Home Technical Talk

How The F*#% Do I Model This? - Reply for help with specific shapes - (Post attempt before asking)

Replies

  • s_yass
  • AlexandrL
    Offline / Send Message
    AlexandrL polycounter lvl 4
    Looks like you have a shading issue because you moved one vertex that forms the shape of a coneAs you can see I used a cutter with more segments. In that way I have a more consistent topology.
    Thanks!  :) Yup, cutter defenitely should just have more edges, basically it was the major problem. I complitely overthinking it and try to figured out some other solution rather that just use more segments  :'(

  • PolyDoge

    Recap:
    There will be situations where it's necessary to increase the segment count on a curved surface to resolve some minor smoothing artifacts but it's usually possible produce acceptable results without having to double or triple the amount of starting geometry. So it's important to fully utilize the existing geometry as support by offsetting the edges of shape intersections and matching the segments of intersecting shapes wherever possible.
    You're absolutely right, thanks man, very clean explanation
  • drakewho
    Here is my base mesh, it is basically a cylinder and a cube joined together.


    With a bevel modifier and a subdivision surface modifier it looks how I want except around the two triangles where the cylinder and cube fully merge.


    I'd really appreciate some tips/guidance?

    Thank you!
  • Cake_Seller
    Offline / Send Message
    Cake_Seller polygon
    drakewho said:

    With a bevel modifier and a subdivision surface modifier it looks how I want except around the two triangles where the cylinder and cube fully merge.
    Hi. Try to fiddle with these things: 1) levels of subdivision; 2) number of segments of Bevel modifier; 3) the amount of bevel.

    Here is the result I get with subdivision level 2 and 2 segments of the bevel:

    Is this result good enough?

    Here is the mesh:


    Also I used 24 segment cylinders instead of 20 segments, but I don't think it will make much of a difference.
  • drakewho
    Thanks for the help @Cake_Seller. Yes, if I crank up the bevel modifier and subdivision surface modifier the issue becomes pretty much unnoticeable, but I am still concerned I that I have sub-optimal topology and am just covering it up with lots of extra geometry from the modifiers. Is there a better way to make the this object such that it looks good even without having to hide behind cranked up modifiers?
  • Cake_Seller
    Offline / Send Message
    Cake_Seller polygon
    @drakewho looks like I found the reason why you have that shading artifact. Try to add this support loop:



    What level of subdivision and number of Bevel segments do you want to have? Level 1 and 1 segment?
  • Cake_Seller
    Offline / Send Message
    Cake_Seller polygon
    drakewho said:
    I am still concerned I that I have sub-optimal topology and am just covering it up with lots of extra geometry from the modifiers.
    I see many people recommend, well,  "don't fix it if it's not broken". Does your topology make shading artifacts or do you know that it will definitely cause issues later? Does extra geometry affect performance? If not then maybe there is no reason to fix it yet. Unless of course, you use it to practice in making good topology. If this is the case then I would recommend you to not use the Bevel modifier and try to add all support loops manually.
  • Cake_Seller
    Offline / Send Message
    Cake_Seller polygon
    I have a question about subdivision modeling. We basically have two mechanisms to sharpen edges: 1) support loops; 2) edge creases. Is there some set of rules when I should prefer one over another?
    From my understanding: edge creases allow keep geometry simple; support loops usually give a better look, because it creates more geometry and therefore smoother transition between faces. Is this it? Or maybe things are more complex?
  • wirrexx
    Offline / Send Message
    wirrexx ngon master
    I have a question about subdivision modeling. We basically have two mechanisms to sharpen edges: 1) support loops; 2) edge creases. Is there some set of rules when I should prefer one over another?
    From my understanding: edge creases allow keep geometry simple; support loops usually give a better look, because it creates more geometry and therefore smoother transition between faces. Is this it? Or maybe things are more complex?

    To be honest, My Personal op is to go with whatever makes the job look good and fast.
    However, I usually go with supporting loops for the sole reason, that I feel as if I have more control over my mesh, and I like being in control. of it.  Supporting loops tend to also work better for me because you can decide how smooth or sharp an edge should be, while I haven't used creasing that much, but I think it's a lot lesser control with the smoothness of the edge. It tends to be used when you want a perfect hard edge.
  • Daf57
    Offline / Send Message
    Daf57 polycounter lvl 8
    Daf57 said:
    Nevermind - will work it out. ;)
    Could you please share your solution? I'm really curious. I'm learning 3D and yesterday I saw your post and tried to model myself the piece you had problems with and I also found it very tricky.
    @Cake_Seller Thanks for the reply - After looking through the thread, and all the really complex models within, I removed my request. I don't think it's going to be that hard after all. ;)
    I'm working with using 3 different objects to create a facsimile of the part needed.  (I got some help from friend on Fiverr) rather than trying to do it as one piece. I would imagine that there are several ways to come with the same result. I'll try to remember to post what I come up with. Thanks again!




