Thank you guys. I can't install Maya since I don't have the info for registering with an educational license from the school yet, I'll get that once the course starts. And yes, it has an SSD. I guess we won't be doing any rendering in the beginning, if we do I'll look into rendering on another rig.
Finally joining the SSD wagon, but have a couple questions regarding nvme pcie speeds. I'm considering getting two separate ssd (one for OS/Apps, one for project files)...
Would it make sense to have project files on the faster pcie gen4 slot and leave the OS/Apps on the slower pcie gen3?
Considering substance painter files are measured in gigabytes and .ztl files also getting up there as well. I'm curious if there would be any performance detriment for having windows on a slower drive?
Or maybe just have everything on one large ssd is best?
And then there's DRam: need it on one, both, none, is it even worth it?
If your working files are large as you say, then put it on the faster drive. Not sure how much of a gain you will get, but I see a difference when things load/save or when I copy files from one drive to another.
M.2 nvme's are the way to go on the PCIE gen4.
I would for sure have two SSD's in the machine. In mine I run 3: OS, Artwork, Games.
A couple of years ago I've built a PC according to the recommendations from this topic. Thanks to PolyHertz, I was fully satisfied with it's perfomance. The thing is, I have to swich from my desk PC to the laptop. Could anyone suggest the reliable laptop model that can compete with my current setup? I'm planning to use it mostly for Zbrush, Marvelous Designer and Substance Painter. The screen size and unplugged working time is not much of importance. Here's my current build, although I'm thinking upgrading videocard to somewhat newer:
AMD Ryzen 7 3700X
nVidia GeForce RTX2070 ASUS PCI-E 8192Mb (DUAL-RTX2070-8G-EVO)
These days, mid level branded gaming chasis do seem to offer a performant selection of choice for the budget conscious content creator but that's really dependant on what you're prepared too spend.
For example, here's a couple of comparable portable options although as an aside after currency conversion will turn out to be quite an expensive outlay, especially where I live in Australia, so bought a Gigabyte R7 K1 17.3" instead.
2022 MSI GE76 Raider 17.3" - $2000USD
or
2022 ASUS ROG Strix G17 17.3" - $1889USD
And both laptops also ship with a GeForce RTX3060 GPU, 2TB SSD plus 64GB RAM.
Hello! I was looking to build my first desktop PC, which I'd like to feel more beefy than my current work laptop. I'd be using the PC for creating, rendering high fidelity characters in UE5 (rendering XGen-created hair) while screen sharing for online lessons, and maybe streaming.
Current work laptop is an Acer ConceptD (Intel i7-10875H, Quadro RTX3000, 32 RAM)
I took the mid-tier build as a base to build my PC. I would be willing to pay for a RTX A4000 if it means more VRAM and much lower power costs, so I selected that instead of the 3080:
CPU: Ryzen 5900X
RAM: 64GB (2x32GB at 3200 CL16)
GPU: PNY RTX A4000 16GB
SSD: 2TB Samsung 980 Pro (or WD_BLACK SN850)
MOBO: MSI MAG X570S Tomahawk Max WiFi
CPU Cooler: Scythe Fuma 2 Rev.B (or Noctua NH-D15)
Tower: Corsair 4000D
Power: EVGA SuperNOVA G6 (850W, Gold rated)
Something that would be very important to me is if the PC had USB-C Thunderbolt connectivity - I use a Dell Docking Station with my laptop, which has my 2 monitors, keyboard, Ethernet cable and mouse plugged in. Ideally, I want to re-use all these for my desktop PC by just plugging in the Dell cable, thus why the USB-C THB port would be important. Does the mid-tier build allow for this, or do I need anything extra?
Other than that, could anyone offer their thoughts on this build? Thank you for your time!
@Justo I Just skimmed through your specs, but I would reconsider your GPU choice. At that price point, the 3090 would be a much better choice. Yes, power consumption is higher, but it is CONSIDERABLY faster, and has 24 GB of VRAM (compared to 16 on the A4000). Maybe I missed it, but it looks like you didn't specify a CPU. The RTX 4000 series is also right around the corner, so if you don't need to upgrade immediately, it might be wise to hold off to see how that launch plays out.
@Brandon.LaFrance Hey Brandon, thanks for your input. CPU is a Ryzen 5900X (just copied from the mid-tier build, but willing to change it if benefits are really worth it).
Regarding the 3090, you're right that it's considerably faster...But its power costs are more than double (triple?) the amount of an RTX A4000. In my eyes, doing so should in theory mean at least double the performance gains too, but from what I see it's at most a 40% increase in some specific tasks, most notably at baking/rendering, or moving around in Blender's viewport using Cycles with Denoising.
I would love to have a clear answer and no doubts on this, but the truth is I feel like my opinion can be swayed. As it stands though, I currently don't see the sense in it? Though a lot more powerful, a 3090's ultimate benefits I think are things I can live without for now...And I would feel hella dirty when subd modeling or cutting UVs thinking I'm consuming so much more than with a less-TDP card. As for the 40-xx cards, its even more power and money, which I think leaves it outside of my consideration...Seems like an RTX A4000 is already a big leap from an RTX Quadro 3000?
I would really appreciate it though if anyone lets me know I'm being crazy and why. Obviously I'm just trying to make the decision I won't regret at least 5 yrs from now.
If power draw is a major concern, I'd recommend looking into undervolting. A 3090 for instance can run at as much as 100W below stock if you want it to. The upcoming 4080 16GB would also be a decent option depending on if 16GB of VRAM is enough for your needs, and assuming it can undervolt as well as Ampere cards.
