I think you can show work made in Painter, as long as you're not showing the UI itself.
Exactly, as soon as you don't disclose any confidential info about the tool itself and its functionnalities, you're fine showing what you produce with it.
No problem If you have a hard time finding it in your library list later on, you need to click the tab just under LIBRARY titled 'All Games' and change it to 'All Software', or just 'Installed' and Painter should appear in the list.
Very excited to announce that the Substance Painter Public Beta will go live on Steam on March 6th, which is in 2 days only!
The approach we want to take with Painter is the same as the one we have been successfully taking with Designer over the last 2 years: bringing the product early to customers and be very open and careful about feedback to make sure our development efforts go in the right direction and are as efficient as possible, by focusing on iteration and interaction with the community.
The Beta will be introduced on Steam at a very(!) low price, and purchasing the beta will give access to the full non-commercial version once it is released. Those who don't want to use Steam at that point will be able to download a standalone version.
People who want to upgrade to the commercial version later on will be able to do so too.
A free trial version will also be available during the Beta.
You can help us spread the word through this link.
I'd also like to thank you for letting me take part in the beta, my experience has been almost entirely positive and i'm very excited to see what happens once all the features have been implemented!
It was nice to see this take shape, and to see things are being done with our feedback!
Looking forward to continuing to play with it, and even more to the day it can replace 3dcoat
After some quick testing it's looking very promising and at that price it's a no-brainer.
One thing I'd love to see though, is procedural brushes,
not necessarily based on actual particles, but kinda like Krita has or harmony.
Right now the physics brushes feel a little too random to me, but I guess it's just a matter of proper setup, masking etc.
I'm curious what other people do with it.
Is 2048 the maximum resolution for the document?
Is multi uv tile supported?
At the moment 2048 is the maximum but they've said they want to increase this .
multi UV tiles aren't supported yet, but they want to add this as well.
Hmm I just saw the price they are listing on their FAQ page:
$590
We were actually told it would be much less than the cost of Substance Designer.
What happened guys?
"Hi guys, Jerc from Allegorithmic here. Just wanted to address a few concerns
...
As for the price, I can't give you specifics now, but Painter will be much less expensive than Designer and we will also have a very cheap non commercial license."
Not that its necessarily the end of the world, but once its starts getting closer to the cost of mudbox, then expectations in functionality start to go up, which is a given. :-)
There was also some mention of a lower price for current Substance Designer users. I wonder if thats still on the table.
Would gladly test this on some 3D movies assets I am doing right now but 2K is too limiting for me =(
I am already using a combo of Topogun to bake normal and AO, then use Knald to process the normal and output some neat little masks that I use inside of Mari, either as layer masks or channel masks but I organize my meshes / UVs so all connected parts are on the same udim, most of the time when possible depending on final res on screen.
Would be cool to know if I can import multiple meshes. I don't mind painting on UV Range 0 to 1 as long as I can export my maps as xxx.1001.tif/ png / psd or whatever, xxx.1002.tif and so on. I setup all my baking like this for Topogun anyway and import everything back into Mari at one point...So let's say I'd like to be able to paint on a cylinder, cut the cylinder in half before exporting, to match my udims, then setup 2 "materials" and paint on both of them at the same time. Would that be possible? If yes I might give it a shot...Hell I might give it a shot anyway on some simple props at one point. We'll see if I can cheat the system in a way or another =P
Played with it for about 30 min so far. Here's some thoughts, coming from someone who uses Photoshop and Mari to texture:
Seems pretty snappy, was painting 2k texture on a 70k model.
Want higher res, 4k at least.
Rendering is slooooooow, whatever method being used for PBR chugs the whole app. Painting was MUCH more responsive when I switched to single channel, even if i set to Low quality.
That being said why is there no phong style lighting?! Its insanely cheap and gives the artist information about shape.
I may be missing it but there's hardly any masking options. I want to mask by view angle, noise, I Want to mask by another layer while I paint.
