When I first saw it I just put in the LoD1 model and it made particles all over about half of it. I think that it might have some kind of limit set internally.
I'm not sure how the CK particles are but with the antimage ones they only go along the front edge of the blade (or are meant to traditionally). I made a new mesh which was basically a strip of polygons with all of the verticies moves into a line along the blade. I couldn't really think of a better way to do it in the short time I had but it seems to have worked okay.
If you look closely (its easier on the default model because it's spread out better) you can see the circles in the center of the particles which happens to be where the verticies lie. But I believe that at least in this case it put particles between my verticies too, so there's more than I actually had. The possibly wrong way that I did my particles means that theres an edge that basically runs from the outmost vertex all the way to the middle vertex, but there doesnt seem to be any visible particle coming from inside the blade.
Also I don't know about the LoD1/0 thing because I only ever imported an LoD1 weapon as it is never seen in the portrait, but I think it's safe to assume it would just apply to both (or perhaps its set to only work on LoD1).
We have just started to add support for effects as economy items and support for them in general on existing items. There are a number of additional things we'd like to add to this basic level of effect customization for items in addition to full blown effect authoring as time goes on. This should ramp up quickly, but here's some information for creating effects on existing items. If you have questions about this process or suggestions to make it better, feel free to contact me. This information will also be going up on the submission requirements page shortly.
Vertex Based Particle Effects for Items -
For items which have effects on them by default, such as edge glows, item authors will be required to submit a .dmx or .fbx mesh which defines where these particles should go on their item. This will use base effect authored for the item and place the particles accordingly.
To do this, create a new mesh, much like creating an LOD. However, this mesh will represent particle positions, one per vertex. Triangles, faces, and general connectivity do not matter on this mesh. The best way to create a mesh for this is to treat it as a single polygon. Keep in mind that particles will be created from all vertices in the mesh, so do not attempt to create valid convex or closed triangles in the traditional sense if this creates vertices in undesired locations.
While it is possible to use the vertices from the original item mesh, generally speaking the density will not end up being appropriate for the effect. In addition, UV's, hard edges, etc. can create duplicate vertices in some cases which is generally undesirable.
There is a hard limit to the particle count allowed for each item.
While each piece of modeling software will vary, here is an example of how to quickly create effects for an item in Maya :
First, start with your finished geometry. Select this mesh and Modify->Make Live. This will allow us to use the base mesh to draw vertices for our new mesh, while constraining them to the topology of the original.
Next switch to the Mesh->Create Polygon Tool. This will allow you to draw the new FX mesh locked to the live geo. The entire mesh will be a single polygon. Draw points where you wish to see particles, such as along a blade edge. The density of these points will usually be higher than that of the normal mesh, it may require a bit of trial and error to get the proper density for the desired look.
Once youve added all the points, you can export just the effects mesh. Name your mesh the same as the item with a _fx postfix, similar to an LOD.
Loading the effect into the item submission tool will show you a preview.
What do you guys use to grab presentation shots of clothing on heroes? ASW and SFM Model viewers are both fucked with Dota items for me and using Marmoset or your modeling program you can't use the animations. Using the in game preview on the pedestal seems like the only option. The resolution for thumbnails would be fine but for a big splash art I don't think it'd cut it.
Well, this is a bummer. It seems that TA's shader is currently all kinds of broken. Makes me hesitant to present the set or submit it until it's fixed. It's really difficult to tell how my masks are working when everything is jacked up to ultra shiny. I made a post on the dev forums, I guess we'll see how that goes.
When I did the Third Insight set for the contest everything was fine, when it came time to adding it to the store my hair broke as well, super shiny. Ended up having to adjust the masks on the hair to fix it as well as redo the whole texture for more uv space on the portrait view, the other items were perfectly fine though.
Not sure if it was a fix, or a compensation for a broken shader.
We have just started to add support for effects as economy items and support for them in general on existing items. There are a number of additional things we'd like to add to this basic level of effect customization for items in addition to full blown effect authoring as time goes on. This should ramp up quickly, but here's some information for creating effects on existing items. If you have questions about this process or suggestions to make it better, feel free to contact me. This information will also be going up on the submission requirements page shortly.
