GTA San Andreas is being investigated in the US

JO420

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/4671429.stm


anyone seen any of the so called easter eggs?

ESRB is doing the investigating and it seems that some mod opens up some dating mini game in the game that lets you get freaky

KDR_11k

So what now? Should we rate anything modable AO because someone might mod in a porn scene?

Besides, GTASA is rated "M" wich apparently includes "sexuality" in its descriptions, sounds appropriate to me.

JO420

i think the mod was made of exsisting in game assets

Toomas

Basically the minigame is off by default but the mod turns it on.
Its a difficult case to judge as it comes with the game yet you cant turn it on without a mod...

ElysiumGX

http://www.gtasanandreas.net/news/single.php?id=1469
http://www.gtagarage.com/mods/show.php?id=28

Hope they yank it off the shelves completely.

AstroZombie

Brilliant marketing scheme by R*.

Whargoul

There are lots of assets and unused code in many games.


But most of it sucks so no one cares!

KDR_11k

Doesn't matter if it's been in there or added, it required a modification to the code and to a lawyer a small switch is the same as a total conversion so it'd set a legal precedent for mods. How the code was disabled doesn't matter, all that matters is that the code was not accessible in the unmodified build.

ElysiumGX

These games are expected to be modded. That's what our whole community is about. Did R* expect an average hardcore PC gamer to NOT find the naked sluts they ACCIDENTLY left in the retail release of the game and the code that allows them to be fucked pornstar style? If the ability to cause this modification is present within the release of the game, and was kept secret from those who are assigned to keep it from the wrong age group, then R* is completely responsible for this modification, and should be punished. Are these same assets found within the Xbox versions? It all seems planned to cause more shit and give the industry a bad reputation, and I stand by my statement above. I watched the video of what I thought was a user modification and thought it was retarded. It's not gameplay. Now that I know R* is the cause of it, I'm shocked. What kind of company allows this to make it's way across the internet where who knows who will get there hands on it?

Let the flames begin!

rooster

holy hell, I disagree slightly there.. it seems fairly obvious that its just a disabled feature they thought about adding but then (wisely) took out, forgetting to delete.
seriosly, why the hell would rockstar try to give the industry a bad reputation?

and besides that, its an 18 rated game anyway (at least in the uk) so who exactly needs protecting from sexual content?

MoP

Yeah, it's a bit of a non-issue over here, since it already has an 18 rating, and that wouldn't go any higher even if there were explicit sexual scenes in the game.

I'm with KDR_11k here...

Slipstream

I don't see why it matters. Besides the fact that Rockstar might have a legal problem for not alerting ESRB of the content, from the standpoint of those who are intersted in this and would play it, more likely than not they're already seeing far more reaslistic stuff on the internet. Watching 1200 polygon people have sex isn't likely to negatively affect all that much more.

JO420

gotta remember that this is the states,and politicians eat this up,they love using mistakes like this to furthur regulate the industry and gain political brownie points.


if janet jacksons breast was an issue this can be as well,i think it was iresponsible by rockstar to lett his content go out

oXYnary

I dont get it. The violence and death aren't a issue in this game. Yet the opposite, the process of creating life, and human intimacy.

OMG YOU SICKOS!

KeyserSoze

[ QUOTE ]
I dont get it. The violence and death aren't a issue in this game. Yet the opposite, the process of creating life, and human intimacy.

OMG YOU SICKOS!

[/ QUOTE ]

That's America: disgusting, gratuitous, and essentially pornographic violence is perfectly okay. But a nipple on network television and "OMG HIGH TREASON THEY SHOULD ALL BE HANGED."

palm

OMG! Who cares.. Its m-rated!
And Janet Jacksons titts! WHO CARES!!! God damit, our race is doomed.

