Very late, but is this the shape (droid) you're looking for?
Seems like it. I used a helix, extruded it to make it a cylinder, then just extruded the loop, pushed it upward, and chamfered. Finally I skewed it to get a steeper shape.
Hey guys. I'm modelling a motorbike frame in Maya and could do with a little help on the sub-d model.
I've attached a couple jpegs to show you guys where Im at.
The joint circled in green has been attached and the joint circled in red has not as you can see. I'm just wondering if they're are any advantages/disadvantages in joining up the meshes.
The red example is proving hard to join smoothly because of angles and such. If you guys can offer any techniques I'd really appreciate them!
I'm pretty sure the solution here is to work with a 900-sided cylinder, but is there any easier solution for modeling the T-shaped divots in this revolver cylinder?
(yes I know its an airsoft replica - this was the first clean cylinder I found on GIS)
using floating geometry would be the best step, take the existing geometry, detach it as a clone so you get the basic shape, then work with it to whatever extent you need, you don't need to worry about topology at all, then just use array 360 degrees to place it around your model again
Any idea how to fix that? Don't look at the edges stopping in the middle of nowhere. That's the problem, don't know where to go with those. 'Loop them all the way around' is not really an option cause it will disturn my half rouned shape (the underside of the barrel) with hard edges. So I could use a creative solution.
using floating geometry would be the best step, take the existing geometry, detach it as a clone so you get the basic shape, then work with it to whatever extent you need, you don't need to worry about topology at all, then just use array 360 degrees to place it around your model again
I was hoping to avoid floating geo, I'm considering taking this into zBrush.
I got it working by going to a highly detailed cylinder and then cutting in the required shape, but doing such made working on the other parts of the cylinder awkward - I basically did all the other shape-work at low rez, working off an 18 sided cylinder, then subdivided twice, cut in the T-shape, and then dropped another two subdivisions on it.
tuxmask75, the best way I can think of is to just model it flat and apply a bend modifier or FFD, like what Selentic did above.
Thanks for the quick reply !
Yeah I've tried that already, its a great trick, you can use 2 or more of the bend modifiers to make a spherical shape as well.
The shape I'm doing is a small section of a bigger sphere object.
just bending it 1 direction doesn't work out. ( since its not spherical)
(will need to try the FFD though)
EDIT: Seems FFD may be the answer i been searching for !
Thanks alot! You just made my day!:thumbup:
however id still like to see if there is a way in doing it by standard modeling.
(Aditonal ramble on bend.)
the problem i have with bend (just for this project) is that my object needs to retain its sphere shape while keeping the left side section strait in the front view port.
using 2 bend modifiers or another Sherify bends the shape out of proportion, in frontal view-port.
(Below pic)Using multiple bend modifiers to do sphere type shape)
normally it would be OK, but the circled area needs to retain its straitness in the frontal view-port.
I tried to rectify this by adding an edit poly under the bend modifiers and adjust polygons left or right to counter the spherical deviation to the left and right to keep it strait in frontal view, but it turned into a real nightmare.
( sorry no screens of the rectification attempt were created, i didn't save that file lol)
Seems FFD did not work as I thought it would, ( fiddled with it all day)
Guess I'm stuck with trying to figure out a good edge loop strategy.
in the mean time anyone have any other ideas or good or edge-loop layouts for spheres with cut out geometry?
hey!
I checked out the GameArt Workshop and saw the AW weapon. Just curious on how to model some parts of it. Oh and no im not joining the GameArt Workshop #4. I'm just trying to learn some new stuff, hehe
So the part im going to ask about is
1) Can you see the shape is curved, and goes inwards? Havn't been able to get that right Someone feel free to give me a hand there please
2) What I mean here is the shape that goes inwards aswell, it's like circular and doesn't have an has a rounded end. So yeah, some help here would be appreciated to.
I was wondering if anyone had any suggestions, on how to do the v part on the handle? the handle is easy to make, but once I attached the handle to the main mesh is when i started having troubles with the v part .
I'm trying to model this but no luck so far. I also added an image of what I've got so far. Someone willing to help me out? I'm running out of ideas. Thx in advance!
if you run out of ideas try to model it in lowpoly first and then build up the needed harder edges of the subdivision cage from there on. I actually modeled this shape 3 years ago but its way to shitty to show
if you run out of ideas try to model it in lowpoly first and then build up the needed harder edges of the subdivision cage from there on. I actually modeled this shape 3 years ago but its way to shitty to show
That's what I am trying! But I'm having difficulties finding the right polyflow, I guess. :poly118:
How I fix this? thanks. I read 20 pages of thread and started practise s-d a little more. BTW, I afraid of finding 58 pages to read the resolution somewhere... so sorry for asking such question, pls give me tip here.
