For all we know, the data recorded by the sensors never get out of your living room unless you are using Skype or else.
What makes sense and what happens is that the video and audio feed are processed by 2 of the CPUs for the OS or the game, and the OS or the game MAY send some data (code not video) to the network if you are playing a multiplayer game or using a network feature.
I mean, when you use some gesture to open a movie on netflix, the video feed is in no way sent through the network, only the interpretation of that feed, which is "launch movie X".
I don't see your average internet connection uploading non stop a 1080p feed to a server anyway, and you would need people monitoring the actual content of the video, I mean this is insanely unlikely to say the least.
Again, it has nothing to do with the fantasy of Microsoft hiring people to monitor streams of Kinect stuff.
It's about the simple fact that there will be circumstances when a running mic and camera and an in/out network connection will be required at the same time.
So how do you guys feel about the ads here on polycount then?
i specifically enable adds on polycount as well as other sites i feel are a net good and provide a positive space on the net. i support the revenue and accept the intrusion when it helps sites that strengthen the community. i would even go a step further and say that if polycount ever decide to accept donations i would contribute to that as long as it remained fully open to anyone who wants to use it. :thumbup:
I wonder how they are going to handle events and situations where they don't have internet but need to market the Xbox One, such as in stores and at expos, including dev's showing off their games at expos. If it is as simple as changing a setting in a hidden command console, it might be a day one hack or exploit.
Again, it has nothing to do with the fantasy of Microsoft hiring people to monitor streams of Kinect stuff.
It's about the simple fact that there will be circumstances when a running mic and camera and an in/out network connection will be required at the same time.
Anything can be hacked, from your smartphone to your laptop to your smart tv. And at least two of these have a camera and mic. I would be inclined to think that a closed system like the XBone is far harder to hack than a phone or PC. And anyway, that discussion is now pretty much pointless since MS told us that the Kinect could be turned off when we wanted it to.
and it is simply impossible for them not to store video and audio on there servers for anything involving video chat, sending pictures, and any other use of those devices. they have the data. any game that uses those devices will more then likely be storing some portion of it azure.
Yes, but it doesn't change from using skype on a PC for example. Pretty much everything you say or write through a Microsoft IM software can be collected, I won't argue against that. My point is simply that the XBone, in the end, won't be much more intrusive than what we are already using today if the Kinect can be put offline when we don't want it to work
They collect all that data because the only use for these mic and cameras until now were to communicate over the internet. Kinect main purpose it to communicate with your console's OS, in local.
Of course we can't be 100% sure they won't collect data, but it's clearly not the purpose of the device.
A lot of this kerfluffle over the "Always On" and "Kinect is watching us" is made somewhat moot by a simple fact.
You always have the option of yanking the plug.
Even if your XBox One always has a low-power state, I seriously doubt that it is going to ship with a battery back up. If you are really concerned about Microsoft watching you when you don't want them to, you can always yank the plug out of the wall. If the XBox One has no juice to run on, it isn't going to be providing Microsoft or the government with a live feed of your home.
I'm a bit more concerned with the general direction that Microsoft is taking with the XBox One. The digital future it seems designed to usher in is already happening elsewhere, and other parties are doing it better.
Steam is essentially XBox One-esque. (or the other way around, you could say) But where Microsoft wants to use it's digital-only plans to secure its console interests, Steam instead uses it for other advantages. One of the biggest advantages that Steam allows is the shortening of distance between developers and consumers. I don't see the same happening with the XBox One.
Of course we can't be 100% sure they won't collect data, but it's clearly not the purpose of the device.
no, the purpose of the device is 100% to collect data. that is what a sensor is used for. a sensor that does not collect data is a... ??? and it is abviously designed to take advantage of the network. even current gen is designed to do that.
i do not use skype, nor does most businesses anymore. skype is old news. there are much better ways to do video and audio now.
and msn? good god please don't tell me you use msn.
no, the purpose of the device is 100% to collect data. that is what a sensor used for. a sensor that does not collect data is a... ???
i do not use skype, nor does most businesses anymore. skype is old news. there are much better ways to do video and audio now.
and msn? good god please don't tell me you use msn.
MSN doesn't exist anymore It's been replaced by Skype entirely.