I couldnt figure out if I could import a texture I made outside of the program as a new layer. I would like to be able to import something as a starting point and go from there. Or import my AO as a layer, then use that layer as a mask while I paint.
The standard brush options are super minimal, would like to be able to adjust splatter, rotation, stretching etc....
I couldnt figure out if I could import a texture I made outside of the program as a new layer. I would like to be able to import something as a starting point and go from there. Or import my AO as a layer, then use that layer as a mask while I paint.
The standard brush options are super minimal, would like to be able to adjust splatter, rotation, stretching etc....
You can load textures as a starting point; you import an image which is then added to the shelfI think you either drag it onto the layers section or you create a 'fill' layer (or maybe they're called background layers, can't exactly remember) and then apply the imported image to that.
You can't yet use images as layer masks but it was mentioned frequently in the closed beta so it probably won't be too far off.
Like everything else, particles paint to your UV's which are resolution based. The current max doc size is 2048x2048. Maybe if you're getting some weird results post an image?
This beta is completely open, so you are welcome and encouraged to post anything related to Painter. We want honest feedback, good or bad
About pricing, we had to put a price for the commercial version because we knew people would ask for one, but it is not set in stone and we will soon give more details about tthe commercial version, what kind of deal Designer licensees can get, etc.
Particles quality depends on 2 main parameters. The size of the brush, a smaller size will spawn sharper particle streaks, and the dt parameter in the particle settings. The lower that value, the higher the framerate of the particle simulation. Careful though, an extremely low value will slow down performances quite a bit.
As for the PBR shader, yes it is very expensive right now and we have to go through quite a bit of optimization.
We plan to add the ability to load your own shader and will ship more shaders will the tool asap. In the meantime I would recommend working using the medium quality setting as it will give the best quality/speed ratio.
Importing bitmaps is kind of cumbersome right now. You have to import them in your shelf first and then use a Fill layer to use them. That is going to change obviously.
Masking is one of our top priority in the coming weeks too.
Just gave it a whirl on my older workstation. It was pretty great looking, slow as molasses, but cool. Then my machine shut itself off in dispair at all the calculations without even a blue screen.
I'll have to check it out on the more modern 8 core machine later.
Just tried it on my work computer for about 5 minutes, it took all the particle brush abuse quite well - oooh they are fun! (6 core AMD / 8 gigs / Radeon 7900)
Later this weekend I'll give you some feedback on how well Painter works on tablets (notably my Surface Pro 2), since that's obviously where I'd love to see it succeed.
About pricing, we had to put a price for the commercial version because we knew people would ask for one, but it is not set in stone and we will soon give more details about tthe commercial version, what kind of deal Designer licensees can get, etc.
I hope $590 is not a final commercial price. It's a bit too expensive, especially for indie devs and freelancers, a cheaper commercial license for a single person would be awesome.
- How can you reset your stencil, say if you rotate it and you want it straight again?
- How do you adjust opacity of stencils? Also to tell them to not show always/show when painting/not show when painting?
- Probably just me, can't figure out how to do simple masks by face/object/etc. Are there plans for extensive masking options like in Mari, by curvature/AO/etc.?
- Definitely needs a 2D view.
- Can't figure out what object view is actually doing, seems to select parts of the model and just colour them, is that all? I'd rather be able to select parts of the model here to mask out etc.
As Jordan. Masking is a huge task...
What I'd like to see is the ability to work on tiling textures with depth masking. IE Using height map information to control where to put painting. It could work on fill up to or fill until, so let's say I have bricks and mortar, select fill up to and fill my mortar with greyish color, then switch to fill until and fill my bricks until it reaches the mortar, but just before, so I can fill my bricks, then fill layering so I can add details in the cracks, with a tolerance so from .2 to .3 black (or white) it's painting the details. Now that would be awesome.
As for the interface, man those icons are HUGE. Filled space for nothing to me. Streamline it a bit more a la PS. Small icons on the side for different tools and let me customize them in a window docked on the right when selected, or get me a shortcut to display the customize palette and free up some space.
