Can you help push me?
Hey PC,
I have drooled over the art on this site for years... Even went as far as to make a subpar sketchbook thread with a few crappy works in it. Every since I can remember, my dream has been to make art for videogames. I remember playing on my commodore 64 and my first nintendo until the wee hours of the morning, dreaming of the ninja turtle/robocop/terminator games I would make. I used to draw constantly!
Fast forward to today, I'm a couple years shy of 30, and thanks to hefty amounts of procrastination, and me picking up the guitar and dropping the pencil for a few years, I've returned for one last go at this. I still have that dream, and I feel as though time is running out, but hopefully when they say its never too late, they mean it.
Which is why I'm here. I want you guys to completely destroy and rebuild me. Out of sheer respect and admiration for the artists on this site, I know this is the place to go.
So after a hiatus I have returned to zbrush, and this is about where I am at. I need guidance and ideas and anything you guys can throw at me.
There are a few obvious problems (missing ears etc) but these aren't finished, I'm just not loving the progress on them so I want to bring them here and see where I can focus moving forward.
There it is, I'll keep going in this thread, hopefully I get some replies, but if you guys are tired of this sort of thing, I understand lol
I have drooled over the art on this site for years... Even went as far as to make a subpar sketchbook thread with a few crappy works in it. Every since I can remember, my dream has been to make art for videogames. I remember playing on my commodore 64 and my first nintendo until the wee hours of the morning, dreaming of the ninja turtle/robocop/terminator games I would make. I used to draw constantly!
Fast forward to today, I'm a couple years shy of 30, and thanks to hefty amounts of procrastination, and me picking up the guitar and dropping the pencil for a few years, I've returned for one last go at this. I still have that dream, and I feel as though time is running out, but hopefully when they say its never too late, they mean it.
Which is why I'm here. I want you guys to completely destroy and rebuild me. Out of sheer respect and admiration for the artists on this site, I know this is the place to go.
So after a hiatus I have returned to zbrush, and this is about where I am at. I need guidance and ideas and anything you guys can throw at me.
There are a few obvious problems (missing ears etc) but these aren't finished, I'm just not loving the progress on them so I want to bring them here and see where I can focus moving forward.
There it is, I'll keep going in this thread, hopefully I get some replies, but if you guys are tired of this sort of thing, I understand lol
Replies
At least that is how I was taught.
Also.. don't let the other threads with the amazing sculpts and breathtaking textures take you down. Look at those as inspiration and reference for whatever you do, everyone started out somewhere.
That is all I have for ya Good Luck!
So, best of luck. And keep at it mate.
Edit: If you already follow this idealism then disregard this post. But even so it may be a good reminder that going back to those Loomis or Bridgeman books you may have is a good place to start improving.
You have to love what youre doing. If you just started dont expect anything extraordinary from you. Just try to get fun from any stuff youre working on. As in any profession it takes time to learn how to make good work. Be patient and love to learn. Take any task, even the most boring as a chance to learn. Have an open mind and be grateful for critics you receive from people.
In other words, be persistent and be committed. The games arena is a highly competitive environment across the nation and as harsh as this may sound, don't wait until somebody spoon-feeds you because nobody will. You have to be hungry to get that dream job of yours.
We can definitely help you here, but you're the one who has to push yourself.
Good luck and never give up!
I think it ultimately boils down to this.
If you're coming back to give 3D another shot, it doesn't seem like you love doing 3D.
However, one thing I noticed during the very first time I got into 3D; I got bored of it because of bad instruction using bad tools from some free 3D class at a local skills center for Digipen. Used Hash animation master... that was terrible.
Then they'd take an entire day to teach us to put texture projections on a jeep with 34 polygons or something really low, and then animate it along a spline... granted this was about 7 years ago, but from what I understand Digipen's 3D courses haven't improved much...
Then I found out what the real powerful and most widely used 3D programs were, and this was a couple years later. I was able to learn the basics a lot better on my own with tutorials and then I wasn't as frustrated. I was learning to overcome my own shortcomings as I learned and progressed.
Just keep with it if you really have a passion for this.
I have been studying anatomy/loomis here lately, and I do feel like I've seen some improvements, and understand some forms a little better. I will keep studying, does anyone have any really awesome anatomy/sculpture/figure drawing links they could share?
I think my biggest hurdle is time management, which I'm sure isn't a new concept to any of you guys, but I work 60 to 70 hours a week and also take care of my 3 year old
I have this strange block that seems to keep me from finishing my little projects, like I get really bored of what I'm working on and want to jump to a new idea, any tips for combating this?
I really am soaking all this in, so please keep the replies coming guys! I've also been following some of the other progress threads on here and they are great. Really, thanks for takin the time to help me guys.
Pushing yourself is the only thing you can do, you will also have to as an artist if you want to improve, no matter what field you are in. Comparing your work to others on these forums will help you and after a while you'll see a path you can take. (After many months I recently found mine.) Just never give up on it, even if you think you'll go insane.
Do you guys have any tips for working with reference? I've always loved to sketch, but I've never really been one to use a reference, its' always just came from my head. I'm finding it difficult to reproduce something, like what should I be looking for? What should I exaggerate?