But you are wrong on the main purpose of the sensor. The main purpose is to analyze your movement for gaming and entertainment purpose and it may be used to collect data, not the other way around.
it would be hilarious if, in a year or so's time, we see a news report that "mans life saved after xbone dialed 911", the console is reading heart rate, recognises a heart attack, and sends a message to emergency services who send an ambulance.
it would be even more hilarious if the police and the ambulance knock down your front door and find you wanking off. and the censor was triggered by a false positive. but perhaps it will distinguish the difference between a heart attack and wanking off and they can send you porno adverts instead? but there is still the case when you are having a heart attack and wanking off at the same time! in which case they can knock down your door and send you porno adverts at the same time!
but seriously, the ability to distinguish between an intense gaming session and a heart attack is next to impossible even with better equipment. insurance has been prescribing heart monitors for years to anyone at risk.
no but I'm pointing out that you decided to change the conversation to what the definition of data is. The Kinect trying to figure out the position of your joints and what user profile to load up is a big difference from Microsoft recording & storing a video stream from your living room.
since this privacy discussion is just going around in circles now here's something I realized today. Ok, my mom is a small sample size but she is totally in love with the voice commands in her new car. Voice control might be the next wii-waggle, which is great for the industry at large if it happens on a console that is more 3rd party friendly. The Wii was very good for brick & mortar retailers & Nintendo but it didn't do much for everyone else.
Another realization hit me, we are just starting to see cable/satellite providers in the US offering fairly expensive prizes to entice you to sign up, this is the generation of the TV Marketing wars. Even Google is offering a Nexus 7 tablet to sign up for their fiber+tv package. I've heard rumors that Microsoft has a secret weapon, I wouldn't be surprised if we saw a $200 or less XB1 with a 2 year Time Warner subscription.
data is any buffer that is picked up off of the wire. whether it be r,g,b,a, or z, or any other. the analysis of that data lies in the domain of computer vision algorithms. that algorithmic analysis in turn created more data. i hope that is clarified.
data is any buffer that is picked up off of the wire. whether it be r,g,b,a, or z, or any other. the analysis of that data lies in the domain of computer vision algorithms. that algorithmic analysis in turn created more data. i hope that is clarified.
yes, that wasn't the discussion - focusing on the exact definition of a word is referred to as arguing semantics and is generally seen as an attempt to distract people from the discussion at large. The debate equivalent of saying "look over there, is that Elvis!?"
if the point of discussion is the collection of data over a sensor and one party does not understand what the definition of data is and makes a mistake distinguishing data. then it is the responsibility of that person to read up on there basic understanding of what data is and how a computer system works. otherwise we are not talking about data. we are talking about what ever attribute of the system you want to call data, as data, which is a bit pointless.
i do not want to get into bickering. if it is desired that no one post in the thread unless they have a certain view and this is more of a promotional for xbone then a free discussion then i will simply not post.
but it is no fault that i can argue my point and that there are people you disagree with that have a sound argument. this seems to be taken personally by a few of you.
no, the purpose of the device is 100% to collect data. that is what a sensor is used for. a sensor that does not collect data is a... ??? and it is abviously designed to take advantage of the network. even current gen is designed to do that.
i do not use skype, nor does most businesses anymore. skype is old news. there are much better ways to do video and audio now.
and msn? good god please don't tell me you use msn.
The purpose of a sensor is to sense input, there's no definition anywhere that says it has to collect that data as many devices have sensors without having permanent storage.
We've had computers with webcams and microphones in homes for decades now, where the webcam is not permanently off, just waiting for a program to activate it and get some input, and the microphone input is running at all time unless you specifically decide to disable it, there's often just no program there to retrieve that input.
Computers running on windows, but again, you've shown your unwillingness to let your windows-box online as you are certain that Microsoft will be mining you to the bone.
You don't happen to be a fan of infowars.com do you?
i do not want to get into bickering. if it is desired that no one post in the thread unless they have a certain view and this is more of a promotional for xbone then a free discussion then i will simply not post.
but it is no fault that i can argue my point and that there are people you disagree with that have a sound argument. this seems to be taken personally by a few of you.
sound argument nothing.
I'm up in the air about this console and in no way a 'fan' of it, but reading through your last couple posts was really annoying. It's like you're here just to argue.
It's borderline flamebaiting.
