Thats odd, I'm not seeing that here. What system specs/os/gpu/etc do you have?
Hey EarthQuake,
Thanks for the reply
My system specs:
OS - Windows 7 SP1 installed on an 120 GB SSD
CPU - Intel Core i7 920 @2.7Ghz
Video Card - Nvidia GeFroce GTX 660 Ti 3GB ram, up to date drivers (version 331.82)
Ram - 12 GB
I have tried tangent space vector displacement maps on various meshes now and no matter what I do, the mesh appears to go partially transparent whenever I am using shadow casting lights with tangent space VD maps. The transparency moves and changes as I move the camera around the object too, almost looks like a camera clipping issue.
The latest update appears to have fixed those pesky clipping errors I think, so yay!
I have noticed something with depth of field though. I'm not certain if it's a bug or is working as intended.
Basically capturing my final images at double my screen res seems to adjust the my depth of field settings in the final image, the same thing happens when I adjust the viewport resolution settings to 2:1.
Got my home install working thanks to Marmo support, but now I seem to have lost IBL shadows... Tried meshes of various scales, different materials, etc.
Shadows from placed lights seem to still work though.
Is there a chance that the floor option from TB1 will return? Making a plane with the current alpha options in TB2 leaves a lot of grain and doesn't work well with specular or gloss. I've also noticed that when you render out images with transparency on, the images slightly leave a white outline around the mesh.
Do you think custom camera anim could ever be implemented? Maybe like sweeping shots from a to b in its simplest form for dioramas and such.
Animation is something we plan on giving a lot of love with a future update. Probably not any time soon though. I can’t really talk about specific features of the animation system yet, but camera animation is something we want to add.
OS - Windows 7 SP1 installed on an 120 GB SSD
CPU - Intel Core i7 920 @2.7Ghz
Video Card - Nvidia GeFroce GTX 660 Ti 3GB ram, up to date drivers (version 331.82)
Ram - 12 GB
I have tried tangent space vector displacement maps on various meshes now and no matter what I do, the mesh appears to go partially transparent whenever I am using shadow casting lights with tangent space VD maps. The transparency moves and changes as I move the camera around the object too, almost looks like a camera clipping issue.
Thanks for the info, could you please send me a scene that has the transparency issue so I can see if I am able to reproduce the issue? Thanks again.
Any reason why the Load Selection in Photoshop is giving me an error that no pixels are selected for what should be the Alpha of the model?
There is a known issue with saving alpha’s into PSD files that crashes when you do something specific, I think its a little glitchy.
Try this:
Copy the rgb contents of the layer into a new layer
Alt+click onto the alpha channel, and then copy that content
Then add a layer mask, make sure you’re in the layer mask view (alt+click) and paste that there.
The latest update appears to have fixed those pesky clipping errors I think, so yay!
I have noticed something with depth of field though. I'm not certain if it's a bug or is working as intended.
Basically capturing my final images at double my screen res seems to adjust the my depth of field settings in the final image, the same thing happens when I adjust the viewport resolution settings to 2:1.
Hi Charles,
Glad to know the clipping/zfighting is improved with the latest build. The DOF/output bug is a known issue, we just haven’t gotten around to fixed it yet, sorry!
Got my home install working thanks to Marmo support, but now I seem to have lost IBL shadows... Tried meshes of various scales, different materials, etc.
Shadows from placed lights seem to still work though.
Hey Ryan,
The sky lighting system is completely different in TB2. Light direction is no longer “baked” into the sky light, you can add/move/edit any number of child lights in the sky editor by simply clicking a blank spot, draggin the lights around, etc.
The sky light system and more are explained in the getting started guide.
Is there a chance that the floor option from TB1 will return? Making a plane with the current alpha options in TB2 leaves a lot of grain and doesn't work well with specular or gloss. I've also noticed that when you render out images with transparency on, the images slightly leave a white outline around the mesh.
The floor system will likely be added back in at some point, I think it’s on the todo list here. Though, the floor system itself will not solve your blending issues.
TB2 does not currenty support traditional alpha blending, alpha blending in real time renderers has a lot of problems (sorting being the biggest) and there are some technical reasons why it is very difficult to impliment into TB2.
The dithered blend mode may look noisy in the viewport, however it renders out much smoother, and you can export and even larger image and reduce the size in photoshop to further smooth the noise.
You can also set up a double mesh material, with dithered blend for the diffuse, and add blend for the specular content. This should avoid the problems with dithered blending and specular. I outlined this method a couple pages back: http://www.polycount.com/forum/showpost.php?p=1971400&postcount=492
Heres a link to the scene+textures as well: diving helmet content
The outline in alpha channel is a known issue, but we’re not exactly sure what causes it. What file format are you using?
I have seen this before in the thread, but can't immediatly find it back if there is a solution, but when I capture an image with transparency and DOF enabled. (turn either off these off fixes it) I get these transparent pixels.
EDIT:
Also getting this bug with tesselation/displacement when lowering the fov and viewing the object straight on.
This is also visible in the viewport and in screenhots with & without transparency.
Is there also a way to have bloom applied to only objects with emissive/heat or have some sort of treshold, as it currently is, even trying to get a slight bloom effect on those parts immediatly blooms up the whole image.
