Well, I have enlisted the aid of the inestimably delectable Tully for drawing me tasty concepts to model from.
We've started bouncing some ideas around (read: me rambling silly ideas as she patiently tries to make some sense out of them and draws something entirely not what I expected, but incredibly cool anyway).
Ok, so here's a drawing of the first part of the concept. There's more to him, but this is your basic guy. I want to do this up prettily, so more to come!
Nice, really nice. About the only thing I can suggest is more pouches, and boxes on his belt and at least one or two obvious instances of insignia or rank. Other than that, dead spot on
Tully's pretty busy with work and school at the moment so I'm making a start on the model for this guy even though his mount's concept is not finalised yet.
Everything above the belt is just pretty much just rough sketching masses at the moment, everything below the belt is laid out and started, just needs more detailing. Legs are the mid-level imported mesh from ZB.
I hope to have the head and hands ZBrush base mesh done by tomorrow.
You, my friend, are depriving humanity of essential highpoly knowledge if you havn't made a damned tutorial about detailing those god-forsaken things. Shame on you!
Might I add that your model shows no mercy to the concept, definatly an almost exact replica. I salute you!
HIEL MOP & TOLLY
looking forward to it mop ^^ nice start
that may be the position, but he looks more balanced on the concept...maybe something to do with the legs position/size, dunno...anways, cool work man !!
Yes indeed Mike, and ZBrushing is currently under way! Also interspersed with some sub-d modelling in Max to give some variety
Shape: Thanks, I'll be texturing - Tully is too busy to take any more work on right now, I think!
Scott: Yep, this is the high-poly. I'm still torn between making him stand-alone, or making his mount too. If id software can get away with under 2500 poly normal mapped character meshes, then so can I dammit! I'll finish this guy's high-poly model then see how I'm doing for time, that should decide whether I do the mount or not.
Spacemonkey: Hopefully you will... eventually! Everything right now is pretty much first-pass high res geo.
Poop, ElysiumGX, Makkon, Vahl: Thanks
Aaaaand an update. Modelled the head out today and took it into ZBrush for a first detail pass. Everything is still very lumpy and bland but all the main shapes and details are coming out now.
Hey, that looks great! The areas below the eyes seem a little undefined, but I'm sure that's because you're just getting started. How far did you take the polygonal mesh before importing it into Zbrush?
lookin good keep goin! i like the detail on the horns and forehead, for some reason i dislike the eyes though, i think it's just cause they're beady but thats probably just a personal pref :P
Hey Zcubed, the head mesh was actually a really quick hacky job, 202 quads in total... didn't even have a mouth detailed in :P
You can see the source mesh here if you're interested.
tinman: thanks... personally I quite like the eyes yeah, everything needs a lot more detail and i'm gonna make them more squinted and angry later on.
Looks sweet as Paul and thanks for showing your source mesh. Another part of this exercise for me is to start modeling in ZB earlier, and get out of the habit of the far longer traditional method, so this stuff is interesting to see for me. That really is remarkably low res.
Yeah Daz actually that's probably the worst example of a low-res source mesh you could possibly see, haha! It doesn't even have a line of symmetry down the centre (fortunately 1 sub-d in zbrush later it does )
Basically my philosophy with it is "whatever works" - in this case i'm not gonna be animating it or anything, so it's just a big solid lump of stuff that's gonna be rendered down to a normalmap, so why bother adding detail at source level as long as the polygon distribution is fairly OK and it smooths neatly. I could have done with some more polys around the mouth, but no matter. I played around with actually modelling the mouth into the control mesh but it was just making things too complex.
I think using the Move tool in zbrush a lot at vertex level right at the start, on the 0-level and 1st-level subd meshes, is vital to getting a good start and placement of where you want all your edges to flow. It's easier to address that stuff in ZB than in Max, I think.
