We are, if the president is serious here, a nation that has narrowly constricted its marketable talents to the deployment of violence. We can't manufacture much of anything, but we can kill you. We can't fix our schools, or build adequate levees to protect a city like New Orleans from floodwaters. But we can kill you. We can't reduce infant mortality to anywhere near the level of other industrialized nations with which we like to compare ourselves. But we can kill you. We can't break the power of Wall Street bankers, or jail any of those bankers and money managers who helped orchestrate the global financial collapse. But we can kill you. We can't protect LGBT youth from bullying in schools, or ensure equal opportunity for all in the labor market, regardless of race, gender, sexuality or any other factor. But we can kill you. Booyah, bitches.
Retarded Fratboy answer: AND DON'T YOU FORGET IT! USA USA USA USA!
But seriously, that pretty much sums up my problem with admiring America for nearly anything in regards to accomplishments as a country.
But then again maybe I'm just spoiled because I live in Norway.
But seriously, that pretty much sums up my problem with admiring America for nearly anything in regards to accomplishments as a country
As a nation's strengths go, being able to kill people is pretty important. It's distasteful, but national defense is a more fundamental need than many of the other desirable elements in society. I don't see the need to brag about it, but I am glad to have it.
That said, I think America has a couple other accomplishments. Creating modern democracy, ensuring basic freedoms to citizens, those were some pretty good ideas. Norway based it's constitution in part on the US version, and I don't imagine you'd prefer monarchy to that.
"What we have right now are very powerful military bureaucracies tied to the defense industries that want to stay in business." They're larger than we need, he says, but congressional interests see military budgets as a way to sustain prosperity by redistributing the income from those industries.
"This is an enormous problem," Macgregor says, "but we've got to deal with it, because we can't afford it, and it will ultimately consume us over time."
"We have to deliver the services that were promised under Medicare, Medicaid and Social Security," he says. "We cannot honor those obligations ... without reducing defense and reorienting our defense posture to a world that's very different today than the one in which most of these forces were created and invented."
Maintain a fighting force capable of waging a modern war, ok but we're mostly outfitted to fight a war from 50 years ago. I also agree with his point about starvation and innovation.
If you look at the Soviets, the Royal Navy, British Army and various other military formations over the last couple centuries, Macgregor says, "what you discover is that most innovation and the most positive change, an adaptation to reality occurs not in a flood of money, but in its absence.
I hate reading people suggest this absurdity. First, even if this were true, how is it that NO ONE leaked the truth? Hundreds, if not thousands, of government workers would need to a) cover up the actual death of bin Laden and b) arrange this fake military action last night. In an era of Anonymous, wikipedia and 24 hour news coverage, Obama's team of criminal masterminds have hidden this great conspiracy barely two years into his first term? How could he even get his people infiltrated into the CIA and military that fast? It would take just one former Bush loyalist to leak the truth. If Obama is this amazingly crafty and devious, why didn't he rig the 2010 elections so his party didn't lose control of Congress? Why not rig it so that his budget passed unopposed?
they dont need to cover up anything when there is nothing to cover up. i am not saying they are covering up, but there is no actual proof when and how bin laden was killed.
Bush and Obama are part of the same team, the US government. They act like they are enemies but they are not. They are both paid by the same corporations. Democracy is an illusion. get over it.
Second, if we accept that he did this, why now? He has almost two full years left in office, and 18 months until the elections. Why use his grand conspiracy this far out when anything can happen before the next vote? The economy gets worse, another terror attack, etc - any of that happens and he loses even with the bin Ladin conspiracy. If he rigged it all up, wouldn't Obama save it right until the election, an October surprise to guarantee victory? If Obama's so smart he could mastermind this caper, why is he so dumb that he blows it too early in the race, before the other party has even picked a challenger?
why now? because they had to put something even bigger in the news to cover up the killing of Gaddafi's son and family members. they tried to kill Gaddafi but got his son and grandsons killed in the effort.
Sorry for the long post, but I just can't stand seeing smart people buying in on such obviously illogical shit. People go on and on about the ineptitude of the US government in all things, except when it's a conspiracy - JFK, faked moon landing, 9/11 inside job, bin Laden. When its a conspiracy, tthe government that can't balance a budget or provide health care is suddenly run by Sun Tzu, Machiavelli and Lex Luthor. I frankly wish Obama WAS capable of faking bin Laden's death and fooling everyone, because I'd sleep damned good at night knowing the smartest criminal genius in the universe was working to keep America on top of the world.
why do you think the government would actually wanna balance budget ? it isnt like the top government officials get affected by bad economy. it simply means higher taxes for regular citizens and higher cost of living and more money for the gov and corporations.
try to think outside the box. the bottom line is the rich get richer getting millions of dollars of yearly bonuses while general people have to pay for high cost of living and end in more debt. economic enslavement.
