Yeah, I'd say the down position especially is good for showing weight, but the up position too. The contact and passing are best for showing the action.
As for what you asked after that... is that all Maya lingo? Cause if so, you completely lost me. I could tell you exactly how I would do this with the 3DSMax biped, but I can't really help you with technical Maya stuff, since I still have to learn all that myself. Sorry :P
If you're interested in Pixar, get one of thier movies, get in on your computer, and put it in a program you can scrub through frame by frame. Watching it this slowly let's you see exactly how they moved things, the spacing, the timing, and their curves. You can even draw on your monitor with a dry-erase marker to track it yourself. Also, watching without volume is supposed to be useful too.
I like the newest walk, much improvement. I agree with slip about the contact. The toes aren't connecting as fast as they should. Right now it looks the toes are making contact as they move their way from the down position to the passing position.
It might be helpful to bring the toes down a lot sooner before sliding the foot. It would also give you a little more time for some recoil (I think you're calling it down?)
Good start! Everything seems to be moving correctly, and a good feel of weight. Now, the next step is to add some personality into the little guy(ball?)!
can you do me a favor and render out a side view, it might be just me but it looks like his weight is back a bit too far. remember when you walk you're weight should be moving forward and be slightly ahead of you, it looks like you might have his COG not in the right position, but it could just be the angle..
Good work though.
Since this is my first real walk cycle with good Contact>Down>UP>Contact flow. The problem is that when I spline or clamp it the feet do not stay on the ground at the the Up position and it all just looks really weird and mechanical.
I've never splined a walk cycle before, how do I go about it?
Thanks =]
Like I've said, I'm really only familiar with 3DSMax... but when I have a problem like that, it's normally because I have overextended the leg. Basically, you're trying to make the leg stay on the ground where there is no leg.
I suggest checking how high your Up is, the angle of the hip, and the tilt on the foot. If it still won't stay, you'll probably have to lower his body. (Or... this is an unrelated problem :P)
My latest walk cycle! =]
Following a more advanced PDF tutorial.
It's on 25 frames.
1 Contact > 4 Down > 10 Up > 13 Contact > 16 down > 19 up> 25> Contact
More advanced with the hips and all
It's still. Looking good?
Heh. No. No I'm not.
I'm merley trying to tell you my walk cycle set up, mate.
I'm telling you how I have my poses set up because I'm showing that I've put up and down positions in for once.
On a slightly related note- I can't even do basic maths and when I say BASIC I mean BASIC.. I hate maths. I understand that Animation is a really non-technical pursuit.
Hey, that walk looks solid but it'd be really nice to see it from side on, really hard to crit with only a perspective or front view.
As for the snappyness etc, I guess what I'd say is this (bare in mind when I'm animating I don't touch curves much, animate strait ahead, and am generally very chaotic, which might not be your style):
When I want to give something punch, I just absolutely rocket every single aspect of it to the point where it's past being believable, then I dial it down just enough to read well. With a walk for example, just see what it looks like to slam the foot down perfectly vertically in 1 frame from knee height, and drag out the frames preceding it by double. It wont look good but if you push everything far enough you'll understand where to find the power in the animation.
Also, start with the foot, and think about its angle, if you have the toe pointing up to the sky, and over 1 frame it hit flat to the ground, you'll instantly see such a snap, then follow up to the hips, in the frames before the foot hits the ground, push the hips way in the opposite direction, creating animation that you FEEL is all about contrast, even putting in 1 frame of a contrasting pose before a foot hit, a punch hits, a jump, can make all the difference in the world.
Feel like I'm rambling, its's hard to explain, you just have to throw yourself into it and find the boundaries of aesthetic beauty.
Long time no animate =]
I've been having some 'life issues' but I went into Maya and sculpted a new animation based off my 2nd most recent 'walking ball' animation.
I've hidden the arms for now since I don't know how to handle them yet.
Good leg work? (if you see a weird hiccup on the 2nd step that's post infinite problem I think since it doesn't happen in the original 25 frames.)
Have you checked the graph editor to see what the problem with the infinity loop might be? You will probably see something wrong at about 25 frames(I'm guessing that's how long your sequence is), 2 identical frames or something.
Your animation looks good, I guess you've only worked on the legs and not the upper body? You should also add views from different angles, it's a bit hard to analyze your work from just one view. Also you've zoomed out too much.