Just agree to disagree instead of nitpicking people's words or the definition of words just to continue the bickering.
I totally agree that there is a level of tin foil hattery that makes honest discussion almost impossible but I think there are some legitimate things to be discussed.
It's more likely that they are a big company with diverse interests but then again with the school shootings and the ties to video games that keep getting made, you have to wonder if there won't be a push (and not much push back from MS) to monitor games, chat and possibly even living rooms.
I don't know, it doesn't really bother me, I don't do illegal stuff and if someone really wants to watch my livingroom all day while I'm not there, have fun staring at my couch? If I did do illegal stuff, I wouldn't talk about through means that are easily monitored... But still it seems like we're on a steady path of cameras everywhere and everything being monitored, its not really a new path, we've been on it for a while.
What about the fact that all games have to be installed to the HD? Surely 500gb is going to go quickly if you want to keep a rather large library of games, DVR'd games, media, and DLC. Then again, maybe not. Anyone have a guess what the install size of a next gen game is going to be?
What about it only being HDMI? Is that going to limit the consumer base who may have a TV/cable box that only does component? Since it is only HDMI in/out, that works with your cable box as well. For me, despite being in a major city, Comcast is taking forever to roll out HDMI cable boxes. So until they get off their asses, I can't use any of the TV features with the Xbone? When is Communistcast going to get word of this and charge extra for HDMI boxes? Right now they are the same price but you have to special request it in the area I'm in and God knows when you'll get one.
Granted I'm sure a lot of people have HDMI capable TV's but how deep is the conversion? PS4 is doing HDMI/Component just to cover their asses.
And if this thing is supposed to be the end-all media center, why the hell did they leave out a DVR feature for TV? Ohhhh wait, I need my cable company for that one. They should have put a cable card port in there and make this thing the media hub is supposed to be so I could ditch the cable box.
It just seems that Microsoft is on a different path than it's consumer base. I guess we just gotta wait to see what they say at E3.
What about the fact that all games have to be installed to the HD? Surely 500gb is going to go quickly if you want to keep a rather large library of games, DVR'd games, media, and DLC. Then again, maybe not. Anyone have a guess what the install size of a next gen game is going to be?
Current gen games are already exceeding 20GB. This aside, it is always safe to assume that before the end of a console generation, games will be exceeding the capacity of the storage medium presented - this is the same for game cartidges as it is for disks, and has been a factor in almost every console in the past 20 odd years.
Games are therefore very likely to exceed the capacity of a Blu-Ray disk (50GB). It's possible that they may exceed the capacity of the new format Blu-Ray disks and that the new consoles may support them when they hit the market (100GB).
The original 360 had 20GB, only 14GB of which was useable. That gets you around 4-5 modern XBLA titles in 2013, or a single POD game.
I could easily see games filling up bluray discs, Killzone: Shadow Fall is using 6x the ammount of textures per character, Final Fantasy XIII took up 3 dvds, and was about 30 gigs. Max Payne 3 for pc is 35GB
And if this thing is supposed to be the end-all media center, why the hell did they leave out a DVR feature for TV? Ohhhh wait, I need my cable company for that one. They should have put a cable card port in there and make this thing the media hub is supposed to be so I could ditch the cable box.
It just seems that Microsoft is on a different path than it's consumer base. I guess we just gotta wait to see what they say at E3.
I thought the same thing, but then I thought, who are the worst groups of human beings on the planet, collectively.......the cable companies! I obviously don't know what sort of backroom negotiations/talks went on, but I'm guessing for MSFT to include something like that would severely step on the cable providers toes. Now, that doesn't leave MSFT in a better light, because they should have known the cable companies are notoriously unyielding douchebags, and planned accordingly, unfortunately it seems they were at the mercy of cable companies.
Your last point is one I, though I can understand why this opinion is out there, disagree with. It's already been discussed but just because they didn't talk about games, doesn't mean they aren't making games for it, obviously. They mucked up the press conference, that's apparent to all, and their clarification or lack thereof since leaves something to be desired. I guess I just lead more towards optimism, as I'm genuinely excited whenever new platforms come out, because I KNOW there will be games for it, I don't need them to tell me that. With the news that MSFT is putting 1 billion into XB:One games, it just seems kind of silly to say they don't know their core audience anymore when they're putting down THAT much money just for games. They know we want games, I think they just underestimated the internet, and it's ability to be so fickle.
