wait untill you try it to judge it , its probably going to be yet another free update so you can try it right away.
I have no idea if its going to be good or not, it looks very promising though.
just imagining being able to manually cleanup a zremesh straight inside of zbrush makes me kind of excited.
I`m sure it will be great for character attributes and modeling for bakingrelated purposes.
The way I see it, it doesn't hurt to have these box modeling tools available. If you don't like them, don't use them. Also remember they have two more days of summit, let them finish showing what they got coming up.
I agree, it's another tool that will come in useful and it doesn't hurt to have it. It looks great, however I'm a bit concerned about the little popup menu which looks crowded [even Joseph had to think while choosing the options at times].
I would prefer for Pixo to redo the layer system and some other messiness in the program but I won't complain if I don't have to go to Maya to model sth small...
The Keyshot deal sounds pretty good too and even though I do have a Vray licence I am tempted to hop on board.
I look forward to more stuff this weekend and to trying it myself.
i hawe an feeling that they wont unweal other features at this event ,they mentioned other features to be unweiled befor release so i think nomore features today . maybe im wrong.
Well, that was nice, but the UI looks like its bursting at the seams. Something like marking menus should be used instead of one huge menu with every applicable button showing at once.
The modelling stuff and explicitly 64 bit and any new features certainly feels like a 'beta' version of what's to come in Zbrush 5. Especially since Zbrush is prime for a next big leap. So I'd expect them to maaaaaybe come up with a new version in a year.
I doubt we'll see many changes to the UI this time around. It's common practice to jump to a new version number when giving your app a major facelift if for no other reason than to make distinguishing between the two easier. Also, most of these presentations are on workflows with the current product, so I can't imagine they'll be like, "Lets throw it all out the window!1!" (I'm learning a LOT more than I thought I would.)
Considering how widely ZBrush is used though, I wonder at what point does it warrant being its own little animal? Pretty much every app we use took it's own approach at one point or another. I'm not saying ZBrush's UI is perfect (I work on UI's for a living) but at the end of the day, it does what it does so well that maybe its unique approach is somewhat justified at this point.
edit: I do think there's more to come. I can't imagine they'd hold a summit filled with hour and a half long presentations, while only bringing half an hour's worth themselves.
The smug guy was all about modelling military items and real world printable items. But if you're doing anything near an engineering level of precision zbrush doesn't have very useful tools for that.
Do you really think a sculpting application is remotely intended for 'engineering levels of precision'? Drust has a heavy history with Tom Clancy games, it's not like he's designing working grenades for a defense contract. These are art tools designed to let artists block out and play with sub-d ready shapes quickly, which is a feature zbrush has lacked for a long time. It's a new step that can allow zbrush to tackle hard-surface shapes without having to rely on millions vertices to brute force a form into existence, while still maintaining the conceptive mindset that zbrush tends to focus on.
These complaints are childish. This update opens more options for the artist, some people are software nerds others are just as fast and resourceful with 2 to 3 apps. Is not going to affect your workflow so keep using your other apps, other folks would want to tackle most of the workload from start in zbrush. Simple don't like it don't use it. Not everyone has the same workflow and maybe others are looking for change.
Yuri's complaints are not in the slightest bit childish. Let me dumb it down for you:
Software companies have limited resources. If they spend significant man hours implementing features that other applications do much better/more efficiently rather than improving their core set of tools, this directly affects every user of the software. Time spent adding superfluous stuff means less time advancing tools that are the core of most peoples workflow.
You can argue how important poly modeling tools in zbrush are, but there is no valid counter for the fact that more time spent on traditional modeling tools means less time spent on other features.
Personally, until zBrush adopts something at least vaguely resembling a standard user interface (unlikely to ever happen), I have difficulty imagining a situation I would use it for poly/sub-d stuff over something like Modo. Though I do see the merit of adding such tools for people who want to use zbrush exclusively.
Yuri's complaints are not in the slightest bit childish. Let me dumb it down for you:
You can argue how important poly modeling tools in zbrush are, but there is no valid counter for the fact that more time spent on traditional modeling tools means less time spent on other features.
Personally, until zBrush adopts something at least vaguely resembling a standard user interface (unlikely to ever happen), I have difficulty imagining a situation I would use it for poly/sub-d stuff over something like Modo. Though I do see the merit of adding such tools for people who want to use zbrush exclusively.
