Can I/Should I become an artist, with this personality at 23?
polycounter lvl 9
Hey there,
I'm 23 and I've spent the last couple weeks considering my career options. I hope that maybe someone can give some insight regarding all of this.
I've studied a number of things in university mostly on the basis of being a good analytical and abstract thinker. So far I've been in linguistics, philosophy, biochemistry and Japan studies. All of these have been wrong choices for a bunch of reasons. I've reassessed all of this and came to the inevitable conclusion that an area related to digital art, animation or 3D design in one way or the other is the only career that I feel is honestly worth pursuing.
Although I do enjoy a good dose of theory and science every once in a while, I feel no sense of achievement in studying if I'm not improving a specific set of personal skills. I'm very interested in theoretical backgrounds so long as it relates to a problem or project that I'm working on at that time, or a skill that I seek to improve. I only ever enjoy work if it's something creative where I'm working with a specific project that can be refined and optimized (e.g. writing, drawing, programming, composing etc.) and if it somehow relates to a personal skill, as opposed to raw knowledge.
I have made my previous choices without this understanding of what I actually like doing. It's a bit ironic that I wanted to be an illustrator or animator as a child but ultimately discarded that idea because I was under the impression that I lacked "talent" and that it was not something realistically attainable. However, I currently feel that there is not a single alternative to becoming an artist in the widest sense of the word. I have also considered computer science but the intricate technical details and mathematical stuff are not something that I particularly care about.
I guess I have these major questions:
1. Is it a realistic goal to become an animator, level designer or something to that effect? At 23, I currently have no extensive art skills, but no practice either. I can be very dedicated though.
2. Can I be successful in this field as a person that is more of an analytical thinker rather than someone who goes by what feels best? Is this even relevant?
3. Are there any alternative options I could be missing?
Any help would be greatly appreciated.
I'm 23 and I've spent the last couple weeks considering my career options. I hope that maybe someone can give some insight regarding all of this.
I've studied a number of things in university mostly on the basis of being a good analytical and abstract thinker. So far I've been in linguistics, philosophy, biochemistry and Japan studies. All of these have been wrong choices for a bunch of reasons. I've reassessed all of this and came to the inevitable conclusion that an area related to digital art, animation or 3D design in one way or the other is the only career that I feel is honestly worth pursuing.
Although I do enjoy a good dose of theory and science every once in a while, I feel no sense of achievement in studying if I'm not improving a specific set of personal skills. I'm very interested in theoretical backgrounds so long as it relates to a problem or project that I'm working on at that time, or a skill that I seek to improve. I only ever enjoy work if it's something creative where I'm working with a specific project that can be refined and optimized (e.g. writing, drawing, programming, composing etc.) and if it somehow relates to a personal skill, as opposed to raw knowledge.
I have made my previous choices without this understanding of what I actually like doing. It's a bit ironic that I wanted to be an illustrator or animator as a child but ultimately discarded that idea because I was under the impression that I lacked "talent" and that it was not something realistically attainable. However, I currently feel that there is not a single alternative to becoming an artist in the widest sense of the word. I have also considered computer science but the intricate technical details and mathematical stuff are not something that I particularly care about.
I guess I have these major questions:
1. Is it a realistic goal to become an animator, level designer or something to that effect? At 23, I currently have no extensive art skills, but no practice either. I can be very dedicated though.
2. Can I be successful in this field as a person that is more of an analytical thinker rather than someone who goes by what feels best? Is this even relevant?
3. Are there any alternative options I could be missing?
Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Replies
Just go make art, and i have no idea why new guys always have this fixation with age.
http://boards.polycount.net/showthread.php?t=64763
Seriously no one cares if your a 400 year old brain in a jar as long as you can pump out the quality. I think the average age of developers is growing to be honest.
Fairly similar to myself actually: did pretty much nothing but science (including 5 years of uni) with basically no art schooling, then at 23 switched to art and got in the industry about 2 years later.