Vertex Based Particle Effects for Items -
For items which have effects on them by default, such as edge glows, item authors will be required to submit a .dmx or .fbx mesh which defines where these particles should go on their item. This will use base effect authored for the item and place the particles accordingly.
To do this, create a new mesh, much like creating an LOD. However, this mesh will represent particle positions, one per vertex. Triangles, faces, and general connectivity do not matter on this mesh. The best way to create a mesh for this is to treat it as a single polygon. Keep in mind that particles will be created from all vertices in the mesh, so do not attempt to create valid convex or closed triangles in the traditional sense if this creates vertices in undesired locations.
While it is possible to use the vertices from the original item mesh, generally speaking the density will not end up being appropriate for the effect. In addition, UV's, hard edges, etc. can create duplicate vertices in some cases which is generally undesirable.
There is a hard limit to the particle count allowed for each item.
While each piece of modeling software will vary, here is an example of how to quickly create effects for an item in Maya :
First, start with your finished geometry. Select this mesh and Modify->Make Live. This will allow us to use the base mesh to draw vertices for our new mesh, while constraining them to the topology of the original.
Next switch to the Mesh->Create Polygon Tool. This will allow you to draw the new FX mesh locked to the live geo. The entire mesh will be a single polygon. Draw points where you wish to see particles, such as along a blade edge. The density of these points will usually be higher than that of the normal mesh, it may require a bit of trial and error to get the proper density for the desired look.
Once youve added all the points, you can export just the effects mesh. Name your mesh the same as the item with a _fx postfix, similar to an LOD.
Loading the effect into the item submission tool will show you a preview.
Good luck -
Scott Dalton
Valve
Cheers for the info Scott, looking forward to giving it a try.
What do you guys use to grab presentation shots of clothing on heroes? ASW and SFM Model viewers are both fucked with Dota items for me and using Marmoset or your modeling program you can't use the animations. Using the in game preview on the pedestal seems like the only option. The resolution for thumbnails would be fine but for a big splash art I don't think it'd cut it.
You can import decompiled animations to Maya or Max and they will apply to the rigged models you have open. That's what I currently do to get my presentation shots for sets. Single items don't even need that. However, decompiling the mdls of newer heroes no longer spits out the animations for some reason so it's not possible a lot of the time. Would be nice if they gave us the animations to work with too.
@Spudnik - Handplane seemed to make a big difference in how nice the normal maps look in source. That's the only thing I did differently than before.
What do you guys use to grab presentation shots of clothing on heroes? ASW and SFM Model viewers are both fucked with Dota items for me and using Marmoset or your modeling program you can't use the animations.
Bake the animation in with the pose? Use marmoset!
Make sure you get plenty of ingame shots and vids !
---
Working slowly on a drow ranger set! Hooray for valve adding 250 more tris to her cape slot!
I was working on skinning my shoulder item for enchantress today and I ran into a problem. With the way my item is designed, I can't seem to skin it so that both her attack and enchant animations run without the item going massively into her body. In fact, I can't even get it right with the enchant animation. I had it working for just the attack though.
Does anyone have any suggestions other than redesigning the item? Is there a way to add bones with custom animations for items? I thought I'd heard something about it, but wasn't sure if it was ever implemented. I'd rather not redesign, but will if I have to.
Here's an ursa set concept I've been working on, looking for some feedback before I go any further. I feel I might've gone overboard with the spikes :poly105: . I'll probably remove them from the bracers entirely (I don't know what I was thinking lol), put something smaller, and maybe some more adjustments to the helm since I'm not quite happy with how it turned out.
I like the idea, but I think that the spike-arch position in the arms is just weird, a row of spikes without the arch would look better imo.
Also, I think it lacks some element in the shoulder/torso transition area, as of now those back spike arches look somewhat detached. Perhaps adding some kind of pauldrons/wraps/gorget/whatever to the upper torso?
The mask and hair look great though, curious to see it develop.
I was working on skinning my shoulder item for enchantress today and I ran into a problem. With the way my item is designed, I can't seem to skin it so that both her attack and enchant animations run without the item going massively into her body. In fact, I can't even get it right with the enchant animation. I had it working for just the attack though.
Does anyone have any suggestions other than redesigning the item? Is there a way to add bones with custom animations for items? I thought I'd heard something about it, but wasn't sure if it was ever implemented. I'd rather not redesign, but will if I have to.
