[ZBrush] Sea Creature & Rider
polycounter lvl 10
Hey guys, over the next few weeks I will be attempting to learn ZBrush. I tried and kinda dropped it a couple months ago, but it's time to try again haha. My plan is to create a monster and then a rider that goes with it.
I'm going with an aquatic predator theme. My creature is pretty big; its rider will be about the length of its forearm. It's blind, and uses a sensory system to detect motion in the water in order to navigate. I used a combination of references for its anatomy: his front legs are kindof like shrimp claws, they tuck in when he swims; his back legs are based off frog legs and will propel him; he has an eely face
:)
Also of importance to me: My personal challenge is to make this creature look somewhat menacing, as opposed to my usual tendency of making cute, pretty things. No cute monster!! If you see anything that is making him 'cute' please notify >_> I'd like to see if I can make something more serious this time hahaha.
Here is some of the ref:
So far I have the block-out, in Dynamesh at 72 res. I am looking for critique on design, aesthetics, and function - are the shapes interesting? What do you think of the silhouette? Is there balance, variety? I'd love some fresh eyes for this, all critique and comments appreciated. (p.s. he will have teeth, I totally forgot about those...)
Thanks!
Jessica
I'm going with an aquatic predator theme. My creature is pretty big; its rider will be about the length of its forearm. It's blind, and uses a sensory system to detect motion in the water in order to navigate. I used a combination of references for its anatomy: his front legs are kindof like shrimp claws, they tuck in when he swims; his back legs are based off frog legs and will propel him; he has an eely face
:)Also of importance to me: My personal challenge is to make this creature look somewhat menacing, as opposed to my usual tendency of making cute, pretty things. No cute monster!! If you see anything that is making him 'cute' please notify >_> I'd like to see if I can make something more serious this time hahaha.
Here is some of the ref:
So far I have the block-out, in Dynamesh at 72 res. I am looking for critique on design, aesthetics, and function - are the shapes interesting? What do you think of the silhouette? Is there balance, variety? I'd love some fresh eyes for this, all critique and comments appreciated. (p.s. he will have teeth, I totally forgot about those...)
Thanks!
Jessica
Replies
Will those be able to protract? Or what is their purpose.
And if the back legs are meant to propel it along, I think they'd need to look more powerful/thicker. Mostly on the bottom region, near the webbed feet.
Anyway, just some thoughts - awesome work.
This will be enjoyable to watch
Thanks for the critique on the back legs too, that makes sense, I will revisit them.
http://fc05.deviantart.net/fs70/f/2011/071/4/c/3d_geometry_tutorial_by_bobbie_the_jean-d3bh66u.jpg
if you already kno all of these few things, you can blame me ^^,
otherwise, very good start
alright then ! but it ill be hard to do the retopology in this pose because i did experienced it once unless you have topogun or 3dcoat that will help you greatly, aside that, it's your choice
Hope this make sense for you.
PS: Have you put pandaria fan art in a hold? I was so anxious too see the progress =(
I'm guessing you'll be changing the pose after you've got the base symmetry done though? It's not as dynamic as it could be
As for the design I like most of it, just the arms feel a bit random to me. Especially the claw part, not sure what to make of it.
I also think that maybe adding more fins to the tail and making it flatter and wider (bit like the deep sea eel reference you posted). This way I could imagine him using his legs for a burst of speed during an attack (like frogs swim in tiny bursts of speed) and he could use his tail to swim longer distances.
Somehow I think ending the tail in the shape of a coelacanth tail would be awesome:
Awesome start though!
Fair enough, makes sense. It would probably also help keep that sleek agile feel with the current legs.
Tenchi - I really like your idea for the tail, I think it would make more sense and look a lot better too - right now it is just round and boring haha.
allaze-eroler - Hmmm, I might repose him neutrally if it will make the retopo easier, because I don't want complications there. But then he would be stuck in that icky neutral pose for the final, since I won't be getting around to the rigging.
jramauri - You're right, I could develop his background a little more - perhaps it will give me insight into how I could spice up his design. I haven't thought of the rider yet, or what the creature's enviro is really like. I will take some pencil to paper for it hehe. As for the Pandaren stuff, it is still in the works, but school started recently so now I have a couple other projects on my plate (this being one of them). Progress will be posted on that soon, thanks for asking
MeintevdS - Thanks for that ref pic, I can totally see that working too
I've also been messing around with presentation/render settings in ZBrush, let me know if this is reading well:
Here are my old render settings (basically just default settings with some Wax Preview on xD):
Thanks!
Jessica
Anyway, the project is going well. Looking forward for updates.
For feedback, I've gotta agree with jramauri on the new front hands, they don't make much sense. Maybe combine the back feet style with the concept of the folding pincer foreclaw? Like, webbed fingers, but with one of the fingers larger than the others, serving as the claw? If the back feet were the only "flippers", they'd have to be much bigger to make a creature like this move underwater.
