Have I just not noticed that there's a flood of sports games on the market? Seems like every major sport gets 1 or 2 games devoted if it's lucky.
Perhaps I should not have lumped the two together, as their conditions are different.
The main sports games have a new title every year, which in one way makes sense because teams change, but every time one of my friends asks if I'm getting the new Madden or FIFA I just /sigh.
The shooter genre, however, is absurdly saturated.
The only two things I want to be gone is that steam has multiply currency's or price difference depending on the currency. I'm not blaming Valve or anyone for that matter, cause I don't know why it is like it is or who's in charge of it. And I do know that it's much better then how it used to be. But I would love if there either was only US dollars or that they set the price in dollars and then adjust it for the other currency's on a weekly or monthly basis (or if the price is changed). Do note that I don't want regional prices to be gone, where certain countries gets it cheaper due to having a lower average income.
The second one is, I want Nintendo games on my PC. I know that you can emulate them, but I want to be able to buy them.
I'm tired of people getting mad about something being priced ridiculously. It's super simple. Don't buy it if you think it's bullshit. Stop giving in to hype. Vote with your wallet... or purse. I mean there's nothing wrong with voicing that it's stupid (i agree) but seriously when i see someone getting mad at it, and then i look at there steam library and they have like 5 early access games, come on....
The second one is, I want Nintendo games on my PC. I know that you can emulate them, but I want to be able to buy them.
No kidding. I don't know what Nintendo hopes to accomplish by refusing to entertain the idea of moving games to the PC. Surely they know emulators are a thing.
No kidding. I don't know what Nintendo hopes to accomplish by refusing to entertain the idea of moving games to the PC. Surely they know emulators are a thing.
The reasoning is pretty simple. Nintendos games sell consoles where the people who buy those then potentially also buy other games for that system which Nintendo will get an amount of the price for ($10 for Xbox and Playstation, presumably something similar for Nintendo). I would also guess that you can sell game at a higher price for the Wii systems than PC, but I haven't checked the numbers so I might be wrong here. I'd like to see Mario, Zelda and Samus on the PC as well, but I understand why I probably will never be able to get them on PC (from Nintendo). The same reasoning could be applied to any exclusive title really.
In addition to that I think Nintendo really values creating the right gaming environment. It's not just economics or stubbornness; there's something to be said about games being played without a hitch and on the controllers they were specifically designed for, without all the forethought about FPS, hardware specs, input etc.
In that sense nintendo is one of the last bastions in the golden age of gaming, for me at least; but they really do need to find a way to get with the times.
Less focus on story and graphics and more focus on gameplay.
My hope is that this vapid rant goes away. It gets repeated ad nauseam and it's withering to listen to it, over and over again.
LOTS of games have fun, unique gameplay. If you can't find them, you aren't looking hard enough. If it's really that important to you, then don't buy the latest "Call of Honor : Duty Soldier".
I think developers placing spectacle ahead of gameplay, resulting in ridiculous constraints to the way a game functions is probably the biggest issue I have with modern games as a whole. Things like artificial funneling of the player through a very linear path, having cutscenes that should have been handled in gameplay, cinematic takedowns, etc, etc.
That and coddling the players with pointers and hints and great huge indicators on the screen so there's never a second where they need to take a moment to work out what they need to do, where to go or explore their environment.
Less focus on story and graphics and more focus on gameplay. There are a lot...... of FPS and RPG games where the focus is story and graphics.
Just realized this could be why I like Nintendo games so much. Often enough the gameplay really shines in the games they make.
I'm with you; if I wanted to watch a movie I'd watch a movie, if I wanted to read a book i'd read a book, but I want my games to be games and not some pseudo-game/interactive experience with a cringe inducing story.
That doesn't mean the gameplay is good. I've also never heard anyone rave about the COD story lines so that doesn't set the bar to high for the gameplay.
I'd like people stop trying to make deep/good story and miserably fail at it, but instead focus on the gameplay and level design to make games FUN again.
I'd like people stop trying to make deep/good story and miserably fail at it, but instead focus on the gameplay and level design to make games FUN again.
Do you honestly not find games fun anymore? I think they're a blast and I'm certifiably old and should, by all accounts, be jaded as fuck about it. But I'm not.
