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How The F*#% Do I Model This? - Reply for help with specific shapes - (Post attempt before asking)

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  • WarrenM
    That's well said. And it's true of almost everything in 3D. In fact, I'd go a step further and say that asking "Why?" is a good start, but also try it for yourself. Does having a triangle on your mesh melt your normal map or something? No? Then you've just discovered that the advice you were given is wrong.

    Or, at least, it comes with qualifiers that you weren't given. Like, animation or deformation concerns.
  • WaYWO
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    WaYWO greentooth
    Actually it depends. Tris are bad because of the way they smooth; They tend to create bulges, like NGons on subdivided meshes... otherwise on planar geo it's totally fine and it's a time saver...

    these "issues" are fully visible at least with shinny materials like blinn or phong.
  • WarrenM
    I should have been clearer. Both triangles and n-gons are fine if they aren't affecting the smoothing of your mesh.
  • tommyscottart
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    tommyscottart polycounter lvl 8
    Hi everyone! This photo is of a dome with a cool diamond-like pattern all over it equally. How would you even begin to model this on a sphere?

    http://i.imgur.com/bwATJDJ.jpg
  • King Mango
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    King Mango polycounter lvl 16
    If you're using Maya create a platonic solid of icosahedron.
    Smooth it 3x using linear which will keep the triangles.
    Create a smaller sphere and then shrink wrap the smoothed icosahedron to regain a spherical shape as it will have some verts protruding after a linear smooth.
    Then extrude hexagonal shapes several times to get the steps.
  • King Mango
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    King Mango polycounter lvl 16
    ok nm that gets unpredictable results after going more in depth with the process. Some of the polys lose symmetry. Try a geodesic script from creative crash?
    I unfortunately have to step out and can not try this but it looks promising:
    http://trevorius.com/scrapbook/uncategorized/geodesic-sphere-with-ui/

    EDIT ok that still doesn't really work either.keeping symmetry between polys is nigh impossible.
    I created an icosahedron, scaled all the verts down very close to a dense sphere, shrink wrapped it then smoothed.
    Scaled the new icosahedron up to where the shallowest verts barely stuck out of the sphere. Hand picked a group that had matching elevation above the sphere scaled them down to match. Shrink wrap smooth again.
    Repeated this process two more times and STILL got uneven shapes.
    As a half-hearted suggestion check this site out?
    http://www.ziptiedomes.com/geodesic-dome-calculators/6v-geodesic-dome-calculator.htm
  • Bummer6
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    Bummer6 polycounter lvl 15
    This one should be easy for you guys. Is this geo okay, or is there some better way of doing it that I'm not seeing? It looks alright when it's smoothed, but my OCD is telling me to get rid of that 5-sided polygon... I feel like I'm missing something really freakin' obvious here.
    ngon.png
  • wirrexx
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    wirrexx quad damage
    Bummer6 wrote: »
    This one should be easy for you guys. Is this geo okay, or is there some better way of doing it that I'm not seeing? It looks alright when it's smoothed, but my OCD is telling me to get rid of that 5-sided polygon... I feel like I'm missing something really freakin' obvious here.
    ngon.png
    If it sits, it fits!

    Basically, if it gives you the desired smoothing well than.. !
  • WarrenM
    Yes, first ask yourself ... does it matter? If it doesn't, move on to something more important. Heh.
  • maxivz
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    maxivz interpolator
    I actually use 5 sided polygons in a lot of places in my models. As long as it smooths as expected or the issue is very small just move on to more important stuff :)
  • a3D
    If you are determined and really want to only have quads on that mesh, there are several solutions. This is a quick one.
    359y0w4.jpg

    You have to move vertices in order to have an even distribution of geometry, or at least a gradual shift.
    You can use of average vertex or edit edge flow to automate the process, but you'll have to delete some faces and possibly draw temporary faces in order to make the program understand exactly what you want to blend and in which direction.
  • King Mango
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    King Mango polycounter lvl 16
    Back to the geodesic dome problem. I modeled out a hex with a raised center and then extruded some platforms and then duplicated it out into a square array.
    I tried to use a couple of non-linear bends to make it into a dome but it's pinching one of the axes.
    I figure this is the way to do it though if only I could figure out the right way to deform it.
    Here's an OBJ if anyone wants to have a go
    https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B6QMsNRqTwb7R09DTWtnNlkwTXM/view?usp=sharing
  • a3D
    AFAIK, a sphere that's only made of hexes is geometrically impossible.
    The subject has been extensively covered elsewhere.