How I fix this? thanks. I read 20 pages of thread and started practise s-d a little more. BTW, I afraid of finding 58 pages to read the resolution somewhere... so sorry for asking such question, pls give me tip here.
DING DING DING
You've hit the jackpot!
The solution, like 80% of this thread, is to remodel the shape with more geometry!
yay
The problem is that you dont have enough inherant loops to support the shape, so you then have to add more tight loops, but that creates hard edges. So, you start with a more dense mesh, with a smaller "grid" of polys, so your supporting edges are more naturally just there, supporting the curve and also the shape.
Really quick and dirty,
1. create a cylinder with 64 segments and 36 sides, straighten out the edges adjacent to the center edge
2. Select shape, bevel to get depth, bevel once more to get some more supporting edges
3.select and remove the edges that are pinching in the middle
4. Done!
This is messy and only took about a minute to make, you could use even more geometry, and a little cleanup/ using separate mesh chunks would be a good idea. Even more geo for harder edges of course.
Here's one for you. I think I'm on the right track, but I'm not really happy with anything I come up with. This is the closet I've gotten. I think I should try to get rid of that center vertex that all the edges are leading to, but I can't find another home for those edges otherwise.
Just dropping a quick word here, add more geo yes, it might be the sollution here and there. But remenber that a clean mesh is always easier to work with.
Remenber the bare basics, a cube tessellates into a sphere, and all you need is 6 faces, same concept applies for all round shapes you'd wanna model. (mostly)
Brilliant, that looks a lot better. My brain didn't want to accept that at first because those edges would be left connecting to nothing on the side there, but duh, they'd be quads, so it's okay.
Nobody is going to win a prize for having a "clean" highpoly mesh, while having good flow is essential during the modeling process, worring about having "optimized" high res meshes is a huge waste of time, for round shapes with complex intersections you simply have to add more geo, or spend a lot of time manually tweaking edgeloops etc, so in that case it really isnt faster to have a "clean" mesh.
The fastest thing is virtually always going to be just to model it correctly from the start, and that means starting with enough geometry to support your shapes. Having a dense mesh doesn't mean its not a clean mesh.
The solution, like 80% of this thread, is to remodel the shape with more geometry!
yay
The problem is that you dont have enough inherant loops to support the shape, so you then have to add more tight loops, but that creates hard edges. So, you start with a more dense mesh, with a smaller "grid" of polys, so your supporting edges are more naturally just there, supporting the curve and also the shape.
Really quick and dirty,
1. create a cylinder with 64 segments and 36 sides, straighten out the edges adjacent to the center edge
2. Select shape, bevel to get depth, bevel once more to get some more supporting edges
3.select and remove the edges that are pinching in the middle
4. Done!
This is messy and only took about a minute to make, you could use even more geometry, and a little cleanup/ using separate mesh chunks would be a good idea. Even more geo for harder edges of course.
Uhm, actually model created in 2 parts, shell and a regular sphere inside. Because they have got float distance between (doesn't touch each other), it's not a negative extrude/bevel seam. Yeah, but modeling steps is similar.
Start with a sphere 32x. +Editpoly modifier
Select some loops, chamfer edges (in max chamfer a loop belong surface made a seam) + shell modifier for thinkness.
Editpoly modifier. And add loop for hard edges. +Smooth.
Now a better way do it with 64 or more segments sphere? Yes, it's ok. I'll do. BTW, I still a bit wondering about for these 90° angles of square we made, it need some connect and or loop around itself to keep square not round in 4 angles.
Is there a popular/well-known way to make these 4 angle looks sharp without go to many segments in original sphere?. Because it requires more segments than those border loop edge (which can even made smooth + nice edge with 32x sphere). I tried chamfer or extrude edges (with zero height) those 4 corners but artifact appear in those 4.
There're some popular way to keep that square. Just IMO, I tried something above but seem all of them not good enough. 1 and 2 is similar.
1 is extrude, I like this method 'coz afterward and can remove edges+related vertices easy (not good in this case, leave tri and need manual fix). Otherwise made blotchy smooth in surface nearby 4 corners.
2 is chamfer, it mades quad in this case, nice, but afterward the model change, can't go back.
3 and 4 is similar, tight loop around edge border. Is well nice for simple model but make overall out of smooth effects (locally affects - and where you suggest me go to more geo). Again seem 4 of them isn't good enough. SO I want people give me tip here. It's basic but it's a question.
