The Elder Scrolls IV: Oblivion was one of the games I was looking forward to getting on my X-box 360; I was wowed by the look of the game from the many screen shots I saw leading up to the games release. After reading the seemingly stellar reviews ( Were the reviewers high!) for both the X-box 360 version and the PC version I decided to go with the PC version. I figured that since I bought a GeForce 7800 GS card I might as well put it to good use. After 14 hours into the game I'll be returning my copy to the store, this game feels sloppy from top to bottom. The graphics are boring and lackluster at best even with most of the effects turned on and the combat system feels extremely broken last but not least the story feels flat and doesnt inspire me to go on any further. Admittly I usually play Japanese style RPG's like Final Fantasy, Dragons Quest, etc. and I was hoping that Oblivion would be the game to turn me on to the Elder Scroll series and also more western style RPG's, well if anything this will be my last Elder Scroll game until the developer cuts the fat and truly concentrate on delivering a game that lives up to the hype!
Things Id love to see:
Better Characters, if you cant do face creation properly dont do it at all, no matter how hard I tried my character ended up looking like a cross between Antonio Banderas and Steven Seagal! I would have preferred a couple of really cool choices instead of busted human caricatures!
Tighter Camera Control: I shouldnt have to struggle with fighting knee-high creatures not to mention the control is extremely floaty.
Skip the lip Sync: If you cant do it properly then axe it and just concentrate on something else, RPGs for years have existed with characters who never moved there lips and I was never drawn out of the world but once you attempt to lip-synch and its unconvincing then youve just taken me out of the world you created!
Learn how to use normal maps better: For god sakes stonewalls should look like stonewalls and not plastic slime wallpaper! Same goes for the characters! I work with Normal Maps all day and get much better results.
Why offer third person view: I actually tried to play this game In third person view which was a huge mistake and raised my blood pressure through the roof, the camera is fixed in such a way it makes it impossible to actually fight anyone without guessing whats going to happen next! Once again cut the fat, if it wasnt working during play testing then axe it, this game was obviously designed for the first person view so dont tease the gamer into thinking you can successfully play this way!
The environments were the highpoint in the game: If your going to offer a gorgeous environment as one of the highpoints in the game then spend the time to creatate interesting foliage instead of billboard style trees!
The sad thing is this game will probably turn off any noobe RPG gamer to the whole genre, which is a shame because there is potentially better RPGs looming in the horizon for the 360. Next Gen I think not!
I would be happier if the developer just concentrated on making a solid game than adding a ton of graphical bells and whistles that dont even work properly even on a midrange system and serves very little in the way of game play!
Later,
Marcus Dublin
PS: Time to fire up the old PS2 for some great RPG gaming for now.
It's amazing how much you're willing to forgive because of the game's massive scope. Sure there are frequent crashes wierd faces, boring fights, and mip mapping issues, but there's so much to do!
A bunch more hours in and I'm having a lot more fun with the game. I've been doing side quests rather than advancing the main story (Fighters Guild, Arena, etc.). The world is really the star of this game. Some of my best experiences so far have happened en-route to quests; it just feels great to find something new every time you leave a city. But I've already spent too much time typing, the Fighter's Guild won't run itself! And who's going to take care of that Vampire infestation in Memorial Cavern?! BACK TO CYRODIL!!1
I guess a amd2600+ with a gig of ram and radeon 9250 wouldnt run at all? I dont mind having settings on low, I am just sooooo tempted to buy the game but I cant really afford to
edit: Great, just read somewhere that apparantly the game doesnt support radeon 9250
Zcubed nailed it for me. Just like Morrowind I've come to accept it's shortcomings (seemingly far more to me than Morrowind had 4 years prior) and play it like crazy. I'll reserve final judgement for when i actually beat the game and all, but so far it's very engrossing.
I'm just amazed at how much crap I'm putting up with for this game. I'ved continuosly experiemnted with graphics settings, changed setting on my machine, and tweaked .ini files (seriously now...) all to run around a medieval sandbox and steal stuff with a lizard man that runs like he slipped sat on a broomstick.
I really wonder why other devs have never taken a stab at this formula for a game (save Gothic which still resides in the realm of the obscure for most gamers on my side of the world). Clearly Bethesda proves you don't have to get it all right (or in this case somewhere short of half right) to make a great entry into this genre.