  • Daf57
    Offline / Send Message
    Daf57 polycounter lvl 8
    @Cake_Seller - this is where I'm at with the leg piece. Still hammering away tho, got a bit of tweaking to do. ;)
    Thanks!

  • step8302
    I'm just not sure where to start. I can't even draw it accurately, wireframe or otherwise. I'm not worried about the small details like the mesh or the wires and extra plating on the underside for the screws. I would mainly like to know how to get the shape of this.

  • mr3ddesigner
    Hi,I'm trying to figure out how to fill inside of my object.I want to fill it completely to make it as a solid object
    in order to use it in 3d printing.
    • Also I want to know do I really need to fill the whole object in order to print this model?any suggestions would be appreciated, Thanks
  • wirrexx
    Offline / Send Message
    wirrexx ngon master
    Hi,I'm trying to figure out how to fill inside of my object.I want to fill it completely to make it as a solid object
    in order to use it in 3d printing.
    • Also I want to know do I really need to fill the whole object in order to print this model?any suggestions would be appreciated, Thanks

    just bridge ?
  • mr3ddesigner
    wirrexx said:
    Hi,I'm trying to figure out how to fill inside of my object.I want to fill it completely to make it as a solid object
    in order to use it in 3d printing.
    • Also I want to know do I really need to fill the whole object in order to print this model?any suggestions would be appreciated, Thanks

    just bridge ?
    Yes,I would fill all the gaps
  • aregvan
    Offline / Send Message
    aregvan polycounter lvl 7
    This Kriss Vector stock is giving me quite a hard time. I got it looking like the reference, but the process was a bit dirty, and the cylinder boolean I used ended up messing up the bevel on the edges.



    What are some very simple and clean methods to achieving this?

    Thanks
  • Kanni3d
    Offline / Send Message
    Kanni3d ngon master
    match the segments as best you can so you don't distort either the cylinder, or the bevel. You conveniently have just enough segments, but can add these two loops if you want to enforce quads.



    Don't forget your supporting geo here as well (i'm assuming you're trying to make a highres mesh)


  • aregvan
    Offline / Send Message
    aregvan polycounter lvl 7
    @Kanni3d

    Hey good points. Really didn't notice that I wasn't so far off after all. Yes I will definitely place supporting loops for the high poly.
    Thanks for the visuals.
  • Kanni3d
    Offline / Send Message
    Kanni3d ngon master
    nice yeah, totally weird drawing support loops rather than placing them :tongue: instinctively.
  • aregvan
    Offline / Send Message
    aregvan polycounter lvl 7
    @wirrexx

    Very clear and simple at the end!

    Thanks for the help
  • aregvan
    Offline / Send Message
    aregvan polycounter lvl 7
    For the grip on the Vector, any way to get this bevel from the current state of the mesh? Or would I need to restart from the beginning with the bevel already done?




    I tried beveling that area of issue first before beveling the rest of grip (front and back areas). Seems to work better but would still need to create that back thumb area bevel.




    Thanks as always <3
  • polynewer

    Hey! How to fuse these objects? I realised topology, but i can't fuse ones. Any tutorial or recommendations? Thanks!
  • Cake_Seller
    Offline / Send Message
    Cake_Seller polygon
    Hey! How to fuse these objects? I realised topology, but i can't fuse ones. Any tutorial or recommendations? Thanks!
    I guess add Boolean Union modifier and then clean up topology a bit. There dozens of tutorials on YouTube: https://www.google.com/search?q=boolean+cleanup+blender
  • IronLover64
    Offline / Send Message
    IronLover64 polycounter lvl 2

    I'm trying to model this shape and then bevel it. Beveling destroys the flat surface on top and makes these strange slopes at the corners. Is there a better way to do this?
  • Grubber
    Offline / Send Message
    Grubber polycounter lvl 13
    @IronLover64
    Try changing Limit method to None in Bevel modifier, or reducing the angle.
  • Kanni3d
    Offline / Send Message
    Kanni3d ngon master

    Look at your wireframe post-chamfer operation, you could probably see what's wrong.

    Try selecting these edges ontop of what you initially selected, and bevel.

  • wirrexx
    Offline / Send Message
    wirrexx ngon master

    I'm trying to model this shape and then bevel it. Beveling destroys the flat surface on top and makes these strange slopes at the corners. Is there a better way to do this?
    you could do a couple of things.

    1. select all the faces and right click sayinh "smooth shading". if that does not help 
    2. use a subd modifier on the top. If thats something you want to avoid
    3. Weighted Normal modifier. 
  • Ya69in


    what kind of sorcery did Ray Mairlot do to fuse these cylinders 
  • Kanni3d
    Offline / Send Message
    Kanni3d ngon master
    Ya69in said:


    what kind of sorcery did Ray Mairlot do to fuse these cylinders 

    They aren't fused, they're separate objects (as they should be, since telescopic lenses are separate objects).
  • Ya69in
    meant this,it looks clearly fused idk
  • Cake_Seller
    Offline / Send Message
    Cake_Seller polygon
    Ya69in said:
    meant this,it looks clearly fused idk
    Well, it looks like the mesh and the render you showed have different topologies. 