I recently picked up a 3ds because, as a PC gamer, I feel like I miss out on Nintendo games, and the very different feel they have to most western AAA development.
Playing Mario 3d world has been a fantastic reminder of how great a game can be when it is only about the gameplay elements. It almost feels like a puzzle game the way it introduces new elements and works them into the mix.
Just installed "Final DOOM" for the hell of it. Started a new game and got dropped into a level with a pistol ... that's it. No cut scene, no talking, no HUD markers ... Fucking AWESOME.
the last of us: zombies, guns, story-focus, graphics!!
It's like the sum of everything mentioned in this thread!
LOL, good point.
I think it works because somehow they managed to make story, graphics and gameplay all above average. (Though I have heard people complain about the gameplay.) Most games excel at maybe 2/3 if they're good, with the third being average to poor.
Someone mentioned earlier about game clones. I do agree with that but I don't see it stopping any time soon. I'm at a mobile game studio right now and basically every decision we make has to be based on "Did X game do it and did X game make lots of money?" It's unfortunate but I guess it's just the way the industry works.
Now, having said that, this is my dream job and I can't imagine working at another studio. Just sad that everything is so driven by money, which cancels out a lot of originality.
Combined elements from two awesome games made it fun for me and a lot of others seeing how it won moddb's MOTY a while back back but I guess everybody likes different things. I love the new changes teased in some of the more recently uploaded videos.
I recently picked up a 3ds because, as a PC gamer, I feel like I miss out on Nintendo games, and the very different feel they have to most western AAA development.
Playing Mario 3d world has been a fantastic reminder of how great a game can be when it is only about the gameplay elements. It almost feels like a puzzle game the way it introduces new elements and works them into the mix.
My wife got Mario 3D world for christmas and it's the most fun I've had in a long time. Over the last 5-6 years I've struggled to find games that pull me in like that and have me wanting to complete and collect things. It's been great going back and playing wind waker again too.
Tired of having my hand held all the time and a load of cut-scenes and scripted events forced down my throat.
That's a big turn off for me too. Hopefully with some newer hardware there won't be quite as much load screen time too. Nothing worse than
load screen
cut scene
load screen
hand hold for .5sec of game play
cut scene to "reward" that simple action
load screen
Wash rinse repeat until watching TV seems like it has more game play.
Personally I think games should start at the point that most reviewers start at, well past the soul crushing tutorials and pretty deep into the game play. They just assume the reviewer knows enough to figure it out, but then turn around and think gamers are abject morons who need giant glowing moron arrows constant objective repeating.
It's really hard to assume the role of a ass kicking hero when it's clear that some designer really thinks you're an idiot. The weird thing is that the games that hold my hand and talk down to me the most are the hardcore games...
I think one reason for this cinematic shift is that developers have gotten overexcited. They have all this technological power at their disposal and they want to realise all of their "cool" storylines/characters/set-pieces but in the process they shun the player's ability to carve his/her own adventure.
This then manifests itself the form of endless cut-scenes, overambitious character interaction/storylines and scripted events which play out like a mediocre movie except that the acting is terrible and everything looks distractingly uncanny.
Game development is incredibly expensive however, and innovation can't often be risked. I'm hoping the success of games like Dark Souls will prove that there is still a market for a certain gameplay experience.
I have no problem with almost any of the trends listed on here... particularly the ones that KEEPS US EMPLOYED!
Day 1 DLC's
Are you guys aware that there are often many months between when a game goes GOLD (completely finished), and on shelves?
Are you guys aware that with FINISHED assets, and completed mechanics, whipping out 1-2 levels is not as difficult of an ordeal to create/test/bug-fix in a couple of months with an experienced team?
So... content that is NOT on the disk, that is not on the shelves, that STILL cost hundreds of thousands of $$$ to make, and had to go through an expensive submission process should just be free?
People are really complaining about DLC's altogether
DLC's give value to a game after it has been purchased and played. It is also the ONLY way to add financial longtail to a game.
What do you think fights used game sales?
(Before we go into that stupid Used Games debate; please watch this)
[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2G_f8YBy39M"]The Devil's Halibut - Used Games - YouTube[/ame]
Sequels?