And something else that is currently happening, one of my camera's is stuck in the scene management window, and I can't move it or add to any groups.
Last one is that I have completely seperate pieces in the highpoly, but it's bringing them in as 1 piece. (wich wouldn't be a problem normally, but they need different materials.)
Import 1: I have piece "A" that gets attached to piece "B" when importing.
Import 2: piece "B" doesn't exist anymore, and now "A" is fine.
Import 3: piece "C" wich was newly created for this import gets attached to "A"
Altough when I import the obj back in max it's the same, so I'll probably have to figure out what is going wrong there (they are not attached, so must be max doing something weird).
You can also set up a double mesh material, with dithered blend for the diffuse, and add blend for the specular content. This should avoid the problems with dithered blending and specular. The outline in alpha channel is a known issue, but were not exactly sure what causes it. What file format are you using?
Thanks, I will try that method. As for the rendering issue, I exported my mesh as an obj file. I'll try other file formats to see if anything changes.
I've been playing with the blending modes to try to come up with a way to do grimey glass. Dithered diffusion doesn't really work for glass, as the highlights get all gross. Add blend doesn't really work when you add texture variation, as diffuse is added as blend which = glowy dirt. So my solution? DO BOTH! I duplicated my glass planes, on the first chunk I've added a diffuse only material with dithered blending masked for the grime/dirt. On the second chunk, I've got it set to add blend with the appropriate spec/gloss content. A: No glass B: Dithered diffuse C: Additive Spec B+C E: Additive diffuse+spec for comparison
This shows the difference between the two layer method and simple additive blending a bit better
Big ol gif Textures
maybe a dumb question but, how and where can you add an alpha map to your material?
Loving this new tool so far! Decided to start with a small project to suss out the workflow (Wood base is the default quixel wood). Only have zbrush at the moment so I painted the masks in polypaint layers, converted to texture and exported. Want to look into 3dcoat's texture painting, it looks a lot less painful. Substance painter looks amazing... but I have a feeling it's gonna cost even more than Zbrush...
Some suggestions that came to mind while using TB2 so far:
1. Update mesh button please. Show path of mesh with a load button ( also allows swapping one mesh with another without losing position ).
2. Eagerly awaiting multimaterial shader based on masks.
Would be amazing if such shaders could bake down the textures into one combined map. Even more awesome if textures done in a PBR workflow can be converted to old school spec textures through some mathemagic
3. Second snapping of objects to other objects/grid for ease of placement. Could do a lot with just that and the groups functionality acting as a pivot point.
4. Hold middlemouse button to slide last selected attribute to fine tweak placement, getting juuust that right shade of whatever..
5. Global triangle/mem stats for scene.
6. Instanced materials with overrides (eg. taking a gold preset and making a tarnished gold, changing the original gold preset and having the instance inherit the gold changes)
Hello guys , I apologize since I 'm a junior 3d artist I'm trying to render a wireframe (TB 2.0) for my guy in the pic attached but I'm having an issue as you can see in the body I'm just getting some sort of little white dots instead of my wireframe , if any of you guys pls can point me what I'm might be doing wrong ..... any help will be really appreciated
Hello guys , I apologize since I 'm a junior 3d artist I'm trying to render a wireframe (TB 2.0) for my guy in the pic attached but I'm having an issue as you can see in the body I'm just getting some sort of little white dots instead of my wireframe , if any of you guys pls can point me what I'm might be doing wrong ..... any help will be really appreciated
Thanks in advance folks!!!!
i found a work around for this issue, go to displacement and add a height feature. no need to add any maps or change any settings. the wireframe should immediately pop in once you add the height under displacement.
Toolbag 2 works really well with stylized stuff too! I'm really liking the interesting color adjustments you can get by changing the color value of the different post effects. I'd love to see more NPR features though like Outlines and Posterization. Perhaps interesting shader effects like direction based hatching, similar to anisotropy.
Oh, and could I suggest that the preset values for the skin material be tweaked a bit. 0.5 Shadow Blur seems really excessive and it took me a while to figure out that was the source of the lack of shadows and not a problem with the lights. Also the normal smoothing is really strong and messed with UV seams real bad. Any way to compensate for that?
Would it be possible to integrate sIBL into marmoset? I'd like to use a tonemapped version of my HDRis for the background. http://www.hdrlabs.com/sibl/index.html
you can just load an HDRI and it should work fine? marmoset seems to already use a blurred version of the image for diffuse ambiance (probably taking the 10th mipmap to do it or something similar). and you can create your own lights from the image inside marmoset if you want better control over the sun spot.
you can just load an HDRI and it should work fine? marmoset seems to already use a blurred version of the image for diffuse ambiance (probably taking the 10th mipmap to do it or something similar). and you can create your own lights from the image inside marmoset if you want better control over the sun spot.
The HDRi works fine, but it would be nice if there was an easy way to swap out the background with a tonemapped version or a backplate.
couldn't you just save the tonemapped version out as a new hdri and load that in?
Well it wouldn't work with a traditional renderer, but maybe it would in marmoset. a normal HDRi is 32-bit and the tonemapped version is 16-bit so you'll lose some information. I'm not sure if it would actually be noticeable in marmoset, I'll try it out.