Keep it up!
Thanks, I went side view because James was saying quite a while ago I should go for a side view. I'll look into the little foot problem.
I've actually worked on the legs and the torso quite a bit. It's got a good side to side, up and down, some rotations, stuff like that. I'll upload a front view as well soon.
That's a pretty nice tutorial. The only bit that it is missing is a bit of curve on the spine as it takes the impact of all that weight coming down. Right now, the back is a stiff board which takes a bit of the life out of the animation.
@Taylor: I think you're progressing along really well. And doing the right thing by just keeping at it and absorbing the information. A couple of things I'd like to suggest.
One. If you haven't already, I'd suggest putting away the walk cycles for a bit. Head back to the basics and do some bouncing call exercises. I know they are not fun, but getting it right is invaluable. I'm talking about doing heavy balls, bouncy balls, etc etc. You can break down a walk cycle into three major "bouncing balls". The hips, the chest, the head. There is a great online lecture by Brendan Body that I'd like for you to check out. http://www.brendanbody.co.uk/bb_lecture/index.html
The reason why we emphasize this exercise is because it touches on several of the 12 principles of animation. Timing, Spacing, Squash and Stretch, Slow in and Slow out, and Arcs. Get this right, and you've got a good portion of the battle conquered.
Two. Check out The 11 Second Club. I think they're a great fit for what you're looking to do. A great resource and the constant monthly challenge is great.
If you have any other questions feel free to PM me.
JnBaker - You're right. I should go back and do some bouncing ball animations. But I have been progressing in walks right? It looks pretty solid?
I'll check out the Brendan Body lecture. Also, I'm an avid forum user on 11 second club already =]
Natetheartist- That's because I barley knew how to do a walk back then
I just done it straight ahead and moved the arms up and down.
Lets not concentrate on the stuff I done ages ago. I've got a good formula down and I even hid the arms because I didn't know how to do them. All that matters is that it looks better than the ones I did before (apart from Walking Ball) But JnBaker is right, I should do some bouncing balls.
Er, sorry...I find that very offensive. What do you think I've been doing JimeeB?
That's not very polite. I'm fairly sure I've mentioned that I have read the entire Animators Survival Kit twice. You'd think over months that aspiring animator would read the animation principals right?
I, of course, have over 25 bookmarks, tutorials, webinars and all sorts of stuff dedicated to animation. Including the 12 principals --which every animator should know. That's like the basics of the basics, man. That's why I find it offensive.
Please, change your attitude. Everyone here is giving brilliant critiques and I find your blatant "Study these" post to be quite offensive.
Please put a little effort into your posts.
JnBaker - You're right. I should go back and do some bouncing ball animations. But I have been progressing in walks right? It looks pretty solid?
I'll check out the Brendan Body lecture. Also, I'm an avid forum user on 11 second club already =]
As I went through your progression, I saw you greatly improving. It tells me you're on the right track. A part of getting better is just doing it a lot and that's what you're doing. So keep it up
My over all critique (and something I struggle with myself so that is why is jumped out at me) is how quick your animations are. CG tends to look better the slower the animation is. In the animator's commentary for The Incredibles (I highly suggest watching it), they mention how Brad Bird had to often tell them to slow things down. They were all traditionally trained, but had to rework their process a bit to get the right feel.
I go back to Brendan on this one. Check out this "Behind the Scenes" on his blog. Although this is a fight scene, the action is fairly slow. But you really feel the impact of each hit.
Which is a general rule of thumb. The bigger something is, the slower and less it generally moves.
Edit- Isn't it just fast because it's a 25 frame cycle?
lol.
Partially. One thing you could do is open up your Tracks Editor and space the keys out some more. I don't have my Richard Williams book, but I think he mentions that a "standard" walk cycle is somewhere around 12 frames for a single step. I've found that with my CG characters, have a single step take 24 frames. Meaning 24 frames for one foot to travel from the back to the front, the whole cycle then being 48 frames.
The other part, is that this is where the lesson of spacing comes into play. Take the motion of a hand traveling from front to back across 25 frames for instance. You can control how quick that motion looks by how you space those two extremes. Put those extremes closer together across the same number of frames and you're going to get a slower motion over all.
So imagine a chart showing you this:
(1)|
|(25)
and then this:
(1)|
|(25)
The same number of frames, but since they are closer together in the second chart, you now have a slower motion.