Oh, I totally agree that the US military is far in excess of what's necessary or even what's practical. What was a potentially necessary military buildup during the Cold War has clearly become as much about making money as securing the nation. It's certainly a burden on the other parts of American society, as other needs are neglected in favor of still more military capacity.
My preference is entirely for precision and low-intensity conflict when necessary, rather than wantonly bombing the fuck out of everything. The bin Laden op is pretty much the gold standard of how effective that kind of military effort can be, rather than the brash absurdity that was "shock and awe."
I think that's where I come down on this. As an American, I find the belligerent war machine bullshit unpalatable, with the invasion of Iraq being a prime example of 'war pigs' having their way. But I also do take a measure of pride in knowing that America can send two dozen highly-trained specialists to perform an exceptionally difficult task, and and they can complete that task perfectly with no collateral damage. If conflict is inevitable, which human history suggests it is, I'd rather my country be really good at it than not.
they dont need to cover up anything when there is nothing to cover up. i am not saying they are covering up, but there is no actual proof when and how bin laden was killed.
I wanted to finish reading your post, but I ran out of tin foil before I got to the end
"I mourn the loss of thousands of precious lives, but I will not rejoice in the death of one, not even an enemy. Returning hate for hate multiplies hate, adding deeper darkness to a night already devoid of stars. Darkness cannot drive out darkness: only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate: only love can do that."
How can you be so sure? How can you be so sure of any of the things you said? Those are very strong accusations for the country I call home. I suppose you have a top-secret source for all American black-op stuff, and we're the only country with shady stuff going on behind the scenes.... Things arn't great, and we are far from perfect, but I have faith that they can get better if the people stand for it. Say what you want about that, but this thread has recently turned into a "let me tell you what is wrong with America" rant. What does that solve, huh?
MM You could save some text if you just started referring to situation as a plutocracy instead of democracy heh which is more or less what we're transitioning too if certain people continue to get their way.
We are, if the president is serious here, a nation that has narrowly constricted its marketable talents to the deployment of violence. We can't manufacture much of anything, but we can kill you. We can't fix our schools, or build adequate levees to protect a city like New Orleans from floodwaters. But we can kill you. We can't reduce infant mortality to anywhere near the level of other industrialized nations with which we like to compare ourselves. But we can kill you. We can't break the power of Wall Street bankers, or jail any of those bankers and money managers who helped orchestrate the global financial collapse. But we can kill you. We can't protect LGBT youth from bullying in schools, or ensure equal opportunity for all in the labor market, regardless of race, gender, sexuality or any other factor. But we can kill you. Booyah, bitches.
The moral of the story is that everyone just needs to be good at making their own stuff, educating themselves, not living in big cities near massive bodies of water, not helping the world overpopulate, being awesome enough to have people throw money at them just for being awesome, and being kickass enough to strongarm anyone who screws with them into submission.
Essentially, just be Batman.
Edit: I guess Gotham City is kind of a huge city with a seaside port but Batman can fly so it doesn't matter.
How can you be so sure? How can you be so sure of any of the things you said? Those are very strong accusations for the country I call home. I suppose you have a top-secret source for all American black-op stuff, and we're the only country with shady stuff going on behind the scenes.... Things arn't great, and we are far from perfect, but I have faith that they can get better if the people stand for it. Say what you want about that, but this thread has recently turned into a "let me tell you what is wrong with America" rant. What does that solve, huh?
i never ever said we are the only country doing this. infact i even mentioned UAE in on it. by it i mean oil business, control of resources, gross economical irresponsibility at the cost of general poverty for the gain of money and power for the rich/powerful. other big nations are doing this aswell and and they do this because they can and people like you wanna sound patriotic and dont wanna question.
me, you and all other US citizens are being scammed by the government and corporations.
it is easy to figure out, just track teh money. who earns the most and how and at the cost of what.
Other big nations are doing this aswell and and they do this because they can and people like you wanna sound patriotic and dont wanna question.