Thanks everyone!
This one I did today in about an hour, no reference (I know, I know lol) I was actually trying to work from memory and recreate the one below, or at least come close.
This one I actually used a reference image, but I was having some trouble recreating the reference and then zbrush crashed and I didn't have a very recent save
Here is a link to the reference.
https://picasaweb.google.com/danwill/InspirationErickSosa#5555126020307189346
I heard something about art in general, that not using reference is not something that should be looked down upon. Maybe I'm just reading your posts wrong which if I am sorry. simply ignore this or maybe it will help someone like the other posts on this thread helped me.
after I wrote this and before I submitted I went and searched for what I read about using reference.
This enlightened me and encouraged me to use it as much as I can.
REFERENCE IS A CRUCIAL AID
Before I move on, I want to quickly talk about and encourage that everyone use reference--it doesn't by any means make you a bad artist. I find time and time again that beginning artists feel like using reference is cheating. Well, I'm here to tell you that every professional artist working today uses reference, it's the only way you're going to learn and make things as realistic as possible, even if your work is stylized.
How are you going to understand how the world looks, how color and light behave, and a million other things if you're not observing the real world directly or through reference?
I laugh every time I see a description on someone's work and it says, "No referenced used." Many say in a way that indicates pride or maybe even an inflated ego, but let me tell you a couple things:
Half those people are lying to you, and with the other half it's generally obvious they didn't use reference, and I think to myself, "Yeah, maybe you should have, it could have been much better." Only a very tiny percentage of the people that say that are actually pulling off something remarkable without deceiving you.
I don't think using reference would be anything to be looked down upon. Especially if you are shooting for accuracy, but then I'm left wondering how do you make something you've never seen before :poly124:
I was curious if anyone had any tips for using reference, like how do you measure out the silhouette when you begin a sculpture, to match it to the reference. Does anyone have any tips for that? I assume you pull out the silhouette first and worry about form after?
Some people take to sketching things out in 3D which some of the same principles apply. Work on the silhouette, don't rush to high levels of subdivisions to knock in the veins on an arm when the overall forms are still muddy.
The problem I see you having is that you're making a face and trying to get the pieces in the right places. I need a nose, I need some lips, but you're not actually creating someones lips, there isn't any character to it you're not making "grizzled mountain man lips" or "hot sexy female lips" you're making "mannequin lips" for a "mannequin man" because you are trying to make "lips".
Once you start to try and create "character" in your models, you start to try and figure out what makes up those characteristics. From there you build up a library of ideas about what makes certain things look like they do. Suddenly you're not looking for reference of "lips" but you want big bubba lips, or cowboy lips, or puffy runway model lips, or 90 year old grandma lips...
Sure learn the anatomy but don't forget a large part of creating characters is adding in the characteristic details.
So where does it start? It starts with the character and personality, the body type, the occupation, the race and gender, the age, the clothing, the time period. All of that factors into what shape the lips are. So maybe you need to focus on thinking up some characters that are interesting to you and try figuring out what makes those characters the way they are.
If you're going to make an old man are you going to look up Justin Bieber lips? Probably not...
TL:DR, Practice.
You are absolutely right, I cannot seem for the life of me, to capture character. Its like I get comfortable with a certain technique, the lips are a good example. Now that you've brought this up, looking over these models they all have the same structure to their lips. Its the best way I've found to do it
I'm 28 years old, and this has been a dream of mine since I was 5. I hope that in a years time I'll be making a post here on polycount about my first industry job. Thank you guys for the comments, please keep em' coming. I know these help threads get a little old for you guys, but this is what makes this community so awesome.
Back to the drawing board!
Do you guys have any sculpting tips for the eyes and lips? What brushes work best for those forms, should I mask a lot etc? Thanks!
So far I have improving faster than just trying the 3D way (if there is one) and also found that I actually love 2D also
Today I'm drawing thousands of skulls of a variety of angles and with different characteristics and trying to think about the drawing as if it was a 3d object.
Everything you would need for it would be a pencil, a paper, an eraser, some books on the subject and maybe some of this courses http://www.thegnomonworkshop.com/store/category/10/Comic-Book-Illustration
The book I most use right now as I'm drawing only faces for the moment is [ame]http://www.amazon.com/Facial-Expressions-Visual-Reference-Artists/dp/0823016714/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1311650713&sr=8-2[/ame]
Maybe tomorrow if you have any interest I could show you some of my training.
Hope it helps,
Gustavo.
I've been sketching portraits and basic anatomy (mostly focused on the face right now as well) so this is great! I've noticed a real improvement with this method from where I was when I made my sketchbook so many moons ago.
I'd love to see some of your training, feel free to post it here if you'd like!
Heres a new one I knocked out last night... Still unhappy with the features, but the proportion and silhouette are improving I hope.
