't to accept peaceful terms.
Why wouldn't they turn on the Governor, the only other 'No morals, take what I want' kind of guy was the tank operator, and even THAT guy had his brother killed by this dickwad.
Even if the Governor is that good at manipulating people there must've been a point during the invasion where they're thinking to themselves "Now wait a dingle darn second, we appear to be levelling this place to the ground and destroying the fences just to acquire it.
And dammit why does no one watch their children in this show, that little girl was almost killed once before by one that strolled into the camp (I'm going to assume like, a day or two before) yet that woman couldn't even glance over at her or just be a little closer. I feel like there have been too many stupid deaths like this already.
GAH! *arm flail*
This show is the TV equivalent of Marmite, i love it but i also hate it.
Because the Gov said " You'll be safe here, Zombies can't cross water."
Notice how the girl (who was obviously full of it from the beginning) was both the first to volunteer and the first to mess her pants when the shooting started. I bet she's like 15 or something.
There's more blurring of the lines as to what is morally acceptable between two people in this show.
Hm, must've missed that the alcoholic ex-army medic guy was back with the group? I thought they ditched him when he grabbed drinks instead of meds.
Anyway, decent ep but so much unbelievable stuff (in a bad sense) as pointed out by JFletcher..
When the governor was speaking with rick I was thinking perhaps Carl would shoot first; causing the fight. Which might have been interesting. I wonder how many characters will return later on in zombie form?
Oh yea and what was with the dirty chick that Rick met out in the woods (Irish accent?) leading the zombie brigade after the governor took down the fence?
I swear it was her (I wish I had a screen cap from the last episode).
I thought he took care of her after she stabbed herself? Maybe I imagined that part...
I'm getting a little tired of super sentimental, always shaky and blubbering Rick making speeches while on the verge of a mental collapse. Can we get a few more badass moments, please...
I get that characters need to change and evolve and that they are trying to be real and dramatic and show multifaceted personalities, but his character really needs a few more badass moments. Its hard to get behind someone who is so easily reduced to a blubbering mess.
Where is the Rick that stole a zombies bike and then came back, apologized and put it down?
I think there is a balance between the cold, calculating, ruthlessness of the governor and a compassionate but effective leader who isn't a quivering pile of raw emotions. We've seen Rick in both emotional states can they please balance him out a bit and have him carry both characteristics at the same time, it really makes his character great and they've been shying away from it a lot over the last season.
I hope life outside of the prison brings back some of his badass...
I also hope that they get back on the road for a bit, I would be happy with the rest of the season being them just surviving on the road with fractured story lines then whoever is left meeting back up.
I also want to see the show tackle winter conditions, it introduces a lot of really cool dynamics. We get to see what happens to zombies when it's cold and snow covers just about everything.
They explored it early in the comics and it was great. They don't need to spend much time on it, but something other than dirty sweaty rednecks would be a welcomed break for a bit.
Wow, great episode, lot's of shit happening and they're finally out of that shithole, now back to the cool part of zombie survival, the scavenging/exploration! I hope. Who knows maybe they'll stumble across an identical women's prison nearby, heh.
You could see
Hershel dying
a mile off, they did that thing where they pan to him with a glimmer of hope in his eyes because Rick's trying to do the noble thing, that grin was a "pre-you's-bouts-to-get-killed-yo" grin.
I'm not sure why the other group continued to follow the governors orders after that VERY CLEAR and unmerciful act. They knew Rick about as much as the Governor, and it boiled down to their choice between:
The guy who is offering to live peacefully with them, admits to having children in the group and is caring for the sick..
oooooor...
The guy they met like... I dunno, 2 fucking days ago who takes leadership after everyone dies suspiciously and just cut an old, innocent man's head off because he didn't wan't to accept peaceful terms.
Why wouldn't they turn on the Governor, the only other 'No morals, take what I want' kind of guy was the tank operator, and even THAT guy had his brother killed by this dickwad.