I question everything. I make very strong efforts to positively impact my country politically. I just don't wildly speculate in forums. Believing a conspiracy theorist is in the same boat as believing "big brother" to me. It only depends where your opinion lays. I'm not trying to debate this with you here. I believe, without a doubt, that you have a very strong opinion on the matter. That's about it, I'm afraid.
I question everything. I make very strong efforts to positively impact my country politically. I just don't wildly speculate in forums. Believing a conspiracy theorist is in the same boat as believing "big brother" to me. It only depends where your opinion lays. I'm not trying to debate this with you here. I believe, without a doubt, that you have a very strong opinion on the matter. That's about it, I'm afraid.
well i am not just speculating things out of thin air. i am very skeptical and critical of everything i hear and see and it doesnt matter which side the information comes from. it isnt just my oponion, the facts are out there. am i the only one capable of making the accurate deduction ?
but since you ask, here are few facts to base my so called "conspiracy" off of.
wars cost US gov money lot of money. just google to find how much (as far as i know we spend more than a trillion dollars so far on both wars)
we we have a budget crisis - known fact and is a no brainer. this leads to highers taxes and higher cost of living which we pay.
the trllion dollars comes from our pocket and international loans adding to more debt which we pay off with taxes etc.
in addition, US gov doesnt spend 1/5 of that cost on important things such as education, infrastructure, etc. we can have another Katrina and it wont be as high priority as the war in terms of government spending.
finally, even after all this crisis somehow the top corporations and big guys manage to make millions of dollars in yearly bonuses not to mention high sallary.
it should be clear how the money is being streamlined out of our pockets to the pockets of the billionairs.
also RE no democracy, well it is plain and simple. both democratic and republicann candidates are paid for by big corp that i speak of all the time.
here are the top 5 contributors for Obama and McCain
Obama:
Goldman Sachs $653,030
University of California $576,839
JPMorgan Chase & Co $414,760
Citigroup Inc $408,299
Harvard University $407,219
McCain:
Merrill Lynch $296,913
Citigroup Inc $268,501
Morgan Stanley $234,272
Goldman Sachs $208,395
JPMorgan Chase & Co $179,975
I say democracy is an illusion because at the end of the day they are both financed by mostly the same companies and/or big corp and answer to them. A choice between these thwo is not really a democratic choice, it a money race.
"I mourn the loss of thousands of precious lives, but I will not rejoice in the death of one, not even an enemy. Returning hate for hate multiplies hate, adding deeper darkness to a night already devoid of stars. Darkness cannot drive out darkness: only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate: only love can do that."
-Martin Luther King, Jr.
Not that I disagree with the sentiment, but this isn't an MLK quote.
I say democracy is an illusion because at the end of the day they are both financed by mostly the same companies and/or big corp and answer to them. A choice between these thwo is not really a democratic choice, it a money race.
What's the difference between a NASCAR driver and a politician?
One goes in circles representing their corporate sponsors, and the other drives race cars!
Alternatively, NASCAR drivers are capable of going left
Being an American, I can not express how good it feel's that justice was served to Osama Bin Laden. I am happy for all of the family's in the 9/11 attacks that finally get closure because of this raid. No I do not think that this will be the end of the Al Qaeda or to other terrorist organizations and in a way I dont believe there will ever be an end. The only thing we can do is keep taking the fight to them to prevent further loss of innocent lives.
It shames me to hear other American's labeling this a conspiracy. I still think this country is a great country and I do believe we are capable of accomplishing great things without having to lie about it. Yes, we currently have some problems in our government (Which country doesn't) but I personally don't believe that it is as corrupt as some people might think.
BUT THEY STILL GOT HIM EY? Don't matter if you stoop to the enemy's level while doing it.
I heard Obama wanted to send the Care Bears to hug bin Laden into submission, but they weren't available. The Navy SEALs were Plan B, and it turns out they're not so great at hugging.
"I mourn the loss of thousands of precious lives, but I will not rejoice in the death of one, not even an enemy. Returning hate for hate multiplies hate, adding deeper darkness to a night already devoid of stars. Darkness cannot drive out darkness: only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate: only love can do that."
-Martin Luther King, Jr.
Though i don't think he said that, my sentiments exactly...
That article says nothing of the sort. Nice way of trying to misconstrue information though....
notice the durr :P
and the article does actually say he was unarmed when shot, but wasn't exactly cooperating with being captured, he was resisting for some odd reason.
And the best way to stop someone resisting capture, is to shoot them in the face, I also heard it solves LOADS of other problems. It's like a miracle cure!
