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Dominance War V Begins February 28th

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  • XenoKratios
  • crazyfool
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    crazyfool polycounter lvl 8
    yea Im not a fan of all these press releases but it sounds pretty cool and hopefully will run on time and smoother than before due to it being downsized in the sponsor/prize department. Not sure If I will enter but see what happens.
  • Stinger88
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    Stinger88 polycounter
    Wow. Feb 28th...

    Well. Best start that other project I've been sitting on.

    Glad to hear it still on at least. Any news on the Pre Dom war judging?
  • TortillaChips
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    TortillaChips polycounter lvl 10
    Hmm double post?
  • TortillaChips
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    TortillaChips polycounter lvl 10
    Well, it's good that it's all up and running again, and hopefully it'll continue to run. I'll see what I'm up to for DW6. I'm guessing there were sponserships before but now it'll be all donation based, so I hope enough will be made.
  • aesir
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    aesir polycounter lvl 13
    Glad to hear it. It would probably die without him.

    I sincerely hope he manages to find a way to run this without spending absurd amounts of money or time.
  • Andreas
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    Andreas polycounter lvl 11
    meh

    Aye. 6 days after Killzone 3 is released? P**s off :P
  • Marine
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    Marine polycounter lvl 17
    Dominance War, a non-business entity that is run primarily by a single insane artist, will be Donation based. Donations, if sufficient, will help add additional features like a public voting system for main challenge, student listings, Animation Category, Cinematic Category (DW6?), etc, and also help keep the organizer afloat during the functions of this massive event.

    he wants people to give him money to run it? fuck that
  • XenoKratios
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    XenoKratios polycounter lvl 8
    hahah I like what Marine said, but it's a donation. I don't think it's mandatory.
  • Gav
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    Gav quad damage
    For some reason, I can't resist commenting on this. Again, like mentioned in the scandal thread, this whole thing is rubbing me the wrong way. Like Marine's quote, the self imposed title of "insane artist," the money situation...I don't know, I can't help but feel the "point" was greatly missed. What could have been a lesson in artist rights and business practices, yet again, seems like an opportunity for martyrdom.

    Also, I sure as hell am not donating to that cause - but if I did, I would consider these delays a little more than a small mishap. Plus, they're not "here and there," you can practically set your watch to it. A competition funded by the very people participating it (and, lets face it, generating promotional material for future endeavors for free) better have a stronger backbone or, at the very least, become more democratic.

    Annnnddd...I'd just like to throw it out there that you don't need an organized competition to compete and have fun. All you need is a group of like minded individuals with a little bit of piss and vinegar in their blood.

    http://www.polycount.com/forum/showthread.php?t=79663
    http://www.polycount.com/forum/showthread.php?t=79680
    http://www.polycount.com/forum/showthread.php?t=79722
    http://www.polycount.com/forum/showthread.php?t=79626

    Gav
    .....
    tumblr_kxw6pgQ61X1qzbjzmo1_500.jpg
  • whats_true
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    whats_true polycounter lvl 13
    "Any human can break during a certain vital moment. Nobody is insured from it, but we are all at war - we mens. We should be iron. You were present iron warrior Fred, don't allow itself to "fuse" to anybody else. It is necessary to battle and win throughout all of life... Think once again. Alone, you have begun a great cause, don't betray us and don't throw it out into another's recycle bin."



    Oh geeze. A little dramatic?
  • Jesse Moody
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    Jesse Moody polycounter lvl 15
    So he resigned and then un-resigned.


    HOLY FUCK FRED IS THE NEW BRETT FAVRE!!!!
  • XenoKratios
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    XenoKratios polycounter lvl 8
    Apparently comebacks are all the rave man.

    Everyone's doing it!

    Seriously I got 10 bucks, who wants to host a website with me and start a competition? LETS FUCKING RAVE!

    Oh and a warning in advance, I might quit cause I gave all the money I had to start this website ($10). Then I'll make a comeback and expect everyone to donate and enter.