FYI, $1 billion is not a lot of money for 15 titles, that's only $60 million a pop. Realistically, that's about three or four full scale titles with associated marketing, and the rest is lower budget mid-tier stuff (Nike Kinect Training, etc). Halo 4 would have burnt $100,000+ per day when development was in full-tilt and rumour has it that it has yet to actually recoup it's costs - which puts total cost in the $300 million plus ballpark.
I thought the same thing, but then I thought, who are the worst groups of human beings on the planet, collectively.......the cable companies! I obviously don't know what sort of backroom negotiations/talks went on, but I'm guessing for MSFT to include something like that would severely step on the cable providers toes. Now, that doesn't leave MSFT in a better light, because they should have known the cable companies are notoriously unyielding douchebags, and planned accordingly, unfortunately it seems they were at the mercy of cable companies.
Your last point is one I, though I can understand why this opinion is out there, disagree with. It's already been discussed but just because they didn't talk about games, doesn't mean they aren't making games for it, obviously. They mucked up the press conference, that's apparent to all, and their clarification or lack thereof since leaves something to be desired. I guess I just lead more towards optimism, as I'm genuinely excited whenever new platforms come out, because I KNOW there will be games for it, I don't need them to tell me that. With the news that MSFT is putting 1 billion into XB:One games, it just seems kind of silly to say they don't know their core audience anymore when they're putting down THAT much money just for games. They know we want games, I think they just underestimated the internet, and it's ability to be so fickle.
I know there will be games, that is what E3 is for. I expect a slew of game titles to be talked about and revealed then.
Re-reading my comment, it is confusing what I mean by it. What I intended to mean by Micorsoft not following the consumer base, is them not being wiling to include component video, internet requirements, and other features that, quite frankly, if they did a little consumer research they would find out that not everyone has internet or the number of TV's in the user's homes isn't as big as they assume it is. It is as if Microsoft is so sure of their decisions they aren't listening to the people that will shell out hundreds for their system.
Granted, you can't listen to everyone and everything but certain things they have just barreled forward on is a little head scratching. It seems by trying to be hyper exclusive or trying to stay too far ahead of the curve, they are actually going to hurt their own sales.
The New Coke? Crystal Pepsi? Netflix, and the list goes on of companies so sure of their decisions that just flop on their asses when consumers get them. It reeks of CEO's surrounding themselves with "yes men" and shouting down the people that say, "Let's think about it for a second."
FYI, $1 billion is not a lot of money for 15 titles, that's only $60 million a pop. Realistically, that's about three or four full scale titles with associated marketing, and the rest is lower budget mid-tier stuff (Nike Kinect Training, etc). Halo 4 would have burnt $100,000+ per day when development was in full-tilt and rumour has it that it has yet to actually recoup it's costs - which puts total cost in the $300 million plus ballpark.
Ah, yeah my bad, I wasn't aware of the cost per title, I was more illuminating the fact that the 1 billion investment flies in the face of the "not about games" argument.
@Velvet I get what you're saying now, and yeah, I think MSFT is taking a big risk by cutting out component connections, as well as those with less than stellar internet connections. I'm lucky enough to not have to worry about that, but it does sort of feel like they're saying, "Don't have an HDMI capable? Too bad. Shitty internet? Too bad." Makes me worry about the price too, if they're willing to alienate those that can't exactly afford the newest tech, then price may not be a huge deal for them (I realize that's a stretch, as price is what will probably decide at least the first round of the "console war")
Depends on your needs. We have both because each offers something the other doesn't...
Why bother giving your money to someone that doesn't converge identical services? I won't blow more money just because the networks practice market segmentation so they can charge you multiple times for the same service. I have the internet, it's all I need. If they can't serve me through that medium, then they don't deserve my money.
Why bother giving your money to someone that doesn't converge identical services? I won't blow more money just because the networks practice market segmentation so they can charge you multiple times for the same service. I have the internet, it's all I need. If they can't serve me through that medium, then they don't deserve my money.
I'm also pretty sure they are going to have more internet services on the Xbox One. They are aware that consoles are one of the largest install bases for streaming media.
