And what, when we get older we turn into nostalgia snobs and act like the man is shitting all over our childhood simply because he made a movie faithful to the reality of a franchise and not what our nostalgia thinks?
I'm fine with being called a Nostalgia snob, if that means not liking the direction he's taking this movie- especially his casting choices, Turtle concept, etc... *shrug*
And sure, there's some great TNMT fanart out there. How will that design animate beyond that one expression if it has to act in front of a camera for 90 minutes?
This is a very valid point, and something that I think isn't taken into consideration. It's the same thing with the first Transformers movie, they are trying to make a movie that will attract all audiences, and it looks like with the designs they went with, they are trying to have characters that can truly show emotion and personality, so I'm fine with a bit of a tweak.
Also, cmon, if you take any design in the history of TMNT, they'd look like Shrek without the masks. For me, the designs look like realistic takes on giant mutated turtles. Can't complain too much.
Having dubious source material is not a license for making a bad movie. The later Transformers movies were BAD movies. Plot structure, acting, humor, art direction, they failed on every conceivable level.
I am well aware that a lot of 80s animated properties haven't aged well. But basing a film on those properties doesn't free you up to make a movie of comparable quality or worse. I have seen episodes of the original Transformers cartoon that hold up better than Revenge of the Fallen. That is not an exaggeration.
And there's also the precedent set by other movies. We have seen good movies come out of nerd-stalgia properties. They made a good Spiderman film. They made a whole slew of good Marvel films. The first TMNT live-action film was solid, and actually holds up quite well. Hell, even the Masters of the Universe movie is more entertaining than the second and third Transformers films.
Spending hundreds of millions of dollars to make a bad movie is not something we should praise or defend.
I did read an interview today (I think with the director?) where he talked about the main concept of the Turtles is the brotherhood and how that is the real core of it all. Obviously this is just a teaser, so who knows if they got it right, but if so then the movie could have some heart.
Also, can I nerd out about how much I like the Imagi Studios TMNT movie? It's like Pixar made a Turtles movie, and I thought a full 3d animated film was perfect for the franchise.
From watching the trailer I've gone from totally indifferent to morbidly intrigued.
Shame, though - I think the new CG series is one of the best incarnations yet; for a kid's show it's got some witty, well paced scripts, decent acting, character development, and action scenes, and they finally feel like teenagers growing up together for the first time, with Splinter wavering between bad-ass sensei and rambling over-protective fathering.
This, on the other hand, seems like it'll be firmly in meat-fellow territory.
Still, I'll probably sit through it anyways, like the big sucker that I am, in the hope that it's something more than just the usual ILM disintegrating buildings whilst lens flares reflect off of Megan Fox's inappropriately always-in-shot leather clad bum cheeks, except this time interspersed with slurred outdated pop-culture catchphrases rattling out of Mikey's grotesquely fleshy lips in a weak attempt to nod to the older fans in the cinema.
why do people keep saying Micheal Bay's name? he is just the producer of the film, he did not write or direct this film. Also the original creators Kevin Eastman &
Peter Laird helped write this, you should blame them for not staying true to their original material.
I wouldn't be mad as long as they didn't break the core recognizable features for April O'Neil or just completely make ninja turtle faces unlikable and they look like ogres so what's up with that, it's borderline uncanny valley how it's animated too with this unfitting voice. The trailer also feels like a parody of itself.
In my opinion the business was necessary to sell the scale and the transformations. There's still a LOT of cheating behind the scenes, but the level of detail makes it near impossible to notice it; then again, none of the robot forms have any of the windscreens or the interiors like seats and dashboards visible...
But the shilouettes are strong and identifiable, and I also liked the less humanoid shapes used for the decepticons, the integrated weapons.
I'd say most of the problems were the human point of view for the camera work in the first movie - once they've pulled back a little, the action was a lot easier to follow. Prime's fight in the forest in the second movie was an exceptional piece of animation work in particular.
For me the busyness that bothered me about the model/design was more along the lines of how they used color. A painter could probably articulate this much better than I'd be able to, but I'll give it a shot using their color theory.
Our eyes tend to gloss over complementary colors with ease, until they hit a point where the colors clash.
Some, if not most painters/texture artists use this as a means to grab our attention and direct our eyes to a specific or the most important part of the model.