Well consumers sure the hell aren't buying new IP's nearly in the same volume as sequels/liscences, and they seem to be a LOT cheaper to make, and sell a LOT more.
Pre-Orders
Well ok then...
FYI Pre-sales act as a guage to see how much money should be placed into the marketing budgets, DLC's, or if pre-production on a sequel should be started.
I guess what we could do instead, is just LAY EVERYONE OFF right? that makes you all happy right?
F2P
You guys really think what might be considered the monetization SAVIOUR Of our industry should be scrapped?
Do me a favour... go tell the 2 BIGGEST GAMES ON THE PLANET to start charging for their games.
Go tell Valve and Riot that the 47+ million DOTA players, and the 60+Million LOL players are wrong, and that they should just charge $60 for a game without any micro-transaction.
While you're at it, go to the DOTA 2 section of this forum, and tell all those artists to STOP making Armour sets and couriers because of your shitty belief in monetization strategies.
People are sick of Zombies and Cutscenes??
Yet... 'Last of Us' was Game of the year, and considered one of the best games of all time... full of amazing cinematics, and zombies....
My wife got Mario 3D world for christmas and it's the most fun I've had in a long time. Over the last 5-6 years I've struggled to find games that pull me in like that and have me wanting to complete and collect things. It's been great going back and playing wind waker again too.
That's a big turn off for me too. Hopefully with some newer hardware there won't be quite as much load screen time too. Nothing worse than
load screen
cut scene
load screen
hand hold for .5sec of game play
cut scene to "reward" that simple action
load screen
Wash rinse repeat until watching TV seems like it has more game play.
Personally I think games should start at the point that most reviewers start at, well past the soul crushing tutorials and pretty deep into the game play. They just assume the reviewer knows enough to figure it out, but then turn around and think gamers are abject morons who need giant glowing moron arrows constant objective repeating.
It's really hard to assume the role of a ass kicking hero when it's clear that some designer really thinks you're an idiot. The weird thing is that the games that hold my hand and talk down to me the most are the hardcore games...
Included instant kill/action cutscenes, that takes you out of firstperson. (I'm looking at you, Deus Ex and AvP). It totally breaks my immersion, and hate the lose of control and view.
I have no problem with almost any of the trends listed on here... particularly the ones that KEEPS US EMPLOYED!
I whole heartedly agree with this.
Day 1 DLC's
Are you guys aware that there are often many months between when a game goes GOLD (completely finished), and on shelves?
Are you guys aware that with FINISHED assets, and completed mechanics, whipping out 1-2 levels is not as difficult of an ordeal to create/test/bug-fix in a couple of months with an experienced team?
So... content that is NOT on the disk, that is not on the shelves, that STILL cost hundreds of thousands of $$$ to make, and had to go through an expensive submission process should just be free?
I whole heartedly disagree with this.
Day 1 DLC in my opinion and being completely aware of everything you mentioned above, still does nothing in my mind but devalue a product, it's something that has negative stigma written all over it and should be done away with. Whether on-disc or genuine download only DLC, nothing should ever be released on day 1 with the exception of bug fixes and the like if needed. Because all it does is scream "without this, you're not experiencing the game the way it should be experienced.... ON THE DAY IT'S RELEASED".
The nature of the DLCs requires that they are redudant.
So long you dont have the "must have all armor sets","must see every stone" or "tell me every Sidestory" syndrom i can exist good without DLCs.
The problems occurs when a supposed good game shows your the middle finger and DLCs patch discrepants in the story or gameplay elements. Then the developer unleashs a shitstorm.
Deus Ex 3 was overall good (in today terms :poly124: ) so the DLC with the extra Story dont hurt because the original Story was okay.
Dark Souls i didnt see a shitstorm for the DLCs because the original game is complete.
Problematic are indeed the day 1 DLCs because the incomplete executioners axe floats over you head and every problem or inconsistence is automatic the fault of the fuckn DLC. But thats in my opnion only a matter of the rest of the game. A very good game can have 20 day 1 DLCs and no shitstorm its a matter of quality.
Yet... 'Last of Us' was Game of the year, and considered one of the best games of all time... full of amazing cinematics, and zombies....