@PolyHertz Thank you for your insight. Considering 6GB VRAM with my current work laptop is enough to preview and render characters in UE5 (though it needs to be said I often experience crashes...), I was thinking 16GB should give me a considerable margin to work a lot smoother. Regarding the 3090, again I fall into the question of whether I really need those 24GB of VRAM, which I believe I don't. Undervolting it 100W, to sth like 250W, would make it worth getting though, but from what I read, it's not always guaranteed your card will be able to do this? Hence why ppl call this the silicon lottery. And even if you do this, afaik you need to recognize when the GPU has degraded enough that you need to adjust voltage/clocks, which I don't trust myself to be able to do, thus why UV sounds like a dangerous option?
I was not aware of the 4080 16GB specifics...It shares some of the same specs as the RTXA4000 (same VRAM, same memory bus...), and consumes 200%+ power, but it certainly would be great to have, specially considering it's such a brand new model and architecture.
A lot of suggestions are being given to replace the RTX A4000. Is it really just a bad choice, considering the other products out there? Am I the only one that'd feel dirty paying higher electricity bills amidst energy crisis times, even though I can pay for it?
Lastly, would anyone know about this USB-C Thunderbolt connectivity point I made in the first post? How to make sure what I'm buying allows for it?
Thank you again for reading, and any time you take to share your thoughts.
Undervolting is the extremely safe opposite of overclocking, and with very minor reductions to clock speed having huge reductions in power usage. Depending on the software used, it's often just setting a power target percentage and saving. You don't need to tune anything or set voltages yourself. The GPU crashes in UE5 are rarer when undervolting as well, I recall seeing the reason for these crashes Epic developers believe is a driver issue, but Nvidia claims it's working correctly so Epic will have to compensate and make changes to how the engine uses their GPUs.
This computer purchase seems rather unfortunately timed since there's not only a new generation of GPUs from Nvidia about to come out but also new Ryzen processors from AMD (incompatible with the older generation boards).
3090's seem quite 'cheap' right now in Euroland, probably quite a bit less than the 16 GB RTX 4080 or whatever its called will be. I was also considering to pick one up but size and power/cooling constraints don't make it sound worthwhile. I actually like the idea of going with a Quadro instead of some gaming monster and suspect it might turn out more reliable in hard- and software - but its going to be last gen really soon.
Thank you everyone for sharing your thoughts - it really helps me to come to terms to what do I want with this purchase, and why. Undervolting does sound like a safe thing to do. The new generations of GPUs and Ryzen processors only make me feel more reassured I'm OK without them.
Something that is really important to me is Thunderbolt connectivity - the MSI MAG X570S Tomahawk Max WiFi I took from @PolyHertz 's build suggestions does not support TH technology. Apparently they did during their release, but after BIOS 1.20, they literally stopped functioning. MSI's page on this mobo doesn't mention anything about thunderbolt connectivity either. Can anyone offer a good replacement for this?
The good news is that the 4090 can be voltage limited to under 300W and still get over 90% of its full performance. In fact, it's most efficient when limited to around 220W. Do note however that the lower you go the more stuttering / framerate spikes can be introduced to realtime 3D apps / games, as some frames are harder to generate then others and will take longer with strict power limits. https://www.reddit.com/r/nvidia/comments/ybl2tb/rtx_4090_performance_per_watt_graph/
Are 3d artists still pretty much tied to CUDA and RTX?
I've got my new build up and running but still recycling my 1060 6gb. I was going to replace it when nvidia prices are more reasonable, or when the 1060 just dies...whichever comes first :P
Radeons sure look enticing right about now. Intel Arc 16gb as well...although I might just be asking for trouble for the latter.
For Unreal Engine, unless you're using the Nvidia plugins, none of the ray tracing is exclusive to RTX, it's all DXR based. Dunno how performance will be with the new AMD GPUs though. The larger vram pools with AMD are nice though.
RTX aside long before that we were already tied to Nvidia's drivers - I don't think that's changed.... has it?
How many posts have been made over the years in this forum alone about some viewport- or UV editor refresh or selection issue in one application or another and then it turns out the user was running an AMD GPU. Heathen!
If you want to use stable diffusion (to critic your work, give ideas on your character/Environment) then nvidia is the way to go. Doesn't work great on amd or might not even at all.
Also now I would recommend the intel i9 13900k or 7950x. The generational jump was in both single core and multicore performance too big to ignore.
With the 13900k you can still use ddr4 which is fine. Speaking of I would recommend at least 64gb, but honestly, depending on what you do this is not even enough. 128gb is needed for ZBrush, especially for detailed characters and environmental decoration with displacement maps. If you go 128gb ram you don't need the fastest one because it can't handle high speeds anyway.
For ssd a pcie 3.0 m.2 nvme is often enough with 3-4k speeds. You can also get a pcie 4.0 with 7-8k speeds but it is not that necessary. Samsung m.2 have often the best speeds and a good type of memory but you can also get something like megafastro. I wouldn't go below tlc.
For Intel I would get a midrange z690 board like the tomahawk z690 on the used market. You find deals there for 120-200 bucks.
PSU you now need at least 850w. I got myself a 1200w because it was just a couple dollars more expensive and ideally you wanna run them between 50-80% usage. I recommend getting a platinum, titanium is often too expensive and lower is kinda a waste with those high energy cost in europe.