I still find it pointless to complain, especially when they adding features. Keep in mind this is not the last update zbrush will ever have, whatever feature or fixes people are glamoring or hoping for might come. They are including more features for the artist, so is also an insult to say that man power was not resourceful just because other software provide the same features.
Like before, don't like them don't use them, others certainly will.
Yeah I don't really see the poly modeling tools to be too useful to me. I imagine most artists using zbrush will already have another modeling tool already that they are familiar with. Not to mention the major ones have some form of GoZ which makes it pretty painless to move back and forth for the most part.
While it's nice to see more tools it can also be worrying since their interface does have a bit of a problem with getting too busy as new features get added on and I would enjoy seeing whats already there get more polish.
These poly modelling tools might form the basis for more advanced tools... they might not be useful to everybody now, but the evolution of it might be something everyone can get on-board with (like Qmesher > Zremesher).
Also not everyone wants to obtain (read buy), learn or use other software, this isn't being lazy, it's expensive and time consuming for potentially the wrong reasons.
The speed at which they were able to do all sorts of annoying and complex ego edits already makes me want to give it a chance. But then again I haven't tried Modo yet. So maybe a lot of the features I'm drooling over can be found in there already? EQ can you shed any light on that? How easy is it to punch circles into Geo in Modo?
I still find it pointless to complain, especially when they adding features.
But somehow complaining about the complaining has more merit? Its perfectly acceptable to state an opinion on a piece of software that many people have a good deal of personal investment in. What is ridiculous is popping in and attacking someone for simply stating their opinion. Have some respect for others and make a counter point, don't simply insult them because you disagree with their opinion.
Keep in mind this is not the last update zbrush will ever have, whatever feature or fixes people are glamoring or hoping for might come.
Who said otherwise?
They are including more features for the artist, so is also an insult to say that man power was not resourceful just because other software provide the same features.
I simply pointed out that when effort is put into X feature, it necessarily can't be put into Y feature. This is basic mathematics. How important X vs Y feature is will of course be subjective.
Like before, don't like them don't use them, others certainly will.
In some ways I kind of wish the resources were spent else where on the package than poly tools. But at the same time I guess this gives them a foundation to create some cool tools out of that.
Software companies have limited resources. If they spend significant man hours implementing features that other applications do much better/more efficiently rather than improving their core set of tools, this directly affects every user of the software. Time spent adding superfluous stuff means less time advancing tools that are the core of most peoples workflow.
This.
Just think about how sooner we could have had 64-bit support if their programmers weren't busy adding poly modeling and animation tools.
I imagine the truth is that there's a huge non-professional or at least non-regular user base who only has Zbrush and is only interested in making pretty pictures in this one app. These features are meant to cater for that part of their customers and for people in the DCC industry.
On a code base that old, I doubt 64-bit support could have come any sooner. The code base is undoubtedly full of old cruft, and cleaning that up takes a lot of time no matter how many people you have on the team. Adding more programmers to the project wouldn't help much either, since they have to learn their way around the code base.
why are they doing this to me. It's awesome but I'm not sure why they're showing the same shit... kinda strange how they 'hint' at a bunch of stuff earlier saying they'll show it tomorrow, and then today is just the same thing as yesterday. Groundhog day again tomorrow perhaps? heheh, I'm just excited for more so I'm being impatient.
It's late here... I waited for another Pixology demo... and it's the same stuff... (at least for now). I'm going to bed. I want some sculpting awesomness :<
But somehow complaining about the complaining has more merit? Its perfectly acceptable to state an opinion on a piece of software that many people have a good deal of personal investment in. What is ridiculous is popping in and attacking someone for simply stating their opinion. Have some respect for others and make a counter point, don't simply insult them because you disagree with their opinion
Not once did I initiate an insult if you saw it that way, quite sensitive I must say(but really my apologies). I commented to hopefully stop a train of cries and complaints. Really how simple can it be, don't use it.
My bet and it was heading there already with zbrush; people that wanted new features were asking for more control and elusive hard surface modeling inside the tool. Crying about it is not going to change a thing, when clearly they have a vision some customers are not comprehending at the moment.
Some of those poly modelling tools look cool, being able to put those cylindrical holes in radial symmetry is impressive. Also rotating those extrusions around the cylinder was pretty badass.
