I can see where Ged is coming from, but i mostly just meant that no one is really evil just for stories sake. "well someone has to be evil, so your it, we don't care why"
As an example in the second/third? book there are chapters from Queen Cerseis' point of view. Now she is definitely a bitch, but it at least lets you see where shes coming from, how paranoid she is, and how she just wants to protect her son(even if he is a cunt) I find it just adds more dimensionality to characters.
Joffery would be the closest thing to a pure villian. or the whitewalkers.
speaking purely from the point of view of someone who's only seen the show, not read the books, yet:
Joffery doesn't come across as "evil", per-se. more that he's immature and has the power of a king... and of course, his upbringing as a spoiled kid means he's used to getting his own way. which leads him to be somewhat of a capracious bastard. he wants to be feared, because he believes it will make his rule easier, so he does things to promote that. but he doesn't understand the implications involved in his actions, such as what he does to Ned, and what follows.
Never heard of the show today until a co-worker mentioned i should check it out since i loved rome and spartacus. watched the first two shows of Game of thrones and loving it. Want to see camelot too, sounds interesting.
Ya what Iliek about this series is even though it's a fantasy it feels like it could be real(it does have a lot of bases from real events) The twists and turns aren't completely random but show how even with a ton of thought and planning little things will fuck you up. I also quite like how there is no good and evil, I find black and white to be really boring and unrelatable. There are definite dicks and assholes but they have motivation behind what they do and aren't just trying to destroy the world to laugh maniacally.
I'd have said it was Cersie. She raised Joffery to be a hateful shit. I dont think she particularly cares for her family beyond their facility to provide her with a route to power. In 'A Feast for Crows'
you see how badly she's willing to treat Tommen so that she can get her way, she's ruthless, powerhungry and self centered. Her attitude to Kevan, Lancel, and Jamie when they dont co operate with her schemes is pretty telling.
good point fletcher, i guess Joffrey is kind of a result of Cersei, its been so long since i read the books i forgot how much she leaves people in the dust later on.
So excited for the last book, i didn't know it was coming so soon.
So excited for the last book, i didn't know it was coming so soon.
A Dance with Dragons is merely the fifth book - the last will be the seventh one, A Dream of Spring (with The Winds of Winter inbetween).
It might take another ten years, based on how much time was spent on number 4 and 5...
perna put it right--it reads more like historical fiction in a lot of ways, avoiding a lot of the more tiresome conventions of fantasy.
Yeah, in most fantasy the common folk live a jolly happy life, the wounds of heroes get healed in an instant, everyone's so noble, noone ever takes a s***, all women are empowered, and so on... Even in Lord of the Rings, actually.
Yeah, in most fantasy the common folk live a jolly happy life, the wounds of heroes get healed in an instant, everyone's so noble, noone ever takes a s***, all women are empowered, and so on... Even in Lord of the Rings, actually.
and no one gets eaten,beheaded, or brutally murdered.
I would say especially in LOTR. Have you ever seen a scratch on Legolas or him even getting dirty for that matter? The heroes can however kill like 342423420 orcs with one single blow... I need to be able to relate to the characters in a story.
So amped for the new book, I had it on pre-order a while back through Amazon Kindle and got it sent to me earlier today. But I've started re-reading the series again (4th time now) so I'm struggling not to just skip everything and go straight to the new book.
I figured I've waited nearly 5 years for it, I can hold off for a little longer. Haha.
I've read through bits and pieces of this thread, but was anyone (who has read through the series) somewhat disappointed with the show? I felt like a lot of important stuff was missed or skimmed through and the character development was lacking a great deal. It felt a little rushed.
i'm half way through book 1.
Catelyn comes off a lot harsher toward Jon in the book than she did in the show, and so far while the show is one of the better/best "book to film" adaptations i've seen, the books are far more intricate and i'm finding myself very engrossed in it.
also, there's only one character so far who i can't "see" as the tv show portrayal. and that's Cercei. joffrey should have longer hair in the show, but that's a "meh" issue... just, i dunno, cercei looks different in my head.
I'm disappointed with the show in comparison to the books. Taken on it's own the show is good, it's just that the books are so much better. It's understandable though cramming everything they need into a ten episode season per book many things are bound to be lost or feel very rushed.