I guess it works now, but it would be better if you could just swap out the background or use a backplate. The lighting is really flat compared to 3ds max though, even with the same hdr image.
It looks like you're loading the LDR image there, not the HDR one. Make sure to load the .hdr file into the load slot in the sky editor.
sIBL support is unlikely, as it is already processed content. TB2 loads and processes IBL content on the fly, and does the diffuse contribution with spherical harmonics. There is no way to load in a custom image for the diffuse contribution, as it is computed in real time.
There is no way to load a custom background image yet, but I think this is on the todo list. But again, make sure you're loading the .hdr file (and that your content is actually hdr) as the screenshots look like you're loading a low dynamic range image(8bit).
It looks like you're loading the LDR image there, not the HDR one. Make sure to load the .hdr file into the load slot in the sky editor.
sIBL support is unlikely, as it is already processed content. TB2 loads and processes IBL content on the fly, and does the diffuse contribution with spherical harmonics. There is no way to load in a custom image for the diffuse contribution, as it is computed in real time.
There is no way to load a custom background image yet, but I think this is on the todo list. But again, make sure you're loading the .hdr file (and that your content is actually hdr) as the screenshots look like you're loading a low dynamic range image(8bit).
Yeah I was just testing it with the tonemapped 16-bit file. With the HDR I get better results but the lighting is still pretty flat. It's better if I manually add the lights, but it's hard to do with so many lights in that little editor. Any way you could make the light editor bigger?
I tried playing around with the selective brightness but I'm struggling to get results like the max render.
I have seen this before in the thread, but can't immediatly find it back if there is a solution, but when I capture an image with transparency and DOF enabled. (turn either off these off fixes it) I get these transparent pixels.
EDIT: Also getting this bug with tesselation/displacement when lowering the fov and viewing the object straight on. This is also visible in the viewport and in screenhots with & without transparency.
Thanks, well look into these.
Is there also a way to have bloom applied to only objects with emissive/heat or have some sort of treshold, as it currently is, even trying to get a slight bloom effect on those parts immediatly blooms up the whole image.
Not currently, this is something we may look into adding in the future.
And something else that is currently happening, one of my camera's is stuck in the scene management window, and I can't move it or add to any groups.
Yes this is by design, currently you need to have at least one camera in the scene otherwise it will crash. So the default camera can not be moved/grouped/deleted/etc, though this may change in the future.
Last one is that I have completely seperate pieces in the highpoly, but it's bringing them in as 1 piece. (wich wouldn't be a problem normally, but they need different materials.) Import 1: I have piece "A" that gets attached to piece "B" when importing. Import 2: piece "B" doesn't exist anymore, and now "A" is fine. Import 3: piece "C" wich was newly created for this import gets attached to "A" Altough when I import the obj back in max it's the same, so I'll probably have to figure out what is going wrong there (they are not attached, so must be max doing something weird).
Yeah that sounds like a max bug. If you can narrow it down to a file that loads correctly in max but incorrectly in TB, please let me know.
Loving this new tool so far! Decided to start with a small project to suss out the workflow (Wood base is the default quixel wood). Only have zbrush at the moment so I painted the masks in polypaint layers, converted to texture and exported. Want to look into 3dcoat's texture painting, it looks a lot less painful. Substance painter looks amazing... but I have a feeling it's gonna cost even more than Zbrush...
Some suggestions that came to mind while using TB2 so far: 1. Update mesh button please. Show path of mesh with a load button ( also allows swapping one mesh with another without losing position ).
[/QUOTE] This is on our todo list, not sure about mesh swapping but mesh reloading for sure.
2. Eagerly awaiting multimaterial shader based on masks. Would be amazing if such shaders could bake down the textures into one combined map. Even more awesome if textures done in a PBR workflow can be converted to old school spec textures through some mathemagic
Were not sure exactly how the layering system will work, still looking into options there.
3. Second snapping of objects to other objects/grid for ease of placement. Could do a lot with just that and the groups functionality acting as a pivot point. 4. Hold middlemouse button to slide last selected attribute to fine tweak placement, getting juuust that right shade of whatever.. 5. Global triangle/mem stats for scene. 6. Instanced materials with overrides (eg. taking a gold preset and making a tarnished gold, changing the original gold preset and having the instance inherit the gold changes) Hope that helps, and happy holidays to all!
Hello guys , I apologize since I 'm a junior 3d artist I'm trying to render a wireframe (TB 2.0) for my guy in the pic attached but I'm having an issue as you can see in the body I'm just getting some sort of little white dots instead of my wireframe , if any of you guys pls can point me what I'm might be doing wrong ..... any help will be really appreciated
Toolbag 2 works really well with stylized stuff too! I'm really liking the interesting color adjustments you can get by changing the color value of the different post effects. I'd love to see more NPR features though like Outlines and Posterization. Perhaps interesting shader effects like direction based hatching, similar to anisotropy.
We may look into a NPR shader if there is a lot interest.
Oh, and could I suggest that the preset values for the skin material be tweaked a bit. 0.5 Shadow Blur seems really excessive and it took me a while to figure out that was the source of the lack of shadows and not a problem with the lights.
Also the normal smoothing is really strong and messed with UV seams real bad. Any way to compensate for that?