I really don't like that Pixologic are adding new features to a software that could really use some ground base rework and basic features presented in any other graphical application like folders. Instead of box modeling tools I'd love to see folders, new UI and performance optimisations.
Also, will there be a proper Wireframe view mode for poly modeling? What about vertices selections? I can't imagine modeling anything proper without that.
I really don't like that Pixologic are adding new features to a software that could really use some ground base rework and basic features presented in any other graphical application like folders. Instead of box modeling tools I'd love to see folders, new UI and performance optimisations.
Also, will there be a proper Wireframe view mode for poly modeling? What about vertices selections? I can't imagine modeling anything proper without that.
I never expected any big UI updates to be implemented before a major release. I'm confident/hopeful we will get UI updates in zbrush 5.
The overarching trend I'm seeing is that they're trying increase their utility in areas outside of character art. (There's obviously some overlap though.) I doubt you could get CAD like precision, but in many cases you just need a piece of blocking geometry as a proportion guide to get started. If ZBrush wants to help me bang out base meshes AND lay in secondary elements faster, I'm not complaining.
I love the ui. I know it's a little strange compared to other programs but Everything is the way it is for a reason. I hope that don't change it up, except for if they are streamlining things. Folders, better layers etc would be amazing.
I should say that I hope they don't change it up just to make it more accessible at the cost of speed, which I don't imagine they will do. If they change it up because they legit think they have found a better and faster way to work with their tools, I'm all for it.
While the UI needs an update yes, the way Zbrush has it's UI is actually quite intelligent. It's not that Zbrush's UI is wrong or anything. It's just that ZBrush has it's own language for everything. Same way Autodesk has its own language for its tools/UI. So I think an overhaul isn't needed, but organization is welcomed and just to make it alot neater.
Low down is streamlined modeling tools, extruding, edgeloops, bridging..the whole shebang. A bridge to keyshot and a special keyshot deal for $250. Oh and the real topping on the cake... 64bit.
I'm actually pretty psyched about the poly modeling tools in ZB, at first I was thinking "Great....something that I can easily do in [Insert 3D app here], why bother?"
...but, it looks like the process is kept fairly streamlined and if you can do it all in one app, all the better
Best software for the artist, every time they show something new.
There is always feeling that if the feature or a bug are not urgent, it can be postponed.
But basically we love them for the alien system of decision-making. We always have alternative in the form of 3d coat or Mudbox.
ZBrush 5 wishlist: changes in the UI, camera with real perspective, improve retopology, improve uv, fbx, ptex, opensubdiv, fix bugs, etc...
By the way, Keyshot for 250$ will be the full HD version?
Another Pixologic demo starting in a few minutes, with a promise of 'showing features we haven't demoed already' at the end of the last presentation. Hopefully it's not just more tools in their new box modeling toolset.
Wether we get r7 or 5 its going to be good stuff and always getting better.
Sculptris comments were interesting and having the guy onboard who created sculptris must mean there is an interest there with ideas for development. Exciting stuff. Love the kermit giff. That says it all for me.
Pixologic guys stated that these are just a "sneak peek" of some of the features in the next release of 4R7. So I await in much excitement of what will come.
Replies
I have no idea if its going to be good or not, it looks very promising though.
just imagining being able to manually cleanup a zremesh straight inside of zbrush makes me kind of excited.
I`m sure it will be great for character attributes and modeling for bakingrelated purposes.
I would prefer for Pixo to redo the layer system and some other messiness in the program but I won't complain if I don't have to go to Maya to model sth small...
The Keyshot deal sounds pretty good too and even though I do have a Vray licence I am tempted to hop on board.
I look forward to more stuff this weekend and to trying it myself.
Considering how widely ZBrush is used though, I wonder at what point does it warrant being its own little animal? Pretty much every app we use took it's own approach at one point or another. I'm not saying ZBrush's UI is perfect (I work on UI's for a living) but at the end of the day, it does what it does so well that maybe its unique approach is somewhat justified at this point.
edit: I do think there's more to come. I can't imagine they'd hold a summit filled with hour and a half long presentations, while only bringing half an hour's worth themselves.