Even if the Governor is that good at manipulating people there must've been a point during the invasion where they're thinking to themselves "Now wait a dingle darn second, we appear to be levelling this place to the ground and destroying the fences just to acquire it.
And dammit why does no one watch their children in this show, that little girl was almost killed once before by one that strolled into the camp (I'm going to assume like, a day or two before) yet that woman couldn't even glance over at her or just be a little closer. I feel like there have been too many stupid deaths like this already.
GAH! *arm flail*
This show is the TV equivalent of Marmite, i love it but i also hate it.
I actually think that kid thing is good. It shows that this world is not for children. Grown ups can't always look out for kids. That's why Carol thaught the kids how to handle a gun. When shit hits the fan you can't protect your kid and the rest of the people. Sometimes you can't save everyone...
also I think Ricks daughter was saved by someone with hands covered with blood ;p Maybe Tyreese (not sure how his name is spelled) since he was hanging with the kids who have taken Ricks kid outside.
The Gov thing is true though. They just needed a way for him to make a big return. He couldn't do it alone so they gave him a camp of not-so-smart people. Meh... will do ...
-edit-
Everything I thought about the timeframe is moot as the Gov says during his montage that he's been on the road for a couple months...
The Walking Dead may be better than about 98% of every other piece of zombie fiction, but sometimes it's really poorly written...
-snip--
I think the biggest problem with the Gov's return is that they just didn't effectively convey how much time had passed since he found his new sheeple. In the premiere we know it's been at least 6 weeks, as Daryl and Zach specifically say so, + a few more to get them where they are when the Gov shows up. Assuming Zach showed up with the Woodbury folk that's 7 weeks give or take a day.
So when he does we get the groovy montage of him wandering and slowly giving up, and it's unlikely that that took more than 2 or 3 weeks based on his state of mind and beard growth. When he gets to the apartment did he "get over it" the very next day? There was probably at least a couple days they didn't show of him deciding to live or not. Then how long did he spend there both before and after the old man died? Another week? So let's say that's 5 weeks, did the truck break down the very next day? They probably didn't drive very far since at the time his only concern was his new family and he wouldn't be driving closer to the prison. So the truck breaks down and within mayyyybe a few hours the find Martinez and the new group. That gives him roughly 2 weeks to get to know these people. That seem like a reasonable estimation given the way Tara and Alisha(?)'s relationship had developed; she was in the car when they tried to drive away. So over the course of these 2 weeks this group has met what they can only assume is a strong and protective family man. Martinez' death is reasonably explained as a drunken mistake and it's probably a day or two before the Gov kills Pete. Between these two deaths and Lily being attacked right in the (stupidly unsafe) camp it was probably pretty easy to use the groups fear over however much time was left to convince them that attacking the prison was the only option. The speech he gives in the last episode was probably just the "official push" to the group.
That's my assumed understanding anyway.
--snip-
What actually really bugged me about the confrontation though was how the Gov openly blamed Rick for both Woodbury and Andrea and Rick didn't say a word. Like hello?!?! "You shot everybody from Woodbury and fed Andrea to a Walker you one-eyed maniac!!!"
But then I guess we wouldn't have had the crazy shoot-out
On Talking dead Kirkman said something along the lines of Irish-zombie-chick showing up to remind people that zombies were people too once.
Rick didn't want to make decisions. He didn't want to be a leader again. He was still in his shell. That scene with the talk is when we see him 'coming back' which was the gist of his part of the talk.
The Gov however saying 'Liar', I didn't get that part.
The Gov however saying 'Liar', I didn't get that part.
It's pretty clear, Rick said they can come back from the horrible things they did to survive and the Governor disagreed. The Governor had a clean slate to start over with and he pretty much fell back to his old ways.
As for Rick banishing Carol, I think if she had expressed any remorse over what she did he wouldn't have done it. She literally didn't come back.