This may also be scale-dependant. Normal smoothing relies on your uvs to be set up with a good amount of spacing between uv islands, as well as a good deal of pixel padding on your actual normal map. If you dont have any pixel padding, and have a black background or something on your normal map youll get seam issues.
I'm having some error with tesselation, any idea what the problem could be?
Could you please post more information on exactly what youre doing? Tessellation type? Displacement type? Displacement map? If youre simply throwing pn-triangles on a mesh like this, youre not going to get very good results. PN-triangles is a silhouette smoothing algorithm meant for lowpoly, organic shapes. With rigid mechanical shapes like this there isnt really any way for it to know what to smooth and what not to smooth.
Yep, its a more accurate term for what that content actually is, and the terminology is in line with current generation game engines from Epic, Crytek, etc as well.
Yeah I was just testing it with the tonemapped 16-bit file. With the HDR I get better results but the lighting is still pretty flat. It's better if I manually add the lights, but it's hard to do with so many lights in that little editor.
Ah ok, that makes sense.
Any way you could make the light editor bigger?
There is no way currently, no. Its something we may consider if there is a lot of interest in it. After you place a light you can drag it around in the light editor for more accurate placement. I'm not sure exactly what you're trying to do, the light editor isn't necessarily designed for placing hundreds of unique lights. While that is technically possible, performance will most likely suffer quite a bit unless you have very high end hardware.
I tried playing around with the selective brightness but I'm struggling to get results like the max render. http://i.imgur.com/MsFO7VS.jpg
Yeah thats a little difficult to use, some way to load in a tonemapped skybox replacement image makes sense. I know we plan on adding a replacement bg image functionality, I'll suggest we add a skybox replacement function as well.
EarthQuake and team, Marmoset is an incredible tool, I've been waiting for this to exist for 15 years, so helpful. I am especially happy to see the physically based workflow has been integrated as I find this workflow to be so much easier to work with than the traditional spec and reflection maps. I am purchasing a license right now. Thanks a lot guys.
Now on to my questions:
1. How to a look through a camera? I've created two cameras but can't figure out how to look through them.
2. Is there a way to show the resolution gate so I can frame my shot correctly for capture at 1600x900.
3. I see there is a setting for "sampling 16x," is this offline antialiasing, I am wondering if I should capture my images at double res and scale down or if the 16x aa takes care of this.
4. Where has the chromatic abberation setting gone in post process?
Feature requests:
1. Could you implement the old style Maya controls were you can zoom in by holding LMB + MMB, I'm old.
2. Could you implement a tweak to the Maya controls, in Maya once you are holding RMB to zoom in you can move the mouse up/down or left/right, currently Marmoset only supports up/down, again I'm old and got used to left/right.
3. Could you make an option for adding meshes that references them like the textures currently work it would be nice if these auto updated each time you changed the .obj file on the hard drive.
4. Could you put a reset to default on each slider bar, or have some kind of right click reset to default. I like to experiment with the settings to see what they do, but then I forget what they were originally set to.
Licence purchased! Here is my first scene to test the lighting quality and features, this look really good. Can't wait to see some full environments coming out of this.
--- It would be nice to put in the title bar of Toolbag 2 an "*" (asterisk) like other software do when the file/scene has not yet been saved. Currently I use CTRL+S a lot because I never know if my changes are saved or not.
This seems important by the way as there is no warning when you quit the software in case you didn't save.
--- Related to the CTRL+S, I found a bug that is a bit hard to reproduce. I managed to get multiple times however. At my current home, I have a poor Internet connection which is often down. So when you load Toolbag 2 without internet, you get the pop-up window about the fact that the tool can't reach the server. This is normal.
However, if you use CTRL+S at the same moment of just a few seconds before. Once you click on the "Okay" button, Toolbag 2 close immediately. no warnings, nothing. Looks like a crash.
I don't meet this behavior if I save a bit before or after.
--- Why the performances goes down when you zoom on a mesh with dynamic lights or with a skin shader ? Is that a screenspace performance issue ?
--- I have some problems with the softness of the shadows on dynamic lights. While the projected shadows are good, the self-shadow are broken. Even with a low value, the shadow is quickly broken. (see the attached image)
Is there still no way to do multi subbed materials in Toolbag2? I have a building, its one single mesh, but it has 5 different textures. Do I have to break it up into 5 different parts?
I know that if I did that and export it, it would come up as one one Mesh Object with 5 sub Mesh Objects under it which I could assign each peice its own material. But that still seems WAY more annoying than being able to work with multi sub materials like in 3ds Max
Is there still no way to do multi subbed materials in Toolbag2? I have a building, its one single mesh, but it has 5 different textures. Do I have to break it up into 5 different parts?
I know that if I did that and export it, it would come up as one one Mesh Object with 5 sub Mesh Objects under it which I could assign each peice its own material. But that still seems WAY more annoying than being able to work with multi sub materials like in 3ds Max
i think its planned for the future. but for the building i made i had to split everything up yeah
Regarding the tesselation problem, i was using default settings and after importing it level on x axis (original before it was modified) it solved the error. But only problem is marmoset doesnt support pivot points it seems? I was trying to rotate the telescope independently to the base but it moves from bottom center pivot like everything else. (maybe a checkbox to use custom pivot for future release? )
EarthQuake and team, Marmoset is an incredible tool, I've been waiting for this to exist for 15 years, so helpful. I am especially happy to see the physically based workflow has been integrated as I find this workflow to be so much easier to work with than the traditional spec and reflection maps. I am purchasing a license right now. Thanks a lot guys.