EarthQuake: Your anim gif another hands made out a different artifact in square area. And need remove edges to fix. But it's no problem. Your demo doesn't keep square sharp corners. But I know that you just try demo the general method, so thanks again for help. Here I think maybe you skip/overlook my certain object, surely you can handle all these basic issue. So I want to ask again, I just ask more specifically, not any different meaning here.
If made them sharp & square + same time smooth hard edge it wastes a litte too many geometry because it'll need another subdivision level in the end to smooth out effect...? (while it's already require very tight loop to keep square in shape).
So I think probably I miss something obivious here, the way manually connect/fix those 4 angles to keep square and smooth (beveled) edge same time. Sorry about my bad English, it's not my native language.
Maybe it's another way to ask - a square hole in round object. (Opposite: A round hole in box). There's tip to make a round hole in box, now with oppsite case, I want to know something similar.
EarthQuake: Your anim gif another hands made out a different artifact in square area. And need remove edges to fix. But it's no problem. Your demo doesn't keep square sharp corners. But I know that you just try demo the general method, so thanks again for help. Here I think maybe you skip/overlook my certain object, surely you can handle all these basic issue. So I want to ask again, I just ask more specifically, not any different meaning here.
All you need to do for sharper edges is simply use a smaller grid, IE: more sides/segments. The exact modeling methods are not important, nor is matching your mesh exactly, just the theory behind having enough geometry to support the shape, when you understand that, you can simply apply the theory to your object, and other objects as well.
Here is an example of varying "gird sizes" and how they affect sharpness:
And an example of what we can do, when we have enough supporting geometry. We can simply slide some edges closer to the corners without causing artifacts.
The exact sharpness is going to depend on the specifics of how you choose to model it, really you should just try, because it only takes a minute to create these sort of shapes.
For a shape like this, does it matter how many sides your sphere has? I really fail to see any practical relevance to the amount of sides it has.
Maybe it's another way to ask - a square hole in round object. (Opposite: A round hole in box). There's tip to make a round hole in box, now with oppsite case, I want to know something similar.
I'm not an expert but I hope to help you. I'm a Max user too and I used pretty much 'Connect' for these following examples.
Try to understand the concepts behind... experience it by yourself and you will get the point: TurboSmooth takes a cube and makes it become a sphere, with that in mind, add more geo when you need hard edges, also you will need more geo density to avoid 'pinching' in some cases like curved surfaces. And don't forget that Modifiers and floating geo are your friends
I'm not an expert but I hope to help you. I'm a Max user too and I used pretty much 'Connect' for these following examples.
Try to understand the concepts behind... experience it by yourself and you will get the point: TurboSmooth takes a cube and makes it become a sphere, with that in mind, add more geo when you need hard edges, also you will need more geo density to avoid 'pinching' in some cases like curved surfaces. And don't forget that Modifiers and floating geo are your friends
Replies
Im not sure if you managed to get this finished but if you don't need to have it on the HP you could draw it in later.
http://philipk.net/tutorials/ndo/ndo.html
really great site! This is my first post,
Anyways, I'm Having some pinching issues with this here shape,
Been trying to figure it out for the past few days, to no avail.:poly122:
The model file.
http://filebeam.com/download2.php?a=dedd00dd0ff2fb909b9295c09e3a8984&b=2d31f9389269cd091e025b75da77c9f4
For the bottom section,
I haven't really played much with yet.
I'm sure it will be an issue requiring advise as well,
Seems like it. I used a helix, extruded it to make it a cylinder, then just extruded the loop, pushed it upward, and chamfered. Finally I skewed it to get a steeper shape.
I've attached a couple jpegs to show you guys where Im at.
The joint circled in green has been attached and the joint circled in red has not as you can see. I'm just wondering if they're are any advantages/disadvantages in joining up the meshes.
The red example is proving hard to join smoothly because of angles and such. If you guys can offer any techniques I'd really appreciate them!
Thanks! BreaK-
(yes I know its an airsoft replica - this was the first clean cylinder I found on GIS)
First post on this forum and I immediatly start of with a problem! I'm working on my first model in 3Ds max, a Beretta 92FS.
This is what I've got so far:
http://users.skynet.be/bk334383/total.bmp
And this is where the problem is situated:
http://users.skynet.be/bk334383/trigger_hp.bmp
And this is how it looks withouth the Turbosmooth on:
http://users.skynet.be/bk334383/trigger_lp.bmp
Any idea how to fix that? Don't look at the edges stopping in the middle of nowhere. That's the problem, don't know where to go with those. 'Loop them all the way around' is not really an option cause it will disturn my half rouned shape (the underside of the barrel) with hard edges. So I could use a creative solution.