I heard Obama wanted to send the Care Bears to hug bin Laden into submission, but they weren't available. The Navy SEALs were Plan B, and it turns out they're not so great at hugging.
"I mourn the loss of thousands of precious lives, but I will not rejoice in the death of one, not even an enemy. Returning hate for hate multiplies hate, adding deeper darkness to a night already devoid of stars. Darkness cannot drive out darkness: only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate:… only love can do that."
-Martin Luther King, Jr.
Although I wish this were true, I think that some people have so much hate inside of them, that when they release it out into the world it prevents people's from loving one another.
Its quite distasteful. You would have thought America would have more honour and respect for itself than this.
They have all these laws and ideals, but of course they mean nothing. Can be broken any time to torture and kill whomever they like for whatever reason.
Its like they like enemies. Plus there mostly religious, you've got the contradiction of that. America is really behaving the worst of all. At least with these terrorist groups its a few individuals. With America its the state and the whole that condones and does terror.
Although I wish this were true, I think that some people have so much hate inside of them, that when they release it out into the world it prevents people's from loving one another.
Its quite distasteful. You would have thought America would have more honour and respect for itself than this.
They have all these laws and ideals, but of course they mean nothing. Can be broken any time to torture and kill whomever they like for whatever reason.
Its like they like enemies. Plus there mostly religious, you've got the contradiction of that. America is really behaving the worst of all. At least with these terrorist groups its a few individuals. With America its the state and the whole that condones and does terror.
I dont know its wierd.
Yes, America is a very bad place and we're all horrible people. Oh well.
The Obama administration is involved in debate over whether or not to release a photo of bin Laden's body, which was taken on board one of the US helicopters used in the military mission and later buried at sea after confirmation of identity.
ah, barbarism. Lets set ourselves back a couple hundred years and put the head on a pike outside of the White House.
I think its interesting watching / reading / listening to these events unfold, especially with the internet, where people of the world are brought together without borders, but still retaining their nationality. With Hitler's death, celebration was contained, and although displayed publicly around the world, not near to this magnitude of involvement by everyone with opinions. Imagine if message boards, twitter, ircs, etc all existed then!
Lol, yeah, America is the devil, and every other country can do no wrong.
Humans suck, it doesn't matter what fucking country they're from. With power comes corruption. The only reason America gets ridiculed so much for the things we do is because we're the only country that has the ability to do these things. Give any other country the same amount of power and ability, and you'll see the same amount of corruption. It's human nature.
Yes, America is a very bad place and we're all horrible people. Oh well.
once again, you dont get it.
all of this has NOTHING to do with american people for the most part. like you, many are ignorant of how the rest of the world is and how the world politics are at work currenntly and what US Government is doing to affect it all.
the american people are equal victims of the US government as are the rest of the world.
ah, barbarism. Lets set ourselves back a couple hundred years and put the head on a pike outside of the White House.
I dearly hope that no photos are released. It WILL NOT PROVE A THING. Hopefully, Obama's lesson in Birth Certificate-ology already taught him that some people will never believe. It will only bring more tension and anger without gain.
all of this has NOTHING to do with american people for the most part. like you, many are ignorant of how the rest of the world is and how the world politics are at work currenntly and what US Government is doing to affect it all.
the american people are equal victims of the US government as are the rest of the world.
If all this is true, if it's really true, then at least I have an excuse. I'm one of the ignorant masses of sheeple, I don't know any better. Can't fault me for going along with the program, I don't know any better.
What's your excuse? You live and work in America, consuming our mass media (games, at the least), paying our taxes, participating in the illusion just like the fools you lump me in with. I'll bet you even have a bank account or credit card backed by one of those financial corporations you believe run the nation. What's your excuse, man? Why aren't you a filthy hypocrite who knows better but still patronizes the decadent American illusion? Why aren't you gone? Ben Mathis did that - he doesn't like what America's become and so he just got up and left. I don't share many of Ben's opinions, but I respect the hell out of him for following through on them.
If you really believe all your theories and you remain here, then you're not a victim - you're a collaborator. I'll start taking your charges seriously when your address isn't New York.
If all this is true, if it's really true, then at least I have an excuse. I'm one of the ignorant masses of sheeple, I don't know any better. Can't fault me for going along with the program, I don't know any better.