I love it mop - but I really want to make that cheekbone a bit thicker. Bring it further round the eye and make it vertically a bit longer - I dunno just looks a bit like a metal plate in the face now
Just tweaking proportions here and there, made the arms actually a useable source mesh and started ZBrushing them a little, also blocked in the armour shapes for the main shoulder/neck armour.
Very nice so far! Maybe you could bulk up the lower leg joint a bit? Not the girth of the legs themselves ( in fact the thigh could even be more slim I think ), just the joint, you know, how a knuckle is wider than a finger. It's in the sketch, and hinted at in your model, but you could perhaps push it a little further. I know he's a slender character, but it feels like a lot of weight on a fairly flimsy seeming joint?
Great concept, and definately a clear transition to the model. Can't wait to see more detail going in and how well it will keep on the lo-res mesh.
Keep it up!
Looks really sweet, but it seems to have lost some of the dynamicness that the concept had, especially in the legs. The concept was very tall and thin but the model is a little bulkier and shorter.
Good point Daz, there's still plenty of work to be done on those legs. In fact they haven't changed since the last WIP screengrab
Caseyjones: Thanks!
Soccerman18: Hmm, well I think some of the loss of dynamic-ness is due to the neutral pose I'm modelling it in, that should all disappear when posed.
I'm pretty sure the proportions are very close to the concept - maybe it was the angle of the render making it look bulkier than it really is.
I think its pretty much spot on! if you wanted a minor nitpick the material tucked into the belt could be a bit longer under the beltline, but Im sure youll tweak minor stuff like that- looks great overall
yea i lso think u pretty much nailed it.. Maybe make the upper legs a tad bit longer and thin the waist a bit. On the concept he has really swooshy lines while your model is more "rigid". Anyway this is just nitpicking i guess. It looks rad sofar.
hey Mop its looking good! I have a few suggestions though, the belt area could be pinched in a little more - like it is in the concept, I also think the pants would benefit from increasing the width/baggyness around the knee area. Marine is right about the cheek bones, make sure you acheive that narrow feel he has to his face in the concept - currently I think his head might be a little wide perhaps? any good work so far!!
OK good calls guys, I think I've addressed most of the main issues now. Rooster: yeah, I noticed that too but was too lazy to change it. Done now Motives: I don't think I'm gonna make the upper leg longer, in fact I was thinking it was close to being too long already! However I did scale the legs up by 105% vertically, I think it helps. Good call on the waist thing too, I went and did that. Marine: Yep Thnom mentioned that earlier and I tried to fix it but didn't do enough, I think it's improved now somewhat. All the zbrush stuff is hugely subject to rapid change anyway spacemonkey: Good calls, like I said to motives I think I fixed the waist and it looks a whole lot better now, also made the pants a bit more baggy below the knee and gave them a bit more width near the top too. I don't think the head is too wide personally but the cheekbones have been fixed somewhat now, and I'll see about head proportions further down the line.
Anyway, here's an animation showing the changes from the previous version, I think you'll agree it's a lot closer to the concept now and retains more of the dynamic shapes and forms Tully worked in there.
The collar on the jacket in the concept looks better to me than the one on the model. in the concept, it looks to come almost straight up from the jacket, and then slopes in on the inside of the collar toward the neck, and would have a certain thickness to it. The one in the model expands outward right off the jacket and because of that it seems to lose some of its coolness.
Chest also seems to like it needs to be puffed out a bit.
Replies
Glad you are in on this Mop my man, I'm sure we'll see something classic.
oh ****.
why?
One time I saw Mop eat the head off of a four year old at a McDonalds because he thought the four year old looked like a CGchat member.
Glad you are in on this Mop my man, I'm sure we'll see something classic.
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Hahahahahahahahaha I love those stories man
3000+ posts is serious.
Good luck Mop!
Etheros: You have to remember.... all the tallented game artists that post on cgchat CAME from polycount, wtf you think? hahahaha
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Yeah that's true even about me... but you gotta start somewhere, right???