[ QUOTE ]
The Construction Set will occasionally appear to hang or lock up while
attempting to exit. Wait 5 minutes. If it still hasn't closed, press
CTRL-ALT-DEL and manually END TASK on the application.
dangit, im hooked. I played it all weekend. All things considered it's not that buggy... I do some weird things that by all rights should be breaking quests and screwing up the plot, but most of those things have been pretty tightly refined.
it took me awhile to get into, but it's pure escapism now. Doesn't matter how it looks, a good game is still a good game.
I got the game friday (had no time to go to the closest mall before) and I'm really loving it...I'm not a RPG fan, although I played some neverwinter nights (didn't like it that much) and finished one or two final fantasy games before.
The thing is ( and the previous discussion makes it even more obvious for me) that this game reminds me a lot of GTA ( especially San Andreas). See, I'm a big fan of the gta games becaus you can do a lot of side thing, so if you don't like the story, then just take part in it from time to time. So the game is not as nice as it should be, that's true, very bad taste on some characters (the lizards are just awful) slow performance if you don't tweak it, but damn, there's so much to do...I played all teh weekend, then yesterday, came to the office for a few hours and talked with some of the other oblivion players there...and honestly at some times, I though they were talking about a completely different game (we're all around the same level, 11-ish, but completely different classes).
I learnt about the vampire thing just by reading that thread...
I also spent a lot of time to make the game running fine on my home PC (p4 2.4, 2gigs and gf6600) and even more on my work PC ( athlon2100+ less than a gig ram and radeon 9700) but now that it's done, I really enjoy it...I mean, I spent like 10 mins yesterday watching the snow falling and saying to myself : wtf it's snowing !!!
I like the combat system too, while at first it was a bit messy, once you get used to it it becomes way more interesting (I started creating my magical weapons and doing poisons, which helps a lot).
then maybe the class you play make the game really different, I know I only use like 2 or 3 spells, everything else is sword or bow, I play as an assassin...
For me it's what Fable should have been...you can blame oblivion for the graphic choices, but honestly I prefer this than Fable with its gorgeous graphics and 10-ish hour adventures with nothing that I bought the game for ( loads of choices : bullsh!t, freedom : bullsh!t, consequences of any action you do in the world : bullsh!t), felt like dumb when I finished that crap )
although yah I was still a bit disapointed by the graphics hype bullsh!t...
Yeah, I have to say really, for anyone put off their purchase by my angry rants (not that anybody was Im sure!), please dont be! I am completely hooked. Meh, *pay* for a horse? it's a damn site more like GTA If you just help yourself to one! There's also moments when perhaps strangely its reminded me of playing Half Life2. Probably some of the quests were you're battling alongside other soldiers. Although graphically it is (imo) dissapointing, and the performance less than good, it completely draws you in. I couldn't for the life of me on saturday morning figure out how Gamespot could justify a 93% score, but after an entire day of not being able to leave this game alone yesterday, I'm beginning to understand.
Yep Daz, that's pretty much how everyone reacted to Morrowind I think ... "Damn this looks ugly... and it's running slow... wait, I got it speeded up a bit... it's so huge! I need to become the top assassin... and venture to the unexplored Dwarf ruins to get some prize loot... and what are those statues in the jungle all about anyway? And who lives in that tree in the swamp? Gah, there's so much to do!"
well, royally with oblivion. i'm getting massive artifacts in the game and they end up occuring in cs source and such afterwards. note that if I reboot, cs source and everything else is fine, even oblivion is good for a little while. i've run atitool to test for artifacts which showed no errors over a 2 hour period.
systems crap for those curious is p4 2ghz, 1gb ram, bfg 6600gt oc.
related to morrowind, I still have poor frames with my current machine in that game. engine I found really dissapointing.
Err, if you're getting artifacts in Oblivion then they occur in different games afterwards, that's a hardware problem. Sounds to me like you're taxing your system too much and things are overheating and causing graphics problems.