    Yes we can, babe

    cool.jpg
  • Steve Schulze
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    Steve Schulze polycounter lvl 15
    With the monetary concerns, removing corporate sponsorship seems like a curious decision.

    Anyway, I imagine I'll still give it a go. It's a good incentive to focus on a new piece of work and given I never finish in these things, it won't matter if the judging takes a bazillion years.
  • Cyrael
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    Cyrael polycounter lvl 10
    So he resigned and then un-resigned.


    HOLY FUCK FRED IS THE NEW BRETT FAVRE!!!!

    LOL
  • aesir
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    aesir polycounter lvl 13
    Jackablade wrote: »
    With the monetary concerns, removing corporate sponsorship seems like a curious decision.

    Anyway, I imagine I'll still give it a go. It's a good incentive to focus on a new piece of work and given I never finish in these things, it won't matter if the judging takes a bazillion years.

    sponsors give him the prizes. They don't pay him money. He then had to ship a ton of prizes all over the world, and that costs a bit of cash.
  • ScoobyDoofus
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    ScoobyDoofus polycounter lvl 17
    ** Note: the following post is a bit inflammatory I guess. Don't read it if you're gonna get your panties into a bunch**

    El-oh-fucking-L.
    I was all set to come into the thread and joke:

    "Dominance War! Break out your checkbooks folks!"
    Lo and behold, I was right. Donations baby.

    I think the lack of sponsorships is less a "reduced complication" and more a "they don't want to be affiliated with this debacle any more"

    Get a real job Fred, seriously. (I'm kidding...sorta. Do you have a job?) It just feels to me like you're trying to fleece the community and that you think we're gullible morons who are going to fund your hobby & lifestyle. I understand the competition costs money to run. Really, I do, but this is just past ridiculous now. Put a fork in DomWar. Its dead.
  • Swizzle
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    Swizzle polycounter lvl 14
    I always enjoyed seeing the stuff that came out of DomWar, participating when I could, and I tried to keep quiet through the drama and crap from the past few months. Now, though, the only thing that comes to mind when I hear about all this is "fuck this shit."

    Fred needs to pull his head out of his ass and deflate his ego, actively pursue help from outside sources and give the community something that it can sink its teeth into instead of jerking people around. The unannounced selling of other people's work, his "resignation" and now this wah-wah-poor-me bullshit just makes him look like a dumbass with no business sense and a load of butthurt.

    Every single major comp that's come out of GameArtisans has been mismanaged to the point where delays and pushing deadlines back has become the running joke. People have had prizes canceled, there've been questionable judging practices and the whole thing is just starting to smell like a scam rather than a legitimate place where people can go to learn and have fun.

    I already stopped hanging around GA a long time ago because the level of discourse, be it critiques or quality of work posted was all generally pretty bad. Now I'm certain I won't be involved in any of their big competitions in the future unless Fred actually starts running things like a professional instead of a whining child who can't accept when he's in the wrong.
  • Tyler
    So you want the artists to donate to the competition, so that they can try to win their money back?

    Pfff-ahahaha.

    lineourpockets.jpg
  • Justin Meisse
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    Justin Meisse polycounter lvl 17
    TL : DR

    LESS QQ MORE PEW-PEW
    You ready, jerk faces? I'm 'bout to bring it in a big way, that's right, Justin returns to character art after a 4 year hiatus. SHIT JUST GOT REAL!!!
  • Wells
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    Wells polycounter lvl 16
    TL : DR

    LESS QQ MORE PEW-PEW
    You ready, jerk faces? I'm 'bout to bring it in a big way, that's right, Justin returns to character art after a 4 year hiatus. SHIT JUST GOT REAL!!!

    OH FUCK IT'S ON LIKE PRAWN
  • XenoKratios
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    XenoKratios polycounter lvl 8
    I was super serious about the $10 website thing.

    Any takers?
    Tyler wrote: »
    So you want the artists to donate to the competition, so that they can try to win their money back?