Ideally you want to use an Aio or custom water cooling for the 13900k but you can still get away with a big noctua air cooler (depends on motherboard but a 12 is mostly possible) and a shit ton of case fan. I recommend the P12 PWM PST A-RGB and the p14. You only hear them when you zremesh, decimate or something similar. It is important that you get the a-rgb ones because the ones without RGB are way worse.
For graphic card... well it is a clown fiesta. Ofc. the 4090 is the best but it is twice as expensive as it should be. People speculate that the 4080 might get cheaper after christmas because of amd but idk man. Used market is also full of graphic card scammer so this is not really an option either. It just sucks.
@jomaa Yea I need to update the first post with the new GPU's and CPU's.
For GPU's; 4090's a monster but it's still tough to get at MSRP depending where you live. I think for the next step down I'd still generally recommend the 3090 for artists over the 4080 just because of how much more vram the 3090 has while being very close performance wise. However like you said, the used market is kind of a mess atm so getting cards from there is risky.
For CPU's; Both new Intel and AMD CPU's run quite hot, so yea water cooling is probably the way to go for high end builds now (I'm generally in favor of air cooling, but standard temps are just getting too high). And while their is a performance uplift, it's certainly no where near as significant as people were hoping. The rumors atm are that AMD will be releasing 16 core CPU's with V-Cache (7950X3D) within a month or two, which should offer a more substantial performance uplift in certain workloads.
For RAM; AMD seems to be hitting a wall with RAM speeds past DDR5 6000, so anything faster then that should be avoided on AMD builds atm. Either way, DDR5 is still quite a bit more expensive then DDR4, so Intel builds are going to be better for those on a limited budget atm.
If dlss had similar benefits for production work as in gaming, then a 4090 would make sense. But prices are still whack. I can't believe that scalper pricing is still a thing...even on last gen cards.
I just went from haswell to 12th gen, and for everyday busywork it's not a huge jump. Except when it comes to rendering hi-poly zbrush sculpts in keyshot, it's night and day!
I've recently changed the case for a better passage of the air and also added other fans and changed the power supply so you can find my current and updated build there:
CPU: Intel i7-6700k
RAM: 16GB (2x8GB 2.100MHz at CL15)
GPU: Geforce 1060 8GB
SSD: 256 GB SanDisk
Secondary HDD: 1TB Seagate ST1000DM003 1SB102
MOBO: Thimphu (??)
Tower: Noua Orizon M3
Power: EVGA 600 BR, 80+ BRONZE 600W
These are some of the problems that I have in my pipeline:
- Toooo much time when I import my decimated mesh from ZBrush to Maya
- Sometimes the bake from highpoly to lowpoly on Marmoset toolbag are very slow
- When I work with Substance Painter with 2k+ texture I can see in the Windows Task Manager that Memory hits the 70-80% and it lag so much
I want to upgrade my setup to work in a less stressful way possible, can you help me find out which components I need to replace? Thank you!
@KICKBACK The best course of action atp would be to just buy a new PC, as basically every part on your PC is due for an upgrade. If that's not possible right now, at a minimum I'd replace the RAM with a 32GB or 64GB kit (4x16GB) of DDR4, and get a better GPU (such as a Geforce 3060 or better), though keep in mind depending on the GPU you may also need a better power supply.
I agree with @PolyHertz, I think that mobo maxes out at 32GB ram.
32GB ram
3060 (450wPSU, so you are OK)
1TB SSD for your work files
For the OS HDD (256GB) to save space, use your platter HDD (Seagate) for your Documents, Photos, Music, Downloads, Videos folders that Windows uses by default. This also comes in handy when you want to nuke the PC and start new.
Thank you guys, I had the feeling that I had to replace everything..
I want to do a full upgrade so I was looking at the examples of PolyHertz in the first page and I was thinking to go with the last build (Under 1200$) I've seen that the ram and the gpu are the same you already mentioned so.. I think it's a good way to go?
Anyone using an ultrawide monitor? My second monitor took an oculus rift controller to the face and died. I'm considering replacing both monitors with an ultrawide, but not sure how that works and feels with sizing / snapping window panels. I like the ability to quickly snap windows to half, full and quarter size of each monitor in Windows 10. Also concerned about losing color accuracy as most utlrawides seem geared towards gaming (which I'll use it for, but not its primary function).
I replaced all my screens with (curved) ultrawides a while back - no regrets here. Color accuracy might be an issue if you are coming from fairly high end pre-calibrated 'artist' screens. I came from Eizo, LG and NEC office monitors similar to what just about every workplace I've been at used and colors seem fine on the Dell U3818 office-level ultrawides I'm using now. I had a smaller LG ultrawide as well that was fine (and with perfectly even backlight - that's one to look out for in ultrawides in my experience).
These are not high refresh rate gamer monitors however.
More freedom when arranging windows, less monitor stands, cables, power and heat-output are the perks for me.
Window snapping is not my expertise but I believe there are thirdparty tools out there that allow the screen to be configured into zones. LG bundled one but I never tried it out. Regular Windows snapping works too. Not sure what that one can do either.
I bought an ultrawide with the thought of consolidation of my two 24" 16x10's... it didn't last long due to the aspect ratio of my apps when snapping. I ended up with a 24" 4k on the side. If apps could better remember positions, I would maybe go to a single UW. Another thing is that there aren't any tablets that are in UW configuration, you end up doing one of three things: drawing a portion of the screen in 16:9 and you have to switch to the mouse for stuff outside of that space, snap windows for the apps to fit that 16:9 box or drawing in an odd aspect and compensating for it.
I kind of regret the AW38 Ultrawide due to the fact that it doesn't have PIP/SBS or dual display (which I need now), but it's a great display none the less.