Yuri's complaints are not in the slightest bit childish. Let me dumb it down for you:
Software companies have limited resources. If they spend significant man hours implementing features that other applications do much better/more efficiently rather than improving their core set of tools, this directly affects every user of the software. Time spent adding superfluous stuff means less time advancing tools that are the core of most peoples workflow.
You can argue how important poly modeling tools in zbrush are, but there is no valid counter for the fact that more time spent on traditional modeling tools means less time spent on other features.
Personally, until zBrush adopts something at least vaguely resembling a standard user interface (unlikely to ever happen), I have difficulty imagining a situation I would use it for poly/sub-d stuff over something like Modo. Though I do see the merit of adding such tools for people who want to use zbrush exclusively.
I still find it pointless to complain, especially when they adding features. Keep in mind this is not the last update zbrush will ever have, whatever feature or fixes people are glamoring or hoping for might come. They are including more features for the artist, so is also an insult to say that man power was not resourceful just because other software provide the same features.
Like before, don't like them don't use them, others certainly will.
While it's nice to see more tools it can also be worrying since their interface does have a bit of a problem with getting too busy as new features get added on and I would enjoy seeing whats already there get more polish.
These poly modelling tools might form the basis for more advanced tools... they might not be useful to everybody now, but the evolution of it might be something everyone can get on-board with (like Qmesher > Zremesher).
Also not everyone wants to obtain (read buy), learn or use other software, this isn't being lazy, it's expensive and time consuming for potentially the wrong reasons.
But somehow complaining about the complaining has more merit? Its perfectly acceptable to state an opinion on a piece of software that many people have a good deal of personal investment in. What is ridiculous is popping in and attacking someone for simply stating their opinion. Have some respect for others and make a counter point, don't simply insult them because you disagree with their opinion.
Who said otherwise?
I simply pointed out that when effort is put into X feature, it necessarily can't be put into Y feature. This is basic mathematics. How important X vs Y feature is will of course be subjective.
Who has said anything contrary to this?
In some ways I kind of wish the resources were spent else where on the package than poly tools. But at the same time I guess this gives them a foundation to create some cool tools out of that.
This.
Just think about how sooner we could have had 64-bit support if their programmers weren't busy adding poly modeling and animation tools.
I imagine the truth is that there's a huge non-professional or at least non-regular user base who only has Zbrush and is only interested in making pretty pictures in this one app. These features are meant to cater for that part of their customers and for people in the DCC industry.
Not once did I initiate an insult if you saw it that way, quite sensitive I must say(but really my apologies). I commented to hopefully stop a train of cries and complaints. Really how simple can it be, don't use it.
My bet and it was heading there already with zbrush; people that wanted new features were asking for more control and elusive hard surface modeling inside the tool. Crying about it is not going to change a thing, when clearly they have a vision some customers are not comprehending at the moment.
Also, will there be a proper Wireframe view mode for poly modeling? What about vertices selections? I can't imagine modeling anything proper without that.
I never expected any big UI updates to be implemented before a major release. I'm confident/hopeful we will get UI updates in zbrush 5.
I should say that I hope they don't change it up just to make it more accessible at the cost of speed, which I don't imagine they will do. If they change it up because they legit think they have found a better and faster way to work with their tools, I'm all for it.
Can anyone give me the lowdown on what they added to ZBrush?
I cannot find anything feature wise about it on their site
day 1:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6v3714_DrCs
day2:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=btMLA4Z8WOE
Low down is streamlined modeling tools, extruding, edgeloops, bridging..the whole shebang. A bridge to keyshot and a special keyshot deal for $250. Oh and the real topping on the cake... 64bit.
...but, it looks like the process is kept fairly streamlined and if you can do it all in one app, all the better
There is always feeling that if the feature or a bug are not urgent, it can be postponed.
But basically we love them for the alien system of decision-making. We always have alternative in the form of 3d coat or Mudbox.
ZBrush 5 wishlist: changes in the UI, camera with real perspective, improve retopology, improve uv, fbx, ptex, opensubdiv, fix bugs, etc...
By the way, Keyshot for 250$ will be the full HD version?
Sculptris comments were interesting and having the guy onboard who created sculptris must mean there is an interest there with ideas for development. Exciting stuff. Love the kermit giff. That says it all for me.
The stroke repeating stuff is simple but super useful.
Surface noise improvements are nice too.