...and aside from this thread alone, there's also a ton of relevant info on the wiki as well. So really, getting up to speed with the fundamentals will save all that faffing/pissing about, in the first place.
Hello! I've done as much reading as I can, I keep seeing things that are almost the solution to my problem but ohmygod I'm so sick of faffing about with this. It's a dumb issue that I used to just ignore but I like to think I'm better than that now, but then I can't fix it so clearly I'm missing something. It's a small asset but one day it'll be a hero one and I'll still be pissing about with edge loops.
So, I'm making a lantern. I want to extrude in the glass windows, keep them as the same mesh however, and preserve the roundness of the cylinder. So I can add retaining loops horizontally, but they result in this because there's no vertical ones. Vertical ones cause vertical pinching where it's hardening those edges.
Heres the pinching vertically and you can see to the right where the horizontal pinching is happening.
If someone could once and for all tell me how to fix this stupidity I'd be delighted. Oh, and in Maya terms pls if possible lol
another thing nobody is mentioning. it's not build in one piece. So why build it as one piece?
Hi blastframe, I'm sorry I took so long to reply, I need to turn on notifications so i get an email of a reply. Did Yerus's most recent suggestion work?
That's a good point wirexx, I thought that the same issue would happen if the metal case was separated anyway so I just said screw it it'll be one mesh- my fairly limp excuse for doing it this way (I did remove the top half-sphere to reduce hardening it's edges too) is that it's the HiPoly for a small asset for a game, and my laziness has clearly cost me more time in the end lol!
...and aside from this thread alone, there's also a ton of relevant info on the wiki as well. So really, getting up to speed with the fundamentals will save all that faffing/pissing about, in the first place.
Yeah, it's pretty gutting to be caught up on something that should be so simple! Those resources are great, so many links! I'll be sure to read through them cos I clearly have gaps in my knowledge that need filling/revising lmao
Thank you everyone, I'll give it another go in a few days cos my deadline is so soon :sm:sweat_smile: with a higher division cylinder. Is it ok to post (what i hope will be) my success later on?
Hello, I have a tube that I'm extruding into a flat surface. When I try to bevel the object, I run into some trouble and could use some help. I have tried using triangles to not interfere with the inner curvature of the tube as in the image below.
It's good except that it creates distortion when subdivided.
I then tried another way, using more spans in the tube, which worked better, but still created an uneven union of the bevels. Here it is subdivided:
Does anyone have advice on how to join extrude this flat surface out with optimal beveling? I've attached an .obj of the shape (before bevelling) if it helps.
Hello, I have a tube that I'm extruding into a flat surface. When I try to bevel the object, I run into some trouble and could use some help. I have tried using triangles to not interfere with the inner curvature of the tube as in the image below.
It's good except that it creates distortion when subdivided.
I then tried another way, using more spans in the tube, which worked better, but still created an uneven union of the bevels.
Here it is subdivided:
Does anyone have advice on how to join extrude this flat surface out with optimal beveling? I've attached an .obj of the shape (before bevelling) if it helps.
Thank you!
I would flatten some parts of the cylinder first before extruding, try something like this. Less geo should work as well.
Hello, I have a tube that I'm extruding into a flat surface. When I try to bevel the object, I run into some trouble and could use some help. I have tried using triangles to not interfere with the inner curvature of the tube as in the image below.
It's good except that it creates distortion when subdivided.
I then tried another way, using more spans in the tube, which worked better, but still created an uneven union of the bevels. Here it is subdivided:
Does anyone have advice on how to join extrude this flat surface out with optimal beveling? I've attached an .obj of the shape (before bevelling) if it helps.
Remember SubD does NOT required all quads, jut put ngon in there, you will enjoy it more. In max I'll just model the first mesh low cage mesh then slap in there a chamfer modifier + turbosmooth.
I have considered all of your posts and feel much better about the bevel (thanks to you!).
