Fuse did you see the Sony Home movie? It looked nothing like the Mii 'system' to me besides creating avatars.
EDIT: Confirmed: LittleBigPlanet is 4 players! wooot!
[ QUOTE ] Phil Harrison keynote recap...
The final announcement is for LittleBigPlanet, the new Media Molecule-created game from the creators of Rag Doll Kung Fu. It's a customizable multiplayer environment with physics, a sandbox environment where you can make "tactile and highly interactive environments".
When levels are created for the visually attractive, cartoony game, they use realistic physics systems for many of the puzzles, and completely customizable levels can be created and shared over the PlayStation 3 network. Four players can team up to get through the levels at once, which all involve levers, gravity, and other physics to great effect. The game will be debuting on the PlayStation Network later this year, and on Blu-ray Disc in early 2008.
[/ QUOTE ]
So it looks like you can not only play with 4 people but create your own puzzles. AWESOME!
San Francisco, CA- Today in a shocking turn of events Sony has decided to release positive news about their newest game system, the Playstation 3. "After spending the last year trying to prove what utter fuck-tards we are, we thought it was time for a change of pace. The upside to this is that no matter how mediocre our positive news is it will get a huge response from the Sony fans, who are just glad that we have stopped shitting on them" said Sony of America president Phil Harrison.
nice to see good news from sony. Both of those things were pretty impressive. The only thing that was confusing me was; is "home" going to have public areas? If so are they going to be overrun by little freaks? Is it invite only? Guess we will find out.
Wow... That game looks pretty goddamn fun. Besides one or two other games, that's the first news in a long time that's had me looking forward to maybe getting a PS3. Sony's change in attitude helps as well.
It looks nice but didn't the N64 churn out side-scrolling 2.5d platformers on it's release? Looks like it would get boring real quick.
It's all just eye candy IMHO. How many people can seriously go back to platform games for more than 10 minutes without getting mind numbingly bored?
That Home thing sounds totally ridiculous. Too little too late done by too many other companies copying Habbo's Hotel and try to be the next big SNS. What myspace user it going to suddenly drop everything to hang out on an overpriced console where you can make your own face and buy Habbo's furniture? Not as many as Sony hope, I predict.
Game 3.0?
stick it up your arse. Web 2.0 is just a catch phrase, jump on the bandwagon sony!
BTW I am not a sony hater, I just bought a 36" bravia.
[ QUOTE ]
It looks nice but didn't the N64 churn out side-scrolling 2.5d platformers on it's release? Looks like it would get boring real quick.
[/ QUOTE ]
Did you not watch the video I watched? 3 dimensions were right there, side scrolling or not.
[ QUOTE ]
It's all just eye candy IMHO. How many people can seriously go back to platform games for more than 10 minutes without getting mind numbingly bored?
[/ QUOTE ]
Let me answer that with another question: How many people can say they've played a 3D 4-player co-op side scrolling platform game that has its puzzles based completely on dynamic physics and includes a level AND puzzle creator?
[ QUOTE ]
That Home thing sounds totally ridiculous. Too little too late done by too many other companies copying Habbo's Hotel and try to be the next big SNS. What myspace user it going to suddenly drop everything to hang out on an overpriced console where you can make your own face and buy Habbo's furniture? Not as many as Sony hope, I predict.
[/ QUOTE ]
Habbo was wildly successful and I believe that it still is. So comparing it to Habbo may not be such a bad thing. Their definition of 'Game 3.0' is the reasoning behind this - and what other method could they possibly use to get this sort of online communication, media sharing, game connecting, event planning, etc. that is NOT a boring 2D operating system? This is a console, after all. An over-priced one, sure. But that doesn't take away from the fact that those who have the PS3 will most likely have PS Home and will most likely be experiencing something unique to the console crowd that you simply cannot have on the other major consoles right now.
[ QUOTE ]
Game 3.0?
stick it up your arse. Web 2.0 is just a catch phrase, jump on the bandwagon sony!
[/ QUOTE ]
So is Game 3.0. The definition he gave makes sense, I suppose. I'm not sure what makes Web 2.0 JUST a catch phrase when its a clear definition of the online computing platform and all those sites that claim to be 'web 2.0' clearly fit within that definition, comparatively.
