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Critique on my artwork

axer
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axer node


Hello, this is my first ever render done in Maya 2020 (Vray renderer). I've applied just smart materials, there are 3 separate texture sets. My first question is, can this render be enough of a quality to be published on Artstation, and to send as a portfolio for a studio i want to apply. Also, i am aware that the materials are too basic, and that i need to work on them, bear in mind i just wanted to finish the render. 

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  • teodar23
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    teodar23 sublime tool
    *Trying to not sound sarcastic here*
    You can post it and send it anywhere but the quality is not there. Maybe, if its an indie studio that does low poly minimalist art then you might have a chance. But its just one asset. Its better to have a portfolio with a few assets.
    You seem to be aware of the low quality of the materials but still you think that it might catch some eyes...
    The modeling is passable if you want to use this in a top-down or isometric game where the camera is far away from the model.
    I strongly suggest looking at some tutorials (ex chamferzone's gun tut) before even considering applying for a job.
  • axer
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    axer node
    Yes, im fully aware that its shitty looking, as i said, this is just my render practice, the goal was to achieve a render using Vray, thats why i added only the smart materials. Now i can focus more on adding additional details on every part.
  • Zi0
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    Zi0 polycounter
    axer said:

    can this render be enough of a quality to be published on Artstation, and to send as a portfolio for a studio i want to apply.
    I would say that its not, what is the purpose of this model?
  • axer
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    axer node
    The purpose was to achieve my first ever render using Vray. I will redo the textures for the ak, and add additional details, and will post my progress here.
  • Kanni3d
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    Kanni3d ngon master
    I guess a piece of advice that would be a drop in the bucket here is to not render your assets with offline rendering (vray, iray, arnold, cycles, etc). Doesn't give an accurate representation and visualization of how your asset would look in a realtime renderer/game engine.
  • sacboi
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    sacboi high dynamic range
    axer said:
    The purpose was to achieve my first ever render using Vray. I will redo the textures for the ak, and add additional details, and will post my progress here.
    Intrigued!...I'll keep an eye out.
  • axer
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    axer node
    Kanni3d, thanx a lot man! The thought to do my renders real time never crossed my mind up until now. I will do that for sure!!
    Sacboi, thanks for the support, im finishing up another model, and once im done with that one, im picking up where i left off with the AK! 


  • axer
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    axer node


    Sooooo... here is the newest project i've done. It's an Mycenae Armor circa 1400 BC. I've stylized it a 'lil bit', but pretty much its historicaly accurate. Whatcha think bout dis son?
  • Lether
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    Lether polycounter lvl 8
    Hey :)
    Nice one !
    I found some adjustement to do by the way !
    It strongly depends on the platform you want to use. If it for VFX or CGI I would say you have to increase the level of detail in the geometry of your asset. You have an angular aspect (without joking with the dev framework :p ). For both of plateform (realtime or VFX) you might increase the resolution but follow the guidelines of optimization for realtime (unless you are working on mobile or top view game)
    Be carreful with your normals, it seems to be artefacts on the leggings because of the lack of geometry (sorry if it isn't the accurate word).
    Your material is good but I feel it have to be enhanced (AO, dirt, roughness, ...). A think comes to my mind : try using another envi map for the reflections and avoid this dark background (blurred background?) ;)
    More generally try to pay attention to the presentation of your work. It has a far more psychological influence than you think on the viewer's mind ;)
    Good work :)
  • axer
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    axer node
    Thank you so much for the reply! :)
    Im relatively new to SP, so for new i've just added smart materials, some alphas, paint here and there, to add a lil bit of style. I do agree that the geometry needs to be better, on some parts you could still see cubes. Today im gonna add a new light, add some geometry try to render it alongside a HDRI Image.
  • axer
  • axer
  • axer
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    axer node

    Modelling done in Maya, textured in Substance Painter, rendered in Arnold. Pls post ur critics. Any feedback is much appreciated!
  • hwaminjung
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    hwaminjung polycounter lvl 2
    I think you are improving at a rapid pace, which is pretty cool to see. There are little details that bring your final presentation down, which I think you should keep in mind.

    from the top to bottom in the image. the pattern on the arms goes in a different direction to the cloth, which does feel really strange. The chainmail on the body seems to be missing some texture maps? The normals information seems to be missing, or in the very least it looks a lot different to the chainmail on the shoulder/neck region. The shadows are also acting very strangely, I am not sure if this is just a quirk of the renderer you are using, but its drawing my focus in a bad way. Finally the seams on the bottom also feel "amateur" and would not be good in a portfolio setting.
    I would suggest for your next project, keep the scope low, but the quality really high. Some objects that come to mind is a knife, sword, pump action shotgun, fire hydrant etc.
  • axer
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    axer node
    Hahaha thanks for the improvement part!!! Means a LOT!
    For the chainmail, im not entirely sure whats wrong. When i applied the chainmail texture, and set up the parameters, it looked fine, but when i put my materials up in hypershade, something is always missing. I thought it was the Height map, which i did include, but nothing changed, it still looks 'weird'.
    Ye, i agree 100%. My scale of projects is a bit big. I like to do big stuff immediately, which kinda slows me down. For my next project i am definitely gonna do something more simple. Thank you so much for a reply <3
  • axer
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    axer node