No fill function on a layer? Choose color and fill it. Or even better, procedural color, so I can iterate quickly (especially important for roughness). Typically in Mari I setup a bunch of colors and mask them with my painting...I use a lot of add mask from alpha from my diffuse, then copy / paste that mask into a procedural color layer so I have exact values (IR I use .2 color, mask it with the alpha of a stain from my diffuse, I know my stain will be .2 fading to whatever underneath, and I usually clamp the levels of my mask with levels and so on).
Adjustments? Levels, HSV, and so on? I am spoiled with Mari with all the adjustment layers and stacks.
Layer palette is confusing to me. Just do it a la PS. No need to display that big square texture.
Alt click a layer to isolate as diffuse a la mudbox. I love this feature.
Ability to control paint / brush as mentionned above, but follow brush stroke direction? I couldn't find it.
Particles seems hard to control, I sometimes want to reduce the number of them, I especially don't want to be able to paint on all meshes when spawning particles. Can you add an option like "constraint to mesh element" so we can only paint on one "object" without affecting others?
Isolate function. Over on top of a mesh element press key and bam, isolated. Press key again to display everything bak. Could work with UV shelves as well.
Zooming is atrociously slow here. Let me customize how fast I want to zoom.
Free rotation camera. Thanks god! I personally love this feature (a la modo trackball). =D
That's it for now but I am sure I will have mannny more comments as I am using it.
- How can you reset your stencil, say if you rotate it and you want it straight again?
- How do you adjust opacity of stencils? Also to tell them to not show always/show when painting/not show when painting?
- Probably just me, can't figure out how to do simple masks by face/object/etc. Are there plans for extensive masking options like in Mari, by curvature/AO/etc.?
- Definitely needs a 2D view.
- Can't figure out what object view is actually doing, seems to select parts of the model and just colour them, is that all? I'd rather be able to select parts of the model here to mask out etc.
- No hide/unhide features for the model.
Loving this so far!
-You can find jittering options in the advanced Brush settings rollout (click twice on the brush rollout).
-No way to reset a stencil for now.
-You can use the selection tool to mask by element, simply hit T and then select the selection tool to maks out parts of the object by face or element (I to invert the mask, T to come back to painting, Y to reset).
Globally the selection tool is really early and robust masking is in our short term pipe.
-2D view will be there.
-No hide feature yet indeed.
@fr0gg1e: You can use the little B icon on top of the layer stack to create a Fill layer, in which you can set a different color or bitmap for each channel. You will soon be able to load substances in those too.
As a side note, we decided to allow the use of the Non-Commercial version for people generating less than $10K per year in revenue, so indies or people doing freelancing on the side can use the non-commercial version for their projects for example.
As a side note, we decided to allow the use of the Non-Commercial version for people generating less than $10K per year in revenue, so indies or people doing freelancing on the side can use the non-commercial version for their projects for example.
That. is. awesome.
Is this strictly for Painter, or also for other tools?
Replies
Thanks for your help! But whithin the "add new game" window, I find two versions of substance designer, substance player, but no substance painter
Exactly, as soon as you don't disclose any confidential info about the tool itself and its functionnalities, you're fine showing what you produce with it.
cman2k: Looking nice btw
Then 'Activate a product on Steam'
Finally type in your code and it should work, came up for me earlier
for someone who isn´t used to Steam, this is not very obvious!
Well done everyone at Allegorithmic! Can't wait to see how this evolves.
You need to be part of the beta group that were invited to test it, you're then sent a code which you can use in steam to activate it.
In Steam library, right click Substance Painter and go to 'View Community Hub'
The approach we want to take with Painter is the same as the one we have been successfully taking with Designer over the last 2 years: bringing the product early to customers and be very open and careful about feedback to make sure our development efforts go in the right direction and are as efficient as possible, by focusing on iteration and interaction with the community.