    Ahahaha, the best. Is that like a oxymoron? aahhaha
  • Justin Meisse
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    Justin Meisse polycounter lvl 17
    I was recently arguing in Polycounts favor that it wasn't full of a bunch of trolls and crybaby nubs, don't make me switch sides, I had to register on GA in order to vote for the mini challenge.
  • TortillaChips
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    TortillaChips polycounter lvl 10
    Ahahaha, the best. Is that like a oxymoron? aahhaha

    [ame=" remind me of this[/ame]

    I have no problem with supporting things if I see something I like the look of. An accordian player on the street, a forum, a competition. I know you're not serious, but if you were to put hard work in and make a big popular competition then I would put some money into it. Donations aren't mandatory.
  • Hazardous
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    Hazardous polycounter lvl 12
    This is the best 'undo' in the history of 'undos'. I got nothing to add on to whats already been said by Gav and most of the other guys here.

    Hey,

    80642422.jpg

    .........at least this guys not bullshitting me.
  • XenoKratios
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    XenoKratios polycounter lvl 8
    I have no problem with supporting things if I see something I like the look of. An accordian player on the street, a forum, a competition. I know you're not serious, but if you were to put hard work in and make a big popular competition then I would put some money into it. Donations aren't mandatory.

    To be honest I was thinking about it back when Fred released that 10 page story.

    I think I'm going to do some research and post some information in the General Discussion thread, but it would essentially be there to show that you don't need $1000's to make shit work.
  • Autocon
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    Autocon polycounter lvl 13
    Were already at Day Time TV ridiculous factor for this competition and its still a month and a half away!
  • Steve Schulze
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    Steve Schulze polycounter lvl 15
    To be honest I was thinking about it back when Fred released that 10 page story.

    I think I'm going to do some research and post some information in the General Discussion thread, but it would essentially be there to show that you don't need $1000's to make shit work.
    I think you're underestimating the kind of traffic that'll come from funneling the entire membership of 12 forums through a single site. They might not all participate, but everyone's going to have a look at some point.
  • XenoKratios
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    XenoKratios polycounter lvl 8
    There could be ways to get around that, for example: Keeping the work of forums on that forums until a final winner is decided and then put all those winners against each other to pronounce the final winner.

    I'm researching and thinking of ways to keep it fair/low cost/entertaining. The smaller the better for now I guess.

    The prize might be a super soft cashmere sweater with the logo of their forum sewed in it :P. Not decided yet ahah
  • akacg
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    akacg polycounter lvl 12
    this is really cool and good news! Although i think ill be on the polycount side/team this year. I havent really visited this site during big comps, so i think ill see wat other artist are doin over here. Should be a good experience to meet new artist on this site. Caint wait sounds fun!!!
  • Two Listen
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    Two Listen polycounter lvl 12
    Well, money bullshit aside.

    I hope to see some kickass art from fellow polycounters. I'm not in a position to participate myself, but it has been a joy throughout the years to see what you guys come up with and I'm really itching to see more badassery. Good luck to all involved!
  • kaptainkernals
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    kaptainkernals polycounter lvl 10
    I'm not taking part, and have no intention in taking part, but the following I find contradicting:

    3. To reduce workload and correspondence requirements, paid corporate sponsorships will also be eliminated.

    The main part with the above that I have a problem with is this:
    To reduce workload
    And then in the next point he has this:
    4. Dominance War, a non-business entity that is run primarily by a single insane artist, will be Donation based. Donations, if sufficient, will help add additional features like a public voting system for main challenge, student listings, Animation Category, Cinematic Category (DW6?), etc, and also help keep the organizer afloat during the functions of this massive event.
    And the problem with this is:
    add additional features

    I find this contradicting, he's removing paid corporate sponsorship - I understand this to be corporations giving him money as sponsorship to help run the competition. - So correct me if I'm wrong in that regard.

    He states that it's being removed to reduce workload - main point for me.