I'll tell you to forget about adding bones. Somewhere,somehow you are able but it makes the actual implementation of your item into the game all the more harder for valve. So if they had to choose between your set which is hard to implement, or one that they can just slot right in, which one do you think they will choose?
It looks like you can just get away with making it bigger to buffer the movement (or lack of thereof) Redistributing your polyflow or adjusting the mesh so that is doesn't hug the deltoid/bicep so much may also be an option!
Try copying the weights from the enchantress body LOD1 if lod 0 doesn't copy over. I had a similar idea for a shoulder piece like that and wondered if I would be able to even attempt it with those tri counts :<
We have just started to add support for effects as economy items and support for them in general on existing items. There are a number of additional things we'd like to add to this basic level of effect customization for items in addition to full blown effect authoring as time goes on. This should ramp up quickly, but here's some information for creating effects on existing items. If you have questions about this process or suggestions to make it better, feel free to contact me. This information will also be going up on the submission requirements page shortly.
Vertex Based Particle Effects for Items -
For items which have effects on them by default, such as edge glows, item authors will be required to submit a .dmx or .fbx mesh which defines where these particles should go on their item. This will use base effect authored for the item and place the particles accordingly.
To do this, create a new mesh, much like creating an LOD. However, this mesh will represent particle positions, one per vertex. Triangles, faces, and general connectivity do not matter on this mesh. The best way to create a mesh for this is to treat it as a single polygon. Keep in mind that particles will be created from all vertices in the mesh, so do not attempt to create valid convex or closed triangles in the traditional sense if this creates vertices in undesired locations.
While it is possible to use the vertices from the original item mesh, generally speaking the density will not end up being appropriate for the effect. In addition, UV's, hard edges, etc. can create duplicate vertices in some cases which is generally undesirable.
There is a hard limit to the particle count allowed for each item.
While each piece of modeling software will vary, here is an example of how to quickly create effects for an item in Maya :
First, start with your finished geometry. Select this mesh and Modify->Make Live. This will allow us to use the base mesh to draw vertices for our new mesh, while constraining them to the topology of the original.
Next switch to the Mesh->Create Polygon Tool. This will allow you to draw the new FX mesh locked to the live geo. The entire mesh will be a single polygon. Draw points where you wish to see particles, such as along a blade edge. The density of these points will usually be higher than that of the normal mesh, it may require a bit of trial and error to get the proper density for the desired look.
Once youve added all the points, you can export just the effects mesh. Name your mesh the same as the item with a _fx postfix, similar to an LOD.
Loading the effect into the item submission tool will show you a preview.
Good luck -
Scott Dalton
Valve
Thank you so much for this info! This will help a lot! Now i can resume my experiments with the particlesystem
I was working on skinning my shoulder item for enchantress today and I ran into a problem. With the way my item is designed, I can't seem to skin it so that both her attack and enchant animations run without the item going massively into her body. In fact, I can't even get it right with the enchant animation. I had it working for just the attack though.
Does anyone have any suggestions other than redesigning the item? Is there a way to add bones with custom animations for items? I thought I'd heard something about it, but wasn't sure if it was ever implemented. I'd rather not redesign, but will if I have to.
You can also try moving some of your topo to the right shoulder and add some extra skinning in hopes that it won't clip that much, but i think that buffing it up is the safest bet. You can also use alpha opacity on that fur (i think it's fur) instead of actual geometry, this will save some tris.
Wow! If making amazing items was not enough, those presentations are absolutely gorgeous! Can I ask you how you make them? Is it just a Marmoset shot with a cool background or there's something more to it?
sadly tge last few items don't do very well n the workshop, especially compared to the way simpler first tstcase we added :X
is there any source of what mae it actually in the game? before we fit this hammer to axe we searched for items in the store and the ones accepted ofr the game in the workshop. but apperently the hammer does was accepted but n added? How are we supposed to know that?
about the presentation, yes its marmoset, with a bit of post - nothing too fancy
sadly tge last few items don't do very well n the workshop, especially compared to the way simpler first tstcase we added :X
is there any source of what mae it actually in the game? before we fit this hammer to axe we searched for items in the store and the ones accepted ofr the game in the workshop. but apperently the hammer does was accepted but n added? How are we supposed to know that?
about the presentation, yes its marmoset, with a bit of post - nothing too fancy
nice dragonskin anuxi!
