Playstation 4 Thread
mod
Well, the rumour mills have started full swing. Not sure how much of it is true or not. But honestly, I like the used game thing, I don't like the not backwards compatible thing.
http://kotaku.com/5896996/the-next-playstation-is-called-orbis-sources-say-here-are-the-details
http://kotaku.com/5896996/the-next-playstation-is-called-orbis-sources-say-here-are-the-details
Replies
The reason I'm sounding so down is because I had some nasty experiences with the PS3. Mainly problems with games running at sub-par framerates that hurt my eyes and freezing. Not to mention the online browser is awful. I don't use it often but it was nice to have the option to surf in my TV lounge room.
Basically I stayed with Sony since the PS1 and I had this mentality that Microsoft wasn't as good but now I'm starting to think the opposite.
The downloading and account locking sounds like it might be the start of a steam like system, which could be cool, not having to have your discs to play the game, etc etc. But account locking has me worried for a few reasons, how would sharing a console with roomates or family work? And no offline options? Really?
I don't want to have to connect every damn thing I own to the Internet.
I like the idea of being easily transfering media between devices, but I don't want to be getting facebook and twitter updates while exploring though a jungle.
The original Playstation was abbreviated PSX for the first few years of its life, the code name for the unreleased SNES CD. Around the launch of the PS2 it was changed to PS1/PSone officially. Then a modified PS2 was released in Japan that could burn dvds, it was called the PSX. So Sony is no stranger to this sort of thing.
Account Security. If these games are locked to your account and your account is stolen what do you do? Even though you still have the disks they are basically useless now. How is Sony going to re-assure customers that they can keep everything secured after the fiasco with the PS3 hacking?
That would be one of my biggest concerns. I'm sure I'll get one. Probably not at launch but when the good titles roll out I'm sure it will join my shelf...
greed + the fact that they lose money on the console hardware. consoles and their development cost are usually subsidized by games sold. That's also the reason for all the DLC - you cannot resell that. Somehow those consoles must be paid for.
about the analogy: cars and books have wear and tear often making them less attractive - a used game itself (if the dvd is ok) is usually just the same as a new copy. And nobody cares anymore about game manuals and boxes any more either.
Except it's not a scapegoat, you can quantify how many used copies are sold vs new. You can even see that the used ones are only a few dollars cheaper so it's not like the pricepoint is bad, it's only a few dollars "worse" than new.
isnt that the same risk most people take with something like steam?
although a desktop is a bit harder to swipe than a console, i dont think that would be too much of an issue if the proper security measures were taken like steam has done more recently
Rumor that is called "Orbis"... really?
http://arstechnica.com/gaming/news/2012/03/ps3-successor-orbis-rumored-for-late-2013-ties-retail-games-to-online-accounts.ars?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=rss
That just looks like another version of Playstation move, and plus there is a playstation eye? (if this concept is even accurate...)
Not that ive ever been one for modding my console or doing anything ban worthy but Ive had friends who have gotten banned through what more or less was a misunderstanding.
I would really like some assurances that I could transfer stuff over or st least get some credit. Otherwise I smell a potential class action suit.
It also means, if someone breaks into your house and steal your console and your whole game collection, the worth would be in the actual PSN account, which you could just change password on and activate on your new ps4.
Services like steam retain the right to shut down your account without further notice if you break any rules, but they're much more interested in keeping you buying new games rather than do a move that would alienate you forever.
100% agreed. Ive been saying for years that games are too expensive...the price of a blueray (£20) seams like it would undercut second hand sales out of the loop. the market for second hand DVDS and blueray is no where near that of games, the reason i think is the resale price is below what most people would consider worth it and instead people collect them way more. this would lead to a wider market with more room in peoples wallet for more radical or impulse purchases.
and the arguement that games cost more to make and a re longer therefore need to charge more is bullshit... an indie film thats shot for under a million costs the same amount on realease (generally)as the 100 million blockbuster. more sales at less money will decrease top sellers margins by a bit BUT would increase sales of lesser titles leveling the playing feild a bit, and hopefully making most middle market games less risky finacially
getting any publisher to take that initial hit would be hard part... swapping to digital seams to be the opportune time. ESP as people would not think the product de-valued as they are not receiving a hard copy and all the rest of the gumph
That's the thing that Ive been thinking about. I know their are people who have issues with Steam's policy, but due to steam being a PC/Mac platform it hasnt really been challenged heavily from a consumer standpoint. Due to the much more mainstream (and larger) audience that consoles have I could see having your account taken away plus the purchases tied to it raising a lot more stink.