Now on to my questions: 1. How to a look through a camera? I've created two cameras but can't figure out how to look through them.
There is a camera drop-down in the top left corner of the viewport where you can select the active camera. Be sure to give the getting started guide a read as it goes over a bunch of the basic stuff like this: http://www.marmoset.co/toolbag/learn/getting-started
2. Is there a way to show the resolution gate so I can frame my shot correctly for capture at 1600x900.
So, no, not currently. We plan on adding some sort of safe frame functionality with a future update.
3. I see there is a setting for "sampling 16x," is this offline antialiasing, I am wondering if I should capture my images at double res and scale down or if the 16x aa takes care of this.
Yes, the sampling is super-sampling, for most purpose you shouldnt need to capture at double res, but it can help in some situations (like noise with dithered transparency).
4. Where has the chromatic abberation setting gone in post process?
Sorry this isnt back in yet, but its on the todo list.
Feature requests: 1. Could you implement the old style Maya controls were you can zoom in by holding LMB + MMB, I'm old. 2. Could you implement a tweak to the Maya controls, in Maya once you are holding RMB to zoom in you can move the mouse up/down or left/right, currently Marmoset only supports up/down, again I'm old and got used to left/right. 3. Could you make an option for adding meshes that references them like the textures currently work it would be nice if these auto updated each time you changed the .obj file on the hard drive. 4. Could you put a reset to default on each slider bar, or have some kind of right click reset to default. I like to experiment with the settings to see what they do, but then I forget what they were originally set to.
Thanks for the feedback, mesh updating is something we certainly plan on doing, Ill add the rest to the list of suggestions here.
--- It would be nice to put in the title bar of Toolbag 2 an "*" (asterisk) like other software do when the file/scene has not yet been saved. Currently I use CTRL+S a lot because I never know if my changes are saved or not. This seems important by the way as there is no warning when you quit the software in case you didn't save.
Thanks for the suggestion.
--- Related to the CTRL+S, I found a bug that is a bit hard to reproduce. I managed to get multiple times however. At my current home, I have a poor Internet connection which is often down. So when you load Toolbag 2 without internet, you get the pop-up window about the fact that the tool can't reach the server. This is normal. However, if you use CTRL+S at the same moment of just a few seconds before. Once you click on the "Okay" button, Toolbag 2 close immediately. no warnings, nothing. Looks like a crash. I don't meet this behavior if I save a bit before or after.
Ok, I will see if I can repro this.
--- Why the performances goes down when you zoom on a mesh with dynamic lights or with a skin shader ? Is that a screenspace performance issue ?
Yes, most likely because of screenspace effects.
--- I have some problems with the softness of the shadows on dynamic lights. While the projected shadows are good, the self-shadow are broken. Even with a low value, the shadow is quickly broken. (see the attached image)
Yeah the dynamic light shadow size/blur results in artifacts if the value is set too high, youll just have to eyeball it to find a nice balance. This may also be affected by mesh scale, check your mesh against the reference human scale cube here: https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/499159/scalecube.obj
Is there still no way to do multi subbed materials in Toolbag2? I have a building, its one single mesh, but it has 5 different textures. Do I have to break it up into 5 different parts?
I know that if I did that and export it, it would come up as one one Mesh Object with 5 sub Mesh Objects under it which I could assign each peice its own material. But that still seems WAY more annoying than being able to work with multi sub materials like in 3ds Max
Sorry, not yet, but matids are on the todo list. You will have to split your mesh into separate objects for each material that you need to assign.
Regarding the tesselation problem, i was using default settings and after importing it level on x axis (original before it was modified) it solved the error.
Sorry, but that still isnt enough information, if there is a bug related to the axis a mesh is on I would like to know how to reproduce it, could you please tell me: Which subdivision type, flat, or PN-triangles? Which displacement type, height, or vector? Did you have a displacement map loaded? What exact settings for the displacement/subdivision modules? Thanks
But only problem is marmoset doesnt support pivot points it seems? I was trying to rotate the telescope independently to the base but it moves from bottom center pivot like everything else. (maybe a checkbox to use custom pivot for future release? )
No, sorry, custom pivot points are not currently supported, we may add this in the future.
Sorry, I meant which output image format art you using? Try tga and psd and let me know if you have the same problem.
I tried TGA, but with the transparency on for the render setting, it also leaves a white outline. It also doesn't render out planes with an alpha very well, it turns white and washed out. The PSD setting has the greatest result out of them all, it leaves such a minimal amount of an white outline, but the mask it comes with can help you easily edit it out. The method I was using when I was rendering out with PNGs was to render two different images, one with and without transparency to mask out the model. PSD is definitely the best choice if you're planning to alpha mask out your render.
Hi guys, is there a refraction material property somewhere, I can't find anything about making glass in any of the tutorials. If it's not in there could we get a refraction material in the next release please.