With Optimus Prime as a perfect example, they splattered Blues and Reds all over the model creating a distracting or busy appearance to me .. is all.
Comparing the two, it's easy to see which one Reads better.
I do agree with ya that they did do a good job with the silhouettes though. Along with scaling the detail within the model to appear believable while doing all the necessary transformations on-screen.
why do people keep saying Micheal Bay's name? he is just the producer of the film, he did not write or direct this film. Also the original creators Kevin Eastman &
Peter Laird helped write this, you should blame them for not staying true to their original material.
No. Only Kevin. AFAIK Eastman left the Turtles behind after he sold the IP to Nick. How much Kevin wrote of it and what was rewritten by ghost writers we will never know unless Kevin spills the beans.
Having MB as your producer pretty much forces you to have baysplosions. Which cmon, the trailer had.
I'm sorry, but you can hardly go by what the "critics" at Rotten Tomatoes say. Bottom line who's to say a movie that has a 36% is worst than a movie that has a 90%? No one, but you in the end.
And it makes it so, because they're never wrong...blind faith.
Rotten Tomatoes also lets the community have a voice. If you take in the average critics rating versus what the general audience gave a film, you usually get a pretty good idea of it's quality. Examples:
The Pianist (2002)
Critics.........96%
Audience.....96%
American Hustle (2013)
Critics.........93%
Audience.....77%
Lock, Stock and Two Smoking Barrels (1999)
Critics.........76%
Audience.....94%
Looks dumb as hell. I won't watch it, but I know it will still put butts in seats and make a squajillion dollars because people like to watch shiny garbage explode loudly on huge screens.
Haha. This post was great, pretty much sums up anything I could have said.
I'll probably rent it waaay down the line as a joke film.
The Transformers designs are objectively bad. An incoherent mess of tiny, shiny parts that are hard to read in a still and pretty much entirely abstract when they start to move around. It's interesting to not that they've gone back and fixed updated the designs on the upcoming movie, even on some of the transformers from the previous films. Many now have larger, cleaner components that can actually be read. I still wouldn't exactly call them good, but its a step forward.
As for the Ninja Turtles, I don't mind the designs myself, but I don't have any investment in the property. . I'm fairly confident that the rest of the movie will be awful, but I think the character design could have been a hell of a lot worse than what they went with.
And it makes it so, because they're never wrong...blind faith.
I have watched quite a few of Michael Bay's movies. Both the ones he produced and the ones he directed. They are generally bad films. A few of them manage to be bad and entertaining at the same time. And some of them rise to the level of mediocre. And one or two of them are so bad that they wrap back around into being entertaining just because you can't wait to see what ridiculous thing happens next. (I'm looking at you, Bad Boys II)
I've experienced quite a few of these films myself. It's not a matter of blind faith or relying on critics. I saw Revenge of the Fallen before I ever read a single review. When I walked out of the theater after the film I felt personally insulted. Normally I'm able to get a little bit of a contact high from seeing even bad films in the theater. I will feel more favorably toward a film until I've had a chance to think about what I saw. The second Transformers movie was so bad that it's awfulness could not be concealed or compensated for. The flash and spectacle was inadequate for covering up its shortcomings, even while I was in the process of watching it.
I never understand Bay-pologists. The man makes films of a certain style that tend to be terrible. Every so often he manages to make one that is both terrible and entertaining. But that doesn't excuse his lack of craft. At least he wasn't responsible for Green Lantern. That film was so bad it made Michael Bay look good.
The Turtles film could be good. But past experience in the production company does not inspire confidence. And Revenge of the Fallen proved to me that ILM can't make a film worthwhile all on their own.
Let's be real, if a movie rates low on RT and IMDB, that's a pretty big indicator and it's usually right 98% of the time. The only film I can think of that breaks that trend is Skyfall, which I thought was a banal homework assignment of a film.
The director of this did Battlefield LA? Wow that was a bad flick. I actually hope Bay is more involved in that case.
I don't get the fun in watching mediocre bad movies. If you're going to watch a bad movie make sure it's over the top insanity:
[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1qw_g2qG38s"]THE VISITOR Trailer - 1979' Sci-Fi Horror Movie [HD] - YouTube[/ame]
My brother mentioned this to me last night. What if the turtles in this movie are mutated people? Similar to Bebop and Rocksteady's origin in the cartoon. Hmm.