What's your excuse? You live and work in America, consuming our mass media (games, at the least), paying our taxes, participating in the illusion just like the fools you lump me in with. I'll bet you even have a bank account or credit card backed by one of those financial corporations you believe run the nation. What's your excuse, man? Why aren't you a filthy hypocrite who knows better but still patronizes the decadent American illusion? Why aren't you gone? Ben Mathis did that - he doesn't like what America's become and so he just got up and left. I don't share many of Ben's opinions, but I respect the hell out of him for following through on them.
If you really believe all your theories and you remain here, then you're not a victim - you're a collaborator. I'll start taking your charges seriously when your address isn't New York.
leaving the country is same as admitting defeat and giving up. i might do that when there is no choice left. there is still lot of good things going on here. like i said, i live among the american people, i dont work with or for the government.
i would rather survive the system and try to educate more people about the situation.
if everyone who knows US gov is corrupt and just left the country there would be no america.
it is more patriotic to care about the condition of the country and speak out about it so that it gets better.
Stating your opinion is all well and good, but when we start down the line of "You dont understand because you're ignorant, too stupid to see the truth" and all the conspiracy theory stuff, you guys are just asking for this thread to be closed. Keep it sane and keep it civil, or this will just be another in a long line of terrible political threads.
leaving the country is same as admitting defeat and giving up. i might do that when there is no choice left. there is still lot of good things going on here. like i said, i live among the american people, i dont work with or for the government.
i would rather survive the system and try to educate more people about the situation.
if everyone who knows US gov is corrupt and just left the country there would be no america.
Well, suffice it to say, I don't agree with that. I wouldn't want to live in a country that I truly thought as poorly of as you do the United States, admitting defeat or not. I think its better to get out of an abusive relationship rather than to stay in the hope you can change how the other party treats you.
I heard Obama wanted to send the Care Bears to hug bin Laden into submission, but they weren't available. The Navy SEALs were Plan B, and it turns out they're not so great at hugging.
They used highly compressed care bears made out of lead and stuffed into tiny cartridges and delivered like a T-Shirt cannon at some kind of sporting event... His heart couldn't handle the love... I hear it was a rainbow striped one that finally got him.
Perhaps they need to rethink their delivery method.
Well, suffice it to say, I don't agree with that. I wouldn't want to live in a country that I truly thought as poorly of as you do the United States, admitting defeat or not. I think its better to get out of an abusive relationship rather than to stay in the hope you can change how the other party treats you.
lol, it isnt like there is a much better place i rather be. criticizing US gov doesn't necessarily mean it is the worst place. it means it could be lot better. there are worst places than America and I know that from experience. I like it here and I wanna make it better.
if everybody thought like you there would be no evolution or development in anything.
They used highly compressed care bears made out of lead and stuffed into tiny cartridges and delivered like a T-Shirt cannon at some kind of sporting event... Perhaps they need to rethink their delivery method.
Fur Metal Jacket!!!
Slightly related note, latest report is that the president has decided NOT to release the bin Laden photos or vids. He'll catch it from the conspiracy crowd and probably the Al Qaeda sympathizers, but it's the right call. Obama hasn't really blown a lot of wind up my skirt during his two years in office, but I do think he's a good and decent man. Hurray for being civilized.
I dearly hope that no photos are released. It WILL NOT PROVE A THING. Hopefully, Obama's lesson in Birth Certificate-ology already taught him that some people will never believe. It will only bring more tension and anger without gain.
Yeah, i definitely agree. I'm surprised they're even admitting there is a debate about it, should be a clear and cut simple "no, that is immoral and it isn't going to happen" statement.
lol, it isnt like there is a much better place i rather be. criticizing US gov doesn't necessarily mean it is the worst place. it means it could be lot better. there are worst places than America and I know that from experience. I like it here and I wanna make it better.
if everybody thought like you there would be no evolution or development in anything.
And if everybody [whatever] like you, etc etc... I can tell you're an artist, because you're painting me with a broad fucking brush.
Well, the White House has chosen not to release the images, so let the conspiracies begin snowballing.
I honestly don't see this situation as an America Fuck Yeah! deal. I want to see the removal of those who see to take civility away from civilization. I don't care if it was the U.S., Russia, or the UK. But apparently the U.S. is going to go back to being warmongers for eliminating a bastard that liked to destroy the rights of women, and terrorize people around the world. I'm curious how people feel this should have been handled.
Look, I know we got off on the wrong foot, but I'd like to take the time to gently explain how badly you have hurt our feelings. Please contact us at your earliest convenience so we can grab a cup of coffee and talk things out.