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"Damn this looks ugly... and it's running slow... wait, I got it speeded up a bit... it's so huge! I need to become the top assassin... and venture to the unexplored Dwarf ruins to get some prize loot... and what are those statues in the jungle all about anyway? And who lives in that tree in the swamp? Gah, there's so much to do!"
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hahahahaha, that mess alone makes me want to play this game, and my brother bought it so I'm probably going to install it tomorrow evening when I go home.
After some more thought and testing of the leveling system, I'm come to the conclusion that it does indeed suck. It had potential, and the good intentions that went into its design are obvious, but Bethesda simply missed the mark in terms of user friendlines and balance.
The problem is two-fold. For one, you level far too fast. Bethesda scaled the leveling system assuming that people would simply blow through the main quest as fast as possible. Only in this situation does it work well. But if you say, want to actually complete some guild quests or sidequests, you can (read: will) be wearing the best armour in the game before you ever touch the main quest at all. This can also cause problems in that it's much harder to do the main quest at a high level than a low one. Some people are quite simply unable to beat the game just because they explored too much at the start.
Secondly, the attribute system requires you level up only the skills related to the attribute you want bonuses for, if you want to be most effective. Players who decide to level up minor skills or non-combat related skills (ie. alchemy) will find themselves levelling up without being offered useful bonuses. As a result they get gimped with bad stats later on.
For the mindless masses who buy the game without having a clue what they're doing, this might be fine. But if you bought the game for the tons of sidequests and hundreds of dungeons, thinking you can take your time exploring the world, you're in trouble.
Never fear! Oblivion is incredibly easy to mod and there's already several alternatives that fix the system quite well. Personally, I'm using the <a href="http://www.elderscrolls.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=289263">Slower Leveling</a> mod (on the Epic level), which simply makes leveling up take longer. This allows you to explore much, much more without having the enemies/items rapidly change around you to the hardest levels. I know it sounds weird to actually slow down an RPG, by five times no less, but that's just how bad the default settings are.
I'm also using a mod which offers you a flat rate of attribute bonuses when leveling up, so it doesn't matter what skills you use. There's a tutorial for doing this <a href="http://www.elderscrolls.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=301749">here</a>, which also includes a premade mod file if you don't want to go through the hassle (although it's super easy and the TES: Construction Set is only 6.3MB).
Alternatively, you can try <a href="http://www.elderscrolls.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=301013">this mod</a> which links your attributes directly to the skills you use. It might be possible to use this in combination with Slower Levelling as well, although I haven't tried.
It really is an amazing game, it's just a shame that (like pretty much every game these days) it got screwed over by being targetted at clueless average joe.
yea mop, i'm thinking you're right. going to have to get my gforce4 tomorrow from home and send in my card to be replaced.
I can understand the system being taxed, but at the same time i've been able to run cs source with aa at 4x and af at 4x and i'm certain those tax the card more than oblivion could.
i'm glad I got a bfg card though, the lifetime warrenty could come in handy.
Are you actually overclocking the card? Tried the latest bios?
The performance situation is definitely *very* weird. What I've gleaned from a lot of forum lurking is that at some point no matter how uber your 3D card is, performance isn't really improved from a lower card. There are people with dual 7800's having dips in fps. It seems the game code is more reliant on CPU. Could be something to do with the physics, speedtree, instancing, streaming, slow code or just a crappy inefficient engine. Could be any number of things. Who knows. But I doubt the validity of comparing the performance to a game that just loads one map that sits in memory the whole time. What Oblivion does with its streaming world system is very different. I really wish the performance was a lot better, but alas. Unlike a lot of people on the forums, Im not holding out for a magic patch that gives a massive fps boost. I think the inefficiency problems are buried too deep in code. But there are performance gains to be had If you look into it. How much time Ive spent this wkend re-installing drivers, tweaking all sorts of in and out of game settings just shows how desperately I want to enjoy it to its fullest potential.
If it's overclocked and you're throwing Oblivion at it, especially at higher settings, it's most likely an overheating problem, CS: Source isn't actually all that intensive graphically, even with 4xAA and whatever on, Oblivion on default settings is considerably more intense
Thanks for the heads up, acc. I've been avoiding the main quest alltogether, and it sounds like I'm going to have some serious problems once I get to work on the core storyline. The change from goblins/rats to ogres/vampires was quite abrupt, and my gear doesn't seem to be improving much anymore either. I guess I'll have a little more fun with my Imperial Knight and then start over with this mod enabled. It's a bit of a pain to restart after all the time that I've put in, but it seems like the game isn't going to have much longevity at this rate.
mop: i'm running right at 640x480. Going to try turning off most options and see if that makes a difference. Another oddball thing is I can reboot and oblivion and everything else runs fine for a little while.