For crits, I think the muscle definiation on the creature, along with its shape, is looking more like a grayhound then an aquatic creature. Maybe if you think more along the lines of rough or odd skin deformations (your reference images are perfect for this!), gills, scales, etc, it would help the creature feel more at home in an aquatic setting. Anyway, looking forward to your next update!
I think his main form of attack should be his mouth, so making his front legs have web'd feet would help the creature be able to propel itself through the water, or making the back tail fin larger to get it more power.
I also imagine this creature to be colored dark, because it will want to blend into the wherever it is hiding..waiting for a innocent fish or other unsuspecting creature to come within its range.
And finally another thing this reminds me of is a "power pole" used in boats to anchor themselves but it still allows rotation. So if the creature could perhaps puncture the surface floor and hold a steady position, or maybe go to sleep, or feel vibrations within a surface better.
If so, I can't see where you'd ride without a huge risk of getting impaled. :P
jramauri, Ferg, SCB - I've decided to keep the front claws because giving him webbed fingers was making him look less menacing. However, to reinforce his swimming functionality, I took the advice of making the back feet and tail a lot bigger, and shrunk his front claws as well. Hopefully this also draws his appearance further away from 'grayhound' and more toward aquatic. I've added some scales and other skin details in the sculpt, but will work more on that in the texture as well.
whalesharkbite, samcole - Thanks guys! Loved the impressions of his narrative. They really did help me to visualize him better :]
Bardler - Part of our assignment for this project was to do the concepting solely in ZBrush. I guess this is because our teacher wanted us to get used to the interface and dynamesh's visualization abilities.
pseudoBug - Hmmm, let's pretend those spiky things coming from his fins are soft xD I guess I could take them off, but I am trying to stick with a sharp shape language. What do you think? I do find it difficult to balance between functionality and aesthetics sometimes haha.
So here is the final sculpt, or as final as time will allow. Retopo'd version will be posted soon, sometime Sunday I think. Thanks again for all the critique
The bigger back legs look good for swimming but the upper leg muscle just looks to big for the body its connected to i think. Also im going to have to agree with other people on those front legs. While you've added some menacing in a way, i think your also taking away from it in another. You lose mobility by changing the front legs and i think in this case your going for a speedy creature. By removing some of the speed you're also decreasing its threat level.
Just a thought anyway, still love it! Cant wait to see it done
The presentation needs to be tweaked. Drop the gradient fade in the bg (Document>Range to the left). That screams I just opened ZBrush look.
Also I'd adjust the material to push the specular more since this is supposed to be a water creature.
Add some sweet looking teeth too!
5,470 tris:
And the sculpt again for reference:
Wow, both characters and environments
Also worth pointing out that even a fully quaded mesh can have nasty poles in it depending on how it ends up triangulated. If you're using 3DS Max use turn edges to look at the models triangulation.
In regards to the joint topology, here's a still relevant discussion on the topic: http://www.polycount.com/forum/showthread.php?t=61079
Stromberg90 - Thanks! Yeah, school has us touch on everything haha.
toxic_h20 - Thank youI but dunno what you are talking about man, you work REALLY fast xD
Tigerfeet - Yes, these triangles sure are difficult to eliminate :x Thanks for pointing out some of the errors :], I will fix them.
dll - Okies, I will cut down on the torso and fix the tris around the neck. I didn't know about the turn edges thing, I will def check it out, and thank you for the link as well!
I feel I've made a tremendous error naming myself dii cause it's always misread -____-
bake bake :] Just tried XNormal for the first time, love it !! super fast and easy to use 8] Texture progress to be posted soon:
*EDIT: SORRY dii !!! I'll be sure to get it right from now on ! xD And thanks for pointing out about the floating fins - now that I have baked my normal map, I will attach them to the body (they didn't have anything to do with the bake, they will just have diffuse and spec on).
Polypaint - critique and comments welcome:
njc6425 - I think that tip about the mottling pass worked really well, so thanks! Also still working on the webbing trying to fake some SSS.
Progress - Critique and comments welcome! UDK Shot:
Color:
Spec:
Character concepts will be posted soon!
Leaning toward the one in the bottom right at the moment:
An older iteration (might revert to some elements from this one..)
Some reference for design, color, and material inspiration:
Progress:
Thanks!
Jessica
Logically, although I could be wrong on this, I think the gills would be lower down like along the neck or even on the body itself. However from a design standpoint putting some sort of gill on the face itself could look cool. you could even put them right under the cheekbones to emphasize them more and push her into a more "severe" pointed look.
Also, personally I don't really like the lack of ears on her, I know that technically speaking flat ear-holes probably make more sense underwater, but like the flattened nose I think I prefer the concept, having some sort of noticeable delicate fin-shaped ears could really get her feeling more than human as well as add a bit more interest to the head.
On a good note I'm really liking how sea-weathered coral-like and barnacley you've made the bit of armor you've sculpted so far.