Your Favorite Warmongers,
The United States of America"
Never underestimate a kindly-written letter. And we chose bullets.... silly Americans
Replies
Retarded Fratboy answer: AND DON'T YOU FORGET IT! USA USA USA USA!
But seriously, that pretty much sums up my problem with admiring America for nearly anything in regards to accomplishments as a country.
But then again maybe I'm just spoiled because I live in Norway.
As a nation's strengths go, being able to kill people is pretty important. It's distasteful, but national defense is a more fundamental need than many of the other desirable elements in society. I don't see the need to brag about it, but I am glad to have it.
That said, I think America has a couple other accomplishments. Creating modern democracy, ensuring basic freedoms to citizens, those were some pretty good ideas. Norway based it's constitution in part on the US version, and I don't imagine you'd prefer monarchy to that.
I agree with your other points Verm, but... It's more like overkill.
Maintain a fighting force capable of waging a modern war, ok but we're mostly outfitted to fight a war from 50 years ago. I also agree with his point about starvation and innovation.
they dont need to cover up anything when there is nothing to cover up. i am not saying they are covering up, but there is no actual proof when and how bin laden was killed.
Bush and Obama are part of the same team, the US government. They act like they are enemies but they are not. They are both paid by the same corporations. Democracy is an illusion. get over it.
why now? because they had to put something even bigger in the news to cover up the killing of Gaddafi's son and family members. they tried to kill Gaddafi but got his son and grandsons killed in the effort.
why do you think the government would actually wanna balance budget ? it isnt like the top government officials get affected by bad economy. it simply means higher taxes for regular citizens and higher cost of living and more money for the gov and corporations.
try to think outside the box. the bottom line is the rich get richer getting millions of dollars of yearly bonuses while general people have to pay for high cost of living and end in more debt. economic enslavement.
Oh, I totally agree that the US military is far in excess of what's necessary or even what's practical. What was a potentially necessary military buildup during the Cold War has clearly become as much about making money as securing the nation. It's certainly a burden on the other parts of American society, as other needs are neglected in favor of still more military capacity.
My preference is entirely for precision and low-intensity conflict when necessary, rather than wantonly bombing the fuck out of everything. The bin Laden op is pretty much the gold standard of how effective that kind of military effort can be, rather than the brash absurdity that was "shock and awe."
I think that's where I come down on this. As an American, I find the belligerent war machine bullshit unpalatable, with the invasion of Iraq being a prime example of 'war pigs' having their way. But I also do take a measure of pride in knowing that America can send two dozen highly-trained specialists to perform an exceptionally difficult task, and and they can complete that task perfectly with no collateral damage. If conflict is inevitable, which human history suggests it is, I'd rather my country be really good at it than not.
I wanted to finish reading your post, but I ran out of tin foil before I got to the end
-Martin Luther King, Jr.
How can you be so sure? How can you be so sure of any of the things you said? Those are very strong accusations for the country I call home. I suppose you have a top-secret source for all American black-op stuff, and we're the only country with shady stuff going on behind the scenes.... Things arn't great, and we are far from perfect, but I have faith that they can get better if the people stand for it. Say what you want about that, but this thread has recently turned into a "let me tell you what is wrong with America" rant. What does that solve, huh?
And yea you're speculating a little wildly there.
The moral of the story is that everyone just needs to be good at making their own stuff, educating themselves, not living in big cities near massive bodies of water, not helping the world overpopulate, being awesome enough to have people throw money at them just for being awesome, and being kickass enough to strongarm anyone who screws with them into submission.
Essentially, just be Batman.
Edit: I guess Gotham City is kind of a huge city with a seaside port but Batman can fly so it doesn't matter.
lol, people with limited understanding of international diplomacy and world politics are already wearing a tinfoil all around their head.
i never ever said we are the only country doing this. infact i even mentioned UAE in on it. by it i mean oil business, control of resources, gross economical irresponsibility at the cost of general poverty for the gain of money and power for the rich/powerful. other big nations are doing this aswell and and they do this because they can and people like you wanna sound patriotic and dont wanna question.
me, you and all other US citizens are being scammed by the government and corporations.
it is easy to figure out, just track teh money. who earns the most and how and at the cost of what.