I think Carol drove the bus away.. possibly. She came back and was living near the girls. I also think Carol might have been covering for the psycho girl. Psycho girls the one been feeding the rats, dissecting them, etc instead of giving up the girl, Carol told Rick she did it, not thinking he'd tell her to leave. She might have dragged and burned the bodies but that was to cover up for the girl killing them.
maybe.. /shrug
It's a big prison she could have been close by still. Awaiting the time to take the girls and make a break for it and to tell Daryl bye..
Reason I think she's taking the fall for the killings is even Daryl says "That's not her"..
Replies
What kind of idiot would go onto the internet and read a thread about WALKING DEAD thread if they didn't want anything spoiled to them??
Anyways, I can't take the guvnor seriously anymore. That song gets stuck in my head whenever I see him.
BIBBIDABIBIDAAMMM
Bibidabibidooooo
And thats how we do it.. on broadway!
So, the spoiler tag is appreciated by me.
Some things in the last season really annoyed me but so far this season isn't too bad.
You know what...
[ame="
Btw, the comics do not tell the future of this show (for the most part). I think it points toward future locations now, with maybe a hint of some actions, but the groups actions/timelines have been put into a blender, and sprinkled into the show.
I'm falling out of love with the show, but it keeps me amused. Good season.
I'm a little disengaged because they've been in the prison for so long and its like they're not going anywhere. They've become complacent in their setting, and complacency dulls the storyline. Hopefully the disease will be enough of a boot to get them on the road again and involved in more adventures.
In the last scene, i'm thinking he'll miss from that distance... which hopefully will lead to another clash between two camps
Minor character falls/is in love without having had much screentime yet? -> They die soon.
They meet some new strangers that seem OK and are super eager to be saved and join them ? -> They die soon.
Also I thought the way
It's a shame 4-07 kind of entirely shit all over that and brought him to the exact point he was and essentially wasted two episodes. And what they're setting up in the mid-season finale
Also
"Here, have a cigarette"
"Ok we're cool"
Still my favourite show, they just need to keep it moving and not fuck around in prison for 8 more episodes. I figured they would have learned their lesson from Season 2 but here we are. Taking a 2 episode break in the middle of the season, right after we hear a voice on a goddamn radio and the Carol shenanigans go down, just feels so poorly timed to me.
Someone said they should have made the spinoff show about the Governor and that seems like a much, much better idea than where they're currently going. Although I do think this season has been great and will continue to be great once everything settles down a bit.
At least dig a moat or something that the zombies could get stuck in, bleh.
I liked the other side of the governor they were showing but like James said they immediately shat all over that in the latest episode and brought him back to where he was, quite pointless, and a very, very rushed episode to be honest..
Also I dont understand the scene where they drove away and came across the zombies stuck in the mud, was that a flashback or something? just seems weird to go back like that.
He's always been about fixed fortifications.
I was curious about the mud scene too. At first i thought it was a pit across the road keeping them from leaving, but then I believed that it was really a sign of what was out beyond the camp. He probably realized that if he was going to have to stay, he'd have to take over...rather than face the hordes out there.
What i thought was a great scene was when the zombie walked right past him after he had been on the road for so long that he was weak, dirty and tired.
That zombie barely noticed him.
Zombies in the mud were blocking the only way out of there... at least that's what we should think. I didn't like this part since it is a Governor. He sees zombies in mud on the first road they tried and he heads back to the camp... that's just lazy Gov.
I always thought they could create some creative defenses around prison. Even with all those zombies pushing on the fence. They could create holes in the ground inside so if the zombies come in it should be easy to get rid of them. They could even think of some safe way to clear the fences. Why won't they put zombies on fire ? They won't push harder on the fence because they are in pain. They don't feel pain.
They were sitting around doing nothing. Now it's getting back at them. They had time and space to create some clever ways to stay safe. Now it's them against tank. Good luck!
This is my favourite method of killing off masses of zombies, but from a story point of few .. this could be seen as an easy way out that would create less conflict.