    LP model of a Hoplite. The C. mesh is not mine, its from Zbrush library. 
  • axer
  • axer
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    axer node

    Autodesk Maya, Substance Painter, Arnold
  • axer
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    axer node

    Modelling done in Maya, textures in Substance Painter, render in Arnold
  • axer
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    axer node


    I want to achieve renders like this stock photo. But all of my renders always look like they are made of clay for ex. and not steel or iron. Am i making errors in Arnold settings, or do i need to work more on my textures. Or maybe both?

    Any feedback is much appreciated!
  • axer
  • Kanni3d
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    Kanni3d ngon master
    How does it look in painter? If it looks like something completely different, then it's obviously a render/arnold issue.
  • axer
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    axer node
    In painter it looks good. Mhm, ok, il work on the render then. Tnx for reply!!
  • sacboi
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    sacboi high dynamic range
    Can you post a screencap of the SP result and your maps, because the output in Arnold seems very flat i.e. metalness, specular highlights or roughness are imo not apparent?

    Also I'd advise, taking another look at your export settings as well.
  • axer
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    axer node


    I've done this one using UDIMs. And also here are two renders from SP. I didnt include the height map in hypershade(Maya), maybe thats causin the issue here?
  • chien
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    chien polycounter lvl 13
    hello, this is my first ever render done in Maya 2020 (Vray renderer). I've applied just smart materials, 
    the models looks fine, i guess i would only mention that dont think too much on render with v-ray if you want this to be game art, you could put it in the engine and work on the asset in there, hope that helps
  • axer
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    axer node
    So i've decided to try a different approach to my models. Here is my latest project. I've done the HP, now im thinkin my next step should be to make the LP version. Or if im gonna just put this on my Artstation, do the textures on the HP?

    Any feedback/critique is much obliged!
  • teodar23
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    teodar23 sublime tool
    I think you need to look at reference pics from different angles. Just to point one of the many issues, the buttstoc is much more smooth almost oval in profile.
  • axer
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    axer node
    Yep, i am definitely gonna redo the buttstock. What is ur op on the rest?
  • lluc21
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    lluc21 polycounter lvl 5
    Take better care of the topology. Even if it is a High Poly model you should avoid loops that don't add anything to the model, as it only makes your life more complicated. 
    Generally you should avoid all those vertical lines as most of them are unnecessary. 
    I'd suggest you to start with something simpler so that you can really get comfortable with topology.
  • axer
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    axer node
    I agree 100%, but for some parts, without the geometry, the mesh falls apart, especially the curved parts in the middle.



    Dunno, maybe im just doing it wrong, but all of this u see here, can not hold without these loops.
  • Zi0
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    Zi0 polycounter
    The proportions seem to be off on a lot of things and the shape of the stock is not defined yet. Before you even start adding edgeloops you should define the shapes in your blockout. Other than that I would say that subDs are kind of outdated, I would suggest looking at a fusion or zbrush workflow tutorial

    https://www.artstation.com/marketplace/p/XGGA/handgun-for-video-games-tutorial-complete-edition
    https://www.artstation.com/artwork/9mKmzL


  • sacboi
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    sacboi high dynamic range
    Firstly, slap yourself upside the head =)

    Secondly, I strongly recommend reading this article which pretty much illustrates a brief outline via eight chapters worth of content.
    Not only limited too both pre / post production but also essential insight into each pipeline task that will definitely prove useful regardless of an intended goal, whether off-line or realtime output because preceding years has seen continued tech/workflow development, thus enabling increasing interpolation between the two.


    Thirdly, without overlapping previous advice already shared by others, I'll just reiterate feedback somebody once gave me when first starting out - "Before anything else, learn the fundamentals" 

    Edit:
    Referring to an earlier post, why so many udim tiles for such a simple model? plus other obvious issues needing improvement are lighting and material generation, as well.
  • axer
  • axer
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    axer node
    So i've come a long way in this amazing journey of 3D. I've read all of the advice that u great people put here, and i can't thank you enough. When i finished this one, i almost cried, and im not even joking, considering the fact how much all of this means to me, it's not just a job. But anyways, from the last post i've reduced the polycount considerably on my HP, from there i used quad draw, and got a pretty low enough PL. Also i reduced the number of UDIMs from 13 to 3 xD. Yea i know...