I question everything. I make very strong efforts to positively impact my country politically. I just don't wildly speculate in forums. Believing a conspiracy theorist is in the same boat as believing "big brother" to me. It only depends where your opinion lays. I'm not trying to debate this with you here. I believe, without a doubt, that you have a very strong opinion on the matter. That's about it, I'm afraid.
well i am not just speculating things out of thin air. i am very skeptical and critical of everything i hear and see and it doesnt matter which side the information comes from. it isnt just my oponion, the facts are out there. am i the only one capable of making the accurate deduction ?
but since you ask, here are few facts to base my so called "conspiracy" off of.
wars cost US gov money lot of money. just google to find how much (as far as i know we spend more than a trillion dollars so far on both wars)
we we have a budget crisis - known fact and is a no brainer. this leads to highers taxes and higher cost of living which we pay.
the trllion dollars comes from our pocket and international loans adding to more debt which we pay off with taxes etc.
in addition, US gov doesnt spend 1/5 of that cost on important things such as education, infrastructure, etc. we can have another Katrina and it wont be as high priority as the war in terms of government spending.
finally, even after all this crisis somehow the top corporations and big guys manage to make millions of dollars in yearly bonuses not to mention high sallary.
it should be clear how the money is being streamlined out of our pockets to the pockets of the billionairs.
also RE no democracy, well it is plain and simple. both democratic and republicann candidates are paid for by big corp that i speak of all the time.
here are the top 5 contributors for Obama and McCain
Obama:
Goldman Sachs $653,030
University of California $576,839
JPMorgan Chase & Co $414,760
Citigroup Inc $408,299
Harvard University $407,219
McCain:
Merrill Lynch $296,913
Citigroup Inc $268,501
Morgan Stanley $234,272
Goldman Sachs $208,395
JPMorgan Chase & Co $179,975
I say democracy is an illusion because at the end of the day they are both financed by mostly the same companies and/or big corp and answer to them. A choice between these thwo is not really a democratic choice, it a money race.
find him > shoot him in the face > bring back the body > let the rest of the world catch up :thumbup:
It's pretty amazing that the SEAL team was able to pull off that operation with no casualties on our side. Incredible work.
All politics aside this is a good thing.
BUT THEY STILL GOT HIM EY? Don't matter if you stoop to the enemy's level while doing it.
durr
That article says nothing of the sort.
Not that I disagree with the sentiment, but this isn't an MLK quote.
http://www.theatlantic.com/national/archive/2011/05/out-of-osamas-death-a-fake-quotation-is-born/238220/
What's the difference between a NASCAR driver and a politician?
One goes in circles representing their corporate sponsors, and the other drives race cars!
Alternatively, NASCAR drivers are capable of going left
It shames me to hear other American's labeling this a conspiracy. I still think this country is a great country and I do believe we are capable of accomplishing great things without having to lie about it. Yes, we currently have some problems in our government (Which country doesn't) but I personally don't believe that it is as corrupt as some people might think.
I heard Obama wanted to send the Care Bears to hug bin Laden into submission, but they weren't available. The Navy SEALs were Plan B, and it turns out they're not so great at hugging.
Though i don't think he said that, my sentiments exactly...
and the article does actually say he was unarmed when shot, but wasn't exactly cooperating with being captured, he was resisting for some odd reason.
And the best way to stop someone resisting capture, is to shoot them in the face, I also heard it solves LOADS of other problems. It's like a miracle cure!
They hugged him with bullets!
-Martin Luther King, Jr.
Although I wish this were true, I think that some people have so much hate inside of them, that when they release it out into the world it prevents people's from loving one another.
They have all these laws and ideals, but of course they mean nothing. Can be broken any time to torture and kill whomever they like for whatever reason.
Its like they like enemies. Plus there mostly religious, you've got the contradiction of that. America is really behaving the worst of all. At least with these terrorist groups its a few individuals. With America its the state and the whole that condones and does terror.
I dont know its wierd.
Yes you are. Offering a handful of facts and leaping to a conclusion isn't the same as proving something to be true.
It's a cheesy line from a decent movie but I feel it rings true in regards to what you're saying.
It's easier to hate and be a misanthrope than love and be kind to your fellow man.
Takes less effort and the results are much more immediate.
Yes, America is a very bad place and we're all horrible people. Oh well.
ah, barbarism. Lets set ourselves back a couple hundred years and put the head on a pike outside of the White House.