Very nice program! Think I found a couple of bugs; when holding down the middle mouse button + moving the mouse in any direction the focus distance changes randomly.
I have set the default tangent space to 3D Studio Max in the preferences but it does not seem to remember the setting even though it says so. So I have to change all the meshes manually after import.
Some feature suggestions:
- Change the rotation/move gizmo from local to world.
- Scale meshes
- Refresh mesh button
And I would also like to see chromatic aberration and distance/height fog, thanks!
Hi guys, is there a refraction material property somewhere, I can't find anything about making glass in any of the tutorials. If it's not in there could we get a refraction material in the next release please.
Refraction is not in yet, and we do not have an ETA on when it will be in, but we are planing to include it in a future release. Refraction will likely not work very will in terms for sorting (as it has to be rendered after everything else) so if you have a complex situation where you need need overlapping glass planes (car windows or something) the refraction shader will probably not be the solution.
Additive specular blending is your best bet for glass currently, and it works rather well for simple, clear glass.
Replies
Hey EarthQuake,
Thanks for the reply
My system specs:
OS - Windows 7 SP1 installed on an 120 GB SSD
CPU - Intel Core i7 920 @2.7Ghz
Video Card - Nvidia GeFroce GTX 660 Ti 3GB ram, up to date drivers (version 331.82)
Ram - 12 GB
I have tried tangent space vector displacement maps on various meshes now and no matter what I do, the mesh appears to go partially transparent whenever I am using shadow casting lights with tangent space VD maps. The transparency moves and changes as I move the camera around the object too, almost looks like a camera clipping issue.
soften normals!!!
And a turntable
I have noticed something with depth of field though. I'm not certain if it's a bug or is working as intended.
Basically capturing my final images at double my screen res seems to adjust the my depth of field settings in the final image, the same thing happens when I adjust the viewport resolution settings to 2:1.
Shadows from placed lights seem to still work though.
Animation is something we plan on giving a lot of love with a future update. Probably not any time soon though. I can’t really talk about specific features of the animation system yet, but camera animation is something we want to add.
Thanks for the info, could you please send me a scene that has the transparency issue so I can see if I am able to reproduce the issue? Thanks again.
Sorry no, I am not aware of any way to get that sort of diffuse glass look where the objects behind it are blured due to the roughness of the glass.
There is a known issue with saving alpha’s into PSD files that crashes when you do something specific, I think its a little glitchy.
Try this:
Copy the rgb contents of the layer into a new layer
Alt+click onto the alpha channel, and then copy that content
Then add a layer mask, make sure you’re in the layer mask view (alt+click) and paste that there.
Let me know if that works.
Hi Charles,
Glad to know the clipping/zfighting is improved with the latest build. The DOF/output bug is a known issue, we just haven’t gotten around to fixed it yet, sorry!
Hey Ryan,
The sky lighting system is completely different in TB2. Light direction is no longer “baked” into the sky light, you can add/move/edit any number of child lights in the sky editor by simply clicking a blank spot, draggin the lights around, etc.
The sky light system and more are explained in the getting started guide.
The floor system will likely be added back in at some point, I think it’s on the todo list here. Though, the floor system itself will not solve your blending issues.
TB2 does not currenty support traditional alpha blending, alpha blending in real time renderers has a lot of problems (sorting being the biggest) and there are some technical reasons why it is very difficult to impliment into TB2.
The dithered blend mode may look noisy in the viewport, however it renders out much smoother, and you can export and even larger image and reduce the size in photoshop to further smooth the noise.
You can also set up a double mesh material, with dithered blend for the diffuse, and add blend for the specular content. This should avoid the problems with dithered blending and specular. I outlined this method a couple pages back: http://www.polycount.com/forum/showpost.php?p=1971400&postcount=492
Heres a link to the scene+textures as well: diving helmet content
The outline in alpha channel is a known issue, but we’re not exactly sure what causes it. What file format are you using?
http://graphics.berkeley.edu/papers/DeRousiers-RRR-2011-02/DeRousiers-RRR-2011-02.pdf
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EDIT:
Also getting this bug with tesselation/displacement when lowering the fov and viewing the object straight on.
This is also visible in the viewport and in screenhots with & without transparency.
Is there also a way to have bloom applied to only objects with emissive/heat or have some sort of treshold, as it currently is, even trying to get a slight bloom effect on those parts immediatly blooms up the whole image.
And something else that is currently happening, one of my camera's is stuck in the scene management window, and I can't move it or add to any groups.
Last one is that I have completely seperate pieces in the highpoly, but it's bringing them in as 1 piece. (wich wouldn't be a problem normally, but they need different materials.)
Import 1: I have piece "A" that gets attached to piece "B" when importing.
Import 2: piece "B" doesn't exist anymore, and now "A" is fine.
Import 3: piece "C" wich was newly created for this import gets attached to "A"
Altough when I import the obj back in max it's the same, so I'll probably have to figure out what is going wrong there (they are not attached, so must be max doing something weird).
Thanks, I will try that method. As for the rendering issue, I exported my mesh as an obj file. I'll try other file formats to see if anything changes.
maybe a dumb question but, how and where can you add an alpha map to your material?