Here's a console related question that probably doesn't warrant its own thread. If inappropriate, let me know and I'll delete here and dig out my Reddit handle: Can I use a Dualshock 4 pad from the PS4 to control a PS4 game on the PS5?
Four years on I still have Death Stranding in my queue and would finally like to get around to playing it. Preferably without the turbo fan noise from the PS4 (Pro) though but very much while using a controller with back buttons (I have the back button attachment for the DS4).
PS5 is quiet but has no back buttons on the controller. Is there a way here to combine the best of both worlds?
I don't really know what that has to do with PC building/upgrading, but yes you can use a DS4 on the PS5 (I've done it before to play Astrobot on PS5 since it required the lightbar).
I don't really know what that has to do with PC building/upgrading, but yes you can use a DS4 on the PS5 (I've done it before to play Astrobot on PS5 since it required the lightbar).
Well, if I had to reach just a little - isn't the Playstation some kind of high end Linux PC, apparently suitable to control WMD? That's what they told me!
Anyway, sounds great, thanks! I really can't handle controllers without back buttons anymore.
Hey, I am in need of upgrading my PC and have found a build that I think matches my needs according to the first post on this thread:
- Cooler Master Masterbox TD500 Mesh V2 Mid Tower - MSI GeForce RTX 4070 VENTUS 3X E OC - AMD Ryzen 7 7700X CPU Tray - Akasa Soho H4 Plus Cooler - Kingston FURY Beast DDR5 5600MHz 32GB - Kingston M.2 NV2 PCIe 4.0 NVMe SSD 2TB - ASUS TUF Gaming B650-PLUS WIFI Motherboard (I will also move over my 1TB SSD + 1TB HDD to this motherboard) - ASUS TUF Gaming 850W Gold PSU - Windows 11 - 3 year guarantee
I am studying to create 3D Game Art, specifically weapons, for my portfolio (https://www.artstation.com/alexanderlindberg). I use Blender with a non-destructive workflow and work with millions of triangles, that includes the modifiers Remesh and Smooth Corrective which take a grand deal of performance. I also use Substance Painter and work with 4K textures. I render my models in Marmoset Toolbag and export most renders with 10000 x 5500 pixels, with the highest settings on. Now, with the specs I have listed, would it be a good build to invest in?
It's a good PC, better then a lot of artists use. The 32GB of RAM might limit you though depending on just how dense your meshs are (if we're talking scenes with 100's of millions of tris then 32GB wont be enough). In Substance Painter you might be VRAM limited at 4K depending on how many layers you're working with, but thankfully Substance is all vector paint so you can just work in 2K and scale up to 4K at the end.
It's a good PC, better then a lot of artists use. The 32GB of RAM might limit you though depending on just how dense your meshs are (if we're talking scenes with 100's of millions of tris then 32GB wont be enough). In Substance Painter you might be VRAM limited at 4K depending on how many layers you're working with, but thankfully Substance is all vector paint so you can just work in 2K and scale up to 4K at the end.
I think my models will only scale up to max 30 million if I work on some advance weapon in high poly so 32 GB ram should be enough. As for Painter, I have managed to work with 4K on 8gb VRAM but it gets quite laggy when many layers are getting used so I would think that 12 would enough. Thanks for the input!
Hi everyone! I´d like to get an advice on buying new RAM for my PC. This is what I have right now:
MB: ASUS TUF Z390-Pro Gaming CPU: i5-9600K GPU: Nvidia GeForce GTX 1650 Super Drives: Samsung SSD 970 EVO Plus 500 GB (system/installs) / Samsung SSD 860 EVO 500 GB (files/saves) RAM: HyperX 16GB KIT (2x8 GB) DDR4 3200 MHz CL15 FURY series OS: Windows 10
What I have now is quite sufficient, but I´d like to achieve more fluid performance in ZBrush, especially with Sculptris Pro mode on (I always envy people who can work on multimillion meshes so smoothly in scuptris pro mode). Other than that I´m quite fine, although I plan to work with Marmoset more often (smart materials) so perhaps there could be some benefits to that as well, but ZBrush is really my focus right now.
- Would more RAM be a significant upgrade or am I limited by other parts anyway? - I´m thinking about buying 32GB (2x16GB). Or would it be for some technical reason better to add another 2x8GB to what I have now? (could 4x8 be better with my MB than 2x16? or maybe would the old 2x8 work together with new 2x16?) - If it would make sense to buy new RAM - what should I keep in mind regarding my other specs? (there are some "CL-16, CL-18..." god knows what that means... I´m never going to understand these things, I´m probably looking for someone to tell me what to do and I´ll just have to trust you.. )
@ghost-d If you're often using all of your ram then upgrading to 2x16GB will help. That said zbrush performance is mostly determined by the number of CPU cores.
Heya! Was wondering if anyone can offer any advice on a new graphics card? I only use it for Substance/Mari painting but would like to do some GPU rendering in Arnold to make look dev quicker before rendering final images out using CPU. Also wanna get in Unreal. Think my graphics card is roughly 6 years old and maybe its time for an upgrade though. Heres my specs and any thoughts would be appreciated
@obloquy It depends entirely on your budget. Substance especially loves large amounts of vram, so ideally you'd want something with 12GB or more. The 4070 for $600 has 12GB of vram and is about twice as fast as your 1080. The Geforce 4090 w/24GB of vram is the king atm, but it also costs a kings ransom ($1600 minimum). There's also some rumors that new 'Super' variants of the Geforce cards will be coming out soon, but nothing confirmed on that atm.