I'm now trying to extrude the side in 90°. I came up with a solution to converge the bevel spans which yields a decent result (as in the below images), but I wanted to get some feedback from some more experienced modelers before proceeding. Am I missing a better solution? When subdivided, the intersection doesn't look very clean...it's sharp and seems to split the bevel in two rather than staying continuous. I've attached an .obj file too if you wish to take a look. Detail View:
Firstly model each example as shown, then study in turn their respective topology design, because it seems to me you're still struggling too understand the basic principles of subd modeling and that's ok, we've all been there before.
Anyway no better way too learn that I know of than trial and error.
Firstly model each example as shown, then study in turn their respective topology design, because it seems to me you're still struggling too understand the basic principles of subd modeling and that's ok, we've all been there before.
Anyway no better way too learn that I know of than trial and error.
Thank you for the response. I am struggling, however this is the topology design from @Prime8 as theirs allowed me to extrude in the manor I am demonstrating in my last post. I also tried using n-gons as suggested by @Revel. Beyond that, I've done plenty of trial and error before posting again as to not spam the thread.
Could you please be more specific about which basic principle of sub-d modeling I am not understanding? My current issue does relate to my previous one in that it's a sub-division error from the intersection of sub-d support spans, but it's different and more complex as it's now also going in a 3rd dimension with the partial extrude. I have been studying and working on modeling a lot lately, but I haven't found anything on this which is why I am coming to this forum for help (that I believe exists for when your own methods can't take you any farther).
Firstly model each example as shown, then study in turn their respective topology design, because it seems to me you're still struggling too understand the basic principles of subd modeling and that's ok, we've all been there before.
Anyway no better way too learn that I know of than trial and error.
Thank you for the response. I am struggling, however this is the topology design from @Prime8 as theirs allowed me to extrude in the manor I am demonstrating in my last post. I also tried using n-gons as suggested by @Revel. Beyond that, I've done plenty of trial and error before posting again as to not spam the thread.
Could you please be more specific about which basic principle of sub-d modeling I am not understanding? My current issue does relate to my previous one in that it's a sub-division error from the intersection of sub-d support spans, but it's different and more complex as it's now also going in a 3rd dimension with the partial extrude. I have been studying and working on modeling a lot lately, but I haven't found anything on this which is why I am coming to this forum for help (that I believe exists for when your own methods can't take you any farther).
perna said it all, I'll just add these for further reading.
Hi everyone!! I'm modeling ths piece and i'd like to ask you how would you model the tiny holes that the big one contains on it. This piece is going to be baked and imported to UE4 so i know i'll do the holes' normal map in photoshop or maybe designer and then applying a material in painter but i'm interested in the way this could be modeled. ^^
@Paskuihernandez no illustration but these steps should be clear enough to follow as long as you're familiar with 3ds terms.
-make a a grid. That is, a subdivided plane/quad. -inset by face -delete -project this onto geo with the needed curve (like the geo you have in your mesh) -shell modifier -subdivide to turn the square holes into circles
all you really need to know is how to turn a quad into a circle with subdivision.
@Paskuihernandez no illustration but these steps should be clear enough to follow as long as you're familiar with 3ds terms.
-make a a grid. That is, a subdivided plane/quad. -inset by face -delete -project this onto geo with the needed curve (like the geo you have in your mesh) -shell modifier -subdivide to turn the square holes into circles
all you really need to know is how to turn a quad into a circle with subdivision.
so this means nothing to me
Because of two terms which are inconsistent between 3DS and Maya your entire capability to understand the post collapses? I would like to have a stern talk with your teacher.
Hello Folks, im just wondering how the heck would you model this part super fast? What I know it was created in Modo and screenshot is taken from maya. Im wondering if are there any suppa fast tricks you can use to provide shapes like that? For example Sub-d modelling - and making a turbo smooth, or procedural bridging etc. If there are any PROs who could explain me this example, would be great and really thankfull. Im always trying to solve this kind of riddles to incerase my speed workflow insead of each-poly modelling. Thanks!