    Then in the next point he posted, he wants Donations so that he can increase the workload adding unnecessary features that most of the artist don't care about or need. Instead of heeding peoples advice about downsizing and making the competition simple to run, he's still wanting to make it a bloated behemoth that will eventually die from gluttony.
  • Ahrkey
    I have a hobby. Motorcycles and racing.
    I spend alot of time and money on my hobby.
    I got something good going with my hobby.

    ...

    But if someone or some would donate money, it could become better. How much better they cannot know. There's no guarantee. It's a risk.
    Whether they take the risk or not is up to them.

    (I hope it makes sense.)
  • XenoKratios
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    XenoKratios polycounter lvl 8
    But only one persons gains from that qlz, and thats the hobbyist...

    I guess It does make sense.
  • kaptainkernals
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    kaptainkernals polycounter lvl 10
    It does make sense qlz.

    I've no problem with the donations. My problem is, he's removing one source of revenue, and saying he's reducing workload, and then the next post, he's increasing workload again tenfold. But introduces a new source of revenue. The source of revenue is beside the point, the point is the workload - that doesn't make sense.
  • Ahrkey
    Well I believe Fred when he's saying it's to reduce workload. Dealing with corporate is often a hassle and doesn't work smoothly. Also, you might think corporates are generous since they sit on a mountain of money. But I only know one creature that sits on a mountain of treasure and it's DRAGONS. They're not nice and certainly not the generous type unless they wanna eat you. This might also explain why previous winners havn't recieved their prizes since I doubt Fred takes that money out of his own pockets.

    From his statement it seems he wanna cut the bad out of the good. (Less corporate, more art)

    Corporate sponsorship is awesome to make an event official but you're all sitting here screaming for it to be less official. In most "official" competitions there's always a participation fee. Grander competition, heftier fee.
  • conte
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    conte polycounter lvl 16
  • crazyfool
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    crazyfool polycounter lvl 8
    I think he may have burnt too many bridges if Im being honest. I forgive him for having a moment of idiocy like we all do, I still have a tiny bit of distrust with him however, which I thinks understandable given the past few months. But maybe this DW will be the making of him and we will see that he can run a competition properly and we dont have to wait 6-12 months for results. Donations have always been a large part of dominance war, its just the mystery where that money is going? We all think its going to freds pocket. Hell, I do, hes gotta make money somehow through the forum or GA Montreal to live. But I doubt thats serious money anyway, especially after DW. I just think he has to look at making money through the forum and competitions but not through the artists themselves.

    main thing though is that donations are completely optional like they always have been so theres no need to get your panties in a twist :) just dont donate.....like me lol.
  • pior
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    pior godlike master sticky
    It's so weird - The martyr phrasing and odd decisions like adding even more features to the comp are things that could almost be predictable. But this at the bottom of the page really rubs me the wrong way :


    If you would like to support Dominance War, please donate. Your name along with others who supports DW will be listed on the prizes page for the Main Challenge of Dominance War V.


    It feels like FH still thinks that artists are all desperate beings, doing comps just for the prizes and now donating money with the motivation of maybe getting their name displayed on a webpage close to kickass art. Does he really think that this is something attractive to anyone ? This would actually make me NOT donate. It's like these annoying online casino ad banners, only working because maybe one out of millions viewers might click it and make it work.

    In my opinion this is a fondamental misconception of why artists enjoy doing art. Meh.
  • Andreas
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    Andreas polycounter lvl 11
    So he resigned and then un-resigned.


    HOLY FUCK FRED IS THE NEW BRETT FAVRE!!!!

    Yeah his became apparent when he set up seperate domains for the comps. How does the remedy the situation hmmm??? You are still in charge Fred. Thats the problem.

    This year should be the year PC takes over as the host of the big comps (character, environment, maybe some other elements). I've expressed that in other threads. I think it will happen. Trick would be finding the right time to launch 2 comps.
    Hazardous wrote: »
    80642422.jpg


    Haha oh jesus...
  • Firebert
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    Firebert polycounter lvl 13
    HAZARDOUS!
    LULZ!
    avatar19645_5.gif

    <3'Z

    made my morning with that avatar switcheroo!
  • conte
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    conte polycounter lvl 16
    and remember, guys - we are all at war - we mens. We should be iron.
  • pior
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    pior godlike master sticky
    conte wrote: »
    and remember, guys - we are all at war - we mens. We should be iron.