Thx in advance guys!
I was hoping to avoid floating geo, I'm considering taking this into zBrush.
I got it working by going to a highly detailed cylinder and then cutting in the required shape, but doing such made working on the other parts of the cylinder awkward - I basically did all the other shape-work at low rez, working off an 18 sided cylinder, then subdivided twice, cut in the T-shape, and then dropped another two subdivisions on it.
Thanks, this is the sort of lateral thinking I was blocked on. Completely forgot about using a bend modifier.
this might explain it better though
Correction: I can see two next to each other, the gizmo's y-axis is pointing to them. there will probably be two more on the opposite side
MOOOOOREEE GEOOOOO!
More geometry in the bigger cylinder!
Yeah I've tried that already, its a great trick, you can use 2 or more of the bend modifiers to make a spherical shape as well.
The shape I'm doing is a small section of a bigger sphere object.
just bending it 1 direction doesn't work out. ( since its not spherical)
(will need to try the FFD though)
EDIT: Seems FFD may be the answer i been searching for !
Thanks alot! You just made my day!:thumbup:
however id still like to see if there is a way in doing it by standard modeling.
If anyone would like to take a shot at making nice edgeloops on this model.
Than please by all means. ( without using FFD or bend)
http://filebeam.com/download2.php?a=...025b75da77c9f4
(Aditonal ramble on bend.)
the problem i have with bend (just for this project) is that my object needs to retain its sphere shape while keeping the left side section strait in the front view port.
using 2 bend modifiers or another Sherify bends the shape out of proportion, in frontal view-port.
(Below pic)Using multiple bend modifiers to do sphere type shape)
normally it would be OK, but the circled area needs to retain its straitness in the frontal view-port.
I tried to rectify this by adding an edit poly under the bend modifiers and adjust polygons left or right to counter the spherical deviation to the left and right to keep it strait in frontal view, but it turned into a real nightmare.
( sorry no screens of the rectification attempt were created, i didn't save that file lol)
Guess I'm stuck with trying to figure out a good edge loop strategy.
in the mean time anyone have any other ideas or good or edge-loop layouts for spheres with cut out geometry?
I checked out the GameArt Workshop and saw the AW weapon. Just curious on how to model some parts of it. Oh and no im not joining the GameArt Workshop #4. I'm just trying to learn some new stuff, hehe
So the part im going to ask about is
1) Can you see the shape is curved, and goes inwards? Havn't been able to get that right
2) What I mean here is the shape that goes inwards aswell, it's like circular and doesn't have an has a rounded end. So yeah, some help here would be appreciated to.
Thanks
I was wondering if anyone had any suggestions, on how to do the v part on the handle? the handle is easy to make, but once I attached the handle to the main mesh is when i started having troubles with the v part .
That's what I am trying! But I'm having difficulties finding the right polyflow, I guess. :poly118:
this is not perfect (especially the loops in the middle are kinda ugly in spacing) but it should give you an idea.
Thank you so much man! I really appreciate this! Thx again.
This is intended not only to make the high poly look good but to also help ray tracing produce a normal map that picks up as many details as possible.
1. Create a cylinder with 12 sides and delete the end caps.
2. Using angle snaps in front view, rotate until one face is visible directly ahead.
3. Clone the cylinder (copy) and hide the original. Select the face (2) and detach, delete the rest.
4. Make a new, smaller cyclinder. This will be your cookie cutter.
5. Copy the cutter so you have 4, use pivot points to align them to the face.
6. Attach all the cutter cylinders together and delete the face.
7. Unhide the original cylinder and select the cutters object.
8. Go into sub object mode, element and turn each (left and right) cylinders 15 degress.
9. Add meshsmooth x2 to the cutters object, convert it to edit poly and clone 11 times (copy) attaching them all.
10. Add a meshsmooth x2 to the big cylinder and convert it to edit poly.
11. Select the big cylinder and create objects boolean, pick your cutters as operand b.
12. Create a spline in the front view as shown and convert your cylinder to edit poly again.
13. Add a shell modifier to the cylinder with an inner depth of your choosing.
14. Click the bevel spline button in the shell modifier rollout, select the spline you made to see the holes change shape.
*You can now alter the spline and the cylinder will update in realtime.
So now you can make colanders... just kidding:poly124:
sup dawg we herd u liek geo so we put some more geo in your geo so you can smooth while you smooth
i'll just leave these here.
http://edgesize.com/files/videos/Paintgun/
But i reckon it's best to downloaded them because i screw up on the encoding process lol
http://blog.edgesize.com/2011/02/paintgun-flamethrower-modeling-videos/
How I fix this? thanks. I read 20 pages of thread and started practise s-d a little more. BTW, I afraid of finding 58 pages to read the resolution somewhere... so sorry for asking such question, pls give me tip here.