One of the things that bugs me is the portrayal of Bronn. In the show he's a sort of idiot though good with a blade or maybe just lucky. In the books he's a much more cunning and evil dude.
On the other hand Renly's and Ser Loras's relationship and story is much clearer and makes more sense than in the books.
Many things were very different from how I visualized them, some for the better many for the worse but that's what the imagination is good for I suppose.
Still I look forward to seeing another season of this show.
I also have high hopes for the newest book, now I just need to go buy a copy.
Kindle prices are set by the publisher, and Amazon isn't allowed to lower them, at least that's how it is here in Europe. They get reduced when the paperback edition comes out from what I've read though.
Meh, hate the whole hard-cover scam, too expensive, and too annoying to carry around in public transportation, and waiting for the paperback while everyone spoils it sucks.
Kindle would be a nice solution if all the book prices weren't such a blatant rip-off, why the hell would I pay more for a digital version?
I've read through bits and pieces of this thread, but was anyone (who has read through the series) somewhat disappointed with the show? I felt like a lot of important stuff was missed or skimmed through and the character development was lacking a great deal. It felt a little rushed.
Totally, some of the characters just didn't get the time they needed to develop. Danny was really brushed over in the show. I'm thinking that now the first series was so well received that season 2 will see less of these problems.
Thanks for that info Marine. I had no idea Kindle prices were set that way. I guess the music industry isn't the only one that needs to evolve with the times.
Bal you said exactly what I was thinking. I also don't like hardcovers because the simply take up too much space and paper.
I guess the music industry isn't the only one that needs to evolve with the times.
Its a shame because books are ridiculously easy to pirate/distribute. their files size is tiny and readers are simple to make. If they dont get smart to this quickly and give people fair prices they'll end up the same way as music and games.
I mean $19 for a digital book is ridiculous. Its costing pretty much the same as the hardcover, which has to be printed distributed and displayed..
....i still bought it though, so perhaps im as much to blame.
I cant stand Kindle/e-books. Tried it and was not a fan, prefer actually flipping through the pages. On side note, gonna look and see if they have the series at Chapters.
I'm in the middle of book 4, I'm finding it no where near as intense and interesting as the first 3. Does the 5th book pick things up again?
You just wait. I agree, the fourth was pretty dull, since ol' George didn't mention Tyrion OR Daenerys AT ALL (My two favorite characters). But then, Chapter 1 of book 5 *REALLY* spices things up. I'm not saying any more!
Just know that it's pretty damn awesome.
Good glad to hear Ya the main thign i don't like about 4 is that it doesn;t talk about any of the best characters and introduces a number that I don't really care about.
Yeah, I was quite frankly very disappointed with Feast for Crows. At least now in book 5, things are shaping up quite nicely. I have a feeling it is going to be much more epic than book 2-3.
I'm at 65% through book 2 right now. The first half was pretty uneventful but things have really heated up. The lack of Dany kind of disappoints me though. I'm really curious how they will handle some things in the show next season.
I've been reading them all on my iphone and actually loving it. This isn't the first time I've read ebooks, but it's the first time on my phone. Not having to carry around a book or an extra device is a huge convenience and I find white text on a black background much easier to read. Reading in the dark is also a big plus.
My House Stark shirt came in the mail yesterday, wearing it now.
Replies
speaking purely from the point of view of someone who's only seen the show, not read the books, yet:
Joffery doesn't come across as "evil", per-se. more that he's immature and has the power of a king... and of course, his upbringing as a spoiled kid means he's used to getting his own way. which leads him to be somewhat of a capracious bastard. he wants to be feared, because he believes it will make his rule easier, so he does things to promote that. but he doesn't understand the implications involved in his actions, such as what he does to Ned, and what follows.
http://asoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/topic/5960-a-dance-with-dragons-the-latest-info-inc-pub-date/
edit: Also beware of spoilers..I guess the book got leaked early...so be weary of links on the subject
Except Greggor Clegane.
Lol true enough, man that guy hates horses...
good point fletcher, i guess Joffrey is kind of a result of Cersei, its been so long since i read the books i forgot how much she leaves people in the dust later on.