    Hahahahahahaha yeeeeah BALLS OF STEEL!
  • d1ver
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    d1ver polycounter lvl 13
    [ame]
    i'm sorry I just couldn't resist. and pardon the poor video quality I couldn't find any better video, but here's the audio just in case:
    [ame]

    on the subject though, I really dislike the drama around the whole thing. I'm glad people will have a chance to do some great art, and I really don't want to involve money into this. I believe everyone who wants to make art will make art and if you need armies of mens and kilos of moneys to do it, then I doubt it's about the art for you.
  • greevar
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    greevar polycounter lvl 6
    It makes perfect sense that he wants to get rid of the corporate sponsors. The prizes they entrust him with are a huge logistical undertaking and a liability. He has to be responsible for the accounting and stewardship of those items. I'm sure the sponsors lay heavy expectations on him handling those items and they probably make him sign an legal agreement that makes him legally liable for those items. If something happens, it's his ass on the line. That's a lot of pressure to deal with. In addition to that, you have a bunch of whiny people complaining to about how they hate the way he's running a competition he created without being asked and without demanding anything from us.

    Without Fred, there wouldn't have been a Dom War at all to bitch about. This guy did a really nice thing for us and an bunch of mal-contents nearly ruined it because they don't like the way it's run. He didn't ask anything from us before. That's what the sponsors were for. He did it for us and some are being extremely ungrateful. He risks and sacrifices a lot to make this happen. If anyone should be blamed for making this too big, it's us. As we pushed the envelope for art, we made this contest bigger and bigger. Our popularizing this competition made it what it is today, not Fred.

    Bring on the hate and expletives.... *puts on flame-proof suit.*
  • Gav
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    Gav quad damage
    Whoa. Wait a second there - guy. It wasn't almost ruined because a few people complained about the way it was being run - people raised concern because it appeared that he was attempting to profit from other people's work in a really underhanded way. If anything, the disappearing prizes, constant delays and mismanagement were pretty much tolerated - complained about - but understandable as most people understand that it's a huge undertaking. It wasn't until he imposed on artist's rights that this became a big issue and, lets not forget, this information wasn't even going to be known to us until other people who weren't Fred leaked the information.

    I won't deny that he's the one who started all of this - but what you're not realizing is that it's his "business." Literally. And that business is failing. It was a nice thing that he took initiative to do this, but no one asked for the competitions to get that big and complicated. You can't give someone a gift and say that you're doing this selfless act and then turn to everyone who graciously accepted this gift and tell them how much of a sacrifice it was to provide it. That's bullshit, man.

    "We" didn't make this bigger. Pushing the envelope of art, participation and general quality level doesn't equal an invitation to sites none of us EVER visit or a ridiculous list of prizes that are never delivered. Maybe rather than making it exponentially bigger every year in order to justify calling himself "insane," he should have grown comfortably within his own boundaries. Squeezing as much from the "big 3" before he moved on.

    Plus, as much as you can say it's "one man" who brought you this, you can say that it's "one man" who stood to gain from it. If you truly believe this is all a selfless act - something is incredibly wrong with you. Not just you, anyone. The burden became too much to bear, I guess, and rather than just end it he had a lapse in judgment (some would say this is a really REALLY long lapse...but whatever) that was borderline illegal. So, now what, some random poorly written metaphor has made the phoenix rise from the ashes...give me a fucking break.

    Again - a huge point has been missed. It's not money, it's not deadlines, it's not "making fun" of our little "insane" martyr here. It's principle. It just blows my mind that some have such low dignity and self respect in their work that they can't see how this is a cardinal sin in the art community. I'm trying to think of another example that would be similar - if you subscribed to a magazine and then found that they took your art and printed it making money off of it's subscribers, would you be offended? Or would you be honoured that this magazine that has taken so much time and effort to publish a quality print has chosen you? I don't know, personally, I like to know what people are doing with the things I made in my own time.