The Beta will be introduced on Steam at a very(!) low price, and purchasing the beta will give access to the full non-commercial version once it is released. Those who don't want to use Steam at that point will be able to download a standalone version.
People who want to upgrade to the commercial version later on will be able to do so too.
A free trial version will also be available during the Beta.
You can help us spread the word through this link.
Good luck with the open beta!
Looking forward to continuing to play with it, and even more to the day it can replace 3dcoat
I want it nao
[ame="
Is 2048 the maximum resolution for the document?
Is multi uv tile supported?
One thing I'd love to see though, is procedural brushes,
not necessarily based on actual particles, but kinda like Krita has or harmony.
Right now the physics brushes feel a little too random to me, but I guess it's just a matter of proper setup, masking etc.
I'm curious what other people do with it.
+1 on the 2k question, is it just for the trial?
At the moment 2048 is the maximum but they've said they want to increase this .
multi UV tiles aren't supported yet, but they want to add this as well.
$590
We were actually told it would be much less than the cost of Substance Designer.
What happened guys?
"Hi guys, Jerc from Allegorithmic here. Just wanted to address a few concerns
...
As for the price, I can't give you specifics now, but Painter will be much less expensive than Designer and we will also have a very cheap non commercial license."
Not that its necessarily the end of the world, but once its starts getting closer to the cost of mudbox, then expectations in functionality start to go up, which is a given. :-)
There was also some mention of a lower price for current Substance Designer users. I wonder if thats still on the table.
I am already using a combo of Topogun to bake normal and AO, then use Knald to process the normal and output some neat little masks that I use inside of Mari, either as layer masks or channel masks but I organize my meshes / UVs so all connected parts are on the same udim, most of the time when possible depending on final res on screen.
Would be cool to know if I can import multiple meshes. I don't mind painting on UV Range 0 to 1 as long as I can export my maps as xxx.1001.tif/ png / psd or whatever, xxx.1002.tif and so on. I setup all my baking like this for Topogun anyway and import everything back into Mari at one point...So let's say I'd like to be able to paint on a cylinder, cut the cylinder in half before exporting, to match my udims, then setup 2 "materials" and paint on both of them at the same time. Would that be possible? If yes I might give it a shot...Hell I might give it a shot anyway on some simple props at one point. We'll see if I can cheat the system in a way or another =P
Seems pretty snappy, was painting 2k texture on a 70k model.
Want higher res, 4k at least.
Rendering is slooooooow, whatever method being used for PBR chugs the whole app. Painting was MUCH more responsive when I switched to single channel, even if i set to Low quality.
That being said why is there no phong style lighting?! Its insanely cheap and gives the artist information about shape.
I may be missing it but there's hardly any masking options. I want to mask by view angle, noise, I Want to mask by another layer while I paint.
I couldnt figure out if I could import a texture I made outside of the program as a new layer. I would like to be able to import something as a starting point and go from there. Or import my AO as a layer, then use that layer as a mask while I paint.
The standard brush options are super minimal, would like to be able to adjust splatter, rotation, stretching etc....
You can't yet use images as layer masks but it was mentioned frequently in the closed beta so it probably won't be too far off.
I haven't heard anything specific but since there's a free trial available I assume it is fine to talk about.
I believe you have to change the PBR quality to a higher setting, and it should start showing you the full rez.
About pricing, we had to put a price for the commercial version because we knew people would ask for one, but it is not set in stone and we will soon give more details about tthe commercial version, what kind of deal Designer licensees can get, etc.
Particles quality depends on 2 main parameters. The size of the brush, a smaller size will spawn sharper particle streaks, and the dt parameter in the particle settings. The lower that value, the higher the framerate of the particle simulation. Careful though, an extremely low value will slow down performances quite a bit.
As for the PBR shader, yes it is very expensive right now and we have to go through quite a bit of optimization.
We plan to add the ability to load your own shader and will ship more shaders will the tool asap. In the meantime I would recommend working using the medium quality setting as it will give the best quality/speed ratio.