Let me blow your mind further, I'm willing to bet money that it will be able to play Bluray movies as well.
I'm also pretty sure they are going to have more internet services on the Xbox One. They are aware that consoles are one of the largest install bases for streaming media.
Let me blow your mind further, I'm willing to bet money that it will be able to play Bluray movies as well.
True.
But I'm still concerned about the cost of the system, and how badly that might limit the expansion of its early user-base. I honestly think that hte PS4 as well as the Wii U stand a better chance of gaining a solid foothold. XBox Live has been the XBox's strength for some time. But going forward I could see it becoming an anchor around its neck. Microsoft desperately needs to do something about the "premium" service they are providing, and the drastically expanded competition it is facing.
Requiring an XBox Live subscription for services like NetFlix and Hulu isn't going to fly in the coming console generation. We need to hear changes in that area come E3. We also need to hear some greatly expanded features for XBox Live beyond playing multiplayer if Microsoft intends to keep charging for the service. XBox Live is no longer a competitive service worth the extra subscription charge.
Replies
For all we know, the data recorded by the sensors never get out of your living room unless you are using Skype or else.
What makes sense and what happens is that the video and audio feed are processed by 2 of the CPUs for the OS or the game, and the OS or the game MAY send some data (code not video) to the network if you are playing a multiplayer game or using a network feature.
I mean, when you use some gesture to open a movie on netflix, the video feed is in no way sent through the network, only the interpretation of that feed, which is "launch movie X".
I don't see your average internet connection uploading non stop a 1080p feed to a server anyway, and you would need people monitoring the actual content of the video, I mean this is insanely unlikely to say the least.
It's about the simple fact that there will be circumstances when a running mic and camera and an in/out network connection will be required at the same time.
http://us.norton.com/yoursecurityresource/detail.jsp?aid=webcam_hacking
i specifically enable adds on polycount as well as other sites i feel are a net good and provide a positive space on the net. i support the revenue and accept the intrusion when it helps sites that strengthen the community. i would even go a step further and say that if polycount ever decide to accept donations i would contribute to that as long as it remained fully open to anyone who wants to use it. :thumbup:
Generation 2/3 dev kits.
Anything can be hacked, from your smartphone to your laptop to your smart tv. And at least two of these have a camera and mic. I would be inclined to think that a closed system like the XBone is far harder to hack than a phone or PC. And anyway, that discussion is now pretty much pointless since MS told us that the Kinect could be turned off when we wanted it to.
...
we do know for a fact that microsoft retains vidoe and audio from any device connected to its network when requested to do so.
and it is simply impossible for them not to store video and audio on there servers for anything involving video chat, sending pictures, and any other use of those devices. they have the data. any game that uses those devices will more then likely be storing some portion of it azure.
They collect all that data because the only use for these mic and cameras until now were to communicate over the internet. Kinect main purpose it to communicate with your console's OS, in local.
Of course we can't be 100% sure they won't collect data, but it's clearly not the purpose of the device.
You always have the option of yanking the plug.
Even if your XBox One always has a low-power state, I seriously doubt that it is going to ship with a battery back up. If you are really concerned about Microsoft watching you when you don't want them to, you can always yank the plug out of the wall. If the XBox One has no juice to run on, it isn't going to be providing Microsoft or the government with a live feed of your home.
I'm a bit more concerned with the general direction that Microsoft is taking with the XBox One. The digital future it seems designed to usher in is already happening elsewhere, and other parties are doing it better.
Steam is essentially XBox One-esque. (or the other way around, you could say) But where Microsoft wants to use it's digital-only plans to secure its console interests, Steam instead uses it for other advantages. One of the biggest advantages that Steam allows is the shortening of distance between developers and consumers. I don't see the same happening with the XBox One.
no, the purpose of the device is 100% to collect data.
i do not use skype, nor does most businesses anymore. skype is old news. there are much better ways to do video and audio now.
and msn? good god please don't tell me you use msn.
MSN doesn't exist anymore
But you are wrong on the main purpose of the sensor. The main purpose is to analyze your movement for gaming and entertainment purpose and it may be used to collect data, not the other way around.
but seriously, the ability to distinguish between an intense gaming session and a heart attack is next to impossible even with better equipment. insurance has been prescribing heart monitors for years to anyone at risk.