I don't like the idea of storing games on the system's drive, since the manufacturers like to try making the drives difficult/expensive to upgrade. So, once the system gets full of games that I've purchased, I'd have to either buy an overpriced, higher capacity drive, or juggling which games I keep on my system.
I don't care that the industry doesn't like used game stores. I have no issue with them (well, the concept, not their business practices). I want hard copies of my games, so I can play them if my internet is down for some reason. Plus, what recourse does a consumer have, if they pay $60 for a game, and it sucks? Sorry, you just lost $60. There's no chance of taking it to Gamestop and recouping some of that money.
The way I see it, 'download only' options, only hurt the consumers.
http://www.product-reviews.net/2012/03/29/sony-ps4-orbis-rumors-promising-but-controversial/
Personally, I think gamestop has been screwing themselves over for years, and this is the result of it. If they weren't so greedy, and still gave a share of used game profits to the developers, sony and microsoft wouldnt be trying to get rid of used games. But gamestop knowingly screws the companies that provide them with income, and this will be the result.
I for one want the used games ban. But, it has to be done right. Maybe a master account for the system, then you can sign into your own personal account after, for personal trophies.
Used games I never buy. I'm always scared of scratches, etc. Plus people making the actual games never see the money. Seems couter productive at that point. Just send the devs $40 and pirate the game instead of buying used games.
I haven't bought a physically PC game in about 4 years of so. Steam, Origin thing, or direct from the company website. Why should consoles be any different.
And Gamestop greedy? Yeah, but so are most game companies. They are all greedy fucks. Even if gamestop agreed to share 1%, the sony/ms/developers would want 2%. If gamestop offered 2%, they'd want 3%.
Just like the RIAA, and MPAA, the gaming industry is late at correcting the issue, and their counter measures only hurt consumers
But no backwards compatibility AGAIN?? Fuck that noise. If this machine is worth the money they're going to be charging for it, it should be backwards compatible all the way back to the PS1!:poly127:
I waited 5 years to get a ps3 to Relive .Hack 1-4 and .Hack//G.U from the ps2, Not knowing the slims weren't Backwards compatible I raged when I put one of the discs in and it wouldn't play, I just waisted 300$ on an ugly Demo Machine, and the BC 40gigs are still 500$...
I don't want to have to hook up my ps3 years from now just to play Demon's soul's again! I'm only human and extremely lazy.
I guess I'm a minotiry here, but I'll get the PS4 when it comes, except it has some major let downs other than the backwards compatibility that doesen't affect me personally.
I bought my PS3 for Uncharted and MGS4 and to have a BluRay player. I bought my 360 for Gears and XBLive.
I really don't give a fuck about the hardware in the abstract, it's all about the games (or other features, as these keep moving towards Entertainment Center Convergence)
If these rumors are true about the ps4 you won't be able to do that anymore.
I've never enjoyed gaming more than I have with Steam and I really welcome a new generation to push things forward a bit. Like keg said earlier, it makes sense if they are switching from cell to x64 that it would be too costly to provide backwards compatibility.
i didn't give 2 shits that the snes could not play nes games,or a dreamcast could not play genesis carts, or dos games didn't work on xp, or gameboy games not working in a gba, or atari 2600 games not working in a jaguar, or vhs tapes not working in a dvd player, or the tires from my 1964 mustang not fitting on my 2012 bmw, or the shoes i had when i was 4 years old not fitting anymore, or 8 tracks not playing on my ipod.
guess what?
shit changes, get over it.
if you like playing archaic games no one plays anymore go buy vintage hardware to play them. its not the responsibility of hardware manufactures to cater to your outdated catalog of media. why should they have to invest extra money and resources for a small percentage self entitled complainers? One of sony's biggest mistakes this gen was even attempting it, it cost so much extra money to shoe-horn in the vacuum tubes and wood paneling of the ps2 into the ps3 that the system was way bigger and much more expensive. this made the same butt hurt cry babies that would complain about something so irrelevant as backwards compatibility cry about price, so they didn't accomplish anything.
