TF2 tex is pretty simple, so you're pretty close as is. It just has a fairly 'dirty' AO, and some noticeable square brush strokes.
I'd probably make the 'earrings' gold. But it probably doesn't matter either way.
As far as tri count, I bet you could knock the head down by half and still look just as good in game. Things like the ribs going into the feathers could be flat, but keep the AO from this and that'll be enough detail.
One good way to judge that is open the model viewer and load other hats. You can select the LOD models. The hi poly can look pretty good, but the lowest poly models of hats and weapons look pretty crappy. But you're looking at maybe 50x50 pixels when they are low LOD, so you can't even tell in game.
Even up close on the hi's just standing still is the only time you really notice when things look rough.
So, does that mean I could use this model as the high version and optimize another one and use that as an LOD?
I swear to god I've been trying my best to optimize the model. Spent a few hours today doing just that. Here's a screen of where I was before and where I'm at now:
On the bottom model I try to explain a little on how where I think the model needs geometry in order to look good.
1- The larges wrinkle of the face, made a loop here that bulges out and creates the shape. Had a few more loops before, but cut those down.
2- These are pretty solid I think, to give that rounded look.
3- These ribs are one of the two things that use up a lot of geometry. In truth I thought the hat looked like it had no connection to the feathers at all. Makes the model flow better?
4- This edge marks and sort of "cheek bone" on the eagle head. It protrudes quite a lot, making it seem unreal and therefore hand crafted.
5- THIS. I use up a lot of triangles here. I'm aware this is just aesthetic geometry that serves no purpose, but I think it really helps sell the hat. I was looking at this area before I put them in, and thought it looked too simple. Just empty space with no visual interest. Think it looks cooler now. Maybe its just me.
6- Rounded feathers. Wasting a 1 more try per feather, but I believe it help differentiate this hat from other hats that also use feathers, such as "Big Chief".
The areas marked in green are where I use an extra loop to help mark a hard "rounded" edge. Stole this one from watching the Soldiers chin. He has an extra loop that help define his chin better.
TL;DR: I really don't know where else to cut geometry, besides getting rid of areas entirely, such as the "ribs".
@ Vanlande - Looks good, but as it stands, those secondary dark striped feathers at the back of the headdress are making the model way too visually busy/detailed for TF2's style - maybe you could remove some of them and skew the proportions of the remaining ones to be a bit thicker - or lose all of them entirely? (I can understand if you're hesitant to do that though.) Otherwise, it's coming along really nicely!
@Vanlande, Lazerus Reborn's paint over is a pretty good way to go. Instead of adding extra loops for hard edge just use smoothing groups.
#5 imo is just wasteful, very small detail (which looks good on hi-poly) but will be completely missed in game. Just have the AO you baked for that now on flat polys will basically look the same.
I understand wanting your model to 'stand out', but valve is fine with how the headress feathers are. There are two hats like that and both done the same way. When looking at your they will compare it to that and think yours is just wasteful.
Sure, the feathers on the headresses are kindof flat, but I never notice it in game.
I'd say cut it down like LR shows, use that for the hi. Then go to town and really cut one down for a low. Like I said, the low can be pretty blocky and ugly and it won't be noticeable. You could even make 2 LOD's but I kind of feel that's overkill for small objects.
@Lazerus Reborn: Thanks a lot for the paint over. I really appreciate the help. I'll be sure to make changes you marked, since they make a lot of sense. I can't believe I missed getting rid of 1 tri in the rounded feathers, since I actually did just that for the longer ones. @aivanov: Totally right. I thought something looked off, but thanks to you I now know its the color on them feathers. I'm probably not going to kill them off entirely, just reduce them. @Baddcog: Thanks mate. You and Lazerus have convinced me to get rid of the set of triangle feathers. I'll just paint them on the texture, use the AO for that, and call it a day.
Edit: I'll post an update later today, as soon as I finish with the changes.
Me again, this time with the finished model in game. I slapped the hat on the other classes just to see what they looked like, and surprisingly, it fit most of them. On some of them, like the scout, the hat seems too big.
Question: Does anyone know how to make it so you can test the paints inside the game? I see the option on the itemtest menu, but it does nothing.
Still not "blown away" with the color palette, but I guess it'll have to do.
Me again, this time with the finished model in game. I slapped the hat on the other classes just to see what they looked like, and surprisingly, it fit most of them. On some of them, like the scout, the hat seems too big.
Question: Does anyone know how to make it so you can test the paints inside the game? I see the option on the itemtest menu, but it does nothing.
Still not "blown away" with the color palette, but I guess it'll have to do.
Personally, i think it should stay for the soldier only. It fits the warrior theme for that class. It may also fit nicely with the other classes but it makes the most sense on the soldier.