So you guys didn't want 'Last Of Us' to be made??
I love zombie games still, I never really burned out on WW2 games either even though their popularity attracted a lot of games that where not worth playing.
Uncharted and Last of Us are pretty much the only reasons I own a PS3 and I rarely lump them in with all other games because they are done so well.
I guess my beef with cinematics is mostly when they aren't handled properly or blended well. Switching from intense FPS action to 3rd person is jarring and annoying. If they get the pacing right and flow into it properly no one really cares.
It's like FX in most TV shows, when they do it right, change a LA street into DC, or show a car wreck that never happened, no one notices. Get it wrong and everyone does notice.
Doing it right: I finish a fight and I'm walking up to a gate and someone waves me over, game play stops and a cinematic takes over but the camera doesn't deviate that far from where I'm at. The characters chat for a brief bit, and I watch the gate open as the camera returns to my player.
Doing it wrong: I'm fighting wave after wave of enemies and right as I'm about to do one in or dodge an attack everything pauses because:
A)Some arbitrary number of bad guy deaths has been reached
B)Some timer expired.
C) Someone or something stepped into a trigger or pushed a button.
The bad guys I'm locked in a life or death struggle with, suddenly don't matter or evaporated. The camera flies off or cross fades to some place I'm not and there is my character, walking on screen cool as a cucumber like I just woke up from a long nap, because the voice actor had just woken up from a long nap and was delivering lines with very little direction...
It cuts to a weird low angle of the gate as it raises way too slowly, showing not much more than the drastic disparity in textel density between the ground, the gate and my characters feet. Hoo-ray for poorly timed cinematics, jarring pacing and unflattering per-planned camera angles, heh.
I have no problem with almost any of the trends listed on here... particularly the ones that KEEPS US EMPLOYED!
Well consumers sure the hell aren't buying new IP's nearly in the same volume as sequels/liscences, and they seem to be a LOT cheaper to make, and sell a LOT more.
So... content that is NOT on the disk, that is not on the shelves, that STILL cost hundreds of thousands of $$$ to make, and had to go through an expensive submission process should just be free?
Valid business strategies here JC but you are speaking as a developer. Most gamers are not developers and quite rightly don't care about the behind-the-scenes financial intricacies of producing a game. Despite this being a game development forum, most of us here are/were gamers and are speaking as such in this thread.
Sales figures are as much a measure of a game as they are a Miley Cirus or Justin Beiber album in the mainstream music market. What is popular and what is quality are not always in aligment.
People are sick of Zombies and Cutscenes??
Zombies are just an aesthetic, they don't dictate gameplay at all. I thought DayZ, State of Decay and Project Zomboid were great fun.
Cutscenes? Yes. Completely sick of them, especially the ones where I mash buttons fighting some guy and it is passed off as 'gameplay'.
The visual quality and art direction of AAA games though make them great for running around looking at meshes/textures/visual fx.
I don't really care too much about Day 1 DLC or even on-disc DLC. If they help make a game I like profitable, then by all means go ahead and charge for them since many great games aren't profitable from the sale of the game itself.
The thing that pisses me off to no end is the fact that some developers find it necessary to take something that was already free, then start charging for it. The biggest example that comes to mind for this is the Arms Deal update in Counter-Strike:Global Offensive.
Back when the game was available as a closed alpha to professional players and enthusiasts, each team was given a special knife to represent their faction. By the time the game reached closed beta, these knives were replaced with "better" knives.
Nobody thought anything of it at the time, in fact most people agreed that the new knives were better looking. Fast forward a few years and valve releases an update that adds pointless micro-transactions to an already profitable game and suddenly Valve is charging money for the knives that they scrapped because they weren't good enough to be put into the game.
That's not even the best part, the new knives are the most valuable items on the CSGO marketplace and users are paying hundreds of dollars for virtual goods that used to be free. I've seen some people spend over $600 on chest keys to try and get a knife only to come up with nothing, it's pathetic.
The other thing I don't mind is high quality cutscenes. I just got done playing Yakuza 4, a game in which there is literally a cutscene every 10-15 minutes, and I can't think of how bad the game would be without them. Cutscenes allow meaningful story development to take place and it just wouldn't be the same with interaction.