Ugh…Mikey looks so creepy….Leo looks a bit better, and from some screen leaks i've seen it looks like each turtle looks a bit different and hopefully Raph and Donny look more turtle-y.
But if Shredder looks badass then I might be more excited but the turtle's designs are ruining it for me. Why can't they have the hint of a beak instead full human lips?
Guy at work today claims the problem is the turtles don't look photoreal. Umm.
Yeah, that is NOT the issue. Umm indeed.
With this particular visual interpretation we're dealing with two major problems. The first is the well-known uncanny valley. They're approaching close to realism without actually reaching it. The disconnect causes a subconscious reaction, usually interpreted as a creepy or unsettling feeling.
Then there's the issue of making the turtles look more human than ever before. The closer you get to something looking human, without actually being human, the weirder and more grotesque it appears. You see this in films like Splice. This creates a disturbing impression that the audience reacts to. In Splice this reaction was intentional. In the upcoming turtles film one would hope that they want the audience to sympathize with the protagonists.
The one positive point I saw in this teaser trailer was the joke at the end. It was not the kind of humor I would normally expect from a Platinum-Dunes produced film. Hopefully future trailers will evidence more of this brand of writing and interaction.
I saw Revenge of the Fallen before I ever read a single review. When I walked out of the theater after the film I felt personally insulted. Normally I'm able to get a little bit of a contact high from seeing even bad films in the theater. I will feel more favorably toward a film until I've had a chance to think about what I saw. The second Transformers movie was so bad that it's awfulness could not be concealed or compensated for. The flash and spectacle was inadequate for covering up its shortcomings, even while I was in the process of watching it.
A big part of the reason why these movies and other similar rubbish continue to get made is because people keep going to see them, even though they know beyond a shadow of a doubt that they are going to be terrible. Vote with your wallet, folks. If you don't like something then don't give it your money.
As someone who really loved the turtles when I was younger, I actually really dig this version and cant for the life of me understand the hate its getting here.
Michael Bay has been part of many movies I had a lot of fun wathing. Not epic movies with great plot, but fun and entertaining popcorn blockbusters.
I expect this to follow that path.
But really guys.. The very original Turtles, the ones in the comics look very similar (with out the lips) to what this movie has.
The cartoon turtles are much further from the original designs than these.
Plus the cartoon turtles just look down right childish, its high time for a facelift.
As for April´s jumpsuit. Thank god they got rid of that, but kept the yellow by having her wear a yellow jacket.
I mean what TV station in a large city would allow a news reporter to come on air in a friggin jumpsuit, and why the hell was she wearing a jumpsuit anyway, other than the fact that is was easy to draw and color!
I like it. cant wait to see it, and I´m sure it will be shallower than a pond made of the spit the nostalgia-boys are releasing in Bay´s general direction. but it will more than likely be FUN!
Oh and aimed at kids age 8-14 like the previous ones I suspect.
But to someone how said the original Turtles live action held up through time.. dude.. seriously? It is downright awfull to watch today.
Even Transformers 3 from Bay was better than that crap :P
Michael Bay has been part of many movies I had a lot of fun wathing.
See what's its done to your ability to spell? jk!jk!
But really guys.. The very original Turtles, the ones in the comics look very similar (with out the lips) to what this movie has.
Wrong. Proof:
The original turtles limbs were very enlarged. The new CG cartoon, and the last CG movie have been the closest.
Plus the cartoon turtles just look down right childish, its high time for a facelift.
There is childish, and then there is going to other extreme to be almost scary. (BTW your Scary turtle, is Slash, a Snapping Turtle.)
If your after "realism", I suggest this version. Which I can see some influence from in the movie design. Unfortunately it wont have the metaphysical/philosophical plot this short story had.
Michael Zulli's
As for April´s jumpsuit.
No opinion. April from the comic was totally different. She was an intern with Baxter Stockman and not a redhead.
I like it. cant wait to see it, and I´m sure it will be shallower than a pond made of the spit the nostalgia-boys are releasing in Bay´s general direction. but it will more than likely be FUN!
You sir, contribute to Bay still having access to Hollywood.