@roninmastermix: So true. Built it having the soldier as the base, both when modelling and on the idea in general. I think it was in this thread that someone said that valve has the final word on which class gets the hat, without taking into account the creator's input.
Well, I did say Valve makes the final choice, I didn't say they didn't take the input... You just never know.
Anyway, to test colors you have to have the model set up for it. Whatever color you want swapped needs to be just AO bake. Then have an alpha layer mask for the color section (White is colored part)
Then you need a QC like this. colortint base is the rgb color it will start as, you need one vmt for each team, but can use the same base texture and just use this for each team color.
Wow, when I suggested such a thing, I never imagined such a phenomenal turn out! I'm glad they turned out nice, I'd be willing to bet you're a shoe-in (hehe) for contribution on this set!
Thanks, and I'm glad you suggested it, it's quite a fitting addition i think
The engie pack i'm working on, close to be finished !
I like the new primary, that looks better. I think you could improve the vat, by plugging some wires in to the engies head that just lead down to the bottom of the vat, stuff like that. Also if the hand is a sort of gunslinger, shouldn't that be a mini sentry?
Well, I think this is the final update on the Aztec Pride. I hope. Changed the color palette some. I think I was using too many colors, so I simplified the scheme a bit. I also optimized the model some more, and the final geo count is at 1500 tris. Maybe a bit over the top, but I have no intention of going back to optimize the model for the fourth time :shifty:
Hope you guys like it! And the name is not really final, if anyone would like to help me out with a few ideas for the name and tagline it would be great, because I'm really bad at those kind of things :poly124:
I'm not so keen on the dark blue-grey on the feathers. I think you might be better with a lighter tone not too far from the head colour, probably with a bit of a team coloured shift. Maybe go back and have a look over some pheasant feathers for colour scheme ideas.
For my money, the original barring on the tail feathers was quite nice too. Perhaps just reducing their contrast and number a bit would have been a better option.
What you've got now isn't bad, but I think you could come up with something much more striking without a lot of extra effort.
Huitzilopochtli's Headpiece/Headdress? (He's the Aztec god of the Sun and War, and often represented as an eagle).
Maybe a shortened form like "Huitzil's Headpiece" would be better?
Quetzalcoatl's Crown? (It's an alliteration, trust me).
Quetzal's Crown if you wanted something smaller (and quetzal's are birds that are associated with the god).
Montezuma's Pride?
Bane of Cort
Lookinf pretty good, Vanlande. My eagle warrior helmet wasn't working out, so I've switched to the jaguar helm:
Really cool. Haha, I was toying with the idea of making a panther head next, but your is looking nice. Just a thought: might look better if the jaw was closer (almost hugging) the soldiers jaw.
Well, I think this is the final update on the Aztec Pride. I hope. Changed the color palette some. I think I was using too many colors, so I simplified the scheme a bit. I also optimized the model some more, and the final geo count is at 1500 tris. Maybe a bit over the top, but I have no intention of going back to optimize the model for the fourth time :shifty:
Hope you guys like it! And the name is not really final, if anyone would like to help me out with a few ideas for the name and tagline it would be great, because I'm really bad at those kind of things :poly124:
Enjoy!
I was attempting the aztec eagle helm a while back and the name i came up for it was the Cuauhtli (aztec for eagle) Cowl
Primary = shotgun or mac10
Secondary = grenade (the ones on the vest)
Melee = the shotgun but held by the barrel and the butt/stock used as the blunt end.
Primary = shotgun or mac10
Secondary = grenade (the ones on the vest)
Melee = the shotgun but held by the barrel and the butt/stock used as the blunt end.
That pack would probably make me play scout 24/7 keep it up
I'm not so keen on the dark blue-grey on the feathers. I think you might be better with a lighter tone not too far from the head colour, probably with a bit of a team coloured shift. Maybe go back and have a look over some pheasant feathers for colour scheme ideas.
For my money, the original barring on the tail feathers was quite nice too. Perhaps just reducing their contrast and number a bit would have been a better option.
What you've got now isn't bad, but I think you could come up with something much more striking without a lot of extra effort.
Thanks for the input, mate. I actually made those changes to the texture and it looks much better I think. Here is the (now) final model:
@CidTheNinja: As for names, I really liked Quetzalcoatl's Crown, since it does indeed look somewhat like a crown. I think I'm going to choose between that and Aztlan's Pride or The Sun's Commander (eagle warriors venerated the sun god and were considered his warriors). Not sure which one would be best :P
Would be pretty cool if you made the boots like this for a misc aswell.
I kinder prefer this early concept for the scout, still had a baseball player look about him while being but made to look like well... a scout. Like how the engie has all his engineer regalia but even without hearing his voice, he's clearly a cowboy.
First test images of my new scout set.