It depends on what the meaning of the word 'is' is
since this privacy discussion is just going around in circles now here's something I realized today. Ok, my mom is a small sample size but she is totally in love with the voice commands in her new car. Voice control might be the next wii-waggle, which is great for the industry at large if it happens on a console that is more 3rd party friendly. The Wii was very good for brick & mortar retailers & Nintendo but it didn't do much for everyone else.
Another realization hit me, we are just starting to see cable/satellite providers in the US offering fairly expensive prizes to entice you to sign up, this is the generation of the TV Marketing wars. Even Google is offering a Nexus 7 tablet to sign up for their fiber+tv package. I've heard rumors that Microsoft has a secret weapon, I wouldn't be surprised if we saw a $200 or less XB1 with a 2 year Time Warner subscription.
yes, that wasn't the discussion - focusing on the exact definition of a word is referred to as arguing semantics and is generally seen as an attempt to distract people from the discussion at large. The debate equivalent of saying "look over there, is that Elvis!?"
but it is no fault that i can argue my point and that there are people you disagree with that have a sound argument. this seems to be taken personally by a few of you.
The purpose of a sensor is to sense input, there's no definition anywhere that says it has to collect that data as many devices have sensors without having permanent storage.
We've had computers with webcams and microphones in homes for decades now, where the webcam is not permanently off, just waiting for a program to activate it and get some input, and the microphone input is running at all time unless you specifically decide to disable it, there's often just no program there to retrieve that input.
Computers running on windows, but again, you've shown your unwillingness to let your windows-box online as you are certain that Microsoft will be mining you to the bone.
You don't happen to be a fan of infowars.com do you?
sound argument nothing.
I'm up in the air about this console and in no way a 'fan' of it, but reading through your last couple posts was really annoying. It's like you're here just to argue.
It's borderline flamebaiting.
Just agree to disagree instead of nitpicking people's words or the definition of words just to continue the bickering.
I do find it kind of troubling that Microsoft helped set up the Domain Awareness System in NYC and they could probably use the kinect to do something similar.
http://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/nypd-unveils-new-40-million-super-computer-system-data-network-cameras-license-plate-readers-crime-reports-article-1.1132135
It's more likely that they are a big company with diverse interests but then again with the school shootings and the ties to video games that keep getting made, you have to wonder if there won't be a push (and not much push back from MS) to monitor games, chat and possibly even living rooms.
I don't know, it doesn't really bother me, I don't do illegal stuff and if someone really wants to watch my livingroom all day while I'm not there, have fun staring at my couch? If I did do illegal stuff, I wouldn't talk about through means that are easily monitored... But still it seems like we're on a steady path of cameras everywhere and everything being monitored, its not really a new path, we've been on it for a while.
What about the fact that all games have to be installed to the HD? Surely 500gb is going to go quickly if you want to keep a rather large library of games, DVR'd games, media, and DLC. Then again, maybe not. Anyone have a guess what the install size of a next gen game is going to be?
What about it only being HDMI? Is that going to limit the consumer base who may have a TV/cable box that only does component? Since it is only HDMI in/out, that works with your cable box as well. For me, despite being in a major city, Comcast is taking forever to roll out HDMI cable boxes. So until they get off their asses, I can't use any of the TV features with the Xbone? When is Communistcast going to get word of this and charge extra for HDMI boxes? Right now they are the same price but you have to special request it in the area I'm in and God knows when you'll get one.
Granted I'm sure a lot of people have HDMI capable TV's but how deep is the conversion? PS4 is doing HDMI/Component just to cover their asses.
And if this thing is supposed to be the end-all media center, why the hell did they leave out a DVR feature for TV? Ohhhh wait, I need my cable company for that one. They should have put a cable card port in there and make this thing the media hub is supposed to be so I could ditch the cable box.
It just seems that Microsoft is on a different path than it's consumer base. I guess we just gotta wait to see what they say at E3.
[ame="
Current gen games are already exceeding 20GB. This aside, it is always safe to assume that before the end of a console generation, games will be exceeding the capacity of the storage medium presented - this is the same for game cartidges as it is for disks, and has been a factor in almost every console in the past 20 odd years.
Games are therefore very likely to exceed the capacity of a Blu-Ray disk (50GB). It's possible that they may exceed the capacity of the new format Blu-Ray disks and that the new consoles may support them when they hit the market (100GB).