[ QUOTE ]
BTW I am not a sony hater, I just bought a 36" bravia.
[/ QUOTE ]
I am in no means a Sony 'fanboy'. I just wanted to comment as I pretty much disagreed with everything you wrote. I'm still not buying a PS3.
So is home going to be like real life? Because in the real world my friends used to always come over and just watch my movies, listen to my music, and play my games. The description of home sounded like thats how it worked. If so don't they know that that breaks a few copyrite laws by allowing others to watch/listen to your media at the same time.
If it works the way they worded to sound then well they are basically making the very thing they have been shutting down. A file sharing network. All you would have to do is go into the world and say hey who has (insert movie/music) someone says i do, you say hi then go back to his place and watch/listen to it in his house.
the game looks very very nice. But for me this would be about the largest headache in trying to play a game ever. I don't have enough friends who are good at platformers to bother trying a 4 player co-op platformer... hmm guess that means I need more real life friends. Could also be the only way to afford a ps3. heh
Platform games are still fun if they are done well. I think what makes the retro experience feel so limiting is that people are now used to more complex and precise control than those games had.
Anyway, 4 player co-op puzzle-platforming looks like a blast to play. My impression from the video is that the control looks very tight.
Home looks to me like Sony took Second Life, updated the graphics, removed the already-limited ability to create anything (they want you to buy stuff for your 'house), and called it 'more compelling than anything on other consoles.'
It sounds like they are making a sandbox game and leaving the level design up to the end users? Nice of them to do, I like sandboxes to play in but not everyone does if that is all ends up being.
But who knows it might take off and bring up a new crop of people interested in making games. Where would most of the people who make levels for a living be if it wasn't for editors being shipped with games? Still you have to wonder does the market at large want to build their own levels or do they just want to play the game?
Getting the player to do your level design is a cute idea, but really only a handful of people will pick it up and run with it. Most will more than likely futz around and move on.
you guys should check out the share video, supposedly the system allows for sharing of custom made levels and arenas with ratings etc ... which actually sounds kind of cool, kind of like in the olden days users created elaborate rpg/painball maps for starcraft.
So about that sharing thing.. Hypothetically could I make a level.. Slap my custom, (e.g. pictures of ex-girlfriend naked) decals all over it and then publish it to their servers?
I think Sonys secret plan to guarantee success is to create home and all their 3.0 games as a secret distribution network for pron?
All kidding aside.. after watching that 18 min vid... WOW.. it looks great. I can't wait to try it. Yes, its a side scroller, but I'd rather play a side scroller than another derivative WWII shooter.
From what I understand about the custom levels, is that you use premade assets to arrange new puzzles. No new textures, no new assets, you can't put anything new in the sandbox.
[ QUOTE ]
From what I understand about the custom levels, is that you use premade assets to arrange new puzzles. No new textures, no new assets, you can't put anything new in the sandbox.
[/ QUOTE ]
Actually, one of the videos floating around (the one displaying the games' creation capabilities) specifically says you can bring in new stickers to slap on things at the very least. In fact, I think they specifically mention 'pictures of your girlfriend taken with the eye-toy' or something like that. I imagine the content will be moderated though.
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
It looks nice but didn't the N64 churn out side-scrolling 2.5d platformers on it's release? Looks like it would get boring real quick.
[/ QUOTE ]
Did you not watch the video I watched? 3 dimensions were right there, side scrolling or not.
[/ QUOTE ]
2.5d is the official term to describe 3d sidescrolling platformers, I think it has been in use since crash bandicoot and it's ilk came out.
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
It's all just eye candy IMHO. How many people can seriously go back to platform games for more than 10 minutes without getting mind numbingly bored?
[/ QUOTE ]
Let me answer that with another question: How many people can say they've played a 3D 4-player co-op side scrolling platform game that has its puzzles based completely on dynamic physics and includes a level AND puzzle creator?
[/ QUOTE ]
Loads of games like this on the Amiga and dreamcast. Maybe painted with a different brush but essentially, the same. Wool + Eyes
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
That Home thing sounds totally ridiculous. Too little too late done by too many other companies copying Habbo's Hotel and try to be the next big SNS. What myspace user it going to suddenly drop everything to hang out on an overpriced console where you can make your own face and buy Habbo's furniture? Not as many as Sony hope, I predict.