Item consists of vest and boots intended for the misc. slot. Colors are not final but pretty similar. No Ambient Occlusion. I'll be adding more details now that i see it works with minimal clipping.
The vest pushes his colour layout and silhouette far too close to the sniper. I actually thought you'd stuck the scouts head on the sniper's body on first glance at the initial WIP shot. I'm not sure this is a problem you're going to be able to work around.
I love the bow, I love the arrow and I love the quiver. Make a melee and a hat to go with it (since VALVe seems to add sets more than individual items), so I get to use this beauty.
It's one of the few warrior cultures left to base a soldier hat off of.
actually there are still a good amount of warrior cultures and helmet types that can still be used, believe me i have a list if anyone wants to see and use em (i can texture them ) pm me but there isnt really that much of a shortage.
Replies
So, does that mean I could use this model as the high version and optimize another one and use that as an LOD?
I swear to god I've been trying my best to optimize the model. Spent a few hours today doing just that. Here's a screen of where I was before and where I'm at now:
On the bottom model I try to explain a little on how where I think the model needs geometry in order to look good.
1- The larges wrinkle of the face, made a loop here that bulges out and creates the shape. Had a few more loops before, but cut those down.
2- These are pretty solid I think, to give that rounded look.
3- These ribs are one of the two things that use up a lot of geometry. In truth I thought the hat looked like it had no connection to the feathers at all. Makes the model flow better?
4- This edge marks and sort of "cheek bone" on the eagle head. It protrudes quite a lot, making it seem unreal and therefore hand crafted.
5- THIS. I use up a lot of triangles here. I'm aware this is just aesthetic geometry that serves no purpose, but I think it really helps sell the hat. I was looking at this area before I put them in, and thought it looked too simple. Just empty space with no visual interest. Think it looks cooler now. Maybe its just me.
6- Rounded feathers. Wasting a 1 more try per feather, but I believe it help differentiate this hat from other hats that also use feathers, such as "Big Chief".
The areas marked in green are where I use an extra loop to help mark a hard "rounded" edge. Stole this one from watching the Soldiers chin. He has an extra loop that help define his chin better.
TL;DR: I really don't know where else to cut geometry, besides getting rid of areas entirely, such as the "ribs".
Use alpha planes on the feathers. You'd drop 6 tris per feather. If you dont want alpha then weld the bottom of to get rid of one tri.
The spikey bits at the back can be dropped to 3 sides without any really difference. Also why are the bases higher poly?
The hard edges you said about will go missed, Your forgetting no-one will have that much time to stare at the hat. Texture them in or use AO/normals.
On looking at your diffuse wip, you could just paint fake shadows on the mesh instead of the floating geo for the first two sets of triangle feathers.
The cylinders on the side can be have lower sides without much difference. You can also delete there backfaces.
Its good modeling but sometimes you need to be practical and remember the scope and what your making this for
Hope this gets in.
#5 imo is just wasteful, very small detail (which looks good on hi-poly) but will be completely missed in game. Just have the AO you baked for that now on flat polys will basically look the same.
I understand wanting your model to 'stand out', but valve is fine with how the headress feathers are. There are two hats like that and both done the same way. When looking at your they will compare it to that and think yours is just wasteful.
Sure, the feathers on the headresses are kindof flat, but I never notice it in game.
I'd say cut it down like LR shows, use that for the hi. Then go to town and really cut one down for a low. Like I said, the low can be pretty blocky and ugly and it won't be noticeable. You could even make 2 LOD's but I kind of feel that's overkill for small objects.
@aivanov: Totally right. I thought something looked off, but thanks to you I now know its the color on them feathers. I'm probably not going to kill them off entirely, just reduce them.
@Baddcog: Thanks mate. You and Lazerus have convinced me to get rid of the set of triangle feathers. I'll just paint them on the texture, use the AO for that, and call it a day.
Edit: I'll post an update later today, as soon as I finish with the changes.
It looks really awesome. I especially like the hat.
Question: Does anyone know how to make it so you can test the paints inside the game? I see the option on the itemtest menu, but it does nothing.
Still not "blown away" with the color palette, but I guess it'll have to do.
Personally, i think it should stay for the soldier only. It fits the warrior theme for that class. It may also fit nicely with the other classes but it makes the most sense on the soldier.
Anyway, to test colors you have to have the model set up for it. Whatever color you want swapped needs to be just AO bake. Then have an alpha layer mask for the color section (White is colored part)
Then you need a QC like this. colortint base is the rgb color it will start as, you need one vmt for each team, but can use the same base texture and just use this for each team color.