Oh and aimed at kids age 8-14 like the previous ones I suspect.
The last one was fun (even accounting for the weak unrelated plot). It still had heart, and April wasn't a victim. Anyhow, this one your basically rehashing what we have said. It's meant for tweens. On top of that your still off, as its not kids, its simply for societal norm "boys".
But to someone how said the original Turtles live action held up through time.. dude.. seriously? It is downright awfull to watch today.
Even Transformers 3 from Bay was better than that crap :P
It's heart has held up. Heart. Don't mix that up with CG (or honestly acting).
Moviebob is not exactly the end-all-be-all of film reviews. But his video appraisal confirms most of what I suspected would be wrong with this film. I won't be watching this iteration, and I would encourage everyone else to follow my example. I'll take the parents to go see Guardians of the Galaxy this weekend instead.
The last thing I wanted to see was the Dude-Bro Turtles, but it seems that's what we're getting. You know who to turn to when you're trying to appeal to the drunken frat demographic. If you need a Turtles fix this weekend, just watch the currently running animated series. It's great.
I think the internet just lets people that hate michael bay be more vocal.
His total box office gross is over 2 billion dollars. Not saying that makes the movies good, but if you were going only by what you read online you would think the entire world hates him.
Box Office Mojo suggest the Bay name is losing it's appeal: "The franchise-low domestic numbers for the latest Transformers movie suggest that the Bay connection isn't as much of a draw as it once was. "
Saw it yesterday, it's not even bad enough to be entertaining. Plenty of nice shots of Orange Crush and Windows 8.1 though.
I guess Michael Bay didn't direct either? IMDB lists someone else. Half the time I found myself staring at random background elements and bad texel density instead of trying to pay attention to anything going on. Say what you will about Michael Bay but the man knows how to shoot action scenes that are entertaining. Feels like they found some guy out back of the lot to direct and he tried to make it look like transformers.
Also there's a joke about turtle boners so that was probably straight from Bay.
As a HUGE turtles fan and hater of Megan Fox, this movie was even worse than I could have imagined.
There are absurd plot holes, horrible horrible B rate acting.. Its just bad, forgettable and bad. Please, for the love of God, if people go in droves to watch this and they greenlight a sequel, no one will go for that one and the turtles franchise may very well suffer because of it
Replies
I'm fine with being called a Nostalgia snob, if that means not liking the direction he's taking this movie- especially his casting choices, Turtle concept, etc... *shrug*
This is a very valid point, and something that I think isn't taken into consideration. It's the same thing with the first Transformers movie, they are trying to make a movie that will attract all audiences, and it looks like with the designs they went with, they are trying to have characters that can truly show emotion and personality, so I'm fine with a bit of a tweak.
Also, cmon, if you take any design in the history of TMNT, they'd look like Shrek without the masks. For me, the designs look like realistic takes on giant mutated turtles. Can't complain too much.
I am well aware that a lot of 80s animated properties haven't aged well. But basing a film on those properties doesn't free you up to make a movie of comparable quality or worse. I have seen episodes of the original Transformers cartoon that hold up better than Revenge of the Fallen. That is not an exaggeration.
And there's also the precedent set by other movies. We have seen good movies come out of nerd-stalgia properties. They made a good Spiderman film. They made a whole slew of good Marvel films. The first TMNT live-action film was solid, and actually holds up quite well. Hell, even the Masters of the Universe movie is more entertaining than the second and third Transformers films.
Spending hundreds of millions of dollars to make a bad movie is not something we should praise or defend.
Also, can I nerd out about how much I like the Imagi Studios TMNT movie? It's like Pixar made a Turtles movie, and I thought a full 3d animated film was perfect for the franchise.
Shame, though - I think the new CG series is one of the best incarnations yet; for a kid's show it's got some witty, well paced scripts, decent acting, character development, and action scenes, and they finally feel like teenagers growing up together for the first time, with Splinter wavering between bad-ass sensei and rambling over-protective fathering.
This, on the other hand, seems like it'll be firmly in meat-fellow territory.
Still, I'll probably sit through it anyways, like the big sucker that I am, in the hope that it's something more than just the usual ILM disintegrating buildings whilst lens flares reflect off of Megan Fox's inappropriately always-in-shot leather clad bum cheeks, except this time interspersed with slurred outdated pop-culture catchphrases rattling out of Mikey's grotesquely fleshy lips in a weak attempt to nod to the older fans in the cinema.