    For example,
    http://forums.autodesk.com/t5/modeling/hexagon-ball/td-p/4021084

    The reference picture just happens to not show the pentagons, but they must be there

    Anyway, starting from a Geosphere, smooth it and add a sculpt deformer to make it spheric
  • PetSto
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    PetSto polycounter lvl 4
    Hi polyguys, I need advice with mesh wire, I figh with this and dont know how to fix subd topology to nice quads.

    done46.jpg
  • WarrenM
    Do you need to? Does the mesh smooth correctly?
  • tommyscottart
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    tommyscottart polycounter lvl 8
    Thanks for the help guys! I do appreciate it.

    EDIT: Concerning Sculpt Deformer, I'm using Max...is there a version of that tool in Max?
  • WaYWO
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    WaYWO greentooth
    Thanks for the help guys! I do appreciate it.

    EDIT: Concerning Sculpt Deformer, I'm using Max...is there a version of that tool in Max?

    Your question was interesting to me as well so thank you + i guess spherize modifier will do the job in Max.
  • EarthQuake
    WarrenM wrote: »
    That's well said. And it's true of almost everything in 3D. In fact, I'd go a step further and say that asking "Why?" is a good start, but also try it for yourself. Does having a triangle on your mesh melt your normal map or something? No? Then you've just discovered that the advice you were given is wrong.

    Or, at least, it comes with qualifiers that you weren't given. Like, animation or deformation concerns.

    Exactly, incomplete advice can be just as harmful as bad advice, especially if repeated ad infinitum without understanding.
    WaYWO wrote: »
    Actually it depends. Tris are bad because of the way they smooth; They tend to create bulges, like NGons on subdivided meshes... otherwise on planar geo it's totally fine and it's a time saver...

    these "issues" are fully visible at least with shinny materials like blinn or phong.

    I think you need to re-read the bolded part of Warren's post.
  • WaYWO
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    WaYWO greentooth
    Understood, but I've skipped this part at first read.
  • LaurentiuN
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    LaurentiuN polycounter
    a3D wrote: »
    If you are determined and really want to only have quads on that mesh, there are several solutions. This is a quick one.
    359y0w4.jpg

    You have to move vertices in order to have an even distribution of geometry, or at least a gradual shift.
    You can use of average vertex or edit edge flow to automate the process, but you'll have to delete some faces and possibly draw temporary faces in order to make the program understand exactly what you want to blend and in which direction.

    Or another way like this,

    NSfA5GS.png
  • Mr Whippy
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    Mr Whippy polycounter lvl 7
    I've been doing some sub-d stuff for archvis recently and this thread has been invaluable for reference from all the contributors.


    I'm wondering though, have many people been using stuff like Marius Silaghi's openSubdiv or Max's 2015 onwards, Blender etc, openSubdiv to alleviate some of the extra workload managing support loops for mostly linear edge treatments?


    For stuff like the above I'd probably just use that approach, though for a soft furnishing I was just modelling I quite quickly went back to DIY loops to get the exact form I needed from the smoothing.

    I'm not sure I'd give myself a headache over managing linear edge treatments when I can just use these newer approaches.
  • tommyscottart
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    tommyscottart polycounter lvl 8
    So, since probooleans give me headaches and some people say not to use them 'cause of all the trouble they can cause, what is the best way(s) to cut perfect holes in basic shapes like cylinders, squares, even spheres? I've looked at youtube videos, but I feel members here might have faster ways.
  • WaYWO
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    WaYWO greentooth
    So, since probooleans give me headaches and some people say not to use them 'cause of all the trouble they can cause, what is the best way(s) to cut perfect holes in basic shapes like cylinders, squares, even spheres? I've looked at youtube videos, but I feel members here might have faster ways.