The mian thing is knowing what you want, going for it and doing your best at it.
As for college, it's basically impossible in my country to get a real job without a degree, no matter what additional aspects there might be to the CV. I'd have to relocate and commit to that degree, so that's why it's quite the decision to make.
Just doing it resulted in me making 4 wrong decisions consecutively. I think just doing it again would not be a good sign.
They drill it into you, that if you dont know, you are an idiot and we will telll you, now go and do this for the rest of your life.
They convince people that if they havent started doing what they think they want at the earliest age possible then they will be useless at it or be beaten by a younger who has been doing it since they were six(because everything is sooo much easier when you've been doing it since you were young).
They dont allow, recognise indecision, they dont like people to change their minds, society seems to dissaprove of theses sort of actions.
The most important thing I will tell you is that you need to come at this from a place of passion. I was like you, in that i tried and did ok at a lot of things, but was pulled back to game art because I had always loved games, and loved to draw and wanted to get to the bottom of how it was done. There is no reason you can't break into games if you start now, but you should realize that you will have to want it 100% and put a lot of effort in. You will have catching up to do in the art department, and the EU has less options for studios, so it may be more difficult to break in there vs the US.
You can make it happen, but once you decide to do it, make sure you're hellbent to do it! Best of luck to ya.
Edit: Also an important note. A degree is good to have, but it WILL NOT get you a job in games, especially as an artist, without a good portfolio. 99% of the people i know in the industry threw out their college work, and got jobs with work done on their own time that went above and beyond what their classes required. Thats what people want to see in an applicant.
I work with Mongrelman, don't believe a word he's saying
(just kiddding, it's true and he's a damn good artist)
IF you do want to get into games art, do traditional art studies as well. Knowing about lighting, composition, colour theory, anatomy and all the other bits and bobs is good. While it isn't exactly necessary, you will be better off knowing these things than not. And for the love of god doodle. Doodle like you've never doodled before, it will make you better at visualising ideas and helps communicating with other team members and is generaly A Good Thing(tm).
I agree with this completely. School always tried to force me to make a decision when I really wasn't ready, if they had it their way I'd be doing physics and maths based courses. Just do what you want to do, don't listen to what society deems is right. If you start making some pieces of art, you'll know if you love it or not.
I think there's A LOT of potential in this side of things, and it's far more creative than people think. I actually fell in love with scripting recently and wondered where i'd be had i tried programming when i was younger (i'm 27 and kicked the crap out of all the young bucks in the class so don't let age stop you).
Just a thought... arts fun and all, but it's the "easy way" into the industry. There's a lot more competition and more people with "natural talent". Again, if you're good with math and logical thinking, i'd highly reccomend taking some programming courses. You'll know right away if you're cut out for that kind of stuff and not wast much time unlike in art, where you may spend years finally realizing you don't have the innate talent.
anyway don't let age be a barrier , I am 87 and still regularly paint textures and look at porn and stuff.
LOL... oh man wow! that was awesome, thnx Vig... ya made me laugh for a while.
Yanta, if you want to do it, just do it. It is better to have tried something than to look back in regret! All you need is drive and commitment. Don't worry about the age thing... your still fairly young and you got plenty of time! So go for it!
I don't think any art career (fine arts, production art, entertainment imagery, whatever ...) is something you pick up like that. If you do it "by the book" your stuff might end up being very formulaic and not vey different from the mass of average folios out there.
However, you do have a fantastic background to dig from! Philisophy, Japan culture and scicene? Man you should be drawing already!
One real-life fact tho : I don't think I ever met someone I worked with who decided to pick up as a career just because of a mere interest. It's all passionate people here!
What game do you enjoy? What's your dream game to work on?
Show us stuff man
qft!
Passion>knowledge when it comes to art, youll never make good art unless you love making it. (just my opinion)
OK thanks for the tips
I've actually done C++ for several years as a child and picked it back up for an internship but then it just bored me immensely, especially the more technical side. I like scripting and the sort of work where you work on the front-end, like Flash/Java or web stuff, but I dislike memory management, graphics programming, AI or any of that stuff which is 80% maths and technology.
