im not razzled. You proved your point, and it just dosnt work for me. Simply put, I dont believe in Triangles. I dont care what the book tells ya. Im stickin to my own bent ingenuity.
Epic. That should be sig'd!
Lol, no but seriously, I'm in school for Game Development and the modeling/animation teacher was pretty adamant about trying as hard as possible not to allow any n-gons, as it causes weird anomalies in certain situations. I didn't think to much of it either since I'm a beginner, but after hearing it on these forums, and ready MANY articles about it, I found it to be true as well. Read up on it and you'll see what they're talking about. If nothing else though, just remember most of these people trying to help you are experts, take a look at some of their work and you'll see it in your best interest to just take what they say as pretty solid advice.
Either way bro, thats a nice model considering it has such a low Triangle count (lol see what Idid there?). Keep on going bud.
We are here to help you. This is a board dedicated to helping artists become better artists. From the get go, you posted your work and a suggestion was made to you.
Are you sure?
Trust me, you can have as much N-gons as you want, but the performance is always the same, because the 3D software (or the game engine) counts triangles and quads, but not polygons.
A 2048*2048 texture will significantly lower the performance... Mine was a suggest, but I repeat, I think that you may better switch to 512*512 or even 256*256, unless you don't want extreme close-ups of the model!
Here is where you didn't take constructive criticism.
No man, that's where you are wrong, because. I have a shitty computer with no video memory. And when I start getting over 300 polycount, the computer lags bad. The less polycount the better. And thats what I aim for, creating more triangles will create more lag. Im sorry Im stickin to what I know best and I beleive its working out very good for me.
We are not here to fight with you, but to rather give you insight into what we have found to be better workflows, better methods, and more efficient ways of modeling/texturing. There are people from the gaming industry on Polycount, and there are many aspiring to get into it. As a humble suggestion, please, put down your guard, and allow us to help you become a better artist. This board will teach you a lot, a whole lot more than you could ever imagine.(I could have saved 60 grand if I heard about Polycount sooner.)
I understand that you might be upset at the fact that the whole board seems to be coming down on you and teasing you. I have looked through this whole thread, and you have some really good mentor like artists trying to help you. People like Pior and Hawken are trying to give you knowledge and let you understand how this actually works. I humbly suggest that you work with us on this, we can make you better.
If this is a joke, please stop, but if you are serious in your quest to be a better artist, then lets squash this, and move forward.
I'm just curious, what caliber of professional would would actually listen to?
I mean if someone from blizzard waltzed in would you actually listen to them?
But i think i get what you mean by having n-gons makes your machine lag less.... and it has nothing to do with game performance, you are simply referring to the power to render the wire-frame view, which yes it does take more power to render more lines. Turn off wire-frame view and suddenly having n-gons wont make it faster.
"HEY Listen. For one minute to what I have to say. This Game will Look Exceptional when it is Completed. We Will Get the Pixel Ratio cleared up, We will get Normal Maps involved."
The OP now has his third infraction for trying to pollute the lowpoly thread again after I moved all the noise here. His next infraction will be a ban. He has some days to cool off and think about whether he really wants to be part of this community or not.
I'll keep this thread here though, because some of the advice is golden.
As stated by others, most engines out there only render triangle meshes. Software or hardware side optimization aside, there are other pitfalls caused by geometry, here's a few examples. The original polygon models on bottom, bad render mockups on the top. The left and right ones demonstrate bad fills in different ways. The middle set is a little hard to see well, but shows the classic 'did the artist mean a valley or peak?' scenario. In some cases, an engine could utterly fail and start interconnecting faces inside a cube.
I bring this up because I've had similar discussions in the past, and those artists had all kinds of similarly bad geo.
I'm curious now; does anyone know if 3d cards can actually render anything higher than a triangle when it comes to polymeshes? I'm not talking about behind the scenes geometry, like a plain-ol flat pentagon (in 3d).
Wiggum: "Now Ralphie, you stay here while daddy tries to talk sense with this raving derelict... All right, calm down now. Who's trying to steal your thoughts?"
I didnt start any of this, I was simply posting my truck model. To Each there OWN MY FRIENDS!! But you will never see me Triangulate a model, no matter how drunk you get me!!! thats just stupid to me.
good one this is the fucking funniest thread i have read in long time !
possibility 2 this guy really doesn't get it in which case let me really blow you mind:
its neither polygons nor TRIANGLES you should be concerned about !
really what takes your transform time is the verts !
smoothing groups split verts
uv cuts split verts
different materials you assign splits verts.
but even that is probably irrelevant because i doubt your gpu is transform bound at all
if you really care about performance these are the things you should look into:
STRIPS OVERDRAW AND MOST OF ALL DRAWCALLS !!!!!!!!!!! you have probably heard of neither !
PS the triangulation that the others suggested is purely a safety precaution to retain the shape of your model could be that if you imported your truck into a normal game engine that its tires will sort of "collapse". if this hasnt happend to you yet it must have been pure luck.