Well, speaking from what I saw regarding items that got into the game in the past and now, their selection has had its standard set higher. Added, they might want to make the inflow of items balanced at many levels. They might like an item you made, but they don't see it the right time to introduce it into the game.
Really, best thing is just enjoy making the items and never worry if it makes into the game or not. Trying to guess what they like isn't gonna improve the odds and you might end up forcing your creativity into a tunnel.
i totally agree to that, still i think some informations are pretty vague to non existent and of course it would make more fun to make items that are fitting to the game, so far we tried to reference that from what already is in the store and what people like - so we don't make stuff thats entirely unfitting, after all this whole topic is pretty new to us, so any information is good to know and will make items better for the game.
Following the hangout question about lighting spaces. Loadout preview actually inherits the testmap set-up, so you can basically test your item, run testmap, use something like Rabid for LD, or ult for Sven and have that effect in your loadout preview.
hi guys, im newbie and i speak english not well...
so i have some problem today with import model into dota2. i have color map, normal map, mask 1 and 2 but that thing get problem when i import them into workshop, pls help me
Note:
Great News on the particles, I might finially work on my Lina courier again
@ Scott Dalton: Is it also possible to just change colors from certain effects? Want to use it on my CK set so the tail will be red/orange.
Finially managed to get some more work don on my CK set, don't have much time lately but I really wnat to finish this in 1 or 2 weeks!
Also Can someone tell me if it's possible to transfer skinning weights from 1 model to another, so I don't need to change so much on the CK mount I'm working on. Finishing the lod_1 allready was a pain in the ass
Also Can someone tell me if it's possible to transfer skinning weights from 1 model to another, so I don't need to change so much on the CK mount I'm working on. Finishing the lod_1 allready was a pain in the ass
Right click on the Skin modifier in your stack -> Copy
Select lod 1, right click on the stack -> Paste
So I have what is probably a pretty noob question but I have no shame
So I have this model I made really early on and I spent a damn long time texturing and sculpting. However I was ignorant to the fact of lods, so when it came down to it I couldn't reduce the polycount enough without completely butchering the uvs.
I've heard of "skin weights" but I have never bothered with weight or other sorts of painting in blender. Is this the answer to my problem?
So I have what is probably a pretty noob question but I have no shame
So I have this model I made really early on and I spent a damn long time texturing and sculpting. However I was ignorant to the fact of lods, so when it came down to it I couldn't reduce the polycount enough without completely butchering the uvs.
NOTE: Mind you that if this is just a problem because blender is just not there yet, all I need is an excuse like this to learn my copy of either Max 2013 or Maya 2013.
Well shoot, I was somewhat hoping that it would be Maya since i have to eventually learn it for school but I guess I'll go on ahead with Max. Have any recommended tutorials for someone who is transitioning to it?
i guess thats something a maya artist could tell you ^^
vlad i guess you can't make much about that, but maybe show us how it looks in max? maybe you could equalize the normals there before you bake. not sure if smd exports custom normals though
For some heroes doesnt have anything in the workshop.Why is that?Did Valve acept items only for some heroes or something else?
Some heroes haven't been broken down yet. Valve haven't decided the triangle limit for the different parts (like helmet and such) and haven't made the model completely symmetrical. So in short, the heroes aren't ready yet.
Meanwhile. I like the beard, just not sure what to do with this bit
They blend perfectly on color and normal maps.
It looks good to be honest right now However if you would like it to be perfect (if dota read edited normals) you could edit sidewhisker normals to match them with sourounding normals of beard.
It looks good to be honest right now However if you would like it to be perfect (if dota read edited normals) you could edit sidewhisker normals to match them with sourounding normals of beard.
Some heroes haven't been broken down yet. Valve haven't decided the triangle limit for the different parts (like helmet and such) and haven't made the model completely symmetrical. So in short, the heroes aren't ready yet.
Thanks for the fast response!Where i can see which heroes are available currently for the workshop?