So it's not really enough interest for a degree/career in computer science or game programming, and I think I'd rather work in film or ads than non-games software.
Well I've mostly doodled a lot in boring classes etc. but never really finished any one piece. Also done some mapping for Quake 3 back in the day and HL2 but I've never really considered the possibility of doing anything of that nature professionally since it's not something I've done for years on end.
Unfortunately I can't really say that there's any one thing that I've always done or been fascinated by since my childhood. Obviously I had an interest in animation/games and did something creative every once in a while but that applies to 90% of kids and I think by itself that wouldn't qualify someone for a career in that field.
I liked Penumbra
draw every day, 2-3 hours. read art books, look at other peoples drawings, try drawing them..
don't sit here and make excuses for not making art.
also good for practice is to doodle whenever you can.
doodle in class, when talking on the phone, etc. it increases your concentration and you'll remember more of what is said.
Straight up dude, there is no perfect job. I can't help but feel the reason you're so interested in game art is because you don't know much about it. It sounds like you've tried a lot of various things and nothing's really clicked, at some point you're going to realize nothing ever will be perfect. You gotta pick a path, don't pick what's going to be easy, because that job doesn't exist, or wont last forever. Find what you're good at, and go for it. Take pride in it and enjoy it as best you can. Here's the plus though, you'll get paid because you're good at it.
Age became a pretty hot topic in this thread, and though age isn't necessarily a good gauge of your potential, it is a good gauge of dedication. If you haven't tried really hard to be incredibly good at something by 23, then there's a good chance you wont make it in the game art field, because competition here is pretty tough, for exactly the same reason you're interested. It looks fun on the surface and it doesn't appear THAT hard to do. And that's more or less true. But the job becomes more technical every year, and every year a higher percentage of kids try to jump on the bandwagon.
I'm not trying to piss on your dream or anything, I'm just trying to potentially stop you from making a mistake, there are too many kids trying to get into this field and there just aren't that many positions. Some of these kids are really good and have known they wanted to be game artists since they made their first halo map when they were 7. That's your competition. And what makes them more likely to make it isn't that they're younger and have greater potential per say, it's because they have strong dedication. They decided what they were going to do, started doing it, and became really, realy good at it. But hey, if all this doesn't scare you off you might have a chance, if you also have a natural talent for art and game design. And in the end, following that naive dream of getting that dream job does make the journey a bit more tolerable.
I guess my problem is that I haven't done it consistently mostly because I lacked direction. For example, I played the guitar for some 3 years and I've played 10+ hours/day in some periods when I had the time. It's just that I tend to jump hobbies a lot and leave a field if I feel that I've reached a decent level (not talking about mastery, just good). It could be different if I have long-term commitment for a career goal.
Well, as I said I'm not looking for something "fun" in the traditional sense, just something that I actually want to invest tons of hours into rather than just meeting the demands of the curriculum or some prof without actually caring about the subject matter. I want to work and learn but struggle/d to find something that I care enough about to do it.
The purpose of the thread is just for me to get answers to the questions I've put in the OP, and get comments on the situation so I can better assess it. I never said I was intelligent or talented... (but I am, thanks for playing) I figure that people who have success in a given field would have a good deal of knowledge about it... so I'd rather ask those experts who've actually done something than someone who really has no clue. OK, I will keep that in mind.
I'm 23 (I think) and what I found is I'm quite young apparently. Maybe.
But the point is age, like megapixels, aint but a number.
just a thought.
I also only really decided to do game art about two years ago, and only picked up the tech just over a year ago (before that, I'd never processed from high to low or put things in engine blah blah.)
So it's possible. But yeah determination to do it is the main thing. I was doing art before that though.
As for no art background, I don't know. If you know what you like, art wise, sit down and figure out why, pop some theory up in this piece, figure it out, take what you learn and implement it. I don't think an artistic eye is something you can easily study to gain. But I have no clue on this part.