DING DING DING
You've hit the jackpot!
The solution, like 80% of this thread, is to remodel the shape with more geometry!
yay
The problem is that you dont have enough inherant loops to support the shape, so you then have to add more tight loops, but that creates hard edges. So, you start with a more dense mesh, with a smaller "grid" of polys, so your supporting edges are more naturally just there, supporting the curve and also the shape.
Really quick and dirty,
1. create a cylinder with 64 segments and 36 sides, straighten out the edges adjacent to the center edge
2. Select shape, bevel to get depth, bevel once more to get some more supporting edges
3.select and remove the edges that are pinching in the middle
4. Done!
This is messy and only took about a minute to make, you could use even more geometry, and a little cleanup/ using separate mesh chunks would be a good idea. Even more geo for harder edges of course.
photoshap
See attached.
Remenber the bare basics, a cube tessellates into a sphere, and all you need is 6 faces, same concept applies for all round shapes you'd wanna model. (mostly)
Just sayin... clean meshes ftw
Brilliant, that looks a lot better. My brain didn't want to accept that at first because those edges would be left connecting to nothing on the side there, but duh, they'd be quads, so it's okay.
The fastest thing is virtually always going to be just to model it correctly from the start, and that means starting with enough geometry to support your shapes. Having a dense mesh doesn't mean its not a clean mesh.
Now a better way do it with 64 or more segments sphere? Yes, it's ok. I'll do. BTW, I still a bit wondering about for these 90° angles of square we made, it need some connect and or loop around itself to keep square not round in 4 angles.
Is there a popular/well-known way to make these 4 angle looks sharp without go to many segments in original sphere?. Because it requires more segments than those border loop edge (which can even made smooth + nice edge with 32x sphere). I tried chamfer or extrude edges (with zero height) those 4 corners but artifact appear in those 4.
There're some popular way to keep that square. Just IMO, I tried something above but seem all of them not good enough. 1 and 2 is similar.
- 1 is extrude, I like this method 'coz afterward and can remove edges+related vertices easy (not good in this case, leave tri and need manual fix). Otherwise made blotchy smooth in surface nearby 4 corners.
- 2 is chamfer, it mades quad in this case, nice, but afterward the model change, can't go back.
- 3 and 4 is similar, tight loop around edge border. Is well nice for simple model but make overall out of smooth effects (locally affects - and where you suggest me go to more geo). Again seem 4 of them isn't good enough. SO I want people give me tip here. It's basic but it's a question.
EarthQuake: Your anim gif another hands made out a different artifact in square area. And need remove edges to fix. But it's no problem. Your demo doesn't keep square sharp corners. But I know that you just try demo the general method, so thanks again for help. Here I think maybe you skip/overlook my certain object, surely you can handle all these basic issue. So I want to ask again, I just ask more specifically, not any different meaning here.If made them sharp & square + same time smooth hard edge it wastes a litte too many geometry because it'll need another subdivision level in the end to smooth out effect...? (while it's already require very tight loop to keep square in shape).
So I think probably I miss something obivious here, the way manually connect/fix those 4 angles to keep square and smooth (beveled) edge same time. Sorry about my bad English, it's not my native language.
Maybe it's another way to ask - a square hole in round object. (Opposite: A round hole in box). There's tip to make a round hole in box, now with oppsite case, I want to know something similar.
All you need to do for sharper edges is simply use a smaller grid, IE: more sides/segments. The exact modeling methods are not important, nor is matching your mesh exactly, just the theory behind having enough geometry to support the shape, when you understand that, you can simply apply the theory to your object, and other objects as well.
Here is an example of varying "gird sizes" and how they affect sharpness:
And an example of what we can do, when we have enough supporting geometry. We can simply slide some edges closer to the corners without causing artifacts.
The exact sharpness is going to depend on the specifics of how you choose to model it, really you should just try, because it only takes a minute to create these sort of shapes.
For a shape like this, does it matter how many sides your sphere has? I really fail to see any practical relevance to the amount of sides it has.
I'm not an expert but I hope to help you. I'm a Max user too and I used pretty much 'Connect' for these following examples.
Try to understand the concepts behind... experience it by yourself and you will get the point: TurboSmooth takes a cube and makes it become a sphere, with that in mind, add more geo when you need hard edges, also you will need more geo density to avoid 'pinching' in some cases like curved surfaces. And don't forget that Modifiers and floating geo are your friends
I'm learning too, but I hope this helps...