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Thanks for the heads up, acc. I've been avoiding the main quest alltogether, and it sounds like I'm going to have some serious problems once I get to work on the core storyline. The change from goblins/rats to ogres/vampires was quite abrupt, and my gear doesn't seem to be improving much anymore either. I guess I'll have a little more fun with my Imperial Knight and then start over with this mod enabled. It's a bit of a pain to restart after all the time that I've put in, but it seems like the game isn't going to have much longevity at this rate.
Nah, the difficulty feels just about right at this point. What seems to be the problem is that the enemies are scaled to your level while the allies in the main quest are not. Ironically, the higher your character level, the more challenging the game becomes.
Of course that's just what I've heard on forums. As I said; I haven't touched the main storyline yet.
Regardless, the game is progressing a little too fast for my tastes. I've only been playing for a few days and I've already got some of the best armor/etc in the game. A mod that makes you level slower seems to be the perfect solution for me.
There's a greater design flaw than just monster difficulty. The slot machine effect isn't present in this game. There is no chance of happening upon a cool item or weapon a designer hid behind a rock, etc. No matter what direction I walk, or what ancient ruins I come upon, there will always only ever be stuff that 'just right' for my level. It's very boring in that regard as I basically always know what's around the corner.
It's funny that a game built around the idea of exploring and discovering such a massive world, really has no secrets at all in terms of treasures and encounters.
[ QUOTE ] What seems to be the problem is that the enemies are scaled to your level
Which of course makes levelling up completely pointless.
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No it does not. With higher level you get better loot and different monsters.
And it allows you to play all the quests you can find and its still fun.
Ofcourse it has its minuses too like there are no "oh shit" moments while exploring and no "just wait sucker i come back and own you when im little stronger" moments either.
The whole point of levelling up is to become a 'badass', feared by everyday mortals. Who wants to be a level 20 champion floored by a couple of goblins??
Hmm, I've been reading about the "leveling world" and while I do think it has some really good merits, it kind of saddens me to think people can become the Arena Grandmaster at level 1. I don't mind the creatures leveling a bit to continue the level of challenge. Honestly, it's not a hard linear thing either as many of the very early creatures are dispatched relatively easy after leveling myself a bit. Maybe it's jsut the skill/gear difference who knows.
One thing that will really make me sad is if specific locales don't house specific artifacts. Such as an ancient burial site for long forgotten hero who just so happens to be buried with his family sword. It's those specific details and suprises that really made morrowind so awesome in terms of detail and allure for me. Don't get me wrong, I'm loving Oblivion to no end, and I still recommend it on xbox 360. I just hope that not "all" of the locales are populated with the "leveled" creatures and loot.
Oh and I was sad to hear there is no levitate in Oblivion 8(
I think it has to do with the fact that towns are on their own seperate worldspace, and that hovering over the citywalls would result in you finding a big empty space of nothingness.
quite logical..
BTW, has anyone checked out the E3 kvatch level?.. found it when I was looking in the constructionset :x
Yeah , that whole not being able to plf about is a shame.
One thing that really made morrowind great was the lovly designs for the different races/tribes like the cephlopod helm and stuff like that .... hopeing there will be similar stuff in oblivion.
One thing that really made morrowind great was the lovly designs for the different races/tribes like the cephlopod helm and stuff like that .... hopeing there will be similar stuff in oblivion.
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If there is, I haven't seen it yet - except for the 'Oblivion' stuff. The rest seems very standard medieval fayre?
[edit] I forgot about the 'white ruins' whose underground interiors are spectacular.
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I think it has to do with the fact that towns are on their own seperate worldspace, and that hovering over the citywalls would result in you finding a big empty space of nothingness.
quite logical..
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They go through that trouble to prevent the dispelling of immersion, yet if you walk in any one direction for too long you hit an invisible wall and get a message that says 'You can't go there, turn around.'