There's always hope.
I liked some more than others, but I never hated them like some folks. And I'm a huge fan of the originals as well.
Which can be distracting to the eye during motion.
Peter Laird helped write this, you should blame them for not staying true to their original material.
But the shilouettes are strong and identifiable, and I also liked the less humanoid shapes used for the decepticons, the integrated weapons.
I'd say most of the problems were the human point of view for the camera work in the first movie - once they've pulled back a little, the action was a lot easier to follow. Prime's fight in the forest in the second movie was an exceptional piece of animation work in particular.
Our eyes tend to gloss over complementary colors with ease, until they hit a point where the colors clash.
Some, if not most painters/texture artists use this as a means to grab our attention and direct our eyes to a specific or the most important part of the model.
With Optimus Prime as a perfect example, they splattered Blues and Reds all over the model creating a distracting or busy appearance to me .. is all.
Comparing the two, it's easy to see which one Reads better.
I do agree with ya that they did do a good job with the silhouettes though. Along with scaling the detail within the model to appear believable while doing all the necessary transformations on-screen.
No. Only Kevin. AFAIK Eastman left the Turtles behind after he sold the IP to Nick. How much Kevin wrote of it and what was rewritten by ghost writers we will never know unless Kevin spills the beans.
Having MB as your producer pretty much forces you to have baysplosions. Which cmon, the trailer had.
[ame]www.youtube.com/watch?v=GFLGRidfFo4[/ame]
I'm sorry, but you can hardly go by what the "critics" at Rotten Tomatoes say. Bottom line who's to say a movie that has a 36% is worst than a movie that has a 90%? No one, but you in the end.
And it makes it so, because they're never wrong...blind faith.
Rotten Tomatoes also lets the community have a voice. If you take in the average critics rating versus what the general audience gave a film, you usually get a pretty good idea of it's quality. Examples:
The Pianist (2002)
Critics.........96%
Audience.....96%
American Hustle (2013)
Critics.........93%
Audience.....77%
Lock, Stock and Two Smoking Barrels (1999)
Critics.........76%
Audience.....94%
Haha. This post was great, pretty much sums up anything I could have said.
I'll probably rent it waaay down the line as a joke film.
As for the Ninja Turtles, I don't mind the designs myself, but I don't have any investment in the property. . I'm fairly confident that the rest of the movie will be awful, but I think the character design could have been a hell of a lot worse than what they went with.
IGN posted an analysis of the trailer that should give you folks some more to fret over.
http://www.tele-management.ca/2014/03/video-teenage-mutant-ninja-turtles-trailer-1-ign-rewind-theater-2/
Personally, I'm saving up my nerd outrage for the He-Man movie
I have watched quite a few of Michael Bay's movies. Both the ones he produced and the ones he directed. They are generally bad films. A few of them manage to be bad and entertaining at the same time. And some of them rise to the level of mediocre. And one or two of them are so bad that they wrap back around into being entertaining just because you can't wait to see what ridiculous thing happens next. (I'm looking at you, Bad Boys II)
I've experienced quite a few of these films myself. It's not a matter of blind faith or relying on critics. I saw Revenge of the Fallen before I ever read a single review. When I walked out of the theater after the film I felt personally insulted. Normally I'm able to get a little bit of a contact high from seeing even bad films in the theater. I will feel more favorably toward a film until I've had a chance to think about what I saw. The second Transformers movie was so bad that it's awfulness could not be concealed or compensated for. The flash and spectacle was inadequate for covering up its shortcomings, even while I was in the process of watching it.
I never understand Bay-pologists. The man makes films of a certain style that tend to be terrible. Every so often he manages to make one that is both terrible and entertaining. But that doesn't excuse his lack of craft. At least he wasn't responsible for Green Lantern. That film was so bad it made Michael Bay look good.
The Turtles film could be good. But past experience in the production company does not inspire confidence. And Revenge of the Fallen proved to me that ILM can't make a film worthwhile all on their own.
The director of this did Battlefield LA? Wow that was a bad flick. I actually hope Bay is more involved in that case.