Hello Folks, im just wondering how the heck would you model this part super fast? What I know it was created in Modo and screenshot is taken from maya. Im wondering if are there any suppa fast tricks you can use to provide shapes like that? For example Sub-d modelling - and making a turbo smooth, or procedural bridging etc. If there are any PROs who could explain me this example, would be great and really thankfull. Im always trying to solve this kind of riddles to incerase my speed workflow insead of each-poly modelling. Thanks!
firstly model all parts seperatly. Dont attach them. Just the big shape, secondary and threshery. When you have put them in place. You can see how many segments the big cylinder needs to hold the Secondary shape. And when that is done, see if those segments are enough to hold the smaller part. if not, subdivide the mesh once and then add the smallest.
Also another thing you can do to be a bit faster but maybe with no so good results is to apply a chamfer to the hard edges so they create some support loops that will helps you to get the sub-d result in less time. But, with round shapes you'll need to fix some n-gons for sure manually.
@Przerywnik for an optimised polygonal workflow, research for example a combined technique implementing boolean operands for hard surface subd content creation however results will tend to vary dependant upon object complexity plus alongside personal finesse working with your app/s of choice.
@sacboi thanks for the tip, gonna google that! English is not my native language, sometime i coudnt find a good technical keywords to put into google to find it briliant tip!
...you're welcome, I'll also link a couple of resources as a kind of guide, that may help shed some light as to Boolean intergration or perhaps 'acceptence' as a viable technique for use in game res HS asset generation nowadays, as opposed to when I first started out:
(...if you've time and can afford the fee, I'd strongly recommend checking out the Blender stuff, if nothing else there's some really interesting workflow demo's covering a wide array of methods, either common and uncommon)
...you're welcome, I'll also link a couple of resources as a kind of guide, that may help shed some light as to Boolean intergration or perhaps 'acceptence' as a viable technique for use in game res HS asset generation nowadays, as opposed to when I first started out:
(...if you've time and can afford the fee, I'd strongly recommend checking out the Blender stuff, if nothing else there's some really interesting workflow demo's covering a wide array of methods, either common and uncommon)
emm, i was more thinking about that angle connector between the extruded part and main cylinder shape. How do you do that? sorry if you guys felt trolled, i should somehow mark it with red circle to be more exact : P
@Przerywnik apologies if that was the impression given, so to be clear your query was totally legit by the way.
Additionally these types of objects are typically cast (via mold) due too engineered CNC specific tasks they're designed too perforn under load in certain environments hence the additional 'gusset' for extra strength. An engine block also perfectly illustrates this process to full effect, in fact I'll link a Tutes+ series authored by Laurens Corijn, Modeling/UV Mapping/Texturing/Real-Time render a low poly game res Hot Rod in 3ds Max/Photoshop/IDE.
It was actually one of the first 'class A' project's end to end I'd attempted back when initially published in 2009 and IMHO still relevant nowadays as then.
Anyway if interested check out these vids relating to the engine which describes in detail a straight forward workflow wirrexx noted upthread, where simple shapes/primitives can be used to represent a complex object.
Hi @perna, thank you for your help. So I’m modelling for smooth subdivision surfaces and if I subdivide the left geometry,it creates non smooth areas because of the spacing is far from regular, on the right results are good because polygons are more uniform, but I also wanted maybe other modelling topology alternatives to what I have done. Thanks
What do you think is the best topology? Also would you model it like this topology wise?
Cheers
knockout version of your shoe base. base mesh as few polys as possible. Turbo smoothed using Smoothing groups. and look at how direction of the edgeflow on the extruded edges.
I have this piece that I'm working on, and I was wondering if you guys have any idea on how to fix the topology/ edge flow.