One thing that really made morrowind great was the lovly designs for the different races/tribes like the cephlopod helm and stuff like that .... hopeing there will be similar stuff in oblivion.
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If there is, I haven't seen it yet - except for the 'Oblivion' stuff. The rest seems very standard medieval fayre?
[edit] I forgot about the 'white ruins' whose underground interiors are spectacular.
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those things go on forever, i was in one a good hour and a half before i hit a ghost and i didnt have any silver so i had to turn all the way around.
Meh ive been playing for about 8 hours now and I STILL havent found a single 'magic' weapon or armour piece yet, I think ive raided about 4-5 temples/caves but havent found ANYTHING spectacular yet...
Also, the world seems to be a lot smaller than the one from morrowind, I could walk from one side to the other in half an hour, and I remember the island in morrowind being a LOT bigger.... or maybe its just me hehe
It's most likely because you are not high enough level yet to actually find these items. it's a really lousy design choice, as I think even shop keepers scale their items up and prevent you from ever obtaining them until you are deemed worthy.
As far as the world size, fast travel makes it seem far smaller but apparently the world is twice as big as morrowind. personally I think it's from dungeons, caves, oblivion, etc. These places are considerably larger than Morrowind's and most likely contribute to a large portion of the total sq. footage.
took me ages to discover fast travel (tonight, in fact), was running across the map instead. it's kinda fun, did the dark brotherhood line before making a start on the main quest, had more fun on that than the main quest stuff so far.
All my magic/enchanted weapons have come from me exploring and closing the various Oblivion gates around the agme world. Typically there are at least 3 enemies in each plane that have a unique weapon. Hell, I got so many cool weapons that I managed to become the Grand Champion in the arena with minimal effort. Although, I spent literally 20 hours this weekend playing the game and I am only at level 8.
Heh, i was close to buying the game as people at work keep talking about it and seem to be hooked. What i liked the most was that one turned into a vampire and over the course of a few ingame days (or something) it got worse and worse to the point where he'd die from sunlight, unless he'd feed off a human. That would lower his vampire stats/bonusses for a while but allow him to go outside at daylight.
After this thread it seems tho that there's a lot to forgive to enjoy the game ?
I was mainly not interested because i didn't like the art, character art and animations have been pointed out i think and while the vistas look great, most things look like a scene put together in bryce, porrly lit and using meshes and textures that dont blend together and lack weatheration and detail in favor of exagerated bumpmap.
What looked really cool were the caves.
The empty cities felt like the worst, is it worth being a champ or feared warrior if noone is out there to fear you ?
I think Fable did a great job with populating the world, even WoW has more NPCs, and its not an SP game.
well even with everything turned to bare minimums including forcing 1.1 shaders my card is still f'ing up. went home and got my old gf4 4600. going to see if that works without errors if I can get it working with oblivion.
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Justin, yeah I've thought about that - I've swung swords at folks who've defended themselves quite well with bare hands, so I guess it's possible.
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You can knock people over with bare hands and then beat them while they are down.
Replies
Things Id love to see:
Better Characters, if you cant do face creation properly dont do it at all, no matter how hard I tried my character ended up looking like a cross between Antonio Banderas and Steven Seagal! I would have preferred a couple of really cool choices instead of busted human caricatures!
Tighter Camera Control: I shouldnt have to struggle with fighting knee-high creatures not to mention the control is extremely floaty.
Skip the lip Sync: If you cant do it properly then axe it and just concentrate on something else, RPGs for years have existed with characters who never moved there lips and I was never drawn out of the world but once you attempt to lip-synch and its unconvincing then youve just taken me out of the world you created!
Learn how to use normal maps better: For god sakes stonewalls should look like stonewalls and not plastic slime wallpaper! Same goes for the characters! I work with Normal Maps all day and get much better results.
Why offer third person view: I actually tried to play this game In third person view which was a huge mistake and raised my blood pressure through the roof, the camera is fixed in such a way it makes it impossible to actually fight anyone without guessing whats going to happen next! Once again cut the fat, if it wasnt working during play testing then axe it, this game was obviously designed for the first person view so dont tease the gamer into thinking you can successfully play this way!