Toomas

Violence is good as it teaches how to invade those terrorist countries.

gauss

let's try and keep this thread on topic and not decry the horrible injustices and double standards OMG WTF USA.

this could really be a landmark case as relates to games and mods, and the ingredients are perfectly set up for one of those hairy precendence-setting cases, too.

on the one hand, all the content is already in the game as pointed out. but as whargoul pointed out, this is hardly new--games harbor bits of unused code all the time, which are often difficult (or just not worth) removing before ship time because it's inactive. and also as whargoul said, it's usually inactive code because it sucks. watch the footage or download the mod--the minigame it presents is laughable at best from a gameplay (or titillation) standpoint.

so even though it's all in there, technically, and it only takes a very small mod to unlock it, the fact of the matter is that the game as it shipped, in its unaltered and unmodded state, DOES NOT INCLUDE the offending content in the game itself; it's like unexpressed genetic code.

so let's say that the sex content was not lying dormant in the game, but instead some oddball modder decided that hot coffee was really what the game needed. he cobbles together animations, sounds, etc. and a bit of code to create about the same kind of mod as the 'unlockable' minigame.

if you download this mod as opposed to downloading the mod that unlocks existing content, is there any difference to you, the user?

about the only considerable difference in that scenario would be the size of the download. which i would humbly submit is just not a big issue at all these days; certainly not one when we're talking legal precedents.


so we get to what the real question is: are developers responsible for mod content to their games and/or the inactive code in their game? remove this from the powderkeg territory of a sex minigame... there are many mods that can and are made that activate unused code in games that as a result make a game behave unsteadily and generally bug-ridden.

does that mean that a developer is responsible for mods that make the game unstable? i don't think so.


while i think it certainly would have avoided a lot of headaches if someone at rockstar had seen the sex minigame, thought about the implications and gotten it completely removed (or at least more deeply buried), i don't think this means that rockstar is responsible for a mod. because even if the content is theirs, the mod which makes it accessible is not.

if the precedence is set that rockstar held responsible for what a mod does to its game, i can't see how that can be a good thing for the industry.

it most certainly won't be a good thing for the mod community!

AstroZombie

Good points, Gauss.

While I don't think that R* should be held responsible, I can't help but think that R* knew what they were doing when they released this game with the "unused" code for the sex mini-game. I think they were looking for additional free publicity for an already controversial game.

Sage

Well the reality is that the game features a rated M rating. That means only adults can legally buy this game in a store. So if parents let their kids play the game maybe they should suck it. It's another stupid load of BS which makes me wonder if people know how to read anymore. It be nice if developers could sue the parents for their stupidity and neglect for a change. Hell this kind of thing just happens to often in the States, yet they turn the blind eye to the fact that teens start having sex as early as 12, what the hell is that. Last I heard parent are supposed to raise their kids not freeking video games, schools or other media. But somehow that notion has been lost since I was born back in 1977. Hell you don't see record labels getting sued for promoting sex in the music they publish, talk about double standards. Oh I forgot parents can't read anymore, dah... Rant over.

Alex

peanut™

Its not the first time that Rockstar gets in hot soup, in the last GTA, they had a level where they specifically asked the player to kill minorities.

I dont mind the sex however, Its Rated "M" for this reason but this is just an example of something going overboard.

thnom

[ QUOTE ]
Its not the first time that Rockstar gets in hot soup, in the last GTA, they had a level where they specifically asked the player to kill minorities.


[/ QUOTE ]

And?

Sorry I heard about this at the time, and still think its bullshit. In some games you have to specifically shoot Russians, Vietnamese, etc. Whole nations but its okay because it isn't asians. All this "Anti-Racism" bullshit thats just plain old fucking racism.

3 whitemen attack an asian = racial assault
3 asians attack a whiteman = assualt

gauss

i think you're both missing the point--that crap about Vice City was taken completely out of context of the game. you weren't killing Haitians because they were Haitians, you were killing off rival gang members that happened to be allied along ethnic lines (common for gangs).

just like the people decrying GTA SA for having a black protagonist--if anything, this is a very positive step forward to have a black man be the identifying point for the player. because what are the common features of the GTA player characters? they are all criminals who do stereotypically gangster things. that's what they all do, regardless of ethnic characteristics, so you really can't say CJ is somehow presenting a negative stereotype in that respect he's treated absolutely the same as previous player characters.

so within the established context of the series, it's actually rather empowering that they chose a black man, because it's certainly been an unpopular choice with some of the more closeminded videogame players out there.

now if Rockstar really wanted to get in a fight with the people who play their games, they'd have a female protagonist for a GTA game not that i think it'll ever happen, but wouldn't it be interesting if it did?