I beveled it to be able to hold the shape when smoothing it. As I expected, the three lines that resulted made a sharp edge appear when smoothing it. So what I tried to do was to connect the edges in a different way, to eliminate that sharp edge. That however, didn't go very well, as there is still a bit of a weird shape going on, smooth or not. It is especially noticeable when putting next to another shape. Any ideas on how to fix this issue? Should I use something other than bevel to hold the shape? (I tried just putting some edge loops, but it gave a similar result)
Thank you for your comment. I had an attempt at connecting the edges like you suggested, though there is still a weird edge in there.
Your edges are too tight, and too few. Add more supporting geometry so your polygons aren't so large/stretched apart, and make sure your support loop edges/chamfers aren't super tight.
@Yogev Yeah, as the previous poster commented. Evenly spaced topology will enable correct shading behaviour under most lighting conditions especially on curved surfaces, not the 'bumpy uneveness' as displayed in your posted images.
@Yogev Yeah, as the previous poster commented. Evenly spaced topology will enable correct shading behaviour under most lighting conditions especially on curved surfaces, not the 'bumpy uneveness' as displayed in your posted images.
You cant kill the entire "issue" or artifact with your topology. Curved surfaces need to be Consistent. You know, almost even spacing between edges.
i have the same issue but less visible. Ignore the edge in the middle just added it for fun.
@Yogev Yeah, as the previous poster commented. Evenly spaced topology will enable correct shading behaviour under most lighting conditions especially on curved surfaces, not the 'bumpy uneveness' as displayed in your posted images.
You cant kill the entire "issue" or artifact with your topology. Curved surfaces need to be Consistent. You know, almost even spacing between edges.
i have the same issue but less visible. Ignore the edge in the middle just added it for fun.
I see what you mean. I thought not enough edges might be the problem, I was hoping to avoid messing with the shape too much. I'll definitely look at your example when I go and fix this shape. Thanks for the help.
Replies
Heh
...and aside from this thread alone, there's also a ton of relevant info on the wiki as well. So really, getting up to speed with the fundamentals will save all that faffing/pissing about, in the first place.
Topology
Subdivision Surface Modelling
I'm sorry I took so long to reply, I need to turn on notifications so i get an email of a reply.
Did Yerus's most recent suggestion work?
I have a tube that I'm extruding into a flat surface. When I try to bevel the object, I run into some trouble and could use some help. I have tried using triangles to not interfere with the inner curvature of the tube as in the image below.
It's good except that it creates distortion when subdivided.
I then tried another way, using more spans in the tube, which worked better, but still created an uneven union of the bevels.
Here it is subdivided:
Does anyone have advice on how to join extrude this flat surface out with optimal beveling? I've attached an .obj of the shape (before bevelling) if it helps.
Thank you!
Less geo should work as well.
In max I'll just model the first mesh low cage mesh then slap in there a chamfer modifier + turbosmooth.
I have considered all of your posts and feel much better about the bevel (thanks to you!).
I'm now trying to extrude the side in 90°. I came up with a solution to converge the bevel spans which yields a decent result (as in the below images), but I wanted to get some feedback from some more experienced modelers before proceeding. Am I missing a better solution? When subdivided, the intersection doesn't look very clean...it's sharp and seems to split the bevel in two rather than staying continuous. I've attached an .obj file too if you wish to take a look.
Detail View:
Subdivided:
Anyway no better way too learn that I know of than trial and error.
Could you please be more specific about which basic principle of sub-d modeling I am not understanding? My current issue does relate to my previous one in that it's a sub-division error from the intersection of sub-d support spans, but it's different and more complex as it's now also going in a 3rd dimension with the partial extrude. I have been studying and working on modeling a lot lately, but I haven't found anything on this which is why I am coming to this forum for help (that I believe exists for when your own methods can't take you any farther).
blastframe said:
sacboi said:
Firstly model each example as shown, then study in turn their respective topology design, because it seems to me you're still struggling too understand the basic principles of subd modeling and that's ok, we've all been there before.
Anyway no better way too learn that I know of than trial and error.