For a test. Create a ball and key it moving forward say 10 grid units across 25 frames. Then create a second ball. Key it moving 5 grid units also across 25 frames, and you'll see what I mean
I hope that isn't too confusing. Feel free to ask any questions.
Replies
As for what you asked after that... is that all Maya lingo? Cause if so, you completely lost me. I could tell you exactly how I would do this with the 3DSMax biped, but I can't really help you with technical Maya stuff, since I still have to learn all that myself. Sorry :P
If you're interested in Pixar, get one of thier movies, get in on your computer, and put it in a program you can scrub through frame by frame. Watching it this slowly let's you see exactly how they moved things, the spacing, the timing, and their curves. You can even draw on your monitor with a dry-erase marker to track it yourself. Also, watching without volume is supposed to be useful too.
It might be helpful to bring the toes down a lot sooner before sliding the foot. It would also give you a little more time for some recoil (I think you're calling it down?)
Probably a more helpful link.
http://www.idleworm.com/how/anm/02w/walk1.shtml
Also the spear movement is a lot better but it kind of pops a little. Probably just a hickup or sharp point in the curve.
This thread has become a bounty of animation knowledge that I'll keep looking back on ; )
It's not so good on Splined/Clamped but they, it's an improvment right?
Thanks guys =]
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9rLRBBXRTHk
Edit- Wont embed but I'm sure you can click on the link
The down is definitley crucial and beneficial for weight.
Good work though.
I've never splined a walk cycle before, how do I go about it?
Thanks =]
I suggest checking how high your Up is, the angle of the hip, and the tilt on the foot. If it still won't stay, you'll probably have to lower his body. (Or... this is an unrelated problem :P)
=]
My latest walk cycle! =]
Following a more advanced PDF tutorial.
It's on 25 frames.
1 Contact > 4 Down > 10 Up > 13 Contact > 16 down > 19 up> 25> Contact
More advanced with the hips and all
It's still. Looking good?
It's still in stepped.
You are approaching this WAY too mathematically.
I'm merley trying to tell you my walk cycle set up, mate.
I'm telling you how I have my poses set up because I'm showing that I've put up and down positions in for once.
On a slightly related note- I can't even do basic maths and when I say BASIC I mean BASIC.. I hate maths. I understand that Animation is a really non-technical pursuit.
Thanks everyone.
Hey that's it splinned.
How do I go about making it all snappy and give weight to it?
As for the snappyness etc, I guess what I'd say is this (bare in mind when I'm animating I don't touch curves much, animate strait ahead, and am generally very chaotic, which might not be your style):
When I want to give something punch, I just absolutely rocket every single aspect of it to the point where it's past being believable, then I dial it down just enough to read well. With a walk for example, just see what it looks like to slam the foot down perfectly vertically in 1 frame from knee height, and drag out the frames preceding it by double. It wont look good but if you push everything far enough you'll understand where to find the power in the animation.
Also, start with the foot, and think about its angle, if you have the toe pointing up to the sky, and over 1 frame it hit flat to the ground, you'll instantly see such a snap, then follow up to the hips, in the frames before the foot hits the ground, push the hips way in the opposite direction, creating animation that you FEEL is all about contrast, even putting in 1 frame of a contrasting pose before a foot hit, a punch hits, a jump, can make all the difference in the world.
Feel like I'm rambling, its's hard to explain, you just have to throw yourself into it and find the boundaries of aesthetic beauty.
I'm more of a pose-to-pose guy.
I'll take your crits on-board tho, thanks.
Long time no animate =]
I've been having some 'life issues' but I went into Maya and sculpted a new animation based off my 2nd most recent 'walking ball' animation.
I've hidden the arms for now since I don't know how to handle them yet.
Good leg work? (if you see a weird hiccup on the 2nd step that's post infinite problem I think since it doesn't happen in the original 25 frames.)
Your animation looks good, I guess you've only worked on the legs and not the upper body? You should also add views from different angles, it's a bit hard to analyze your work from just one view. Also you've zoomed out too much.
Keep it up!
I've actually worked on the legs and the torso quite a bit. It's got a good side to side, up and down, some rotations, stuff like that. I'll upload a front view as well soon.
Thanks, again =]
http://www.angryanimator.com/word/2008/11/01/animation-tutorial-2-walk-cycle/
Best walk cycle tut I've ever read or used.