[/ QUOTE ]
Habbo was wildly successful and I believe that it still is. So comparing it to Habbo may not be such a bad thing. Their definition of 'Game 3.0' is the reasoning behind this - and what other method could they possibly use to get this sort of online communication, media sharing, game connecting, event planning, etc. that is NOT a boring 2D operating system? This is a console, after all. An over-priced one, sure. But that doesn't take away from the fact that those who have the PS3 will most likely have PS Home and will most likely be experiencing something unique to the console crowd that you simply cannot have on the other major consoles right now.
[/ QUOTE ]
Agreed, however what exactly are they bringing to the table? An SNS with a 3d interface. It's nice to see such things put into action, all I'm saying is that there are SNSes coming out every 5 seconds, each one claiming it's the best.
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Game 3.0?
stick it up your arse. Web 2.0 is just a catch phrase, jump on the bandwagon sony!
[/ QUOTE ]
So is Game 3.0. The definition he gave makes sense, I suppose. I'm not sure what makes Web 2.0 JUST a catch phrase when its a clear definition of the online computing platform and all those sites that claim to be 'web 2.0' clearly fit within that definition, comparatively.
[/ QUOTE ]
Web 2.0 describes services on the web. It's terribly over used though, with most people thinking if they use a bit of CSS and a shiny logo they are suddenly Web 2.0.
The greatest sadness is that if you don't try to be Web 2.0, you look stupid, not the other way around. Jumping on the bandwagon and trying to future proof them selves is ridiculous. Lets have Game 1.0 first please Sony.
I like how Sony claimed that the big secret they were going to reveal at GDC would make all the PS3 owners happy they bought one.
To those who own one, did it do that for you? Is Home the killer app that makes you glad you bought it?
[ QUOTE ]
Agreed, however what exactly are they bringing to the table? An SNS with a 3d interface. It's nice to see such things put into action, all I'm saying is that there are SNSes coming out every 5 seconds, each one claiming it's the best.
[/ QUOTE ]
What they are bringing to the table is not important. What is important is that they are bringing it with the table.
If Live had first launched on the PC no one would care. There were online gaming services launching every 5 seconds back then. But Microsoft shoved it out with their console and all of a sudden millions of people had it and were using it.
By the time Home is out millions of people should have PS3's and, even better than with Live, almost all of them will be using it because it is free. By the end of the year the amount of active Home users could possibly match the amount of active Live users. That's a big deal.
And if they rope people into using an SNS like Home, that can only benefit a game like LittleBigPlanet, which is based around a YouTube-like sharing service for levels.
Apologize for bumping this thread, but there was a pretty heated discussion at work about the point of this game:
Is this game just a level editor or what? All the videos I've seen just show editing tools, and silly party games.
The game looks OMFG WTF BBQ amazing, but what's the gameplay? All I hear is hype about how we can create levels and customizing stuff which I'm not really much of a fan of doing.
Heck, 99.9% of the user made level/mods for any game that ever shipped with an editor have been complete an utter crap. Sifting through and playing through thousands of them just to find ONE semi-decent one seems like such a chore.
Colour me a cynic, but is there more to this game than what I'm seeing (incredible hype for a product without substance).
Well they've said the amount of levels that ship with the game equal a complete game experience.
I guess this game will appeal to people who like Garry's Mod and Phun. Me and Rhinokey are always trying to make 'games' inside Gmod and Phun but there's no real rules built in, it usually involves both of us building tanks and whoever kills the other one wins.
[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L5nqHNaDus8[/ame]
Well if you saw the Sony keynote for E3 this year, the presentation at the beginning was done entirely in LBP. It's a game that has 50 or so levels built in, but provides all of the tools to make your own levels, adventures, stories, etc. If you want to make a quick party game you can, if you want to make a longer platform adventure you can. It's all up to you.
I think the game looks amazingly fun. It's just the sort of thing I can get lost in for hours creating a level or something my wife would actually enjoy playing with me. It's just that cute. If you preorder from gamestop you get a Kratos outfit for sackboy.
Nearly all the videos I've seen were showing off the level creation tools. Then I saw a couple of user created Party games, and an incredibly easy looking platformer level (the one that ended up on a skateboard).