Hey! The 4070 12 GB sounds pretty reasonable in terms of budget, just finding SP and Mari are becoming slower these days and its time for a change but not sure I'd be willing to go for the 4090 haha! Is there a difference between the 4070 Windforce vs 4070 Gaming apart from a minor price difference?
The Gigabyte Geforce 4070 Gaming OC is built a little better and runs a bit quieter + cooler then the Windforce OC. If the price difference isn't much I'd go for the Gaming OC.
With the NVIDIA 5090 on the horizon, it's an exciting time for anyone planning a PC upgrade. The 5090’s rumored massive VRAM and architectural improvements are poised to redefine workflows in GPU-heavy applications like UE5, Blender, and Substance. If you're on the fence about waiting for the 5090 or grabbing a 4090, it's worth considering how significant your VRAM needs will be for future-proofing.
cgifurniturecom The 5090 is rumored to have 28GB of VRAM, which is just 4GB more then the 4090, so not sure why you'd think that is "poised to redefine workflows" ? There were some rumors that Nvidia was working on a Titan class card with 48GB of VRAM, but even if they were true that would be in a whole other price bracket over the 5090.
Replies
Thank you guys. I can't install Maya since I don't have the info for registering with an educational license from the school yet, I'll get that once the course starts. And yes, it has an SSD. I guess we won't be doing any rendering in the beginning, if we do I'll look into rendering on another rig.
Finally joining the SSD wagon, but have a couple questions regarding nvme pcie speeds. I'm considering getting two separate ssd (one for OS/Apps, one for project files)...
Would it make sense to have project files on the faster pcie gen4 slot and leave the OS/Apps on the slower pcie gen3?
Considering substance painter files are measured in gigabytes and .ztl files also getting up there as well. I'm curious if there would be any performance detriment for having windows on a slower drive?
Or maybe just have everything on one large ssd is best?
And then there's DRam: need it on one, both, none, is it even worth it?
Thank you kindly for any thoughts and opinions!
If your working files are large as you say, then put it on the faster drive. Not sure how much of a gain you will get, but I see a difference when things load/save or when I copy files from one drive to another.
M.2 nvme's are the way to go on the PCIE gen4.
I would for sure have two SSD's in the machine. In mine I run 3: OS, Artwork, Games.
Good luck.
A couple of years ago I've built a PC according to the recommendations from this topic. Thanks to PolyHertz, I was fully satisfied with it's perfomance. The thing is, I have to swich from my desk PC to the laptop. Could anyone suggest the reliable laptop model that can compete with my current setup? I'm planning to use it mostly for Zbrush, Marvelous Designer and Substance Painter. The screen size and unplugged working time is not much of importance. Here's my current build, although I'm thinking upgrading videocard to somewhat newer:
AMD Ryzen 7 3700X
nVidia GeForce RTX2070 ASUS PCI-E 8192Mb (DUAL-RTX2070-8G-EVO)
MSI MPG X570 GAMING EDGE WIFI (AM4, ATX)
2 X Kingston HX430C16FB3-32
Fractal Design Meshify C–TG (FD-CA-MESH-C-BKO-TGL)
SAMSUNG 2.5" 860 EVO 1000 Гб SATA III (MZ-76E1T0)
WD Blue 2Tb WD20EZAZ
Sea Sonic 750W SSR-750FX
Deepcool GAMMAXX GTE V2
These days, mid level branded gaming chasis do seem to offer a performant selection of choice for the budget conscious content creator but that's really dependant on what you're prepared too spend.
For example, here's a couple of comparable portable options although as an aside after currency conversion will turn out to be quite an expensive outlay, especially where I live in Australia, so bought a Gigabyte R7 K1 17.3" instead.
2022 MSI GE76 Raider 17.3" - $2000USD
or
2022 ASUS ROG Strix G17 17.3" - $1889USD
And both laptops also ship with a GeForce RTX3060 GPU, 2TB SSD plus 64GB RAM.
https://www.reinisfischer.com/top-20-laptops-64gb-ram-gaming-business
Yeah. Maybe not a huge difference between gen4/gen3, at least in real-world perception. (But a huge one from my current 7200rpm hdd)
Thanks, mate!
And I'll most likely opt for the DRam cache. Perusing reddit a bit, they seem to suggest them as higher end drives (according to their ssd tier list).
Thanks for the advice, sacboi! I myself was considering Asus Strix G17. By the way, great link, I'll definitely check it out!
Hello! I was looking to build my first desktop PC, which I'd like to feel more beefy than my current work laptop. I'd be using the PC for creating, rendering high fidelity characters in UE5 (rendering XGen-created hair) while screen sharing for online lessons, and maybe streaming.
Current work laptop is an Acer ConceptD (Intel i7-10875H, Quadro RTX3000, 32 RAM)
I took the mid-tier build as a base to build my PC. I would be willing to pay for a RTX A4000 if it means more VRAM and much lower power costs, so I selected that instead of the 3080:
CPU: Ryzen 5900X
RAM: 64GB (2x32GB at 3200 CL16)
GPU: PNY RTX A4000 16GB
SSD: 2TB Samsung 980 Pro (or WD_BLACK SN850)
MOBO: MSI MAG X570S Tomahawk Max WiFi
CPU Cooler: Scythe Fuma 2 Rev.B (or Noctua NH-D15)
Tower: Corsair 4000D
Power: EVGA SuperNOVA G6 (850W, Gold rated)
Something that would be very important to me is if the PC had USB-C Thunderbolt connectivity - I use a Dell Docking Station with my laptop, which has my 2 monitors, keyboard, Ethernet cable and mouse plugged in. Ideally, I want to re-use all these for my desktop PC by just plugging in the Dell cable, thus why the USB-C THB port would be important. Does the mid-tier build allow for this, or do I need anything extra?