Some suggestions that came to mind while using TB2 so far:
1. Update mesh button please. Show path of mesh with a load button ( also allows swapping one mesh with another without losing position ).
2. Eagerly awaiting multimaterial shader based on masks.
Would be amazing if such shaders could bake down the textures into one combined map. Even more awesome if textures done in a PBR workflow can be converted to old school spec textures through some mathemagic
3. Second snapping of objects to other objects/grid for ease of placement. Could do a lot with just that and the groups functionality acting as a pivot point.
4. Hold middlemouse button to slide last selected attribute to fine tweak placement, getting juuust that right shade of whatever..
5. Global triangle/mem stats for scene.
6. Instanced materials with overrides (eg. taking a gold preset and making a tarnished gold, changing the original gold preset and having the instance inherit the gold changes)
Hope that helps, and happy holidays to all!
is there a way to see how much space the textures take in the Vram?
as for now it seems that its only possible to see how much the mesh itself takes.
Thanks in advance folks!!!!
i found a work around for this issue, go to displacement and add a height feature. no need to add any maps or change any settings. the wireframe should immediately pop in once you add the height under displacement.
Oh, and could I suggest that the preset values for the skin material be tweaked a bit. 0.5 Shadow Blur seems really excessive and it took me a while to figure out that was the source of the lack of shadows and not a problem with the lights. Also the normal smoothing is really strong and messed with UV seams real bad. Any way to compensate for that?
Albedo has always been the correct term, in shaders, Albedo is the colour output.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albedo
Thanks. Been having a great time using Marmo 2 so far
The HDRi works fine, but it would be nice if there was an easy way to swap out the background with a tonemapped version or a backplate.
http://i.imgur.com/G1w1BFu.jpg high res
Well it wouldn't work with a traditional renderer, but maybe it would in marmoset. a normal HDRi is 32-bit and the tonemapped version is 16-bit so you'll lose some information. I'm not sure if it would actually be noticeable in marmoset, I'll try it out.
marmoset:
mental ray render:
sIBL support is unlikely, as it is already processed content. TB2 loads and processes IBL content on the fly, and does the diffuse contribution with spherical harmonics. There is no way to load in a custom image for the diffuse contribution, as it is computed in real time.
There is no way to load a custom background image yet, but I think this is on the todo list. But again, make sure you're loading the .hdr file (and that your content is actually hdr) as the screenshots look like you're loading a low dynamic range image(8bit).
Yeah I was just testing it with the tonemapped 16-bit file. With the HDR I get better results but the lighting is still pretty flat. It's better if I manually add the lights, but it's hard to do with so many lights in that little editor. Any way you could make the light editor bigger?
I tried playing around with the selective brightness but I'm struggling to get results like the max render.
http://i.imgur.com/MsFO7VS.jpg
I have not, I will send the links to our programmers to see what they think of it.
Thanks, well look into these.
Not currently, this is something we may look into adding in the future.
Yes this is by design, currently you need to have at least one camera in the scene otherwise it will crash. So the default camera can not be moved/grouped/deleted/etc, though this may change in the future.
Yeah that sounds like a max bug. If you can narrow it down to a file that loads correctly in max but incorrectly in TB, please let me know.
Sorry, I meant which output image format art you using? Try tga and psd and let me know if you have the same problem.
As noted, save the alpha channel into the alpha of the diffuse/albedo texture. Pick your transparency type from the transparency shader module.
Some suggestions that came to mind while using TB2 so far:
1. Update mesh button please. Show path of mesh with a load button ( also allows swapping one mesh with another without losing position ).
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This is on our todo list, not sure about mesh swapping but mesh reloading for sure.
Were not sure exactly how the layering system will work, still looking into options there.
Thanks for the feedback!
Not currently, no.
Sorry, this is a known issue, hopefully we will be able to fix it in a future update.
We may look into a NPR shader if there is a lot interest.
The shadow blur is scale dependant, try adjusting the scale of your mesh and re-importing. Here is a scale reference mesh that is about the size of a person: https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/499159/scalecube.obj
This may also be scale-dependant.
Normal smoothing relies on your uvs to be set up with a good amount of spacing between uv islands, as well as a good deal of pixel padding on your actual normal map. If you dont have any pixel padding, and have a black background or something on your normal map youll get seam issues.
Could you please post more information on exactly what youre doing?
Tessellation type?
Displacement type? Displacement map?
If youre simply throwing pn-triangles on a mesh like this, youre not going to get very good results. PN-triangles is a silhouette smoothing algorithm meant for lowpoly, organic shapes. With rigid mechanical shapes like this there isnt really any way for it to know what to smooth and what not to smooth.
Yep, its a more accurate term for what that content actually is, and the terminology is in line with current generation game engines from Epic, Crytek, etc as well.
This is certainly something we plan on looking into, it may not be for quite some time though.
Ah ok, that makes sense.
There is no way currently, no. Its something we may consider if there is a lot of interest in it.
After you place a light you can drag it around in the light editor for more accurate placement.
I'm not sure exactly what you're trying to do, the light editor isn't necessarily designed for placing hundreds of unique lights. While that is technically possible, performance will most likely suffer quite a bit unless you have very high end hardware.