    Here they are definitely separate pieces:

  • Kanni3d
    Offline / Send Message
    Kanni3d ngon master
    Looks fused, but the smaller cylinder seems to be crashing into the other one rather than having a tiny gap. That - or he had a change in topology to merge them together. No magic here.
  • Ya69in
    fine...thought there's something wizardry to it 
    you guys figure out the impossible sometimes idk
  • borealis
    Hello guys! I need your advise again. I'm modeling this mouse

    Here is my attempt. I was trying to achieve this form using spline modeling (''Loft" modifier in 3ds max)




    Anyway in the end I have this angle on the round part(it should be smooth). Should I add more geometry or maybe I try another topology ?
  • wirrexx
    Offline / Send Message
    wirrexx ngon master
    borealis said:
    Hello guys! I need your advise again. I'm modeling this mouse

    Here is my attempt. I was trying to achieve this form using spline modeling (''Loft" modifier in 3ds max)




    Anyway in the end I have this angle on the round part(it should be smooth). Should I add more geometry or maybe I try another topology ?

    you are adding details to fast, and at that, you're mesh is already very dense.
    Try to block out the entire shape before. See if you can find better references, that shows it from more perspective.
    Take those into your photo editing program and draw out the edgeflow.
  • Kether
    Hey guys! I need advise. I having a trouble to bevel the hole inside there. Every time I try to bevel it the bevel will make the cylinder get hard edge and the rectangle hole become terrible.


  • Kanni3d
    Offline / Send Message
    Kanni3d ngon master
    Kether said:
    Hey guys! I need advise. I having a trouble to bevel the hole inside there. Every time I try to bevel it the bevel will make the cylinder get hard edge and the rectangle hole become terrible.




    Moar geometry. You're using an 8 sided cylinder, which doesn't even closeesly represent the proportions/size of that hole you're trying to detail in. Try a 48 sided cylinder.

  • wirrexx
    Offline / Send Message
    wirrexx ngon master
    start with a 8 cylinder, and make your big shapes (primary).
    subdivide 1-2 (add your secondary shapes).

    clean up some of the edges, I was lazy to do it properly.
    Add new supporting edges to the new shape.



  • Kether
  • Kaito_Mei
    can anyone tell me how to do the hinge here? I do not have a clue how to connect the panel with the hinge...
       
  • Cake_Seller
    Offline / Send Message
    Cake_Seller polygon
    Kaito_Mei said:
    can anyone tell me how to do the hinge here? I do not have a clue how to connect the panel with the hinge...
    Hi, to be honest, it's hard for me to even understand the shape of this joint and what part of the shape belongs to the top or bottom piece. The concept looks a bit confusing to me. Although it has a hinge it looks like it is one piece and the top and the bottom parts will not able to rotate relative to each other because they are coupled rigidly (not sure that I found good words to describe what I mean).

    Is this your problem too? You can not understand what form does this object has? Or you have understood the shape but you don't know how to implement this shape in 3D software?
  • ZacD
    Offline / Send Message
    ZacD sublime tool
    Start with a cylinder blocking out there the hinge will be, and build around it. I wouldn't worry too much about making it make 100% sense or avoiding internal collisions, scifi art takes a lot of liberties with design realism. 
  • Kaito_Mei
    Kaito_Mei said:
    can anyone tell me how to do the hinge here? I do not have a clue how to connect the panel with the hinge...
    Hi, to be honest, it's hard for me to even understand the shape of this joint and what part of the shape belongs to the top or bottom piece. The concept looks a bit confusing to me. Although it has a hinge it looks like it is one piece and the top and the bottom parts will not able to rotate relative to each other because they are coupled rigidly (not sure that I found good words to describe what I mean).

    Is this your problem too? You can not understand what form does this object has? Or you have understood the shape but you don't know how to implement this shape in 3D software?
    I too do not understand the shape either, well partially I do but primarily I want to learn to make a cylindrical detail that is attached to a plane or box-shaped model. I have an idea how to do it but want to see how others are doing it and learn from them.
    I also want to learn hard surface modelling and be able to design from concepts that are seen at an angle like the mecha leg up there.
  • sprunghunt
    Offline / Send Message
    sprunghunt polycounter
    Kaito_Mei said:
    can anyone tell me how to do the hinge here? I do not have a clue how to connect the panel with the hinge...
       

    This is one case where I would use a boolean. Make the hinge half-cylinder pieces and boolean them with the rest of the mesh. As long as the boolean is done when the mesh is very low poly it's easy to make sure it has clean topology with a bit of cleanup. 
  • Kaito_Mei
    ZacD said:
    Start with a cylinder blocking out there the hinge will be, and build around it. I wouldn't worry too much about making it make 100% sense or avoiding internal collisions, scifi art takes a lot of liberties with design realism. 
    will try it out.

Sign In or Register to comment.