[ame="
But if Shredder looks badass then I might be more excited but the turtle's designs are ruining it for me. Why can't they have the hint of a beak instead full human lips?
Yeah, that is NOT the issue. Umm indeed.
With this particular visual interpretation we're dealing with two major problems. The first is the well-known uncanny valley. They're approaching close to realism without actually reaching it. The disconnect causes a subconscious reaction, usually interpreted as a creepy or unsettling feeling.
Then there's the issue of making the turtles look more human than ever before. The closer you get to something looking human, without actually being human, the weirder and more grotesque it appears. You see this in films like Splice. This creates a disturbing impression that the audience reacts to. In Splice this reaction was intentional. In the upcoming turtles film one would hope that they want the audience to sympathize with the protagonists.
The one positive point I saw in this teaser trailer was the joke at the end. It was not the kind of humor I would normally expect from a Platinum-Dunes produced film. Hopefully future trailers will evidence more of this brand of writing and interaction.
I will refuse to let anyone tell me the rock is a bad movie. Greatest movie of our generation.
fuck yeah bro.
the main theme even got used in a Children of Bodom track
[ame="
Michael Bay has been part of many movies I had a lot of fun wathing. Not epic movies with great plot, but fun and entertaining popcorn blockbusters.
I expect this to follow that path.
But really guys.. The very original Turtles, the ones in the comics look very similar (with out the lips) to what this movie has.
The cartoon turtles are much further from the original designs than these.
Plus the cartoon turtles just look down right childish, its high time for a facelift.
As for April´s jumpsuit. Thank god they got rid of that, but kept the yellow by having her wear a yellow jacket.
I mean what TV station in a large city would allow a news reporter to come on air in a friggin jumpsuit, and why the hell was she wearing a jumpsuit anyway, other than the fact that is was easy to draw and color!
I like it. cant wait to see it, and I´m sure it will be shallower than a pond made of the spit the nostalgia-boys are releasing in Bay´s general direction. but it will more than likely be FUN!
Oh and aimed at kids age 8-14 like the previous ones I suspect.
But to someone how said the original Turtles live action held up through time.. dude.. seriously? It is downright awfull to watch today.
Even Transformers 3 from Bay was better than that crap :P
See what's its done to your ability to spell? jk!jk!
Wrong. Proof:
The original turtles limbs were very enlarged. The new CG cartoon, and the last CG movie have been the closest.
There is childish, and then there is going to other extreme to be almost scary. (BTW your Scary turtle, is Slash, a Snapping Turtle.)
If your after "realism", I suggest this version. Which I can see some influence from in the movie design. Unfortunately it wont have the metaphysical/philosophical plot this short story had.
Michael Zulli's
Escape to the Movies: Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles
Moviebob is not exactly the end-all-be-all of film reviews. But his video appraisal confirms most of what I suspected would be wrong with this film. I won't be watching this iteration, and I would encourage everyone else to follow my example. I'll take the parents to go see Guardians of the Galaxy this weekend instead.
The last thing I wanted to see was the Dude-Bro Turtles, but it seems that's what we're getting. You know who to turn to when you're trying to appeal to the drunken frat demographic. If you need a Turtles fix this weekend, just watch the currently running animated series. It's great.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pOXS6f77Sek
Then my brother got a pencil and paper RPG book, and that was really interesting. Never found many people to play it with though.
I'm closed minded if I don't waste $10.50 and 90 minutes of my life on a movie who's trailers make me groan and is getting panned by critics?
His total box office gross is over 2 billion dollars. Not saying that makes the movies good, but if you were going only by what you read online you would think the entire world hates him.
Losing his appeal in his home market at least, makes me proud to be an American!
I guess Michael Bay didn't direct either? IMDB lists someone else. Half the time I found myself staring at random background elements and bad texel density instead of trying to pay attention to anything going on. Say what you will about Michael Bay but the man knows how to shoot action scenes that are entertaining. Feels like they found some guy out back of the lot to direct and he tried to make it look like transformers.
Also there's a joke about turtle boners so that was probably straight from Bay.
There are absurd plot holes, horrible horrible B rate acting.. Its just bad, forgettable and bad. Please, for the love of God, if people go in droves to watch this and they greenlight a sequel, no one will go for that one and the turtles franchise may very well suffer because of it