Other than that, could anyone offer their thoughts on this build? Thank you for your time!
@Justo I Just skimmed through your specs, but I would reconsider your GPU choice. At that price point, the 3090 would be a much better choice. Yes, power consumption is higher, but it is CONSIDERABLY faster, and has 24 GB of VRAM (compared to 16 on the A4000). Maybe I missed it, but it looks like you didn't specify a CPU. The RTX 4000 series is also right around the corner, so if you don't need to upgrade immediately, it might be wise to hold off to see how that launch plays out.
@Brandon.LaFrance Hey Brandon, thanks for your input. CPU is a Ryzen 5900X (just copied from the mid-tier build, but willing to change it if benefits are really worth it).
Regarding the 3090, you're right that it's considerably faster...But its power costs are more than double (triple?) the amount of an RTX A4000. In my eyes, doing so should in theory mean at least double the performance gains too, but from what I see it's at most a 40% increase in some specific tasks, most notably at baking/rendering, or moving around in Blender's viewport using Cycles with Denoising.
I would love to have a clear answer and no doubts on this, but the truth is I feel like my opinion can be swayed. As it stands though, I currently don't see the sense in it? Though a lot more powerful, a 3090's ultimate benefits I think are things I can live without for now...And I would feel hella dirty when subd modeling or cutting UVs thinking I'm consuming so much more than with a less-TDP card. As for the 40-xx cards, its even more power and money, which I think leaves it outside of my consideration...Seems like an RTX A4000 is already a big leap from an RTX Quadro 3000?
I would really appreciate it though if anyone lets me know I'm being crazy and why. Obviously I'm just trying to make the decision I won't regret at least 5 yrs from now.
If power draw is a major concern, I'd recommend looking into undervolting. A 3090 for instance can run at as much as 100W below stock if you want it to. The upcoming 4080 16GB would also be a decent option depending on if 16GB of VRAM is enough for your needs, and assuming it can undervolt as well as Ampere cards.
@PolyHertz Thank you for your insight. Considering 6GB VRAM with my current work laptop is enough to preview and render characters in UE5 (though it needs to be said I often experience crashes...), I was thinking 16GB should give me a considerable margin to work a lot smoother. Regarding the 3090, again I fall into the question of whether I really need those 24GB of VRAM, which I believe I don't. Undervolting it 100W, to sth like 250W, would make it worth getting though, but from what I read, it's not always guaranteed your card will be able to do this? Hence why ppl call this the silicon lottery. And even if you do this, afaik you need to recognize when the GPU has degraded enough that you need to adjust voltage/clocks, which I don't trust myself to be able to do, thus why UV sounds like a dangerous option?
I was not aware of the 4080 16GB specifics...It shares some of the same specs as the RTXA4000 (same VRAM, same memory bus...), and consumes 200%+ power, but it certainly would be great to have, specially considering it's such a brand new model and architecture.
A lot of suggestions are being given to replace the RTX A4000. Is it really just a bad choice, considering the other products out there? Am I the only one that'd feel dirty paying higher electricity bills amidst energy crisis times, even though I can pay for it?
Lastly, would anyone know about this USB-C Thunderbolt connectivity point I made in the first post? How to make sure what I'm buying allows for it?
Thank you again for reading, and any time you take to share your thoughts.
Undervolting is the extremely safe opposite of overclocking, and with very minor reductions to clock speed having huge reductions in power usage. Depending on the software used, it's often just setting a power target percentage and saving. You don't need to tune anything or set voltages yourself. The GPU crashes in UE5 are rarer when undervolting as well, I recall seeing the reason for these crashes Epic developers believe is a driver issue, but Nvidia claims it's working correctly so Epic will have to compensate and make changes to how the engine uses their GPUs.
This computer purchase seems rather unfortunately timed since there's not only a new generation of GPUs from Nvidia about to come out but also new Ryzen processors from AMD (incompatible with the older generation boards).
3090's seem quite 'cheap' right now in Euroland, probably quite a bit less than the 16 GB RTX 4080 or whatever its called will be. I was also considering to pick one up but size and power/cooling constraints don't make it sound worthwhile. I actually like the idea of going with a Quadro instead of some gaming monster and suspect it might turn out more reliable in hard- and software - but its going to be last gen really soon.
Thank you everyone for sharing your thoughts - it really helps me to come to terms to what do I want with this purchase, and why. Undervolting does sound like a safe thing to do. The new generations of GPUs and Ryzen processors only make me feel more reassured I'm OK without them.
Something that is really important to me is Thunderbolt connectivity - the MSI MAG X570S Tomahawk Max WiFi I took from @PolyHertz 's build suggestions does not support TH technology. Apparently they did during their release, but after BIOS 1.20, they literally stopped functioning. MSI's page on this mobo doesn't mention anything about thunderbolt connectivity either. Can anyone offer a good replacement for this?
EDIT: I believe a Gigabyte B550 VISION D-P ATX AM4 would offer TH ports, while also offering slightly more than the Tomahawk?