There is room (and need) for both analytical/logical and abstract/intuitive thinkers in the field of commercial art. Art is neither science nor mysticism.
Alternative options to what?
Many of the exercises in the book are still used in art schools today. They'll genuinely help you get into an artist's mind-set and learn to "see" properly. The subjects you've studied are all very left-brained, maybe with the exception of philosophy. Most people find they have neglected the right side of the brain and the skills that go with it, with the result that they still draw the same way as they did when they were twelve years old.
Anyway, enough PR for the book. Game art is a good mix of creative and technical, problem solving skills which are constantly changing, meaning that it's unlikely to ever get too easy or dull.If this sounds like your thing, then give it a shot. Just remember that traditional art skills are WAY more important than knowing the digital tools.
That's why people are criticising you for asking. Art is something you should need to do. It's generally not a career choice. It's a very difficult career with a lot of competition so if you think for one minute that you can't do it then you probably shouldn't.
This sentence of yours irks me, "I only ever enjoy work if it's something creative where I'm working with a specific project that can be refined and optimized"
Looks to me like you're looking for a type of perfect job that does not exist. It's not always going to be creative. It's not always going to be fun. Bottom line, even though you're a game artist, (unless it's personal work) you're still creating a product.
Oh, and sprunghunt's answer ^ is right on the money too.
On a related note, if I go back to the thread title (removing the age bt, since we agree it's not relevant) :
Can I/Should I become an artist, with this personality?
then if we are talking purely game art, I would say no/no (except if you change that one attitude/personality). I have been taking part to tons of artists interviews over the last year+, and the whole part about your educational background (even if it's intersting stuff to study) would only give you a slight polite nod from the persons interviewing you, before moving on to other worthwile interview matters. It's not a matter of getting a degree or not in such fields - it's about how this rich background proves itself to be relevant to your artwork or game art passion. And I am positive it'd be the same in the other slightly related fields you mention (web, animation, whatnot). So I am not saying 'no' because I personally believe you shouldn't try (no one can judge you on this!), but rather, 'no' as in, I don't think this would make for a successful job interview.
I do realise it is hard to get an idea of how competitive this field is (many students out there really have no idea themselves) and even browsing websites like Polycount won't give you that perspective easily either since we can only show our personal stuff here, not the NDA things we work on 90% of the time. Check out the dominance war results, this IS the kind competitors you are supposed to be as good as to get in.
I agree with the general tone of the thread - it's a strange question to ask. Show us stuff man!
Oh btw, regarding getting into the technical sides of game (technical art, tool coding and so on). I personally only trust TAs that have an artistic background, since at least they know what they are talking about. That's something to consider too, one can't jump in and be a kickass TA just thanks to Melscript knowledge.
As the wise Yoda would say "Do or do not. There is no try"
Im 23 and I just got into game-art. I learn by working almost everyday on pieces. Either take the plunge or don't, you don't need approval from anyone but yourself.
You don't "talk" the walk. You "walk" the walk.
anyone can do it.... and anyone can do it well.
just make sure you want it.
While you're keeping that in your mind, understand that saying you're passionate isn't the same as demonstrating your passion. You demonstrate passion through your work. If you need to tell people you're passionate then you are probably not doing enough.
i believe in you peter.
2. Can I be successful in this field as a person that is more of an analytical thinker rather than someone who goes by what feels best? Is this even relevant?
i don't see how that matters. i think either of those types of people can find success in any field. i'd say, it's not relevant.
3. Are there any alternative options I could be missing?
if i were casting you for a role, i think you'd be a good college instructor that bangs his students.
Seriously, listen to them. You are looking for approval in some sort(as EQ said), and all the pros here know what they are talking about. If you were passionated enough, you wouldn't be here asking for "critical comments"... you would be here showing off work and then asking for critical comments.
Misunderstand me correctly though, I think you should DO and then make up your mind.