If you have a huge collection of PS3 games... well chances are you have a PS3... lol
I don't give a shit about backwards compatibility. If I want to play an older game then I'll use my older system. Pretty simple stuff.
As a while I think gamers act way too self entitled....
Regardless, used game sales are terrible for dev's / pubs. The all digital future though will take care of that. And I don't think the next consoles are ready for discless.
Also, for those worring about taking their games with them. They will be tied to your account, not the console. So go to a friends, log into your account on his ps4, download game / saves. Play? That is how it works on the ps3.
What I am interested in is if now we will be able to have 1080p at 60fps as the standard.
Also I don't see why so many people are surprised with the whole locked to one account, no used games and constant internet connection when a lot of PC games work like that already with Origin and Steam.
I assumed that this would be already the case in some scenarios, because my PS3 is hooked up to the internet all the time without any problems.
And as you mentioned, with the PC it already works just fine. Sure it's kind of a stupid thing, but as long as it works I'm okay with it.
^ This
Since game companies are pushing for digital downloads should that bring down the price of games? I mean it obviously takes a big chunk away from production cost and also takes out the middle men like GameStop.
Also, I think I am going to skip over the hype of buying a new console. I have always been a PC person myself and would rather put the money to better use in that area. Things were easier in high school and early college, but since I'm soon to be married and money is tight, I think my fiance and I will kick back and play all of the discounted PS3 games.
also i dont think you can compare preowned games with books, cars, movies etc...
noone mind that you sell your game on ebay or wherever... the main problem is that special retailers advertising preowned games right next (sometimes even more prominently placed) to new ones and even ask people who want to buy new games to get a preowned copy....
Unforunatly downloading will be no good. Games are getting bigger in size, games around 10-15gb like batman for example, will take hours to download to a new console.
Right now I can take 10-20 or even more games with me to a friends house and play all afternoon.
With this tech I'll need to drag a console over. If we're playing a street fighter game for example and want to switch to say a new gears game and each is on different consoles we'll have to keep plugging and unplugging devices.
Not to mention porting over profiles.
The other solution is to have my friend use up his hdd space for what ever games I have for the times I go over.
Just seems incredibly annoying. I'd rather have the annoying code tying it to my account and have the physical media like its stated.
Pretty much, there's nothing left at all but a gigantic chain of gamestops, the used-games market is since long ago already dead.
All you'll find there is new games with none of your money going to the developers, you're better off saving the money by pirating that game, then at least you're saving money for a new game instead of used.
Woah, classy there.
I have a selection of 5 consoles that completely take up all the available space I have, and I'm running out of available connections, not to mention: I can't imagine the nightmare of having to have had to keep all the pc iterations I got over the years.
Removal of the ps2 hardware I could understand, but otherOS and psx emulation in the ps3 were both removed for no apparent reason since both were features completely unrelated to need of hardware.
The ps4 is not going to be able to emulate the ps3, but the ps2 and psx could realistically be done, even the psp comes with a built in emulator for psx games.
But then again, it's easier to sell games over and over again.
Calling it self-entitlement is a bit of a low blow considering these consoles are products made for the consumers that request these features, at the very least understand the wishes.
Nintendo has been highly successful with backwards compatibility, it's the thing that makes people considering buying a new console even if there's only a few games out there.
Gameboy games on gba, gba games on ds, ds games on 3ds.
Gamecube games on wii, wii games on wii U.
It's all very relative, some parts of the world really needs to catch up when it comes to internet-infrastructure, especially since everything relies to heavily on it.
As any hardcore steam user knows, downloading games is pretty fast.
Still, this is the reason physical media will remain for consoles even if it goes all digital, you simply install the game from disc without having to download anything but a patch, but from there it's drm.
I understand why people want backwards emulation... ideally id love to have a device that can handle anything I try to insert in it. But these devices are supposed to push the industry forward and allow for new and exciting things. The product life cycle is increasing and id much rather they did the most they possibly could to move the tech forward rather than meet any sort of middle ground.
As far as backwards compatibility is concerned, well Ive often looked at old games and thought must play that again but never got round to doing so.. theres just too much new stuff to play..