    Use a regularize script, or a spherize command to circle your selection(there are bunch online). IMO booleans are gold but not for things such as a perfect hole. To make a hole in a cylinder just inset it's cylinder cap, if you want mini holes, just do a double quad inset where you want them, hope this quick reply help...
  • a3D
    Mr Whippy wrote: »
    cut
    It seems like a good idea to use these approaches.
    As a Maya user, I do not have any of this fancy modeling stuff. But I like to retopologize intersection of tubes with quad draw, it's still faster than doing it the traditional way.
  • Klim3D
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    Klim3D polycounter lvl 6
    Hi! please help. How to make was correct topology? http://pixs.ru/showimage/chairjpg_9821183_18410740.jpg
  • Bummer6
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    Bummer6 polycounter lvl 15
    Gee, I feel like I post a ton of silly questions here... Oh well! I have yet another problem. This area is supposed to be smooth, but the shading looks weird and lumpy, probably because of the poles. Could someone show how I should make the topology to avoid these issues? The shading problem really doesn't come across very well on a picture, but it shows very well when a lightsource is moving across the model.

    screenshot_01.jpg
  • Noors
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    Noors greentooth
    Yeah that's not the best place for poles. Try to keep the lines parallels on the side.
    jyt9wjhh.jpg
    i try to think how the model is machined irl, and basically, it's simple shapes with booleans operations. So think booleans with support loops (even if you don't really model it with booleans operations)
  • tommyscottart
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    tommyscottart polycounter lvl 8
    Thanks for the help WaYWO! New problem time! :D

    In Max, how do I make these spaces equal in distance? Image here: http://i.imgur.com/FX6DTtb.jpg
  • Colddeez
    Thanks for the help WaYWO! New problem time! :D

    In Max, how do I make these spaces equal in distance? Image here: http://i.imgur.com/FX6DTtb.jpg


    I'd build half of it and use the symmetry modifier.
  • a3D
    Thanks for the help WaYWO! New problem time! :D

    In Max, how do I make these spaces equal in distance? Image here: http://i.imgur.com/FX6DTtb.jpg
    1- make cylinder
    2- select edge ring
    3- connect
    4- select the new loop
    5- chamfer (from 1 to 2 edges) so you have now 2 lines in the right place
    6- select the 2 new loops
    7- chamfer both with the same value
    8- select both poly rings
    9- extrude inwards with the same value
  • tommyscottart
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    tommyscottart polycounter lvl 8
    Thanks a ton a3D! I still haven't learned enough about Max, so your tips really helped speed my process.
  • wirrexx
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    wirrexx quad damage
    ok, i'm stuck, and i cant for the love of good not figure this shape out!

    The Ref. I have is really bad, and if i had a better one, i'd probably could do a better job.

    1. I'm overthinking it?
    2. how's the shape going?

    Please help meDGsmI72.jpg
  • a3D
    The shape is super-simple. Let's assume the reference is facing the Z axis.

    You have a profile with visible finger indents, that you extruded along Z axis.

    Cut the shape along its Z symmetry, now you have a triple profile with finger indents.
    Leave the central one alone and move the extreme ones back along the X axis.
  • WaYWO
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    WaYWO greentooth
    wirrexx wrote: »
    ok, i'm stuck, and i cant for the love of good not figure this shape out!

    The Ref. I have is really bad, and if i had a better one, i'd probably could do a better job.

    1. I'm overthinking it?
    2. how's the shape going?

    Please help meDGsmI72.jpg

    You're overthinking it though. just by seeing how the handle catch the highlight you can pretty determine if this or that area is "concave", i mean I like to say "do it as you see it". This is why blockout is so important. If i can give you a special advice : visualize indents from all the views.
  • wirrexx
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    wirrexx quad damage
    Probably overthinking it, got to this point, not really happy, but atleast i figured out how to get to that point. Thank you guys for the tips. If you guys have time, i would be very helpfull to see a block in!