Importing bitmaps is kind of cumbersome right now. You have to import them in your shelf first and then use a Fill layer to use them. That is going to change obviously.
Masking is one of our top priority in the coming weeks too.
I'll have to check it out on the more modern 8 core machine later.
Later this weekend I'll give you some feedback on how well Painter works on tablets (notably my Surface Pro 2), since that's obviously where I'd love to see it succeed.
I hope $590 is not a final commercial price. It's a bit too expensive, especially for indie devs and freelancers, a cheaper commercial license for a single person would be awesome.
- How can you reset your stencil, say if you rotate it and you want it straight again?
- How do you adjust opacity of stencils? Also to tell them to not show always/show when painting/not show when painting?
- Probably just me, can't figure out how to do simple masks by face/object/etc. Are there plans for extensive masking options like in Mari, by curvature/AO/etc.?
- Definitely needs a 2D view.
- Can't figure out what object view is actually doing, seems to select parts of the model and just colour them, is that all? I'd rather be able to select parts of the model here to mask out etc.
- No hide/unhide features for the model.
Loving this so far!
What I'd like to see is the ability to work on tiling textures with depth masking. IE Using height map information to control where to put painting. It could work on fill up to or fill until, so let's say I have bricks and mortar, select fill up to and fill my mortar with greyish color, then switch to fill until and fill my bricks until it reaches the mortar, but just before, so I can fill my bricks, then fill layering so I can add details in the cracks, with a tolerance so from .2 to .3 black (or white) it's painting the details. Now that would be awesome.
As for the interface, man those icons are HUGE. Filled space for nothing to me. Streamline it a bit more a la PS. Small icons on the side for different tools and let me customize them in a window docked on the right when selected, or get me a shortcut to display the customize palette and free up some space.
No fill function on a layer? Choose color and fill it. Or even better, procedural color, so I can iterate quickly (especially important for roughness). Typically in Mari I setup a bunch of colors and mask them with my painting...I use a lot of add mask from alpha from my diffuse, then copy / paste that mask into a procedural color layer so I have exact values (IR I use .2 color, mask it with the alpha of a stain from my diffuse, I know my stain will be .2 fading to whatever underneath, and I usually clamp the levels of my mask with levels and so on).
Adjustments? Levels, HSV, and so on? I am spoiled with Mari with all the adjustment layers and stacks.
Layer palette is confusing to me. Just do it a la PS. No need to display that big square texture.
Alt click a layer to isolate as diffuse a la mudbox. I love this feature.
Ability to control paint / brush as mentionned above, but follow brush stroke direction? I couldn't find it.
Particles seems hard to control, I sometimes want to reduce the number of them, I especially don't want to be able to paint on all meshes when spawning particles. Can you add an option like "constraint to mesh element" so we can only paint on one "object" without affecting others?
Isolate function. Over on top of a mesh element press key and bam, isolated. Press key again to display everything bak. Could work with UV shelves as well.
Zooming is atrociously slow here. Let me customize how fast I want to zoom.
Free rotation camera. Thanks god! I personally love this feature (a la modo trackball). =D
That's it for now but I am sure I will have mannny more comments as I am using it.
-You can find jittering options in the advanced Brush settings rollout (click twice on the brush rollout).
-No way to reset a stencil for now.
-You can use the selection tool to mask by element, simply hit T and then select the selection tool to maks out parts of the object by face or element (I to invert the mask, T to come back to painting, Y to reset).
Globally the selection tool is really early and robust masking is in our short term pipe.
-2D view will be there.
-No hide feature yet indeed.
@fr0gg1e: You can use the little B icon on top of the layer stack to create a Fill layer, in which you can set a different color or bitmap for each channel. You will soon be able to load substances in those too.
As a side note, we decided to allow the use of the Non-Commercial version for people generating less than $10K per year in revenue, so indies or people doing freelancing on the side can use the non-commercial version for their projects for example.
That. is. awesome.
Is this strictly for Painter, or also for other tools?