JO420

and she would pick up male hookers,have her fun kill em and retrieve her money

Seyiji

I just saw this on "ABC's World News Now" and during the interview/story they cut in scenes of MORTAL motherfucking KOMBAT!

Either that or GTA: SA also has a Mortal Kombat Deception mini game that the ABC people "unlocked"

Also shown was a (probably M rated) XBox FPS being played by a KID which again unless the ABC people managed to "unlock" in GTA: SA didn't belong there.

Why the fuck did they have a KID on there playing a game where from as far as I could see there was a zoomed in picture of a characters brain and when zoomed back out to the FPS player there were hands and a gun

This is total BS.....

I'll watch it again and see what else if anything was "featured"

lkraan

I find this all very funny.
The game itself with heaps of pretty realistic violence and criminal behaviour is fine but some sweet lovin' between 2 adults is wrong.
It's not like you see any genitals, cum shots or rape so the M rating seems to cover it fine. At least not in the screenshots I saw.

I can't believe that Tomb Raider's nude patch never caused a riot. I think that patch only activated hidden code and textures also.

Seyiji

While not exactly games you can't forget about Nvidia's (one of the largest graphics chip makers) Dawn and Dusk demo's they had textures with nipples already and waiting just alpha out the leaves and BLAM half nekkid Fairies!

edit:
Oh and Max Payne 2 a few lines added to the programs shortcut and a bunch of presses of the page down button and BLAM Nude Back side of Mona.

edit2:
Punch in a console command BLAM full frontal nudity!

danr

i can make my Sims lez up something chronic ...

KDR_11k

Sage: It's not illegal for stores to sell M rated games to minors, just immoral. The Supreme Court struck down any attempt of making the rating legally binding with the argument that games are free speech and legally enforced ratings would be censorship and unconstitutional.

I'm waiting until a GTA game has a eunuch or a homosexual as the main character...

Seyiji

[ QUOTE ]
I'm waiting until a GTA game has a eunuch or a homosexual as the main character...

[/ QUOTE ]Bi Sexual Shemale now that would be fun

edit:
Oh noes have I said too much!!!

jgall21

As far as I see its pretty stupid to get all jumpy because they have in the game but it is disabled until modded. Now this would not be in any way an offence tothe ESRB mainly due to the fact is its not accessable, Unless you install a Mod which in this case has to be APPROVED by yourself to use it. now this game in rated M for a reason, due to Violence, Profanity, Sexual Contant, and so on and so on. In either case I very well doubt this game can affect this community, and on the other had Jannet Jackson should not be proud to show that Ugly thing she claims is a nipple.

adam

The game already has a MATURE rating. Anyone in that recommended age group has seen sex somewhere else.

I don't get why people have to waste time on this shit.

ElysiumGX

[ QUOTE ]
Yet the opposite, the process of creating life, and human intimacy.

OMG YOU SICKOS!

[/ QUOTE ]

That would be a great arguement. But, when I think of the miracle of creating life, and human intimacy...

...this is not the first image that comes to mind. If it's your's, I suggest you delete all those gigs of porn, wash your hands, and get a girlfriend.

The nature in which it is acted out is pornography. Any other part of this discussion isn't worth debating anymore. Everything is just fine, until it's too fucked up we don't know where we went wrong. And then politics, and death, and the screaming.