Thank you for the response. I am struggling, however this is the topology design from @Prime8 as theirs allowed me to extrude in the manor I am demonstrating in my last post. I also tried using n-gons as suggested by @Revel. Beyond that, I've done plenty of trial and error before posting again as to not spam the thread.
Could you please be more specific about which basic principle of sub-d modeling I am not understanding? My current issue does relate to my previous one in that it's a sub-division error from the intersection of sub-d support spans, but it's different and more complex as it's now also going in a 3rd dimension with the partial extrude. I have been studying and working on modeling a lot lately, but I haven't found anything on this which is why I am coming to this forum for help (that I believe exists for when your own methods can't take you any farther).
perna said it all, I'll just add these for further reading.
http://wiki.polycount.com/wiki/SubdivisionSurfaceModeling
http://wiki.polycount.com/wiki/Topology
Im modeling a JBL speaker and im at the point i need to "represent" the speakers "grid/net" and have no idea how to do it XD.
and arnold for that matter
Arnonious said:
[...]
-shell modifier
[...]
so this means nothing to me
Actually there's a plug for this in Maya:
https://lesterbanks.com/2015/05/getting-started-using-the-maya-shell-modifier/
...and for me as a 'Blenderite', "Shell Modifier" means adding thickness or volume:
https://docs.blender.org/manual/en/latest/modeling/modifiers/generate/solidify.html
@perna
@sacboi
@wirrexx
Thank you for your reply folks!!
@sacboi
thanks for the tip, gonna google that! English is not my native language, sometime i coudnt find a good technical keywords to put into google to find it
https://polycount.com/discussion/168610/3ds-max-zbrush-proboolean-dynamesh-hardsurface-workflow-tutorial/p1
https://blendermarket.com/products/hard-surface-modeling-in-blender
(...if you've time and can afford the fee, I'd strongly recommend checking out the Blender stuff, if nothing else there's some really interesting workflow demo's covering a wide array of methods, either common and uncommon)
That blender one is a gold mine of information.
Additionally these types of objects are typically cast (via mold) due too engineered CNC specific tasks they're designed too perforn under load in certain environments hence the additional 'gusset' for extra strength. An engine block also perfectly illustrates this process to full effect, in fact I'll link a Tutes+ series authored by Laurens Corijn, Modeling/UV Mapping/Texturing/Real-Time render a low poly game res Hot Rod in 3ds Max/Photoshop/IDE.
It was actually one of the first 'class A' project's end to end I'd attempted back when initially published in 2009 and IMHO still relevant nowadays as then.
Anyway if interested check out these vids relating to the engine which describes in detail a straight forward workflow wirrexx noted upthread, where simple shapes/primitives can be used to represent a complex object.
https://cgi.tutsplus.com/tutorials/creating-a-next-gen-video-game-hot-rod-the-complete-workflow-part-3--cg-2247
Cheers
What do you think is the best topology?
Also would you model it like this topology wise?
Cheers
I have this piece that I'm working on, and I was wondering if you guys have any idea on how to fix the topology/ edge flow.
I beveled it to be able to hold the shape when smoothing it. As I expected, the three lines that resulted made a sharp edge appear when smoothing it.
It is especially noticeable when putting next to another shape.
Any ideas on how to fix this issue? Should I use something other than bevel to hold the shape? (I tried just putting some edge loops, but it gave a similar result)
@Yogev Yeah, as the previous poster commented. Evenly spaced topology will enable correct shading behaviour under most lighting conditions especially on curved surfaces, not the 'bumpy uneveness' as displayed in your posted images.
i have the same issue but less visible. Ignore the edge in the middle just added it for fun.
Thanks for the help.
Hello,
I am having some issues beveling an inset for subd and was hoping someone out there could teach me.
The first is a corner that includes an open face. The open face creates a nasty transition when subdivided:
The second is advice on how to terminate the bevel for a triangle that flows into a flat shape:
My model is attached if needed.
Thank you!
any idea how to get this on Curved Surface?