I suppose they could always have a fuel shortage, realizing they couldn't keep doing this...
At the very least, a ditch like the other camp have done. Perhaps adding a bit of bait to lead the zombies in there. Michonne was the only one who had a really neat way of handling herself in this zombie apocalypse. I don't know what happened to her...
The creativity shown so far for killing zombies is beyond boring. They haven't shown us anything new.
Stuff actually happened.
+1
This is the turning point for the season.
Now that they're out of the prison.... it's going to be badass again!
Wouldn't they burn without gasoline? Just put the first zombie on fire with a torch (which you put on fire with magic) and the clothes on the rest should burn until the flesh would start to burn.
Flesh doesn't really burn that easily, it's mostly water after all. If a burger catches on fire on the grill all I need to do is take it off the fire & it goes out immediately.
I'm fairly positive that won't be the last human we see Lizzie kill. I won't be surprised if it's revealed that she was the one feeding walkers & dissecting bunnies.
To be fair, the girl is a psycho
And now that society has crumbled into raiding groups....it should be a whole lot of fun.
They didn't even have an escape plan or layers of defenses even through they talked about having to defend it, constantly.
I do like how Carol was sort of vindicated by the kids saving Tyreese (that kid has some crazy accurate aim). I can see the kids that Carol trained, playing a factor later when and if Carol ever rejoins the group. It might be the only thing keeping Tyreese from ripping her arms off.
Probably a leader.
*I had to watch it a second time.
I like how they are all split up now. It will be interesting to see how they handle the outside dangers now that they are pretty much back at square one with no weapons and no real supply cache.
It is going to be a long wait to February.
You could see
I'm not sure why the other group continued to follow the governors orders after that VERY CLEAR and unmerciful act. They knew Rick about as much as the Governor, and it boiled down to their choice between:
The guy who is offering to live peacefully with them, admits to having children in the group and is caring for the sick..
oooooor...
The guy they met like... I dunno, 2 fucking days ago who takes leadership after everyone dies suspiciously and just cut an old, innocent man's head off because he didn't wan't to accept peaceful terms.
Why wouldn't they turn on the Governor, the only other 'No morals, take what I want' kind of guy was the tank operator, and even THAT guy had his brother killed by this dickwad.
Even if the Governor is that good at manipulating people there must've been a point during the invasion where they're thinking to themselves "Now wait a dingle darn second, we appear to be levelling this place to the ground and destroying the fences just to acquire it.
And dammit why does no one watch their children in this show, that little girl was almost killed once before by one that strolled into the camp (I'm going to assume like, a day or two before) yet that woman couldn't even glance over at her or just be a little closer. I feel like there have been too many stupid deaths like this already.
GAH! *arm flail*
This show is the TV equivalent of Marmite, i love it but i also hate it.
Notice how the girl (who was obviously full of it from the beginning) was both the first to volunteer and the first to mess her pants when the shooting started. I bet she's like 15 or something.
There's more blurring of the lines as to what is morally acceptable between two people in this show.
Anyway, decent ep but so much unbelievable stuff (in a bad sense) as pointed out by JFletcher..
When the governor was speaking with rick I was thinking perhaps Carl would shoot first; causing the fight. Which might have been interesting. I wonder how many characters will return later on in zombie form?
I swear it was her (I wish I had a screen cap from the last episode).
I thought he took care of her after she stabbed herself? Maybe I imagined that part...
I'm getting a little tired of super sentimental, always shaky and blubbering Rick making speeches while on the verge of a mental collapse. Can we get a few more badass moments, please...
I get that characters need to change and evolve and that they are trying to be real and dramatic and show multifaceted personalities, but his character really needs a few more badass moments. Its hard to get behind someone who is so easily reduced to a blubbering mess.
Where is the Rick that stole a zombies bike and then came back, apologized and put it down?
It could use a bit more sh!t happens, Rick.
Where is the " I hear Nebraska's nice..." Rick?