I mean, if two characters are having a deep conversation while sitting on a couch, how would developers have the same conversation take place but with the introduction of gameplay elements? The Walking Dead is a great example of this, technically the game is like 80% cutscenes since it's just dialogue with the occasional point and click section. Beyond:Two Souls is another great example.
Of course, those kinds of games don't appeal to anybody, but I think if you're the person the values story over anything else, then you won't have too much of an issue with cutscenes.
Look at skyrim start for a bad example. Sitting only with the hands shackled in a carriage. Hell why i cant stand up and run? Because Storywise you must undergo Character creation and a dragon attack.
Solution:
So what! Let the player stand up, run and he becomes a arrow in the knee, the pictures becomes black and he start with 50% Health and a bandage.
The problem is that small cutscenes are mostly useless, like going through a door, run against a bomb timer they kill only immersion for many people and show waht what you are doing even.
The longer ones often enforce actions you dont agree with and that developer forget you are a gamer not a spectator.
Cutscenes are for situations which are not possible with ingame control but the player has agreed. Like a woman asks for a dance and the player says yes.
F2P
You guys really think what might be considered the monetization SAVIOUR Of our industry should be scrapped?
Do me a favour... go tell the 2 BIGGEST GAMES ON THE PLANET to start charging for their games.
Go tell Valve and Riot that the 47+ million DOTA players, and the 60+Million LOL players are wrong, and that they should just charge $60 for a game without any micro-transaction.
While you're at it, go to the DOTA 2 section of this forum, and tell all those artists to STOP making Armour sets and couriers because of your shitty belief in monetization strategies.
The problem is that a lot of F2P games are nothing like DOTA and and TF2. A lot of free to play games make you pay for time or for simple coins so you can get things faster and the buying of things effects your gameplay experience. I don't know about Dota, but in TF2 you can still play the full game without having to buy anything and it's a similar experience to anyone else playing.
But when you have games like Sim's Freeplay, EA Theme Park, Tiny Tower, or many other games, the only gameplay feature that adds a "challange" is that you must wait hours and hours for a task to be completed or pay for these points and not have to wait.
Plus I've also seen this F2P monotization in non F2P games and that just seems odd. Where you pay for the game and then there are things like coins and such that you have to pay for.
My problem with F2P games are the Pay to Play games. Dota2, TF2 and LoL are examples of F2P done outstandingly well. The number one reason those games can be free and still reap a huge profit is because they are FUN so the player WANTS to spend money on it, AND it doesn't affect the game. Its a win-win all around. The biggest problem with a lot of other F2P games with micro-transactions is that they aren't as engaging or things are blocked off or there's a LOT of waiting around, all ruining the game experience. While yes, some of these games are very popular and well done, there's still plenty of F2P games out there that are all about the money.
Plus I've also seen this F2P monotization in non F2P games and that just seems odd. Where you pay for the game and then there are things like coins and such that you have to pay for.
Basically all first party Xbox One games. WTF Microsoft? Have me pay £60 for the new Forza (a markup of £10 over the previous iteration), then show me cars that you could never afford to buy in the game without many hours of serious grinding, or pay real cash.
F2P aka Pay2Win seriously its terrible and i have yet to see a game that does it right, let me pay properly for a game instead giving me a game i have to pay random shit over and over again and in the end i have to pay three times of the price of a "normal" game to have fun...
DLC, another ragequit for me how about makeing REAL expansions again with serious content like Frozen Throne for Warcraft 3 or Tribunal and Bloodmoon for Morrowind etc. THAT was worth every cent back then.
Quicktime events, no brainer here they just SUCK.
Graphics that make my gpu burn to dust, stop half assed console ports with texture resolutions lower then Quake 3 Arena...
Easy peasy games, im not an idiot and i want a game on hard mode to be hard stop appeasing every darn kid, so it wont cry.
Stop supporting Windows and go Linux, not really serious here but would be cool ditching Windows of my HDD and beeing able to stay inside Ubuntu ALL the time
Replies
To this I shall say nay,
Now off I go, to make things out of clay,
Good day!
Perhaps I should not have lumped the two together, as their conditions are different.