  • axer
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    axer node
    @sacboi I will most certainly implement the advice you and the rest gave me. On the next project i will do my best to follow the guideline from the post you have shared. And i think for the next project im not gonna go rambo style again, but i will do something a bit easier. Cheers!
  • sacboi
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    sacboi high dynamic range
    Much better :+1:

    Glad, our collective guidance was helpful plus as you progress with each project, unique challenges will tend too crop up but that's really how we learn - 'by doing and making mistakes'

    Anyway welcome to the club, enjoy the ride  B)
  • axer
  • ImsumDave
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    ImsumDave polycounter lvl 11
    You've made a lot of progress in just two months time, good work! 

    To parrot what others have said, I think the proportions feel off, specifically with the previous gun you created. What kind of references did you have when creating it? Did you seek out technical diagrams with measurements to check your proportions, or just eye-ball it using image references?

    The katana proportions don't seem too out of whack. The handle might be a bit thin and the guard should maybe be more like a circle than an ellipse, but other than that I think it's good.

    Specifically with the katana, I think the lighting is hurting the presentation quite a bit. Are you primarily relying on an hdri environment map for lighting? If so, I would suggest reducing it's effect, using it as fill, and use other lights to showcase the material definition of your textures better. The handle feels quite flat, all the metals seem unblemished. The sheath has some nice wear to it, but I'm not sure it's true to a real katana: it looks like rubber to me, which I don't think it should.

    It might be useful to simplify things before jumping into creating more complex objects. Try to nail the high poly, low poly, proportions, materials, and rendering of a super simple item, like a shotgun shell maybe (just a suggestion).
  • axer
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    axer node
    @ImsumDave
    Thanks! For the rifle i followed the side view, and some photos of the parts, pretty much got them right but not thickness also, my parts are way thicker than they should be, i corrected that and the rifle feels a lot better to the eye. I noticed that issue when i just tried to put the bullets inside the magazine, and the rifle was atleast 3 times thicker than the bullets, where in reality its maybe 5cm on both sides. LOL

    For the katana i used Vray sky, adjusted the strength and got this. I will get back to both projects a bit later, next i will try something super simple next for sure.
  • axer
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    axer node


    So i took up the advice, and made a shotgun shell. And now i truly know how my lighting sucks!!
  • ImsumDave
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    ImsumDave polycounter lvl 11
    Are you still using vray, or have you switched to realtime renderer? I have no experience with what your options are for modern realtime rendering in maya. Downloading blender and using it solely to render with EEVEE if necessary is always an option, and it's free.

    As for the shotgun shell, I'm not sure what your references you are using, after all not all shells are the same, but in my opinion it's lacking some details that contribute to realism. The materials need some work as well. The red area is very flat, and the overall roughness is wrong. The brass area has some wear, but it is too regular, in my opinion. I think it should vary more. I happen to have a shotgun shell, so I can show some things that might be worth trying to match in your model.

    image reference (with completely necessary arrows):


    macro shot for material detail reference:


    And just to comfirm, you are using subd modeling (link to wiki) to create your high poly, right? Zi0 mentioned that other techniques might be supplanting subd in creation of hard surface models with complex closely interacting shapes, as is the case with weapons. Although I do think subd will still continue to be useful is many cases, the options they suggested can be much quicker and do not require worrying about topology issues. It might be worth looking into if you are serious about working as a 3D artist in the video games industry (fusion 360 or zbrush hard surface modeling techniques).
  • axer
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    axer node
    Im still a SP noob to be honest, so i just mainly put smart materials, and do some tweaks here and there. I just didn't have an idea how to do those lines on the red plastic part other than using paint. 

    And to be honest, what @Zi0 mentioned i don't even understand what he meant ( my bad). The pipeline i followed for the Gewehr for example, i created a HP version, then used quad draw to go as low as possible with tris, UVed it and smart materials.

  • ImsumDave
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    ImsumDave polycounter lvl 11
    Hey I know, everything can't be learned in a day. This stuff takes time. Have you looked at tutorials for the various programs you are using, like substance painter? There is a lot of learning material available on the internet, much of which is free (youtube, artstation, etc.).

    With SP, there is nothing wrong with using smart materials as a starting point, but in most instances you should add more unique variation into the material on top of that.

    One way you to make the ridges in the red area is to use mesh displacement, a decently highly subdivided mesh, a proper texture, and model UVs to match the ridge scale you want. Here's how it's done in blender, I attached the texture I used to this post:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vA00_P2QXWc

    Zi0 shared some links to tutorials to the two techniques in his post, although one is not free. His suggestions relate to the high poly creation part of the process.
  • axer
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    axer node
    What i like most about blender is the amount of modifiers you guys have, im jealous. I ended up fixing the shotgun shell, but i've moved on eventualy. Upon incorporating the tips i got here, i went on and completed my next proj.

    However, im far from done with this one. Got a bunch of ideas what i can add to go with this bad boy.
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