The environments were the highpoint in the game: If your going to offer a gorgeous environment as one of the highpoints in the game then spend the time to creatate interesting foliage instead of billboard style trees!
The sad thing is this game will probably turn off any noobe RPG gamer to the whole genre, which is a shame because there is potentially better RPGs looming in the horizon for the 360. Next Gen I think not!
I would be happier if the developer just concentrated on making a solid game than adding a ton of graphical bells and whistles that dont even work properly even on a midrange system and serves very little in the way of game play!
Later,
Marcus Dublin
PS: Time to fire up the old PS2 for some great RPG gaming for now.
A bunch more hours in and I'm having a lot more fun with the game. I've been doing side quests rather than advancing the main story (Fighters Guild, Arena, etc.). The world is really the star of this game. Some of my best experiences so far have happened en-route to quests; it just feels great to find something new every time you leave a city. But I've already spent too much time typing, the Fighter's Guild won't run itself! And who's going to take care of that Vampire infestation in Memorial Cavern?! BACK TO CYRODIL!!1
Isn't this how WoW ruins lives?
edit: Great, just read somewhere that apparantly the game doesnt support radeon 9250
I'm just amazed at how much crap I'm putting up with for this game. I'ved continuosly experiemnted with graphics settings, changed setting on my machine, and tweaked .ini files (seriously now...) all to run around a medieval sandbox and steal stuff with a lizard man that runs like he slipped sat on a broomstick.
I really wonder why other devs have never taken a stab at this formula for a game (save Gothic which still resides in the realm of the obscure for most gamers on my side of the world). Clearly Bethesda proves you don't have to get it all right (or in this case somewhere short of half right) to make a great entry into this genre.
The Construction Set will occasionally appear to hang or lock up while
attempting to exit. Wait 5 minutes. If it still hasn't closed, press
CTRL-ALT-DEL and manually END TASK on the application.
[/ QUOTE ]
Is everything about this game hacky?
it took me awhile to get into, but it's pure escapism now. Doesn't matter how it looks, a good game is still a good game.
The thing is ( and the previous discussion makes it even more obvious for me) that this game reminds me a lot of GTA ( especially San Andreas). See, I'm a big fan of the gta games becaus you can do a lot of side thing, so if you don't like the story, then just take part in it from time to time. So the game is not as nice as it should be, that's true, very bad taste on some characters (the lizards are just awful) slow performance if you don't tweak it, but damn, there's so much to do...I played all teh weekend, then yesterday, came to the office for a few hours and talked with some of the other oblivion players there...and honestly at some times, I though they were talking about a completely different game (we're all around the same level, 11-ish, but completely different classes).
I learnt about the vampire thing just by reading that thread...
I also spent a lot of time to make the game running fine on my home PC (p4 2.4, 2gigs and gf6600) and even more on my work PC ( athlon2100+ less than a gig ram and radeon 9700) but now that it's done, I really enjoy it...I mean, I spent like 10 mins yesterday watching the snow falling and saying to myself : wtf it's snowing !!!
I like the combat system too, while at first it was a bit messy, once you get used to it it becomes way more interesting (I started creating my magical weapons and doing poisons, which helps a lot).
then maybe the class you play make the game really different, I know I only use like 2 or 3 spells, everything else is sword or bow, I play as an assassin...
For me it's what Fable should have been...you can blame oblivion for the graphic choices, but honestly I prefer this than Fable with its gorgeous graphics and 10-ish hour adventures with nothing that I bought the game for ( loads of choices : bullsh!t, freedom : bullsh!t, consequences of any action you do in the world : bullsh!t), felt like dumb when I finished that crap
although yah I was still a bit disapointed by the graphics hype bullsh!t...
systems crap for those curious is p4 2ghz, 1gb ram, bfg 6600gt oc.
related to morrowind, I still have poor frames with my current machine in that game. engine I found really dissapointing.
"Damn this looks ugly... and it's running slow... wait, I got it speeded up a bit... it's so huge! I need to become the top assassin... and venture to the unexplored Dwarf ruins to get some prize loot... and what are those statues in the jungle all about anyway? And who lives in that tree in the swamp? Gah, there's so much to do!"