Parts List here (Potential Risks according to the disclaimers; anxiety creeping in)
For those wanting to buy a new GPU right now, here's some good news and bad news about the recently released 4090, bad news first: The power connector on Geforce 4090 has a tendency to melt! Nvidia are looking into it but atm you should only use 3rd party adapters and NOT the one provided by nvidia! https://wccftech.com/nvidia-16-pin-connector-on-geforce-rtx-4090-graphics-card-burns-up-melts-the-cable-plug/
The good news is that the 4090 can be voltage limited to under 300W and still get over 90% of its full performance. In fact, it's most efficient when limited to around 220W. Do note however that the lower you go the more stuttering / framerate spikes can be introduced to realtime 3D apps / games, as some frames are harder to generate then others and will take longer with strict power limits. https://www.reddit.com/r/nvidia/comments/ybl2tb/rtx_4090_performance_per_watt_graph/
Are 3d artists still pretty much tied to CUDA and RTX?
I've got my new build up and running but still recycling my 1060 6gb. I was going to replace it when nvidia prices are more reasonable, or when the 1060 just dies...whichever comes first :P
Radeons sure look enticing right about now. Intel Arc 16gb as well...although I might just be asking for trouble for the latter.
For Unreal Engine, unless you're using the Nvidia plugins, none of the ray tracing is exclusive to RTX, it's all DXR based. Dunno how performance will be with the new AMD GPUs though. The larger vram pools with AMD are nice though.
RTX aside long before that we were already tied to Nvidia's drivers - I don't think that's changed.... has it?
How many posts have been made over the years in this forum alone about some viewport- or UV editor refresh or selection issue in one application or another and then it turns out the user was running an AMD GPU. Heathen!
Hehe...yeah, guess I might be stuck eating the cost of nvidia.
It looks like Toolbag (my baker of choice) seems to be optimized for RTX though, so there's that 🙃
If you want to use stable diffusion (to critic your work, give ideas on your character/Environment) then nvidia is the way to go. Doesn't work great on amd or might not even at all.
Also now I would recommend the intel i9 13900k or 7950x. The generational jump was in both single core and multicore performance too big to ignore.
With the 13900k you can still use ddr4 which is fine. Speaking of I would recommend at least 64gb, but honestly, depending on what you do this is not even enough. 128gb is needed for ZBrush, especially for detailed characters and environmental decoration with displacement maps. If you go 128gb ram you don't need the fastest one because it can't handle high speeds anyway.
For ssd a pcie 3.0 m.2 nvme is often enough with 3-4k speeds. You can also get a pcie 4.0 with 7-8k speeds but it is not that necessary. Samsung m.2 have often the best speeds and a good type of memory but you can also get something like megafastro. I wouldn't go below tlc.
For Intel I would get a midrange z690 board like the tomahawk z690 on the used market. You find deals there for 120-200 bucks.
PSU you now need at least 850w. I got myself a 1200w because it was just a couple dollars more expensive and ideally you wanna run them between 50-80% usage. I recommend getting a platinum, titanium is often too expensive and lower is kinda a waste with those high energy cost in europe.
Ideally you want to use an Aio or custom water cooling for the 13900k but you can still get away with a big noctua air cooler (depends on motherboard but a 12 is mostly possible) and a shit ton of case fan. I recommend the P12 PWM PST A-RGB and the p14. You only hear them when you zremesh, decimate or something similar. It is important that you get the a-rgb ones because the ones without RGB are way worse.
For graphic card... well it is a clown fiesta. Ofc. the 4090 is the best but it is twice as expensive as it should be. People speculate that the 4080 might get cheaper after christmas because of amd but idk man. Used market is also full of graphic card scammer so this is not really an option either. It just sucks.
@jomaa Yea I need to update the first post with the new GPU's and CPU's.
For GPU's; 4090's a monster but it's still tough to get at MSRP depending where you live. I think for the next step down I'd still generally recommend the 3090 for artists over the 4080 just because of how much more vram the 3090 has while being very close performance wise. However like you said, the used market is kind of a mess atm so getting cards from there is risky.
For CPU's; Both new Intel and AMD CPU's run quite hot, so yea water cooling is probably the way to go for high end builds now (I'm generally in favor of air cooling, but standard temps are just getting too high). And while their is a performance uplift, it's certainly no where near as significant as people were hoping. The rumors atm are that AMD will be releasing 16 core CPU's with V-Cache (7950X3D) within a month or two, which should offer a more substantial performance uplift in certain workloads.
For RAM; AMD seems to be hitting a wall with RAM speeds past DDR5 6000, so anything faster then that should be avoided on AMD builds atm. Either way, DDR5 is still quite a bit more expensive then DDR4, so Intel builds are going to be better for those on a limited budget atm.
@PolyHertz
I have recently upgraded from a 5950x to the 13900k and it is so much better.
The ram speeds tank so much when you put in 128gb. DDR4 goes only between 2666-3600 and ddr5 cant go above 4800 in most cases.
I think upgrading the cpu is the one thing that speed ups your workflow so much.
Importing to nanite? np. Countless zremesh, decimate and project? Also now so much faster. Compiling scripts? yeah not anymore.
Just upgrade your cpu guys, it is worth it. Look for a gpu in a year.
If dlss had similar benefits for production work as in gaming, then a 4090 would make sense. But prices are still whack. I can't believe that scalper pricing is still a thing...even on last gen cards.
I just went from haswell to 12th gen, and for everyday busywork it's not a huge jump. Except when it comes to rendering hi-poly zbrush sculpts in keyshot, it's night and day!