The main sports games have a new title every year, which in one way makes sense because teams change, but every time one of my friends asks if I'm getting the new Madden or FIFA I just /sigh.
The shooter genre, however, is absurdly saturated.
The second one is, I want Nintendo games on my PC. I know that you can emulate them, but I want to be able to buy them.
Amen to that.
No kidding. I don't know what Nintendo hopes to accomplish by refusing to entertain the idea of moving games to the PC. Surely they know emulators are a thing.
In that sense nintendo is one of the last bastions in the golden age of gaming, for me at least; but they really do need to find a way to get with the times.
It's as if a bunch of people played Haunting on the Sega Genesis and it took 20 years to forget it sucked.
Just realized this could be why I like Nintendo games so much. Often enough the gameplay really shines in the games they make.
LOTS of games have fun, unique gameplay. If you can't find them, you aren't looking hard enough. If it's really that important to you, then don't buy the latest "Call of Honor : Duty Soldier".
That and coddling the players with pointers and hints and great huge indicators on the screen so there's never a second where they need to take a moment to work out what they need to do, where to go or explore their environment.
I'm with you; if I wanted to watch a movie I'd watch a movie, if I wanted to read a book i'd read a book, but I want my games to be games and not some pseudo-game/interactive experience with a cringe inducing story.
Misleading crap.
It's like the sum of everything mentioned in this thread!
Except for one thing, platform restricted. If that was fixed, woho.
Playing Mario 3d world has been a fantastic reminder of how great a game can be when it is only about the gameplay elements. It almost feels like a puzzle game the way it introduces new elements and works them into the mix.
[ame="
LOL, good point.
I think it works because somehow they managed to make story, graphics and gameplay all above average. (Though I have heard people complain about the gameplay.) Most games excel at maybe 2/3 if they're good, with the third being average to poor.
Now, having said that, this is my dream job and I can't imagine working at another studio. Just sad that everything is so driven by money, which cancels out a lot of originality.
That's a big turn off for me too. Hopefully with some newer hardware there won't be quite as much load screen time too. Nothing worse than
- load screen
- cut scene
- load screen
- hand hold for .5sec of game play
- cut scene to "reward" that simple action
- load screen
Wash rinse repeat until watching TV seems like it has more game play.Personally I think games should start at the point that most reviewers start at, well past the soul crushing tutorials and pretty deep into the game play. They just assume the reviewer knows enough to figure it out, but then turn around and think gamers are abject morons who need giant glowing moron arrows constant objective repeating.
It's really hard to assume the role of a ass kicking hero when it's clear that some designer really thinks you're an idiot. The weird thing is that the games that hold my hand and talk down to me the most are the hardcore games...
This then manifests itself the form of endless cut-scenes, overambitious character interaction/storylines and scripted events which play out like a mediocre movie except that the acting is terrible and everything looks distractingly uncanny.
Game development is incredibly expensive however, and innovation can't often be risked. I'm hoping the success of games like Dark Souls will prove that there is still a market for a certain gameplay experience.
Day 1 DLC's
Are you guys aware that there are often many months between when a game goes GOLD (completely finished), and on shelves?
Are you guys aware that with FINISHED assets, and completed mechanics, whipping out 1-2 levels is not as difficult of an ordeal to create/test/bug-fix in a couple of months with an experienced team?
So... content that is NOT on the disk, that is not on the shelves, that STILL cost hundreds of thousands of $$$ to make, and had to go through an expensive submission process should just be free?
People are really complaining about DLC's altogether
DLC's give value to a game after it has been purchased and played. It is also the ONLY way to add financial longtail to a game.
What do you think fights used game sales?
(Before we go into that stupid Used Games debate; please watch this)
[ame="
Sequels?
Well consumers sure the hell aren't buying new IP's nearly in the same volume as sequels/liscences, and they seem to be a LOT cheaper to make, and sell a LOT more.
Pre-Orders
Well ok then...
FYI Pre-sales act as a guage to see how much money should be placed into the marketing budgets, DLC's, or if pre-production on a sequel should be started.
I guess what we could do instead, is just LAY EVERYONE OFF right? that makes you all happy right?