Replies
We have just started to add support for effects as economy items and support for them in general on existing items. There are a number of additional things we'd like to add to this basic level of effect customization for items in addition to full blown effect authoring as time goes on. This should ramp up quickly, but here's some information for creating effects on existing items. If you have questions about this process or suggestions to make it better, feel free to contact me. This information will also be going up on the submission requirements page shortly.
Vertex Based Particle Effects for Items -
For items which have effects on them by default, such as edge glows, item authors will be required to submit a .dmx or .fbx mesh which defines where these particles should go on their item. This will use base effect authored for the item and place the particles accordingly.
To do this, create a new mesh, much like creating an LOD. However, this mesh will represent particle positions, one per vertex. Triangles, faces, and general connectivity do not matter on this mesh. The best way to create a mesh for this is to treat it as a single polygon. Keep in mind that particles will be created from all vertices in the mesh, so do not attempt to create valid convex or closed triangles in the traditional sense if this creates vertices in undesired locations.
While it is possible to use the vertices from the original item mesh, generally speaking the density will not end up being appropriate for the effect. In addition, UV's, hard edges, etc. can create duplicate vertices in some cases which is generally undesirable.
There is a hard limit to the particle count allowed for each item.
While each piece of modeling software will vary, here is an example of how to quickly create effects for an item in Maya :
First, start with your finished geometry. Select this mesh and Modify->Make Live. This will allow us to use the base mesh to draw vertices for our new mesh, while constraining them to the topology of the original.
Next switch to the Mesh->Create Polygon Tool. This will allow you to draw the new FX mesh locked to the live geo. The entire mesh will be a single polygon. Draw points where you wish to see particles, such as along a blade edge. The density of these points will usually be higher than that of the normal mesh, it may require a bit of trial and error to get the proper density for the desired look.
Once youve added all the points, you can export just the effects mesh. Name your mesh the same as the item with a _fx postfix, similar to an LOD.
Loading the effect into the item submission tool will show you a preview.
Good luck -
Scott Dalton
Valve
When I did the Third Insight set for the contest everything was fine, when it came time to adding it to the store my hair broke as well, super shiny. Ended up having to adjust the masks on the hair to fix it as well as redo the whole texture for more uv space on the portrait view, the other items were perfectly fine though.
Not sure if it was a fix, or a compensation for a broken shader.
Managed to find a pic
Cheers for the info Scott, looking forward to giving it a try.
You can import decompiled animations to Maya or Max and they will apply to the rigged models you have open. That's what I currently do to get my presentation shots for sets. Single items don't even need that. However, decompiling the mdls of newer heroes no longer spits out the animations for some reason so it's not possible a lot of the time. Would be nice if they gave us the animations to work with too.
@Spudnik - Handplane seemed to make a big difference in how nice the normal maps look in source. That's the only thing I did differently than before.
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=155265807
Bake the animation in with the pose? Use marmoset!
Make sure you get plenty of ingame shots and vids
---
Working slowly on a drow ranger set! Hooray for valve adding 250 more tris to her cape slot!
Does anyone have any suggestions other than redesigning the item? Is there a way to add bones with custom animations for items? I thought I'd heard something about it, but wasn't sure if it was ever implemented. I'd rather not redesign, but will if I have to.
or are we unable to do so?
Good to see we have some Valve support here!
Awesome
Here's an ursa set concept I've been working on, looking for some feedback before I go any further. I feel I might've gone overboard with the spikes :poly105: . I'll probably remove them from the bracers entirely (I don't know what I was thinking lol), put something smaller, and maybe some more adjustments to the helm since I'm not quite happy with how it turned out.
I like the idea, but I think that the spike-arch position in the arms is just weird, a row of spikes without the arch would look better imo.
Also, I think it lacks some element in the shoulder/torso transition area, as of now those back spike arches look somewhat detached. Perhaps adding some kind of pauldrons/wraps/gorget/whatever to the upper torso?
The mask and hair look great though, curious to see it develop.
I'll tell you to forget about adding bones. Somewhere,somehow you are able but it makes the actual implementation of your item into the game all the more harder for valve. So if they had to choose between your set which is hard to implement, or one that they can just slot right in, which one do you think they will choose?
It looks like you can just get away with making it bigger to buffer the movement (or lack of thereof) Redistributing your polyflow or adjusting the mesh so that is doesn't hug the deltoid/bicep so much may also be an option!