Hi everyone, I'm a desperate 3d Character Artist who doesn't understand much about computer that bought this pre-assembled pc in 2016 https://support.hp.com/us-en/document/c05216306
I've recently changed the case for a better passage of the air and also added other fans and changed the power supply so you can find my current and updated build there:
CPU: Intel i7-6700k
RAM: 16GB (2x8GB 2.100MHz at CL15)
GPU: Geforce 1060 8GB
SSD: 256 GB SanDisk
Secondary HDD: 1TB Seagate ST1000DM003 1SB102
MOBO: Thimphu (??)
Tower: Noua Orizon M3
Power: EVGA 600 BR, 80+ BRONZE 600W
These are some of the problems that I have in my pipeline:
- Toooo much time when I import my decimated mesh from ZBrush to Maya
- Sometimes the bake from highpoly to lowpoly on Marmoset toolbag are very slow
- When I work with Substance Painter with 2k+ texture I can see in the Windows Task Manager that Memory hits the 70-80% and it lag so much
I want to upgrade my setup to work in a less stressful way possible, can you help me find out which components I need to replace? Thank you!
@KICKBACK The best course of action atp would be to just buy a new PC, as basically every part on your PC is due for an upgrade. If that's not possible right now, at a minimum I'd replace the RAM with a 32GB or 64GB kit (4x16GB) of DDR4, and get a better GPU (such as a Geforce 3060 or better), though keep in mind depending on the GPU you may also need a better power supply.
I agree with @PolyHertz, I think that mobo maxes out at 32GB ram.
For the OS HDD (256GB) to save space, use your platter HDD (Seagate) for your Documents, Photos, Music, Downloads, Videos folders that Windows uses by default. This also comes in handy when you want to nuke the PC and start new.
Thank you guys, I had the feeling that I had to replace everything..
I want to do a full upgrade so I was looking at the examples of PolyHertz in the first page and I was thinking to go with the last build (Under 1200$) I've seen that the ram and the gpu are the same you already mentioned so.. I think it's a good way to go?
CPU: Intel i5-12400F
RAM: 32GB (2x16GB 3200MHz at CL16)
GPU: Geforce 3060 12GB
SSD: 2TB Samsung 970 Evo Plus
MOBO: Asus PRIME B660M-A WIFI D4
Power: EVGA SuperNOVA GT (750W, Gold rated)
The specs listed are for sure good, perhaps instead of one 2TB M.2, get two 1TB M.2 that support PCIe 4.0.
1TB OS and Apps
1TB Work files.
Use the old 256GB SSD for games?
I kind of regret the AW38 Ultrawide due to the fact that it doesn't have PIP/SBS or dual display (which I need now), but it's a great display none the less.
- Cooler Master Masterbox TD500 Mesh V2 Mid Tower
- MSI GeForce RTX 4070 VENTUS 3X E OC
- AMD Ryzen 7 7700X CPU Tray
- Akasa Soho H4 Plus Cooler
- Kingston FURY Beast DDR5 5600MHz 32GB
- Kingston M.2 NV2 PCIe 4.0 NVMe SSD 2TB
- ASUS TUF Gaming B650-PLUS WIFI Motherboard (I will also move over my 1TB SSD + 1TB HDD to this motherboard)
- ASUS TUF Gaming 850W Gold PSU
- Windows 11
- 3 year guarantee
I am studying to create 3D Game Art, specifically weapons, for my portfolio (https://www.artstation.com/alexanderlindberg). I use Blender with a non-destructive workflow and work with millions of triangles, that includes the modifiers Remesh and Smooth Corrective which take a grand deal of performance. I also use Substance Painter and work with 4K textures. I render my models in Marmoset Toolbag and export most renders with 10000 x 5500 pixels, with the highest settings on. Now, with the specs I have listed, would it be a good build to invest in?
I´d like to get an advice on buying new RAM for my PC. This is what I have right now:
MB: ASUS TUF Z390-Pro Gaming
CPU: i5-9600K
GPU: Nvidia GeForce GTX 1650 Super
Drives: Samsung SSD 970 EVO Plus 500 GB (system/installs) / Samsung SSD 860 EVO 500 GB (files/saves)
RAM: HyperX 16GB KIT (2x8 GB) DDR4 3200 MHz CL15 FURY series
OS: Windows 10
What I have now is quite sufficient, but I´d like to achieve more fluid performance in ZBrush, especially with Sculptris Pro mode on (I always envy people who can work on multimillion meshes so smoothly in scuptris pro mode). Other than that I´m quite fine, although I plan to work with Marmoset more often (smart materials) so perhaps there could be some benefits to that as well, but ZBrush is really my focus right now.
- Would more RAM be a significant upgrade or am I limited by other parts anyway?
- I´m thinking about buying 32GB (2x16GB). Or would it be for some technical reason better to add another 2x8GB to what I have now? (could 4x8 be better with my MB than 2x16? or maybe would the old 2x8 work together with new 2x16?)
- If it would make sense to buy new RAM - what should I keep in mind regarding my other specs? (there are some "CL-16, CL-18..." god knows what that means... I´m never going to understand these things, I´m probably looking for someone to tell me what to do and I´ll just have to trust you..
thank you very much in advance.
CPU - Ryzen 5950x
CPU Fan - Noctua DH-N15 Dual fan
Mobo - X570S AORUS MASTER
RAM - 64GB Ballistix 3600 dual channel
PSU - Corsair CP-9020072 Platinum Series 750W
SSD 1 - Samsung 850 500GB SSD - Running Windows 10
SSD 2 - Samsung 860 1TB SSD
HDD - Seagate Baracuda 4TB
GPU - Geforce GTX 1080 8GB
Corsair 780T Graphite Tower
Anything that stands out?
Also, I really would like a 4090, but that son of a gun is expensive as heck