(just for the record, I still love these boards, I just have a tendency of taking these things too seriously)
We've started bouncing some ideas around (read: me rambling silly ideas as she patiently tries to make some sense out of them and draws something entirely not what I expected, but incredibly cool anyway).
Maybe images soon-ish
But yes. Concepts soonish. I'll need to post them myself or everybody will think you're doing it all.
ME AND YOU MOP!!! AT THE FLAGPOLE, AFTER SCHOOL!
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Going to be kind of hard to finish the competition when you are hanging by your underwear from the top of the flagpole. Maybe you can bring a laptop?
hehehe easy there killer, no harm ment, just tossin a little mud =P
Keep it coming!
Scott
Everything above the belt is just pretty much just rough sketching masses at the moment, everything below the belt is laid out and started, just needs more detailing. Legs are the mid-level imported mesh from ZB.
I hope to have the head and hands ZBrush base mesh done by tomorrow.
Ok enough knob gobbling for now. Hurry hurry! Finish!
Scott
Might I add that your model shows no mercy to the concept, definatly an almost exact replica. I salute you!
HIEL MOP & TOLLY
that may be the position, but he looks more balanced on the concept...maybe something to do with the legs position/size, dunno...anways, cool work man !!
Shape: Thanks, I'll be texturing - Tully is too busy to take any more work on right now, I think!
Scott: Yep, this is the high-poly. I'm still torn between making him stand-alone, or making his mount too. If id software can get away with under 2500 poly normal mapped character meshes, then so can I dammit!
Spacemonkey: Hopefully you will... eventually! Everything right now is pretty much first-pass high res geo.
Poop, ElysiumGX, Makkon, Vahl: Thanks
Aaaaand an update. Modelled the head out today and took it into ZBrush for a first detail pass. Everything is still very lumpy and bland but all the main shapes and details are coming out now.
Onward!
You can see the source mesh here if you're interested.
tinman: thanks... personally I quite like the eyes
Basically my philosophy with it is "whatever works" - in this case i'm not gonna be animating it or anything, so it's just a big solid lump of stuff that's gonna be rendered down to a normalmap, so why bother adding detail at source level as long as the polygon distribution is fairly OK and it smooths neatly. I could have done with some more polys around the mouth, but no matter. I played around with actually modelling the mouth into the control mesh but it was just making things too complex.
I think using the Move tool in zbrush a lot at vertex level right at the start, on the 0-level and 1st-level subd meshes, is vital to getting a good start and placement of where you want all your edges to flow. It's easier to address that stuff in ZB than in Max, I think.
-b
Just tweaking proportions here and there, made the arms actually a useable source mesh and started ZBrushing them a little, also blocked in the armour shapes for the main shoulder/neck armour.
Keep it up!
-caseyjones
Caseyjones: Thanks!
Soccerman18: Hmm, well I think some of the loss of dynamic-ness is due to the neutral pose I'm modelling it in, that should all disappear when posed.
I'm pretty sure the proportions are very close to the concept - maybe it was the angle of the render making it look bulkier than it really is.
Here's a comparison pic for you:
Rooster: yeah, I noticed that too but was too lazy to change it. Done now
Motives: I don't think I'm gonna make the upper leg longer, in fact I was thinking it was close to being too long already! However I did scale the legs up by 105% vertically, I think it helps. Good call on the waist thing too, I went and did that.
Marine: Yep Thnom mentioned that earlier and I tried to fix it but didn't do enough, I think it's improved now somewhat. All the zbrush stuff is hugely subject to rapid change anyway
spacemonkey: Good calls, like I said to motives I think I fixed the waist and it looks a whole lot better now, also made the pants a bit more baggy below the knee and gave them a bit more width near the top too. I don't think the head is too wide personally but the cheekbones have been fixed somewhat now, and I'll see about head proportions further down the line.
Anyway, here's an animation showing the changes from the previous version, I think you'll agree it's a lot closer to the concept now and retains more of the dynamic shapes and forms Tully worked in there.
Back to work!
Chest also seems to like it needs to be puffed out a bit.
keep at it!