Okay, not sure if I should be posting in here, and not sure if this guy is serious... But if he is, he might have something about the triangles causing a performace drop. Not in the engine of course, but in the 3d modelling app. The more lines your card has to render, the more memory the program takes up. For example, in 3ds Max, if you take a very high poly object turbosmoothed, there can be a clear performance difference with isoline display turned on or off as the thousands of lines don't need to be rendered. I'm assuming that's what's happening here, and he's just mistaking it for the triangles causing problems. Maybe?
The more Polycount you have, the more performance problems you will have. I find my process much better than triangulating models. There is a difference in the model to me, but you know what it dosnt matter. Go fuck yourselves
The more Polycount you have, the more performance problems you will have. I find my process much better than triangulating models. There is a difference in the model to me, but you know what it dosnt matter. Go fuck yourselves
It does not matter what you believe! There is this thing called reality, so it does not matter how much you believe in unicorns, fairies and other riff-raff, its still wrong.
If your mathematical "experience" tells you that 2+2=8.43 it still is not.
Replies
Triangulate or not, the dude has pretty good taste in music.
Epic. That should be sig'd!
Lol, no but seriously, I'm in school for Game Development and the modeling/animation teacher was pretty adamant about trying as hard as possible not to allow any n-gons, as it causes weird anomalies in certain situations. I didn't think to much of it either since I'm a beginner, but after hearing it on these forums, and ready MANY articles about it, I found it to be true as well. Read up on it and you'll see what they're talking about. If nothing else though, just remember most of these people trying to help you are experts, take a look at some of their work and you'll see it in your best interest to just take what they say as pretty solid advice.
Either way bro, thats a nice model considering it has such a low Triangle count (lol see what Idid there?). Keep on going bud.
We are here to help you. This is a board dedicated to helping artists become better artists. From the get go, you posted your work and a suggestion was made to you.
Here is where you didn't take constructive criticism.
We are not here to fight with you, but to rather give you insight into what we have found to be better workflows, better methods, and more efficient ways of modeling/texturing. There are people from the gaming industry on Polycount, and there are many aspiring to get into it. As a humble suggestion, please, put down your guard, and allow us to help you become a better artist. This board will teach you a lot, a whole lot more than you could ever imagine.(I could have saved 60 grand if I heard about Polycount sooner.)
I understand that you might be upset at the fact that the whole board seems to be coming down on you and teasing you. I have looked through this whole thread, and you have some really good mentor like artists trying to help you. People like Pior and Hawken are trying to give you knowledge and let you understand how this actually works. I humbly suggest that you work with us on this, we can make you better.
If this is a joke, please stop, but if you are serious in your quest to be a better artist, then lets squash this, and move forward.
Cheers,
Spug
I mean if someone from blizzard waltzed in would you actually listen to them?
But i think i get what you mean by having n-gons makes your machine lag less.... and it has nothing to do with game performance, you are simply referring to the power to render the wire-frame view, which yes it does take more power to render more lines. Turn off wire-frame view and suddenly having n-gons wont make it faster.
triangle definition = three sided shape.
all game engines render in triangles, because they are the smallest physical shape. and the smallest physical shape is ALWAYS the FASTEST to render.
that is all.
oh wait, the 2048* texture might have something to do with your shitty render speeds too. take it down to a 256* or something for that piece of "art".
lol... this is brilliant!
I guess he wouldn't, I'm pretty sure pior works at blizzard..
I'll keep this thread here though, because some of the advice is golden.
As stated by others, most engines out there only render triangle meshes. Software or hardware side optimization aside, there are other pitfalls caused by geometry, here's a few examples. The original polygon models on bottom, bad render mockups on the top. The left and right ones demonstrate bad fills in different ways. The middle set is a little hard to see well, but shows the classic 'did the artist mean a valley or peak?' scenario. In some cases, an engine could utterly fail and start interconnecting faces inside a cube.
I bring this up because I've had similar discussions in the past, and those artists had all kinds of similarly bad geo.
I'm curious now; does anyone know if 3d cards can actually render anything higher than a triangle when it comes to polymeshes? I'm not talking about behind the scenes geometry, like a plain-ol flat pentagon (in 3d).
But can I touch you, then?
good one this is the fucking funniest thread i have read in long time !
possibility 2 this guy really doesn't get it in which case let me really blow you mind:
its neither polygons nor TRIANGLES you should be concerned about !
really what takes your transform time is the verts !
smoothing groups split verts
uv cuts split verts
different materials you assign splits verts.
but even that is probably irrelevant because i doubt your gpu is transform bound at all
if you really care about performance these are the things you should look into:
STRIPS OVERDRAW AND MOST OF ALL DRAWCALLS !!!!!!!!!!! you have probably heard of neither !
PS the triangulation that the others suggested is purely a safety precaution to retain the shape of your model could be that if you imported your truck into a normal game engine that its tires will sort of "collapse". if this hasnt happend to you yet it must have been pure luck.
Brilliant!
It does not matter what you believe! There is this thing called reality, so it does not matter how much you believe in unicorns, fairies and other riff-raff, its still wrong.
If your mathematical "experience" tells you that 2+2=8.43 it still is not.
Quit being pants-on-head retarded, and stop wasting our bloody time..