Is that the selling point of the game?
I keep thinking that a level editor is usually an ADD-ON to what's supposed to be a very solid game with an abundance of gameplay.
Like, if all I want from a game is to finish a single player mode, then go back and maybe have a bit of multiplayer with some friends, and have ZERO interest in creating levels, or sifting through a bunch of VERY crappy user generated ones, then is this game still for me?
(If you want to understand my skepticism about the quality of user generated content, log onto Starcraft, Warcraft 3, or TeamFortress 2, and tell me the ratio between good user generated maps to the bad ones).
If the 50 levels that ship with the game stand on their own merit, howcome there aren't really any videos showing them? Why aren't they selling the 50 levels, AND THEN showing the crazy-ass level editor as a bonus feature to the amazing 50 level game (which I might add we really haven't seen much of)?
Replies
Theres an HD video of it up @ Gametrailers
seems like a great party game if it is indeed 4 player
i really love seeing the 2d side scroller using 3d enviroments and characters. good to see it's not completely dead on 'next-gen' systems
things are shaping up for sony ?
http://download.gametrailers.com/gt_vault/t_littlebigplanet_gdc07_h264.wmv
EDIT: Confirmed: LittleBigPlanet is 4 players! wooot!
[ QUOTE ]
Phil Harrison keynote recap...
The final announcement is for LittleBigPlanet, the new Media Molecule-created game from the creators of Rag Doll Kung Fu. It's a customizable multiplayer environment with physics, a sandbox environment where you can make "tactile and highly interactive environments".
When levels are created for the visually attractive, cartoony game, they use realistic physics systems for many of the puzzles, and completely customizable levels can be created and shared over the PlayStation 3 network. Four players can team up to get through the levels at once, which all involve levers, gravity, and other physics to great effect. The game will be debuting on the PlayStation Network later this year, and on Blu-ray Disc in early 2008.
[/ QUOTE ]
So it looks like you can not only play with 4 people but create your own puzzles. AWESOME!
Sony Generates Postive Buzz
San Francisco, CA- Today in a shocking turn of events Sony has decided to release positive news about their newest game system, the Playstation 3. "After spending the last year trying to prove what utter fuck-tards we are, we thought it was time for a change of pace. The upside to this is that no matter how mediocre our positive news is it will get a huge response from the Sony fans, who are just glad that we have stopped shitting on them" said Sony of America president Phil Harrison.
And sharing : http://download.gametrailers.com/gt_vault/t_littlebigplanet_gdc07_sharing.wmv
(Thanks for posting the name of the cd/band, woulda never found it otherwise.)
It's all just eye candy IMHO. How many people can seriously go back to platform games for more than 10 minutes without getting mind numbingly bored?
That Home thing sounds totally ridiculous. Too little too late done by too many other companies copying Habbo's Hotel and try to be the next big SNS. What myspace user it going to suddenly drop everything to hang out on an overpriced console where you can make your own face and buy Habbo's furniture? Not as many as Sony hope, I predict.
Game 3.0?
stick it up your arse. Web 2.0 is just a catch phrase, jump on the bandwagon sony!
BTW I am not a sony hater, I just bought a 36" bravia.
It looks nice but didn't the N64 churn out side-scrolling 2.5d platformers on it's release? Looks like it would get boring real quick.
[/ QUOTE ]
Did you not watch the video I watched? 3 dimensions were right there, side scrolling or not.
[ QUOTE ]
It's all just eye candy IMHO. How many people can seriously go back to platform games for more than 10 minutes without getting mind numbingly bored?
[/ QUOTE ]
Let me answer that with another question: How many people can say they've played a 3D 4-player co-op side scrolling platform game that has its puzzles based completely on dynamic physics and includes a level AND puzzle creator?
[ QUOTE ]
That Home thing sounds totally ridiculous. Too little too late done by too many other companies copying Habbo's Hotel and try to be the next big SNS. What myspace user it going to suddenly drop everything to hang out on an overpriced console where you can make your own face and buy Habbo's furniture? Not as many as Sony hope, I predict.