    bEst regards
    ZssMwNU.jpg
  • Bummer6
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    Bummer6 polycounter lvl 15
    How would you guys model the area where the "hole" kinda goes over the rounded edge? I want to both maintain the roundness of the hole, and keep a consistent curve along the edge of the grip.

    beretta_950_troubles.jpg
  • a3D
    wirrexx wrote: »
    If you guys have time, i would be very helpfull to see a block in!
    k9fjif.jpg

    You can make it rounder, sharper, etc. Just move the vertices around.
  • wirrexx
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    wirrexx quad damage
    a3D wrote: »
    k9fjif.jpg

    You can make it rounder, sharper, etc. Just move the vertices around.
    Domo Arigato
    Thank you
    Tack S
  • a3D
    Bummer6 wrote: »
    How would you guys model the area where the "hole" kinda goes over the rounded edge? I want to both maintain the roundness of the hole, and keep a consistent curve along the edge of the grip.
    You need to use enough geometry.

    When holes and curves intersect, the smoothing interpolation is altered, and will be stopped by irregular lines.
    You must make sure that your basic shape looks similar enough to the end curve wherever the intersection happens.

    It's in the title of the thread for a reason :)

    mk4eb.jpg

    ilvaeu.jpg

    Topology could be cleaner but I'm a practical guy, if it smooths right it can be ugly IMO
  • Noors
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    Noors greentooth
    shini looks a bit lazy to me. Just go on.
  • a3D
    Shinigami wrote: »
    am i doing it right so far
    Not quite, I can tell at a glance that some parts have a wrong position on the Z axis (too far or too close) not representing the actual shape.

    Also the topology you chose for the triangle shaped hole won't help when it comes the time to bend it (because it's placed on a curved surface, as you can teel observing the handle base)
  • Doguib7
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    Doguib7 polycounter lvl 6
    Hey there everybody!

    I just found this amazing site filled of great artist! Maybe someone could help me with a tedious task I wanted to achieve!

    I am trying to model a sphere with a subtracted star but I want to make it with the proper way! Using quads and right stuff as you all know!

    I am making this for personal achieving and studying!
    I take this challenge to learn a bit more of 3D modelling!
    Take a look at the attached images so you can see what I have done!
    You'll get the Idea of what I want!

    I thinks this is harder than I thing so this is why I am asking here for some tips!
    At the moment I can't get the points of the star sharp, I am getting rounded ones! and I do not know how to get it!

    Hope you can throw me some tips!

    Thanks in advance!!!
    Oh! I am using C4D for modelling!
  • C86G
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    C86G greentooth
    There are better/easier ways to do (zbrush or modeling as plane + wrap around sphere) but try something like this:

    i2sorc5m.jpg
  • WarrenM
    Star from a sphere .. yikes. I'd do something like MeshFusion or ZBrush. Life is too short. :P
  • Doguib7
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    Doguib7 polycounter lvl 6
    hey thanks! Im gonna give it a try! Kind of complicated to me!
    That wrapping idea sounds interesting!
    Also the main idea is to have the interior of the star smooth as the sphere surface!
    Thanks in advance!
  • Fingus
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    Fingus polycounter lvl 11
    For this I would recommend working from a higher poly sphere. SubD is not gonna work with your current mesh. All the unevenly distributed edges are breaking curvature.
  • Doguib7
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    Doguib7 polycounter lvl 6
    Ok thank you guys! What about the star's topology? Did I make it well?
    Thanks in advance!
  • ZacD
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    ZacD ngon master
    Does it need to sub-divide? If not, try this.

    uyQFSd6.png

    If it needs to be smoother, you can subdivide the dodecahedron more.
  • Doguib7
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    Doguib7 polycounter lvl 6
    Oh Gosh!! Closer!!!!!! Thanks ZacD @ZacD! That is a really close solution! I need it to be sub D but star interior like sphere surface! the problem i am facing now is the edges! I need to have them with great bevel! and keeping the star points sharp aswell! Gonna try to upload some screenshots soon! Thanks in advance to everyone elping me! Really appreciate it!
    Pura Vida!
  • ZacD
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    ZacD ngon master
    Something like this?

    lIAGgpp.png
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