F2P
You guys really think what might be considered the monetization SAVIOUR Of our industry should be scrapped?
Do me a favour... go tell the 2 BIGGEST GAMES ON THE PLANET to start charging for their games.
Go tell Valve and Riot that the 47+ million DOTA players, and the 60+Million LOL players are wrong, and that they should just charge $60 for a game without any micro-transaction.
While you're at it, go to the DOTA 2 section of this forum, and tell all those artists to STOP making Armour sets and couriers because of your shitty belief in monetization strategies.
People are sick of Zombies and Cutscenes??
Yet... 'Last of Us' was Game of the year, and considered one of the best games of all time... full of amazing cinematics, and zombies....
So you guys didn't want 'Last Of Us' to be made??
already happens
no, but it should have been made as a movie instead
but i guess they're half way there now, since it already has no gameplay
Oooo... them's fighting words! :poly122:
Included instant kill/action cutscenes, that takes you out of firstperson. (I'm looking at you, Deus Ex and AvP). It totally breaks my immersion, and hate the lose of control and view.
I whole heartedly agree with this.
I whole heartedly disagree with this.
Day 1 DLC in my opinion and being completely aware of everything you mentioned above, still does nothing in my mind but devalue a product, it's something that has negative stigma written all over it and should be done away with. Whether on-disc or genuine download only DLC, nothing should ever be released on day 1 with the exception of bug fixes and the like if needed. Because all it does is scream "without this, you're not experiencing the game the way it should be experienced.... ON THE DAY IT'S RELEASED".
So long you dont have the "must have all armor sets","must see every stone" or "tell me every Sidestory" syndrom i can exist good without DLCs.
The problems occurs when a supposed good game shows your the middle finger and DLCs patch discrepants in the story or gameplay elements. Then the developer unleashs a shitstorm.
Deus Ex 3 was overall good (in today terms :poly124: ) so the DLC with the extra Story dont hurt because the original Story was okay.
Dark Souls i didnt see a shitstorm for the DLCs because the original game is complete.
Problematic are indeed the day 1 DLCs because the incomplete executioners axe floats over you head and every problem or inconsistence is automatic the fault of the fuckn DLC. But thats in my opnion only a matter of the rest of the game. A very good game can have 20 day 1 DLCs and no shitstorm its a matter of quality.
Uncharted and Last of Us are pretty much the only reasons I own a PS3 and I rarely lump them in with all other games because they are done so well.
I guess my beef with cinematics is mostly when they aren't handled properly or blended well. Switching from intense FPS action to 3rd person is jarring and annoying. If they get the pacing right and flow into it properly no one really cares.
It's like FX in most TV shows, when they do it right, change a LA street into DC, or show a car wreck that never happened, no one notices. Get it wrong and everyone does notice.
Doing it right: I finish a fight and I'm walking up to a gate and someone waves me over, game play stops and a cinematic takes over but the camera doesn't deviate that far from where I'm at. The characters chat for a brief bit, and I watch the gate open as the camera returns to my player.
Doing it wrong: I'm fighting wave after wave of enemies and right as I'm about to do one in or dodge an attack everything pauses because:
A)Some arbitrary number of bad guy deaths has been reached
B)Some timer expired.
C) Someone or something stepped into a trigger or pushed a button.
The bad guys I'm locked in a life or death struggle with, suddenly don't matter or evaporated. The camera flies off or cross fades to some place I'm not and there is my character, walking on screen cool as a cucumber like I just woke up from a long nap, because the voice actor had just woken up from a long nap and was delivering lines with very little direction...
It cuts to a weird low angle of the gate as it raises way too slowly, showing not much more than the drastic disparity in textel density between the ground, the gate and my characters feet. Hoo-ray for poorly timed cinematics, jarring pacing and unflattering per-planned camera angles, heh.
Valid business strategies here JC but you are speaking as a developer. Most gamers are not developers and quite rightly don't care about the behind-the-scenes financial intricacies of producing a game. Despite this being a game development forum, most of us here are/were gamers and are speaking as such in this thread.
Sales figures are as much a measure of a game as they are a Miley Cirus or Justin Beiber album in the mainstream music market. What is popular and what is quality are not always in aligment.