That's a pretty nice tutorial. The only bit that it is missing is a bit of curve on the spine as it takes the impact of all that weight coming down. Right now, the back is a stiff board which takes a bit of the life out of the animation.
@Taylor: I think you're progressing along really well. And doing the right thing by just keeping at it and absorbing the information. A couple of things I'd like to suggest.
One. If you haven't already, I'd suggest putting away the walk cycles for a bit. Head back to the basics and do some bouncing call exercises. I know they are not fun, but getting it right is invaluable. I'm talking about doing heavy balls, bouncy balls, etc etc. You can break down a walk cycle into three major "bouncing balls". The hips, the chest, the head. There is a great online lecture by Brendan Body that I'd like for you to check out.
http://www.brendanbody.co.uk/bb_lecture/index.html
The reason why we emphasize this exercise is because it touches on several of the 12 principles of animation. Timing, Spacing, Squash and Stretch, Slow in and Slow out, and Arcs. Get this right, and you've got a good portion of the battle conquered.
Two. Check out The 11 Second Club. I think they're a great fit for what you're looking to do. A great resource and the constant monthly challenge is great.
If you have any other questions feel free to PM me.
The hands in your animations feel really stiff, rigid up to the elbow.
Namely in the "sad robot" expected movement would be for his hands to be slack, instead of parrying the air.
Its good to see that you're on here getting critique! I think more animators of the game-art variety should be posting!
I'll check out the Brendan Body lecture. Also, I'm an avid forum user on 11 second club already =]
Natetheartist- That's because I barley knew how to do a walk back then
I just done it straight ahead and moved the arms up and down.
Lets not concentrate on the stuff I done ages ago. I've got a good formula down and I even hid the arms because I didn't know how to do them. All that matters is that it looks better than the ones I did before (apart from Walking Ball) But JnBaker is right, I should do some bouncing balls.
Thanks
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/12_basic_principles_of_animation
Er, sorry...I find that very offensive. What do you think I've been doing JimeeB?
That's not very polite. I'm fairly sure I've mentioned that I have read the entire Animators Survival Kit twice. You'd think over months that aspiring animator would read the animation principals right?
I, of course, have over 25 bookmarks, tutorials, webinars and all sorts of stuff dedicated to animation. Including the 12 principals --which every animator should know. That's like the basics of the basics, man. That's why I find it offensive.
Please, change your attitude. Everyone here is giving brilliant critiques and I find your blatant "Study these" post to be quite offensive.
Please put a little effort into your posts.
Good day.
As I went through your progression, I saw you greatly improving. It tells me you're on the right track. A part of getting better is just doing it a lot and that's what you're doing. So keep it up
My over all critique (and something I struggle with myself so that is why is jumped out at me) is how quick your animations are. CG tends to look better the slower the animation is. In the animator's commentary for The Incredibles (I highly suggest watching it), they mention how Brad Bird had to often tell them to slow things down. They were all traditionally trained, but had to rework their process a bit to get the right feel.
I go back to Brendan on this one. Check out this "Behind the Scenes" on his blog. Although this is a fight scene, the action is fairly slow. But you really feel the impact of each hit.
Which is a general rule of thumb. The bigger something is, the slower and less it generally moves.
I will check that stuff out.
Edit- Isn't it just fast because it's a 25 frame cycle?
lol.
Partially. One thing you could do is open up your Tracks Editor and space the keys out some more. I don't have my Richard Williams book, but I think he mentions that a "standard" walk cycle is somewhere around 12 frames for a single step. I've found that with my CG characters, have a single step take 24 frames. Meaning 24 frames for one foot to travel from the back to the front, the whole cycle then being 48 frames.
The other part, is that this is where the lesson of spacing comes into play. Take the motion of a hand traveling from front to back across 25 frames for instance. You can control how quick that motion looks by how you space those two extremes. Put those extremes closer together across the same number of frames and you're going to get a slower motion over all.
So imagine a chart showing you this:
(1)|
|(25)
and then this:
(1)|
|(25)
The same number of frames, but since they are closer together in the second chart, you now have a slower motion.
For a test. Create a ball and key it moving forward say 10 grid units across 25 frames. Then create a second ball. Key it moving 5 grid units also across 25 frames, and you'll see what I mean
I hope that isn't too confusing. Feel free to ask any questions.
Hey, would I find The Incredible's commentary on youtube?