[ame="
I think there is a balance between the cold, calculating, ruthlessness of the governor and a compassionate but effective leader who isn't a quivering pile of raw emotions. We've seen Rick in both emotional states can they please balance him out a bit and have him carry both characteristics at the same time, it really makes his character great and they've been shying away from it a lot over the last season.
I hope life outside of the prison brings back some of his badass...
I also hope that they get back on the road for a bit, I would be happy with the rest of the season being them just surviving on the road with fractured story lines then whoever is left meeting back up.
I also want to see the show tackle winter conditions, it introduces a lot of really cool dynamics. We get to see what happens to zombies when it's cold and snow covers just about everything.
They explored it early in the comics and it was great. They don't need to spend much time on it, but something other than dirty sweaty rednecks would be a welcomed break for a bit.
I actually think that kid thing is good. It shows that this world is not for children. Grown ups can't always look out for kids. That's why Carol thaught the kids how to handle a gun. When shit hits the fan you can't protect your kid and the rest of the people. Sometimes you can't save everyone...
The Gov thing is true though. They just needed a way for him to make a big return. He couldn't do it alone so they gave him a camp of not-so-smart people. Meh... will do ...
Everything I thought about the timeframe is moot as the Gov says during his montage that he's been on the road for a couple months...
The Walking Dead may be better than about 98% of every other piece of zombie fiction, but sometimes it's really poorly written...
-snip--
I think the biggest problem with the Gov's return is that they just didn't effectively convey how much time had passed since he found his new sheeple. In the premiere we know it's been at least 6 weeks, as Daryl and Zach specifically say so, + a few more to get them where they are when the Gov shows up. Assuming Zach showed up with the Woodbury folk that's 7 weeks give or take a day.
So when he does we get the groovy montage of him wandering and slowly giving up, and it's unlikely that that took more than 2 or 3 weeks based on his state of mind and beard growth. When he gets to the apartment did he "get over it" the very next day? There was probably at least a couple days they didn't show of him deciding to live or not. Then how long did he spend there both before and after the old man died? Another week? So let's say that's 5 weeks, did the truck break down the very next day? They probably didn't drive very far since at the time his only concern was his new family and he wouldn't be driving closer to the prison. So the truck breaks down and within mayyyybe a few hours the find Martinez and the new group. That gives him roughly 2 weeks to get to know these people. That seem like a reasonable estimation given the way Tara and Alisha(?)'s relationship had developed; she was in the car when they tried to drive away. So over the course of these 2 weeks this group has met what they can only assume is a strong and protective family man. Martinez' death is reasonably explained as a drunken mistake and it's probably a day or two before the Gov kills Pete. Between these two deaths and Lily being attacked right in the (stupidly unsafe) camp it was probably pretty easy to use the groups fear over however much time was left to convince them that attacking the prison was the only option. The speech he gives in the last episode was probably just the "official push" to the group.
That's my assumed understanding anyway.
--snip-
What actually really bugged me about the confrontation though was how the Gov openly blamed Rick for both Woodbury and Andrea and Rick didn't say a word. Like hello?!?! "You shot everybody from Woodbury and fed Andrea to a Walker you one-eyed maniac!!!"
But then I guess we wouldn't have had the crazy shoot-out
On Talking dead Kirkman said something along the lines of Irish-zombie-chick showing up to remind people that zombies were people too once.
The Gov however saying 'Liar', I didn't get that part.
It's pretty clear, Rick said they can come back from the horrible things they did to survive and the Governor disagreed. The Governor had a clean slate to start over with and he pretty much fell back to his old ways.
As for Rick banishing Carol, I think if she had expressed any remorse over what she did he wouldn't have done it. She literally didn't come back.
maybe.. /shrug
It's a big prison she could have been close by still. Awaiting the time to take the girls and make a break for it and to tell Daryl bye..
Reason I think she's taking the fall for the killings is even Daryl says "That's not her"..