And yes there is plenty wrong with the violence in these games, but that is a separate and tired discussion. I never look at a games rating, and most parents probably don't either.

palm

Yeah, the parents have a responsibility. I’m a so tired non-responsibility taking parents.
If a kid shoot someone with your gun its your damn fault for not keeping it in a safe place, not the game makers. If you drunk drive into a family its your damn fault, not the guy who sold you the beer. If you die of lung cancer after smoking 2 packs a day for 10 years, it’s your damn fault!!!

If your kids play these games it’s your own damn fault as well!

palm

And whats wrong with some pornsex every now and then?

Whargoul

What was Rockstar supposed to do? Hand over the game to the ESRB and say:

"Oh yeah, we've got some old content & code in there for a sex game that you can't see or activate, some old art for this hooker character that's not there, this old code for driving unicycles that never gets run and I think someone used the word "cunt" in one of the comments in the code somewhere. Oh yeah, and one of the artists wrote "asshole" in the unused space on one of the texture maps."

Seriously, there's lots of shit lying around in games. The ESRB can't rate you on what's just lying there. They rate the game, and that's all. They shouldn't be allowed to rate everything on the disk.

JO420

Honostly im more concerned with the powerful people and politicians who think they have some sort of moral authority in this country touse things like this as fuel place more regulations on this industry

Mark Dygert

Great something else to defend at the next family BBQ, joy...

Scott Ruggels

[ QUOTE ]
And whats wrong with some pornsex every now and then?

[/ QUOTE ]

Coming from a person, who's nick is "Palm' is pure comedy gold.

Scott

palm

Haha.=D Ye..I’m a wanker.


Its actually my real last name. Michael Palm, palm like the one in your avatar.;)

Mark Dygert

Middle name, Harry?

palm

I better shut up and don’t give you guys more ammunition.

Justin Meisse

I was wondering, does the sex game change the ESRB rating from Mature to Adults Only?

JO420

[ QUOTE ]
I was wondering, does the sex game change the ESRB rating from Mature to Adults Only?

[/ QUOTE ]


i think thats whats causing the whole sticky wicket.

thnom

If the case is guilty, the game can be re-"branded" as Adults Only and be taken from the shelves massively hitting sales.

sonic

It's just a legal issue. In the US, an M rating means you "should" be 17 to play, just like an R movie is 17 years old. Yet in the US you're not allowed to buy pornography until you are 18 years old. Thus the perfect chance for people to crap their pants over a game when they have no other way of exploiting it.

By the way, many many many R movies (same age group as M games) have sex scenes and nudity.

JonMurphy

Wouldn't there be some EULA get-out? The user has modified their installation of the software to do this.

peanut™

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Its not the first time that Rockstar gets in hot soup, in the last GTA, they had a level where they specifically asked the player to kill minorities.


[/ QUOTE ]

And?

Sorry I heard about this at the time, and still think its bullshit. In some games you have to specifically shoot Russians, Vietnamese, etc. Whole nations but its okay because it isn't asians. All this "Anti-Racism" bullshit thats just plain old fucking racism.

3 whitemen attack an asian = racial assault
3 asians attack a whiteman = assualt

[/ QUOTE ]

Huh? your right Rockstar was not in hot soup, they were given an award for good service to the community like i remember. /sarcasm off

adam

From what I can tell theres no actual nudity in these little mini-games. Sure, a sliver of a nipple is there but thats nothing.

Didn't God of War have something similar to this only it was OFFICIALLY part of the game????

arshlevon

is the sex depicted in the game x rated over 18 porn sex.. or standard run of the mill rated R skinemax sex?? that should be the argument... if se see actual penetration thats one thing.. but it dosent even look like he takes his pants off.. kids are having sex at like 13 and 14 anyway.. i think the whole murdering thing is way worse..i love how we think sex is so much worse than violence in this country...

MoP

Adam, no, there is full-on nudity... women without a stitch of clothing on.

Still though, I'd hope the case doesn't have a leg to stand on, since it's not accessible at all from the "unmodded" game, and you'd have to know what you were doing in order to install the mod to reveal these "removed elements", so it's entirely the user to blame, not Rockstar.