Try copying the weights from the enchantress body LOD1 if lod 0 doesn't copy over. I had a similar idea for a shoulder piece like that and wondered if I would be able to even attempt it with those tri counts :<
Thank you so much for this info! This will help a lot! Now i can resume my experiments with the particlesystem
sadly tge last few items don't do very well n the workshop, especially compared to the way simpler first tstcase we added :X
is there any source of what mae it actually in the game? before we fit this hammer to axe we searched for items in the store and the ones accepted ofr the game in the workshop. but apperently the hammer does was accepted but n added? How are we supposed to know that?
about the presentation, yes its marmoset, with a bit of post - nothing too fancy
nice dragonskin anuxi!
You have no idea how nice it is to have some info directly from the source, thanks!
@Frump
How are you adding the animation in Maya? Hasn't worked for me so far...
Well, speaking from what I saw regarding items that got into the game in the past and now, their selection has had its standard set higher. Added, they might want to make the inflow of items balanced at many levels. They might like an item you made, but they don't see it the right time to introduce it into the game.
Really, best thing is just enjoy making the items and never worry if it makes into the game or not. Trying to guess what they like isn't gonna improve the odds and you might end up forcing your creativity into a tunnel.
a-w-e-s-o-m-e
so i have some problem today with import model into dota2. i have color map, normal map, mask 1 and 2 but that thing get problem when i import them into workshop, pls help me
Note:
Starting import of mu...
Compiling TGA: materialsrc\models\items\dragon_knight\0x063a7c05\mu\mu_color.tga
- Compilation successful.
Compiling VTF: materials\models\items\dragon_knight\0x063a7c05\mu\mu_color.vtf
CTargetVTF::Compile( mu_color.vtf ) - RunCommandLine Failed - ""e:\game\bin\vtex.exe" -nop4 -nopause -dontusegamedir "e:\game\steam\steamapps\common\dota 2 beta\content\dota\materialsrc\models\items\dragon_knight\0x063a7c05\mu\mu_color.tga""
@ Scott Dalton: Is it also possible to just change colors from certain effects? Want to use it on my CK set so the tail will be red/orange.
Finially managed to get some more work don on my CK set, don't have much time lately but I really wnat to finish this in 1 or 2 weeks!
Also Can someone tell me if it's possible to transfer skinning weights from 1 model to another, so I don't need to change so much on the CK mount I'm working on. Finishing the lod_1 allready was a pain in the ass
Progress so far:
Select lod 1, right click on the stack -> Paste
Wow so simple, thx a lot VLad!
Found some more info on a different approach here on polycount but this allready worked perfectly..
So I have this model I made really early on and I spent a damn long time texturing and sculpting. However I was ignorant to the fact of lods, so when it came down to it I couldn't reduce the polycount enough without completely butchering the uvs.
I've heard of "skin weights" but I have never bothered with weight or other sorts of painting in blender. Is this the answer to my problem?
Thanks!
This part is about rigging.
Tell us what you wanna do? Rebake the texture for different UV layout?
I'll let this picture explain.
NOTE: Mind you that if this is just a problem because blender is just not there yet, all I need is an excuse like this to learn my copy of either Max 2013 or Maya 2013.
Meanwhile. I like the beard, just not sure what to do with this bit
They blend perfectly on color and normal maps.
Thanks!
vlad i guess you can't make much about that, but maybe show us how it looks in max? maybe you could equalize the normals there before you bake. not sure if smd exports custom normals though
Some heroes haven't been broken down yet. Valve haven't decided the triangle limit for the different parts (like helmet and such) and haven't made the model completely symmetrical. So in short, the heroes aren't ready yet.
It looks good to be honest right now
http://wiki.polycount.net/VertexNormal
http://wypierpapier.blogspot.com/2010/02/vertex-normal-tutorial.html (sorry thats in polish)
Thanks for the fast response!Where i can see which heroes are available currently for the workshop?
http://www.dota2.com/workshop/requirements
I finished my entry for this months competition. I hope you like it. Cheers!
Workshop link: http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=155465296
After seeing your axe for the Darksiders contest I can't wait to see what you come up with for DotA!
man you can do that in blender, if you click on the delete menu and click delete edge loop, it preserves the UVs