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hahahahaha, that mess alone makes me want to play this game, and my brother bought it so I'm probably going to install it tomorrow evening when I go home.
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After some more thought and testing of the leveling system, I'm come to the conclusion that it does indeed suck. It had potential, and the good intentions that went into its design are obvious, but Bethesda simply missed the mark in terms of user friendlines and balance.
The problem is two-fold. For one, you level far too fast. Bethesda scaled the leveling system assuming that people would simply blow through the main quest as fast as possible. Only in this situation does it work well. But if you say, want to actually complete some guild quests or sidequests, you can (read: will) be wearing the best armour in the game before you ever touch the main quest at all. This can also cause problems in that it's much harder to do the main quest at a high level than a low one. Some people are quite simply unable to beat the game just because they explored too much at the start.
Secondly, the attribute system requires you level up only the skills related to the attribute you want bonuses for, if you want to be most effective. Players who decide to level up minor skills or non-combat related skills (ie. alchemy) will find themselves levelling up without being offered useful bonuses. As a result they get gimped with bad stats later on.
For the mindless masses who buy the game without having a clue what they're doing, this might be fine. But if you bought the game for the tons of sidequests and hundreds of dungeons, thinking you can take your time exploring the world, you're in trouble.
Never fear! Oblivion is incredibly easy to mod and there's already several alternatives that fix the system quite well. Personally, I'm using the <a href="http://www.elderscrolls.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=289263">Slower Leveling</a> mod (on the Epic level), which simply makes leveling up take longer. This allows you to explore much, much more without having the enemies/items rapidly change around you to the hardest levels. I know it sounds weird to actually slow down an RPG, by five times no less, but that's just how bad the default settings are.
I'm also using a mod which offers you a flat rate of attribute bonuses when leveling up, so it doesn't matter what skills you use. There's a tutorial for doing this <a href="http://www.elderscrolls.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=301749">here</a>, which also includes a premade mod file if you don't want to go through the hassle (although it's super easy and the TES: Construction Set is only 6.3MB).
Alternatively, you can try <a href="http://www.elderscrolls.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=301013">this mod</a> which links your attributes directly to the skills you use. It might be possible to use this in combination with Slower Levelling as well, although I haven't tried.
It really is an amazing game, it's just a shame that (like pretty much every game these days) it got screwed over by being targetted at clueless average joe.
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I can understand the system being taxed, but at the same time i've been able to run cs source with aa at 4x and af at 4x and i'm certain those tax the card more than oblivion could.
i'm glad I got a bfg card though, the lifetime warrenty could come in handy.
The performance situation is definitely *very* weird. What I've gleaned from a lot of forum lurking is that at some point no matter how uber your 3D card is, performance isn't really improved from a lower card. There are people with dual 7800's having dips in fps. It seems the game code is more reliant on CPU. Could be something to do with the physics, speedtree, instancing, streaming, slow code or just a crappy inefficient engine. Could be any number of things. Who knows. But I doubt the validity of comparing the performance to a game that just loads one map that sits in memory the whole time. What Oblivion does with its streaming world system is very different. I really wish the performance was a lot better, but alas. Unlike a lot of people on the forums, Im not holding out for a magic patch that gives a massive fps boost. I think the inefficiency problems are buried too deep in code. But there are performance gains to be had If you look into it. How much time Ive spent this wkend re-installing drivers, tweaking all sorts of in and out of game settings just shows how desperately I want to enjoy it to its fullest potential.
as for comparing cs source and oblivion, I was talking about the graphical details and taxing the graphics card.
I might be wrong, but then again i've been out of the last bit. dealing with moving and such
r.
Thanks for the heads up, acc. I've been avoiding the main quest alltogether, and it sounds like I'm going to have some serious problems once I get to work on the core storyline. The change from goblins/rats to ogres/vampires was quite abrupt, and my gear doesn't seem to be improving much anymore either. I guess I'll have a little more fun with my Imperial Knight and then start over with this mod enabled. It's a bit of a pain to restart after all the time that I've put in, but it seems like the game isn't going to have much longevity at this rate.
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Difficulty slider, use it!
Of course that's just what I've heard on forums. As I said; I haven't touched the main storyline yet.