"VertexlitGeneric" { "$baseTexture" "models\..." "$detail" "effects/tiledfire/fireLayeredSlowTiled512.vtf" "$detailscale" "5" "$detailblendfactor" .01 "$detailblendmode" 6 "$yellow" "0" "$blendtintbybasealpha" "1" "$blendtintcoloroverbase" "0" "$colortint_base" "{174 54 54}" "$colortint_tmp" "[0 0 0]" "$phong" "1" "$phongexponent" "15" "$phongboost" ".75" "$lightwarptexture" "models\lightwarps\weapon_lightwarp" "$phongfresnelranges" "[.25 1 4]" // Rim lighting parameters "$rimlight" "1" // To enable rim lighting (requires phong) "$rimlightexponent" "4" // Exponent for phong component of rim lighting "$rimlightboost" "2" // Boost for ambient cube component of rim lighting // Cloaking "$cloakPassEnabled" "1" "Proxies" { "weapon_invis" { } "AnimatedTexture" { "animatedtexturevar" "$detail" "animatedtextureframenumvar" "$detailframe" "animatedtextureframerate" 30 } "BurnLevel" { "resultVar" "$detailblendfactor" } "YellowLevel" { "resultVar" "$yellow" } "Equals" { "srcVar1" "$yellow" "resultVar" "$color2" } "ItemTintColor" { "resultVar" "$colortint_tmp" } "SelectFirstIfNonZero" { "srcVar1" "$colortint_tmp" "srcVar2" "$colortint_base" "resultVar" "$color2" } } }Thanks, and I'm glad you suggested it, it's quite a fitting addition i think
Awesome work, those go together so well and everything looks very well made!
I like the new primary, that looks better. I think you could improve the vat, by plugging some wires in to the engies head that just lead down to the bottom of the vat, stuff like that. Also if the hand is a sort of gunslinger, shouldn't that be a mini sentry?
Wow, fantastic work. Can we get a close up of that robot hand?
AK47 inspired shotgun for Heavy.
"She weighs one hundred fifty kilograms.."
Oh poo.
Better get searching again.
Wait, am I able to use the modeling program is Source SDK to model?
Hope you guys like it! And the name is not really final, if anyone would like to help me out with a few ideas for the name and tagline it would be great, because I'm really bad at those kind of things :poly124:
Enjoy!
The Eye Of Edan?
Also, I am currently making an outline and sketch of a minigun idea called the "The Dead Moon"
Doing great on it!
For my money, the original barring on the tail feathers was quite nice too. Perhaps just reducing their contrast and number a bit would have been a better option.
What you've got now isn't bad, but I think you could come up with something much more striking without a lot of extra effort.
That is one well made panther head. bravo!
Name suggestions:
Huitzilopochtli's Headpiece/Headdress? (He's the Aztec god of the Sun and War, and often represented as an eagle).
Maybe a shortened form like "Huitzil's Headpiece" would be better?
Quetzalcoatl's Crown? (It's an alliteration, trust me).
Quetzal's Crown if you wanted something smaller (and quetzal's are birds that are associated with the god).
Montezuma's Pride?
Bane of Cort
Really cool. Haha, I was toying with the idea of making a panther head next, but your is looking nice. Just a thought: might look better if the jaw was closer (almost hugging) the soldiers jaw.
I was attempting the aztec eagle helm a while back and the name i came up for it was the Cuauhtli (aztec for eagle) Cowl
Inspired by this
Headgear = bandanna
Misc = Vest
Primary = shotgun or mac10
Secondary = grenade (the ones on the vest)
Melee = the shotgun but held by the barrel and the butt/stock used as the blunt end.
That pack would probably make me play scout 24/7 keep it up
Thanks for the input, mate. I actually made those changes to the texture and it looks much better I think. Here is the (now) final model:
@CidTheNinja: As for names, I really liked Quetzalcoatl's Crown, since it does indeed look somewhat like a crown. I think I'm going to choose between that and Aztlan's Pride or The Sun's Commander (eagle warriors venerated the sun god and were considered his warriors). Not sure which one would be best :P
Not sure about there being few warrior cultures to choose from, but they indeed look cool.
Would be pretty cool if you made the boots like this for a misc aswell.
I kinder prefer this early concept for the scout, still had a baseball player look about him while being but made to look like well... a scout. Like how the engie has all his engineer regalia but even without hearing his voice, he's clearly a cowboy.
Perhaps my sentence would have been more confusing if I had more "theys."
Well, I was only simply asking someone to try and model it, no need to be rude.
Item consists of vest and boots intended for the misc. slot. Colors are not final but pretty similar. No Ambient Occlusion. I'll be adding more details now that i see it works with minimal clipping.
don't be too cruel,i'm modeling for 1-2 weeks+i'm still working on this :: )
actually there are still a good amount of warrior cultures and helmet types that can still be used, believe me i have a list if anyone wants to see and use em (i can texture them ) pm me but there isnt really that much of a shortage.