[/ QUOTE ]
Habbo was wildly successful and I believe that it still is. So comparing it to Habbo may not be such a bad thing. Their definition of 'Game 3.0' is the reasoning behind this - and what other method could they possibly use to get this sort of online communication, media sharing, game connecting, event planning, etc. that is NOT a boring 2D operating system? This is a console, after all. An over-priced one, sure. But that doesn't take away from the fact that those who have the PS3 will most likely have PS Home and will most likely be experiencing something unique to the console crowd that you simply cannot have on the other major consoles right now.
[ QUOTE ]
Game 3.0?
stick it up your arse. Web 2.0 is just a catch phrase, jump on the bandwagon sony!
[/ QUOTE ]
So is Game 3.0. The definition he gave makes sense, I suppose. I'm not sure what makes Web 2.0 JUST a catch phrase when its a clear definition of the online computing platform and all those sites that claim to be 'web 2.0' clearly fit within that definition, comparatively.
[ QUOTE ]
BTW I am not a sony hater, I just bought a 36" bravia.
[/ QUOTE ]
I am in no means a Sony 'fanboy'. I just wanted to comment as I pretty much disagreed with everything you wrote. I'm still not buying a PS3.
If it works the way they worded to sound then well they are basically making the very thing they have been shutting down. A file sharing network. All you would have to do is go into the world and say hey who has (insert movie/music) someone says i do, you say hi then go back to his place and watch/listen to it in his house.
Sounds like a great, but bad idea.
Anyway, 4 player co-op puzzle-platforming looks like a blast to play. My impression from the video is that the control looks very tight.
Well if Sony said it it must be true.
Frank the Avenger
Good to see it taking advantage of the ps3, and the music fits the game well.
But who knows it might take off and bring up a new crop of people interested in making games. Where would most of the people who make levels for a living be if it wasn't for editors being shipped with games? Still you have to wonder does the market at large want to build their own levels or do they just want to play the game?
Getting the player to do your level design is a cute idea, but really only a handful of people will pick it up and run with it. Most will more than likely futz around and move on.
I am sure it will ship with readymade levels
I think Sonys secret plan to guarantee success is to create home and all their 3.0 games as a secret distribution network for pron?
All kidding aside.. after watching that 18 min vid... WOW.. it looks great. I can't wait to try it. Yes, its a side scroller, but I'd rather play a side scroller than another derivative WWII shooter.
From what I understand about the custom levels, is that you use premade assets to arrange new puzzles. No new textures, no new assets, you can't put anything new in the sandbox.
[/ QUOTE ]
Actually, one of the videos floating around (the one displaying the games' creation capabilities) specifically says you can bring in new stickers to slap on things at the very least. In fact, I think they specifically mention 'pictures of your girlfriend taken with the eye-toy' or something like that. I imagine the content will be moderated though.
[ QUOTE ]
It looks nice but didn't the N64 churn out side-scrolling 2.5d platformers on it's release? Looks like it would get boring real quick.
[/ QUOTE ]
Did you not watch the video I watched? 3 dimensions were right there, side scrolling or not.
[/ QUOTE ]
2.5d is the official term to describe 3d sidescrolling platformers, I think it has been in use since crash bandicoot and it's ilk came out.
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
It's all just eye candy IMHO. How many people can seriously go back to platform games for more than 10 minutes without getting mind numbingly bored?
[/ QUOTE ]
Let me answer that with another question: How many people can say they've played a 3D 4-player co-op side scrolling platform game that has its puzzles based completely on dynamic physics and includes a level AND puzzle creator?
[/ QUOTE ]
Loads of games like this on the Amiga and dreamcast. Maybe painted with a different brush but essentially, the same. Wool + Eyes
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
That Home thing sounds totally ridiculous. Too little too late done by too many other companies copying Habbo's Hotel and try to be the next big SNS. What myspace user it going to suddenly drop everything to hang out on an overpriced console where you can make your own face and buy Habbo's furniture? Not as many as Sony hope, I predict.
[/ QUOTE ]
Habbo was wildly successful and I believe that it still is. So comparing it to Habbo may not be such a bad thing. Their definition of 'Game 3.0' is the reasoning behind this - and what other method could they possibly use to get this sort of online communication, media sharing, game connecting, event planning, etc. that is NOT a boring 2D operating system? This is a console, after all. An over-priced one, sure. But that doesn't take away from the fact that those who have the PS3 will most likely have PS Home and will most likely be experiencing something unique to the console crowd that you simply cannot have on the other major consoles right now.