Regardless, the game is progressing a little too fast for my tastes. I've only been playing for a few days and I've already got some of the best armor/etc in the game. A mod that makes you level slower seems to be the perfect solution for me.
The leveling slow/fast seems to be very personal matter for example my char is lvl 16 and my last save shows over 25 hours played.
It's funny that a game built around the idea of exploring and discovering such a massive world, really has no secrets at all in terms of treasures and encounters.
Which of course makes levelling up completely pointless.
What seems to be the problem is that the enemies are scaled to your level
Which of course makes levelling up completely pointless.
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No it does not. With higher level you get better loot and different monsters.
And it allows you to play all the quests you can find and its still fun.
Ofcourse it has its minuses too like there are no "oh shit" moments while exploring and no "just wait sucker i come back and own you when im little stronger" moments either.
also, I'm all for the 'level-up-slower' mod.
One thing that will really make me sad is if specific locales don't house specific artifacts. Such as an ancient burial site for long forgotten hero who just so happens to be buried with his family sword. It's those specific details and suprises that really made morrowind so awesome in terms of detail and allure for me. Don't get me wrong, I'm loving Oblivion to no end, and I still recommend it on xbox 360. I just hope that not "all" of the locales are populated with the "leveled" creatures and loot.
Oh and I was sad to hear there is no levitate in Oblivion 8(
They probably didn't want to see 7 minute speedruns for Oblivion, too...
quite logical..
BTW, has anyone checked out the E3 kvatch level?.. found it when I was looking in the constructionset :x
One thing that really made morrowind great was the lovly designs for the different races/tribes like the cephlopod helm and stuff like that .... hopeing there will be similar stuff in oblivion.
One thing that really made morrowind great was the lovly designs for the different races/tribes like the cephlopod helm and stuff like that .... hopeing there will be similar stuff in oblivion.
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If there is, I haven't seen it yet - except for the 'Oblivion' stuff. The rest seems very standard medieval fayre?
[edit] I forgot about the 'white ruins' whose underground interiors are spectacular.
I think it has to do with the fact that towns are on their own seperate worldspace, and that hovering over the citywalls would result in you finding a big empty space of nothingness.
quite logical..
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They go through that trouble to prevent the dispelling of immersion, yet if you walk in any one direction for too long you hit an invisible wall and get a message that says 'You can't go there, turn around.'
lame.
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One thing that really made morrowind great was the lovly designs for the different races/tribes like the cephlopod helm and stuff like that .... hopeing there will be similar stuff in oblivion.
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If there is, I haven't seen it yet - except for the 'Oblivion' stuff. The rest seems very standard medieval fayre?
[edit] I forgot about the 'white ruins' whose underground interiors are spectacular.
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those things go on forever, i was in one a good hour and a half before i hit a ghost and i didnt have any silver so i had to turn all the way around.
On the 'look' issue, I've been thinking about it and I reckon they've held back with the architecture to accent the 'oblivion' stuff.
Justin, yeah I've thought about that - I've swung swords at folks who've defended themselves quite well with bare hands, so I guess it's possible.
Also, the world seems to be a lot smaller than the one from morrowind, I could walk from one side to the other in half an hour, and I remember the island in morrowind being a LOT bigger.... or maybe its just me hehe
As far as the world size, fast travel makes it seem far smaller but apparently the world is twice as big as morrowind. personally I think it's from dungeons, caves, oblivion, etc. These places are considerably larger than Morrowind's and most likely contribute to a large portion of the total sq. footage.
After this thread it seems tho that there's a lot to forgive to enjoy the game ?
I was mainly not interested because i didn't like the art, character art and animations have been pointed out i think and while the vistas look great, most things look like a scene put together in bryce, porrly lit and using meshes and textures that dont blend together and lack weatheration and detail in favor of exagerated bumpmap.
What looked really cool were the caves.
The empty cities felt like the worst, is it worth being a champ or feared warrior if noone is out there to fear you ?
I think Fable did a great job with populating the world, even WoW has more NPCs, and its not an SP game.
Justin, yeah I've thought about that - I've swung swords at folks who've defended themselves quite well with bare hands, so I guess it's possible.
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You can knock people over with bare hands and then beat them while they are down.