Zombies are just an aesthetic, they don't dictate gameplay at all. I thought DayZ, State of Decay and Project Zomboid were great fun.
Cutscenes? Yes. Completely sick of them, especially the ones where I mash buttons fighting some guy and it is passed off as 'gameplay'.
The visual quality and art direction of AAA games though make them great for running around looking at meshes/textures/visual fx.
The thing that pisses me off to no end is the fact that some developers find it necessary to take something that was already free, then start charging for it. The biggest example that comes to mind for this is the Arms Deal update in Counter-Strike:Global Offensive.
Back when the game was available as a closed alpha to professional players and enthusiasts, each team was given a special knife to represent their faction. By the time the game reached closed beta, these knives were replaced with "better" knives.
Nobody thought anything of it at the time, in fact most people agreed that the new knives were better looking. Fast forward a few years and valve releases an update that adds pointless micro-transactions to an already profitable game and suddenly Valve is charging money for the knives that they scrapped because they weren't good enough to be put into the game.
That's not even the best part, the new knives are the most valuable items on the CSGO marketplace and users are paying hundreds of dollars for virtual goods that used to be free. I've seen some people spend over $600 on chest keys to try and get a knife only to come up with nothing, it's pathetic.
The other thing I don't mind is high quality cutscenes. I just got done playing Yakuza 4, a game in which there is literally a cutscene every 10-15 minutes, and I can't think of how bad the game would be without them. Cutscenes allow meaningful story development to take place and it just wouldn't be the same with interaction.
I mean, if two characters are having a deep conversation while sitting on a couch, how would developers have the same conversation take place but with the introduction of gameplay elements? The Walking Dead is a great example of this, technically the game is like 80% cutscenes since it's just dialogue with the occasional point and click section. Beyond:Two Souls is another great example.
Of course, those kinds of games don't appeal to anybody, but I think if you're the person the values story over anything else, then you won't have too much of an issue with cutscenes.
Look at skyrim start for a bad example. Sitting only with the hands shackled in a carriage. Hell why i cant stand up and run? Because Storywise you must undergo Character creation and a dragon attack.
Solution:
So what! Let the player stand up, run and he becomes a arrow in the knee, the pictures becomes black and he start with 50% Health and a bandage.
The problem is that small cutscenes are mostly useless, like going through a door, run against a bomb timer they kill only immersion for many people and show waht what you are doing even.
The longer ones often enforce actions you dont agree with and that developer forget you are a gamer not a spectator.
Cutscenes are for situations which are not possible with ingame control but the player has agreed. Like a woman asks for a dance and the player says yes.
The problem is that a lot of F2P games are nothing like DOTA and and TF2. A lot of free to play games make you pay for time or for simple coins so you can get things faster and the buying of things effects your gameplay experience. I don't know about Dota, but in TF2 you can still play the full game without having to buy anything and it's a similar experience to anyone else playing.
But when you have games like Sim's Freeplay, EA Theme Park, Tiny Tower, or many other games, the only gameplay feature that adds a "challange" is that you must wait hours and hours for a task to be completed or pay for these points and not have to wait.
Plus I've also seen this F2P monotization in non F2P games and that just seems odd. Where you pay for the game and then there are things like coins and such that you have to pay for.
I've never played 'Last of Us'. How is the gameplay?
Basically all first party Xbox One games. WTF Microsoft? Have me pay £60 for the new Forza (a markup of £10 over the previous iteration), then show me cars that you could never afford to buy in the game without many hours of serious grinding, or pay real cash.
Fuck. That. Shit.
DLC, another ragequit for me how about makeing REAL expansions again with serious content like Frozen Throne for Warcraft 3 or Tribunal and Bloodmoon for Morrowind etc. THAT was worth every cent back then.
Quicktime events, no brainer here they just SUCK.
Graphics that make my gpu burn to dust, stop half assed console ports with texture resolutions lower then Quake 3 Arena...
Easy peasy games, im not an idiot and i want a game on hard mode to be hard stop appeasing every darn kid, so it wont cry.
Stop supporting Windows and go Linux, not really serious here but would be cool ditching Windows of my HDD and beeing able to stay inside Ubuntu ALL the time