I think its interesting watching / reading / listening to these events unfold, especially with the internet, where people of the world are brought together without borders, but still retaining their nationality. With Hitler's death, celebration was contained, and although displayed publicly around the world, not near to this magnitude of involvement by everyone with opinions. Imagine if message boards, twitter, ircs, etc all existed then!
sigh, if you cant think independently and deduct intelligently from the given facts then there is no point communicating with you further.
Humans suck, it doesn't matter what fucking country they're from. With power comes corruption. The only reason America gets ridiculed so much for the things we do is because we're the only country that has the ability to do these things. Give any other country the same amount of power and ability, and you'll see the same amount of corruption. It's human nature.
Ok!, except for you.
Thinking independently = agreeing with you?
once again, you dont get it.
all of this has NOTHING to do with american people for the most part. like you, many are ignorant of how the rest of the world is and how the world politics are at work currenntly and what US Government is doing to affect it all.
the american people are equal victims of the US government as are the rest of the world.
no, thinking independently = not taking the governments words at face value and instead researching and calculating facts and understanding from that.
and the facts are in favor of what i am saying in general in this particular case at least.
I dearly hope that no photos are released. It WILL NOT PROVE A THING. Hopefully, Obama's lesson in Birth Certificate-ology already taught him that some people will never believe. It will only bring more tension and anger without gain.
If all this is true, if it's really true, then at least I have an excuse. I'm one of the ignorant masses of sheeple, I don't know any better. Can't fault me for going along with the program, I don't know any better.
What's your excuse? You live and work in America, consuming our mass media (games, at the least), paying our taxes, participating in the illusion just like the fools you lump me in with. I'll bet you even have a bank account or credit card backed by one of those financial corporations you believe run the nation. What's your excuse, man? Why aren't you a filthy hypocrite who knows better but still patronizes the decadent American illusion? Why aren't you gone? Ben Mathis did that - he doesn't like what America's become and so he just got up and left. I don't share many of Ben's opinions, but I respect the hell out of him for following through on them.
If you really believe all your theories and you remain here, then you're not a victim - you're a collaborator. I'll start taking your charges seriously when your address isn't New York.
leaving the country is same as admitting defeat and giving up. i might do that when there is no choice left. there is still lot of good things going on here. like i said, i live among the american people, i dont work with or for the government.
i would rather survive the system and try to educate more people about the situation.
if everyone who knows US gov is corrupt and just left the country there would be no america.
it is more patriotic to care about the condition of the country and speak out about it so that it gets better.
TL;DR: This is why we cant have nice things.
Well, suffice it to say, I don't agree with that. I wouldn't want to live in a country that I truly thought as poorly of as you do the United States, admitting defeat or not. I think its better to get out of an abusive relationship rather than to stay in the hope you can change how the other party treats you.
Perhaps they need to rethink their delivery method.
lol, it isnt like there is a much better place i rather be. criticizing US gov doesn't necessarily mean it is the worst place. it means it could be lot better. there are worst places than America and I know that from experience. I like it here and I wanna make it better.
if everybody thought like you there would be no evolution or development in anything.
Fur Metal Jacket!!!
Slightly related note, latest report is that the president has decided NOT to release the bin Laden photos or vids. He'll catch it from the conspiracy crowd and probably the Al Qaeda sympathizers, but it's the right call. Obama hasn't really blown a lot of wind up my skirt during his two years in office, but I do think he's a good and decent man. Hurray for being civilized.
http://www.cnn.com/2011/POLITICS/05/04/bin.laden.photo.release/index.html?hpt=T1
Yeah, i definitely agree. I'm surprised they're even admitting there is a debate about it, should be a clear and cut simple "no, that is immoral and it isn't going to happen" statement.
And if everybody [whatever] like you, etc etc... I can tell you're an artist, because you're painting me with a broad fucking brush.
I honestly don't see this situation as an America Fuck Yeah! deal. I want to see the removal of those who see to take civility away from civilization. I don't care if it was the U.S., Russia, or the UK. But apparently the U.S. is going to go back to being warmongers for eliminating a bastard that liked to destroy the rights of women, and terrorize people around the world. I'm curious how people feel this should have been handled.
Heh, exactly what I thought when I saw the images of the celebrations.
well the 'tin foil' comment was the same, so lets just leave it at that.
Look, I know we got off on the wrong foot, but I'd like to take the time to gently explain how badly you have hurt our feelings. Please contact us at your earliest convenience so we can grab a cup of coffee and talk things out.
Your Favorite Warmongers,
The United States of America"
Never underestimate a kindly-written letter. And we chose bullets.... silly Americans