    It's just a stupid contest and all of this drama is really old hat to the point of being embarrassing.
  • Esprite
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    Esprite polycounter lvl 9
    greevar wrote: »
    It makes perfect sense that he wants to get rid of the corporate sponsors. The prizes they entrust him with are a huge logistical undertaking and a liability. He has to be responsible for the accounting and stewardship of those items. I'm sure the sponsors lay heavy expectations on him handling those items and they probably make him sign an legal agreement that makes him legally liable for those items. If something happens, it's his ass on the line. That's a lot of pressure to deal with. In addition to that, you have a bunch of whiny people complaining to about how they hate the way he's running a competition he created without being asked and without demanding anything from us.

    Without Fred, there wouldn't have been a Dom War at all to bitch about. This guy did a really nice thing for us and an bunch of mal-contents nearly ruined it because they don't like the way it's run. He didn't ask anything from us before. That's what the sponsors were for. He did it for us and some are being extremely ungrateful. He risks and sacrifices a lot to make this happen. If anyone should be blamed for making this too big, it's us. As we pushed the envelope for art, we made this contest bigger and bigger. Our popularizing this competition made it what it is today, not Fred.

    Bring on the hate and expletives.... *puts on flame-proof suit.*

    I'm not really going to flame you..but having dealt with sponsorships for prizes before. It's not like they come into it ready to sick their lawyers on you. I think your being abit overtly dramatic about the evilness of sponsors that dare support events like these. If logistical undertaking is mailing out packages to the winners..In your mind is that extremely difficult to manage?

    I think the decision was probably in his best interest if dealing with prizes from sponsors was a huge problem. There could also be some burnt bridges there.
  • greevar
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    greevar polycounter lvl 6
    Gav wrote: »
    if you subscribed to a magazine and then found that they took your art and printed it making money off of it's subscribers, would you be offended? Or would you be honoured that this magazine that has taken so much time and effort to publish a quality print has chosen you?

    I would be happy that my work is getting out there. As long as they give me credit as the artist, I have no problem with people sharing my work. I know that my work is an advertisement for my skills and if I do good work, I want people to see that. So I would not be offended.

    I apologize if I made assumptions about the situation. I just get upset when people openly attack those that do good things, even if they messed it up. On another note, I think the whole issue of prizes should be scrapped in favor of bragging rights. Something like posting the winning works in a special place of honor. Artists don't do art for riches, we do it for the art! The riches come after! :)
  • crazyfool
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    crazyfool polycounter lvl 8
    'It takes years to build a great reputation but only seconds to destroy it'

    comes to mind, and

    'Dont bite the hand that feeds'

    I feel for him as hes made a big mistake but he is trying to mend bridges. I understand peoples anger with him but for me, lifes too short and his crimes arent unforgiveable in my mind. Everything was resolved quite quickly and he learnt a very good lesson, before peoples loyars got involved. The donate thing has always been in the history of DW so isnt an issue for me. If he can run it on time, no crappy judging, no extensions, and no waiting 6-12 months for the results I will be happy, but still a little sore.

    Saying that though, the rockstar personna needs to stop and he needs to detract business from the whole equation. Im Bi-forum now but have no issue posting on GA because no matter how angry I was with fred at the time I wasnt angry with the thousands of members that actually make up the forum. Same with the competitions, all he is, is an organiser end of the day. What Im trying to say is hes the behind the scenes guy where as the artists make it fun to be a part of which I find easy to overlook. And the point has been made now, 'You cant profit from others work, even if you feel like you are doing it for the right intentions!'

    Just waiting on polycount to show everyone how to run a serious character art comp :) politics should be kept out of art!
  • StefanH
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    StefanH polycounter lvl 12
    I think dominance war should be directed by michael bay. Full of pathos :)

    Balls of STEEEEEELLL! :)
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