The original 360 had 20GB, only 14GB of which was useable. That gets you around 4-5 modern XBLA titles in 2013, or a single POD game.
I thought the same thing, but then I thought, who are the worst groups of human beings on the planet, collectively.......the cable companies! I obviously don't know what sort of backroom negotiations/talks went on, but I'm guessing for MSFT to include something like that would severely step on the cable providers toes. Now, that doesn't leave MSFT in a better light, because they should have known the cable companies are notoriously unyielding douchebags, and planned accordingly, unfortunately it seems they were at the mercy of cable companies.
Your last point is one I, though I can understand why this opinion is out there, disagree with. It's already been discussed but just because they didn't talk about games, doesn't mean they aren't making games for it, obviously. They mucked up the press conference, that's apparent to all, and their clarification or lack thereof since leaves something to be desired. I guess I just lead more towards optimism, as I'm genuinely excited whenever new platforms come out, because I KNOW there will be games for it, I don't need them to tell me that. With the news that MSFT is putting 1 billion into XB:One games, it just seems kind of silly to say they don't know their core audience anymore when they're putting down THAT much money just for games. They know we want games, I think they just underestimated the internet, and it's ability to be so fickle.
I know there will be games, that is what E3 is for. I expect a slew of game titles to be talked about and revealed then.
Re-reading my comment, it is confusing what I mean by it. What I intended to mean by Micorsoft not following the consumer base, is them not being wiling to include component video, internet requirements, and other features that, quite frankly, if they did a little consumer research they would find out that not everyone has internet or the number of TV's in the user's homes isn't as big as they assume it is. It is as if Microsoft is so sure of their decisions they aren't listening to the people that will shell out hundreds for their system.
Granted, you can't listen to everyone and everything but certain things they have just barreled forward on is a little head scratching. It seems by trying to be hyper exclusive or trying to stay too far ahead of the curve, they are actually going to hurt their own sales.
The New Coke? Crystal Pepsi? Netflix, and the list goes on of companies so sure of their decisions that just flop on their asses when consumers get them. It reeks of CEO's surrounding themselves with "yes men" and shouting down the people that say, "Let's think about it for a second."
Ah, yeah my bad, I wasn't aware of the cost per title, I was more illuminating the fact that the 1 billion investment flies in the face of the "not about games" argument.
@Velvet I get what you're saying now, and yeah, I think MSFT is taking a big risk by cutting out component connections, as well as those with less than stellar internet connections. I'm lucky enough to not have to worry about that, but it does sort of feel like they're saying, "Don't have an HDMI capable? Too bad. Shitty internet? Too bad." Makes me worry about the price too, if they're willing to alienate those that can't exactly afford the newest tech, then price may not be a huge deal for them (I realize that's a stretch, as price is what will probably decide at least the first round of the "console war")
The Price is Right is on the internets?
I don't need The Price is Right. It's just one big advertisement.
who's he?
lol, you must not own a 360, if you have not heard of him. They spam him over just about everything in the 360's video section
Why bother giving your money to someone that doesn't converge identical services? I won't blow more money just because the networks practice market segmentation so they can charge you multiple times for the same service. I have the internet, it's all I need. If they can't serve me through that medium, then they don't deserve my money.
I'm also pretty sure they are going to have more internet services on the Xbox One. They are aware that consoles are one of the largest install bases for streaming media.
Let me blow your mind further, I'm willing to bet money that it will be able to play Bluray movies as well.
Not outside of the US.
True.
But I'm still concerned about the cost of the system, and how badly that might limit the expansion of its early user-base. I honestly think that hte PS4 as well as the Wii U stand a better chance of gaining a solid foothold. XBox Live has been the XBox's strength for some time. But going forward I could see it becoming an anchor around its neck. Microsoft desperately needs to do something about the "premium" service they are providing, and the drastically expanded competition it is facing.
Requiring an XBox Live subscription for services like NetFlix and Hulu isn't going to fly in the coming console generation. We need to hear changes in that area come E3. We also need to hear some greatly expanded features for XBox Live beyond playing multiplayer if Microsoft intends to keep charging for the service. XBox Live is no longer a competitive service worth the extra subscription charge.