(of course the ears aren't sculpted just placeholders, I'm not really ready to move into that detail yet. I want to get a better feel for the lips and eyes and I think that'll make the ear detail all that much easier when the time comes)
Started on Hugh Laurie... Am I gettin' there guys? (still WIP, little over an hour I think)
***This is the reference I'm using thanks to google.
http://www.fanpop.com/spots/hugh-laurie/images/2089326/title/hugh-laurie-emmy-magazine-photo
It looks like you've raced up in sub-divisions to work on things like eye creases but left some pretty major forms like the ears, the jaw line, the lower lip and the philtrum are still off. 70% of what makes Hugh Laurie identifiable is his crazy philtrum. Even under a forest of stubble it still sends off strong signals that's its there.
This kind of critical back and forth evaluation and comparison is what you need to work on and you're showing progress on this front but don't expect it to happen overnight.
I tried to take all of your suggestions into account Mark, is it gettin' there?
I may move onto something else, as I'm in a practice mode. Its good to finish projects but I don't want to spend too much time on one sculpt right now, I think a variety will help me get better and faster. Any opinions? Should I keep moving with this one, maybe even paint it eventually?
Thanks everyone.
EDIT:
Tweaked the ears down a little...
(hard to tell I did anything lol)
If you where to keep working on it I would suggest you make his face a little more asymmetrical, give some grain to his eyebrows (the hairs grow in certain directions) and work on the hair some more, right now it looks like it was sprayed on with silly string. But I'd call it a success definitely a step in the right direction.
I want to keep my practice up so I think I may gather some new reference and start on a new face tonight, trying harder this time to nail down the planes of the face and add more "weight" to my sculpt. I really appreciate all the help, hope you guys stick around a while longer
Thank you Dustin, I'm going to use these tonight! And winternights, thank you for the encouragement! I've caught the bug now, I used to get discouraged really easily but I'm seeing some progress and it motivates me!
(the ears are my weak spot, I haven't worked them out on this guy yet)
Okay, did some work on him and I'm pretty happy with where he is heading. I've still got a ton to do but I think he is taking shape
Any crits or comments?
thread over
Then you gotta do a lowpoly, unwrap, cast, and textures.
Why not try to get in as something a little less higher up? Environment, prop, ect. You would be able to make it there a lot sooner than shooting for a character artist position.
I am ask because you said you are 30 and you want to make this happen... When you get your foot in the door you could always hone your character skills then and work your way over into a character position.
In anycase! you are making some good progress. Keep up the practice and posting.
Thanks for the kind words Jeremiah! I see what you are saying about trying to break in as a character artist... I've tried to jump back and forth several times. I love doing LD and prop modelling, but something just keeps pulling me back to characters.
I really do want to make this happen, but I have a catch. I have a decent job right now (for where I live I get paid pretty well) and I also have a 4 year old. I'm really not ready to up and move all of us with the way studio lay offs have been lately
I want to put this out there, I'm sure some people are going to laugh, but I want to work at Valve, and just about only Valve. I'm sure a most of us have that dream studio, and Valve is mine. I might be 45 years old before my skills are good enough to get me there, but I'll keep trying until then.
Do you guys have any portfolio links or websites of some artists at Valve? I can't really find much, except for Mr. Kite's and his stuff is very intimidating lol
(this is just a test)
Ok, back with some progress... I could really use some help going forward. I've sculpted the bust and body as separate objects and plan to do the hands this way also. How do I really join all of these seperate pieces together for the final composition? I'm only used to doing quick single mesh sculpts and only basic subtool manipulation so I could really use some pointers.
Also, if anyone has any critiques to help me move forward, I appreciate it!
Just some quick fun tonight.
Ok guys, I would love some advice and direction here. I just can't figure out what it is that is making my busts look less than real. Admittedly, I need to spend a little more time and a little more love, but I think it is more than that.
Are there any glaring proportional issues that anyone can notice right away? Maybe some flawed forms/anatomy? I really don't like the eyes on any of my sculpts.
Here is another quickish' one from me tonight, just a little cap before my vacation next week.
<story time> I started a game art course in September and I am 75% finished. I was wanting to do characters, because they were cool. After I heard about the low job ops, I started doing environments. Wasn't a huge fan. And then my character modeling teacher told us to do what we love, I took his words, and started back up on my anatomy skills
And then reality hit me and I went back to environments. The more environment stuff I did, the more I liked it...and soon, I realized I did not love characters. It was a cheap, shallow relationship I had with them. Anyways, now I'm working on environments and I have to say it is awesome.
Moral of the story is basically do what you love. You will get so much more out of it.
~
How much time are you giving yourself for these sculpts? It's incredibly important to do 1 hour speed sculpts every day (think of it as 3d sketching). Write a subject for every day of the week, for instance, Zombie Mondays (zombies are great because sometimes doing human faces over and over gets boring, and with zombies you can study muscles in the face and stuff) or Animal Anatomy Fridays. And then go to town for an hour. It will force you to work out your proportions quickly, and not to noodle with details so much.
Here is today's practice, kinda rushed... Coming back off vacation and it is like I need to start over lol
If I could find the time and patience, I know my work would look so much better, but thats just one more thing I gotta' work on.
Hope to start on some full fledged characters and stuff soon.
Torch: thank you! I love your work, the mechanic bust blows my mind!
I really appreciate all the encouragement guys! I know I have a long way to go, but seeing your work improve and getting feedback and compliments from the awesome people on polycount just makes me want to try even harder!