Yeah thats a little difficult to use, some way to load in a tonemapped skybox replacement image makes sense. I know we plan on adding a replacement bg image functionality, I'll suggest we add a skybox replacement function as well.
Now on to my questions:
1. How to a look through a camera? I've created two cameras but can't figure out how to look through them.
2. Is there a way to show the resolution gate so I can frame my shot correctly for capture at 1600x900.
3. I see there is a setting for "sampling 16x," is this offline antialiasing, I am wondering if I should capture my images at double res and scale down or if the 16x aa takes care of this.
4. Where has the chromatic abberation setting gone in post process?
Feature requests:
1. Could you implement the old style Maya controls were you can zoom in by holding LMB + MMB, I'm old.
2. Could you implement a tweak to the Maya controls, in Maya once you are holding RMB to zoom in you can move the mouse up/down or left/right, currently Marmoset only supports up/down, again I'm old and got used to left/right.
3. Could you make an option for adding meshes that references them like the textures currently work it would be nice if these auto updated each time you changed the .obj file on the hard drive.
4. Could you put a reset to default on each slider bar, or have some kind of right click reset to default. I like to experiment with the settings to see what they do, but then I forget what they were originally set to.
--- It would be nice to put in the title bar of Toolbag 2 an "*" (asterisk) like other software do when the file/scene has not yet been saved. Currently I use CTRL+S a lot because I never know if my changes are saved or not.
This seems important by the way as there is no warning when you quit the software in case you didn't save.
--- Related to the CTRL+S, I found a bug that is a bit hard to reproduce. I managed to get multiple times however. At my current home, I have a poor Internet connection which is often down. So when you load Toolbag 2 without internet, you get the pop-up window about the fact that the tool can't reach the server. This is normal.
However, if you use CTRL+S at the same moment of just a few seconds before. Once you click on the "Okay" button, Toolbag 2 close immediately. no warnings, nothing. Looks like a crash.
I don't meet this behavior if I save a bit before or after.
--- Why the performances goes down when you zoom on a mesh with dynamic lights or with a skin shader ? Is that a screenspace performance issue ?
--- I have some problems with the softness of the shadows on dynamic lights. While the projected shadows are good, the self-shadow are broken. Even with a low value, the shadow is quickly broken. (see the attached image)
I know that if I did that and export it, it would come up as one one Mesh Object with 5 sub Mesh Objects under it which I could assign each peice its own material. But that still seems WAY more annoying than being able to work with multi sub materials like in 3ds Max
i think its planned for the future. but for the building i made i had to split everything up yeah
There is a camera drop-down in the top left corner of the viewport where you can select the active camera. Be sure to give the getting started guide a read as it goes over a bunch of the basic stuff like this: http://www.marmoset.co/toolbag/learn/getting-started
So, no, not currently. We plan on adding some sort of safe frame functionality with a future update.
Yes, the sampling is super-sampling, for most purpose you shouldnt need to capture at double res, but it can help in some situations (like noise with dithered transparency).
Sorry this isnt back in yet, but its on the todo list.
Thanks for the feedback, mesh updating is something we certainly plan on doing, Ill add the rest to the list of suggestions here.
Thanks for the suggestion.
Ok, I will see if I can repro this.
Yes, most likely because of screenspace effects.
Yeah the dynamic light shadow size/blur results in artifacts if the value is set too high, youll just have to eyeball it to find a nice balance. This may also be affected by mesh scale, check your mesh against the reference human scale cube here: https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/499159/scalecube.obj
Sorry, not yet, but matids are on the todo list. You will have to split your mesh into separate objects for each material that you need to assign.
Sorry, but that still isnt enough information, if there is a bug related to the axis a mesh is on I would like to know how to reproduce it, could you please tell me:
Which subdivision type, flat, or PN-triangles?
Which displacement type, height, or vector?
Did you have a displacement map loaded?
What exact settings for the displacement/subdivision modules?
Thanks
No, sorry, custom pivot points are not currently supported, we may add this in the future.
I tried TGA, but with the transparency on for the render setting, it also leaves a white outline. It also doesn't render out planes with an alpha very well, it turns white and washed out. The PSD setting has the greatest result out of them all, it leaves such a minimal amount of an white outline, but the mask it comes with can help you easily edit it out. The method I was using when I was rendering out with PNGs was to render two different images, one with and without transparency to mask out the model. PSD is definitely the best choice if you're planning to alpha mask out your render.
I have set the default tangent space to 3D Studio Max in the preferences but it does not seem to remember the setting even though it says so. So I have to change all the meshes manually after import.
Some feature suggestions:
- Change the rotation/move gizmo from local to world.
- Scale meshes
- Refresh mesh button
And I would also like to see chromatic aberration and distance/height fog, thanks!
Refraction is not in yet, and we do not have an ETA on when it will be in, but we are planing to include it in a future release. Refraction will likely not work very will in terms for sorting (as it has to be rendered after everything else) so if you have a complex situation where you need need overlapping glass planes (car windows or something) the refraction shader will probably not be the solution.
Additive specular blending is your best bet for glass currently, and it works rather well for simple, clear glass.
If you want dirty glass, you can combine it with another plane that has dithered blending for the diffuse elements, as shown here:
http://www.polycount.com/forum/showpost.php?p=1971400&postcount=492