So excited for the last book, i didn't know it was coming so soon.
I was worried for a while that it would happen! Such a good programme though! Really tempted to buy the book now!
Seriously dude, its not even got started. some of the stuff that happens later on is fucking horrific.
Gah definitely going to have to get the books!
just finished the last episode and ccant wait. When is this coming back? :poly127:
A Dance with Dragons is merely the fifth book - the last will be the seventh one, A Dream of Spring (with The Winds of Winter inbetween).
It might take another ten years, based on how much time was spent on number 4 and 5...
Yeah, in most fantasy the common folk live a jolly happy life, the wounds of heroes get healed in an instant, everyone's so noble, noone ever takes a s***, all women are empowered, and so on... Even in Lord of the Rings, actually.
and no one gets eaten,beheaded, or brutally murdered.
oh man I could hug you for these news!!! that my old bones can still witness another GRRM book...I almost gave up on him. Awesome awesome awesome!
let's hope there's a kindle version. I'd hate waiting for shipping to China.
I would say especially in LOTR. Have you ever seen a scratch on Legolas or him even getting dirty for that matter? The heroes can however kill like 342423420 orcs with one single blow... I need to be able to relate to the characters in a story.
Guide me Obi Wan... I mean Low Odor.
I figured I've waited nearly 5 years for it, I can hold off for a little longer. Haha.
I've read through bits and pieces of this thread, but was anyone (who has read through the series) somewhat disappointed with the show? I felt like a lot of important stuff was missed or skimmed through and the character development was lacking a great deal. It felt a little rushed.
Catelyn comes off a lot harsher toward Jon in the book than she did in the show, and so far while the show is one of the better/best "book to film" adaptations i've seen, the books are far more intricate and i'm finding myself very engrossed in it.
also, there's only one character so far who i can't "see" as the tv show portrayal. and that's Cercei. joffrey should have longer hair in the show, but that's a "meh" issue... just, i dunno, cercei looks different in my head.
One of the things that bugs me is the portrayal of Bronn. In the show he's a sort of idiot though good with a blade or maybe just lucky. In the books he's a much more cunning and evil dude.
On the other hand Renly's and Ser Loras's relationship and story is much clearer and makes more sense than in the books.
Many things were very different from how I visualized them, some for the better many for the worse but that's what the imagination is good for I suppose.
Still I look forward to seeing another season of this show.
I also have high hopes for the newest book, now I just need to go buy a copy.
I finished watching it and it definitely gets better as it goes on (bit slow at the start) though they're not coming back for a season 2
I hope this is the one.
You'll probably want [ame="http://www.amazon.com/Dance-Dragons-Song-Fire-Book/dp/0553801473"]book 5[/ame] too.
@Anyone:
BTW what's up with the super high kindle prices?
IIRC they used to be cheaper when compared to paperback versions.
Kindle would be a nice solution if all the book prices weren't such a blatant rip-off, why the hell would I pay more for a digital version?
Totally, some of the characters just didn't get the time they needed to develop. Danny was really brushed over in the show. I'm thinking that now the first series was so well received that season 2 will see less of these problems.
Bal you said exactly what I was thinking. I also don't like hardcovers because the simply take up too much space and paper.
Its a shame because books are ridiculously easy to pirate/distribute. their files size is tiny and readers are simple to make. If they dont get smart to this quickly and give people fair prices they'll end up the same way as music and games.
I mean $19 for a digital book is ridiculous. Its costing pretty much the same as the hardcover, which has to be printed distributed and displayed..
....i still bought it though, so perhaps im as much to blame.
LOVING IT.
You just wait. I agree, the fourth was pretty dull, since ol' George didn't mention Tyrion OR Daenerys AT ALL (My two favorite characters). But then, Chapter 1 of book 5 *REALLY* spices things up. I'm not saying any more!
Just know that it's pretty damn awesome.
I've been reading them all on my iphone and actually loving it. This isn't the first time I've read ebooks, but it's the first time on my phone. Not having to carry around a book or an extra device is a huge convenience and I find white text on a black background much easier to read. Reading in the dark is also a big plus.
My House Stark shirt came in the mail yesterday, wearing it now.
I read the entire series on my HTC desire