[/ QUOTE ]
Agreed, however what exactly are they bringing to the table? An SNS with a 3d interface. It's nice to see such things put into action, all I'm saying is that there are SNSes coming out every 5 seconds, each one claiming it's the best.
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Game 3.0?
stick it up your arse. Web 2.0 is just a catch phrase, jump on the bandwagon sony!
[/ QUOTE ]
So is Game 3.0. The definition he gave makes sense, I suppose. I'm not sure what makes Web 2.0 JUST a catch phrase when its a clear definition of the online computing platform and all those sites that claim to be 'web 2.0' clearly fit within that definition, comparatively.
[/ QUOTE ]
Web 2.0 describes services on the web. It's terribly over used though, with most people thinking if they use a bit of CSS and a shiny logo they are suddenly Web 2.0.
The greatest sadness is that if you don't try to be Web 2.0, you look stupid, not the other way around. Jumping on the bandwagon and trying to future proof them selves is ridiculous. Lets have Game 1.0 first please Sony.
BTW my TV rocks.
Got link?
Little Big Planet looks awesome, I might buy a PS3 for it.
To those who own one, did it do that for you? Is Home the killer app that makes you glad you bought it?
I'm just curious.
Agreed, however what exactly are they bringing to the table? An SNS with a 3d interface. It's nice to see such things put into action, all I'm saying is that there are SNSes coming out every 5 seconds, each one claiming it's the best.
[/ QUOTE ]
What they are bringing to the table is not important. What is important is that they are bringing it with the table.
If Live had first launched on the PC no one would care. There were online gaming services launching every 5 seconds back then. But Microsoft shoved it out with their console and all of a sudden millions of people had it and were using it.
By the time Home is out millions of people should have PS3's and, even better than with Live, almost all of them will be using it because it is free. By the end of the year the amount of active Home users could possibly match the amount of active Live users. That's a big deal.
And if they rope people into using an SNS like Home, that can only benefit a game like LittleBigPlanet, which is based around a YouTube-like sharing service for levels.
http://kotaku.com/gaming/gdc07/gdc07-the-littlebigplanet-editor-in-action-242766.php
Damn you Sony
Still not paying arm/leg for it.
Little Big Planet Editor
Is this game just a level editor or what? All the videos I've seen just show editing tools, and silly party games.
The game looks OMFG WTF BBQ amazing, but what's the gameplay? All I hear is hype about how we can create levels and customizing stuff which I'm not really much of a fan of doing.
Heck, 99.9% of the user made level/mods for any game that ever shipped with an editor have been complete an utter crap. Sifting through and playing through thousands of them just to find ONE semi-decent one seems like such a chore.
Colour me a cynic, but is there more to this game than what I'm seeing (incredible hype for a product without substance).
I guess this game will appeal to people who like Garry's Mod and Phun. Me and Rhinokey are always trying to make 'games' inside Gmod and Phun but there's no real rules built in, it usually involves both of us building tanks and whoever kills the other one wins.
[ame]
I think the game looks amazingly fun. It's just the sort of thing I can get lost in for hours creating a level or something my wife would actually enjoy playing with me. It's just that cute. If you preorder from gamestop you get a Kratos outfit for sackboy.
Nearly all the videos I've seen were showing off the level creation tools. Then I saw a couple of user created Party games, and an incredibly easy looking platformer level (the one that ended up on a skateboard).
Is that the selling point of the game?
I keep thinking that a level editor is usually an ADD-ON to what's supposed to be a very solid game with an abundance of gameplay.
Like, if all I want from a game is to finish a single player mode, then go back and maybe have a bit of multiplayer with some friends, and have ZERO interest in creating levels, or sifting through a bunch of VERY crappy user generated ones, then is this game still for me?
(If you want to understand my skepticism about the quality of user generated content, log onto Starcraft, Warcraft 3, or TeamFortress 2, and tell me the ratio between good user generated maps to the bad ones).
If the 50 levels that ship with the game stand on their own merit, howcome there aren't really any videos showing them? Why aren't they selling the 50 levels, AND THEN showing the crazy-ass level editor as a bonus feature to the amazing 50 level game (which I might add we really haven't seen much of)?
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=333902