hey, i managed to get an hour with the model! this is all i did:
not much really... reworked the feet a bit, began the shoulder pads (they're symmetrical now... not for long) and changed the head about a bit...
as soon as i get a confirm that the legs are looking fine, that symmetry modifier is gonna get collapsed!
okay, update time:
symmetry is still on, the shoulderpads and retractable blades are seperate objects i'll attach later...
and now, for my first ever mudboxed piece... after hours and hours of struggling... i give you.... his first set of teeth:
how do they look?
okay, seriously though... any comments and crits are good. I'm guessnig the legs r fine now, so i'm leaving them alone for the time being... gonna work on shoulder-pads and blade.
BTW: im approaching 4000 tris already... is that bad? i think there are some polies i should look to delete.
ur right sectaurs... i do have some "problems" and need to brought back to 'normal' sometimes (ie. gauss about the bumps.) so i apologize...
anyways:
glad that the legs are looking better. i guess i can consider that hurdle crossed?
now his teeth... mudboxitis eh? I guess i could do something (alot-things) to fix that. But as of now, i present both sets of teeth, "complete"!
the first set (like the ones above) are used for crushing and grinding bones and marrow into powder. i guess they need to look more like molars?
the second set (the pointy ones) are canines for ripping out meat and what not...
hope u like 'em!
alrighty... decided to send the blade into mudbox to high-res it. and this is what i came up with.
i dunno if it's clear or not, but its supposed to be a weird animal skull that he's embedded into his arm. I'm thinking of making the rest look like a spinal column and the part that attaches to his arms look like ribs or more teeth (teeth in the stomach of the beast?)
its not done yet (need to add nose hole and eye sockets for example) but even still..... any thoughts?
thanks.
update:
front and back/bottom of the thing. didn't overlay a colour this time though...
and here are two shots to show how the high-poly fits onto the low-poly body... im a bit worried about the wrist area as there is a curve to the side over there... don't think it'll cause a problem during riggin/posing though?
i guess the blade isn't much of an attention grabber... i need to rad-ify it... but for now, here it is:
the crappy colouring is just to show that some bumpy parts are actually under the skin ...
and now im beginning to think that i'm spending too much time on this thing... must move back to the main mesh!!!
any comments, crits, complaints, insults, are completely welcome .
indian_boy if the arm/skull imbeded things is a big selling point for this guy then you really need to push it further - ie make it larger, make the spine intergration chunkier and more noticable. Its a good start for the character but you might find it better if you work on the whole thing (as in all area's of the character) rough out what you want and then go back and detail more. Focusing on this one area might seem important now but it might get lost on the guy later as you create other larger interesting area's. WHO know's, just keep going!
I agree with <font color="green">spacemonkey</font> work the hole model and work the base of it up and then focus on higher details like blade arm. Get all your mucel and bone definision of your character done first.
Keep up the hard work and lest see a well rounded model.
okay so i took your advice, and brought the whole mesh into mudbox. After sculpting the mesh as a whole at 4 levels, my comp started lagging at 5th level, so i had to mask areas etc. etc. In doin so, i'm practically focussing on major chunks separately (i don't think it should be too prablematic this way.) As of now, i've got the head to a minimal-presentable level. Now i'll jump ahead to other chunks to bring them up to the same level of detail one by one, and then repeat the cycle !
here's the head, with the suckermouths (which also have teeth by the way).
As for the composition, I think you'd be better off going in a single direction. The smooth contours of the battle suit seem to contrast the roughness of the wings and tail. You might find better reactions if you stick with a certain basic concept and continue with it.
im not sure i understand exactly what u mean dread_reaper...
a) the wings weren't my concept
b) the 'battle-suit' u refer to is his boey armour i suppose? in which case, the contrast between the two (in colour aswell as shape) was something i _wanted_... is that a bad thing?
----
UPDATE:
alright, did the torso a bit.... the model has reached 2 mill polies, and the lag is killing me! im glad masking in mudbox works like it does!!!
tell me what u guys think....
thanks in advance
ok, what you need to do is drop your model down to the lowest subdivisions... and starting working in those.. do most of the work in the lower subdivisions and you will have a solid base to detail later
its okay dread_reaper... i just got a bit confused thats all
and spacemonkey... hmm, okay please don't take this as a dismissal of ur advice, but isn't it also possible to do this:
1)low poly "sketch" in max
2) make 'sketch' hi-res [with _all_ details]using mudbox/zbrush...
3) import highres model into max
4) conform the low poly to the high poly (while adding cuts and whatnot). this would become the final low-poly model.
5)UV mapping and tex baking etc. etc.
im new to normal mapping (at the scale of a whole character at least) so i'm just wondering if this is also good?
plus, to work at the lowest sub-d i would have to work im max right? to add the new cuts etc (is it possible in mudbox?)
What I believe what spacemonkey was trying to suggest was to work with a lower rez model in mudbox/zbrush. Currently your model is probably in the millions right? I know in zbrush you import your low rez obj and are able to divide your model to your computers ability. So say you divided your model 5x your base model. What spacemonkey is suggesting is to work on the lower rezes, so 2x or 3x. They will be higher rez then your max model but lower rez then your current state.
You need to bring out the forms in the lower subdivisions before you crack it up and start working on the micro-detailing. This will get rid of the meshsmoothed-with-fiddly-bits-on-top look its currently suffering from.
oh okay... thanks for clearing that up. i thought 'lowest' subdivision meant _lowest_ (in which case it would be uber-hard to get any detail i think?)
so i decided to go into the 5000s-10,000 polies and add details like muscle definition (eg. biceps), knee caps, elbows, underside of the hand etc. these would count as medium res right? and then i'll go up the lvls and high-res it while giving tighter defs to the muscles etc....
so i think i got it?
thanks guys...
----
okay, i was gonna update the post, but im having problems with imageshack and slibe using opera and internet explorer... so i'll post an update later.
once again, thanks!
and ta-daaaa!
2 shots... one is subdiv X2 and one is subdiv X3 (or 4, can't remember). Just to show what type of 'construction' is going on.
any c'n'c is cool... it all helps!
yeah coming on nicely man, but it feels like you're being a little timid with your sculpting, just a little here and a little there. Don't forget you've got layers to make the most of, really go at it and put some shape into him. If you use a seperate layer you can always pull it back a bit if you need to
Looking better but you should really push the muscel and bone definitions. He is fairly human so get some pictures of the human muscel structure to use as referance. More definition the better cause you can always build from them. Think of your base Max model as a skeloten of your character, then think of the first couple suddiv's as muscel and bone definition and the higher subdivs as skin, wrinkles and other fine definitions.
You'll also want to work on the wings and tail to make sure they look like they are appart of the model and not just stuck on.
hey thanks for the confidence boost guys.... glad that there's been noticable improvements since my earlier work...
@ Rooster - layers ftw! i never even noticed (i kinda just got mudbox and didn't have time to mess wit it before the competition!)
@ Cridder - thanks for the analogy... good help... and good point about the 'wings' + tail... i'll have to devote some time to them, soon...
---
Update:
alright, i _had_ gone a bit crazy wit the sculpting (timidity begone!) but then i realized that i should probably define his structure properly first (like bone/muscle definitions). So i deleted the layer (oooh layers!) and got to work on the definitions. I don't know if there have been any striking changes, but... ummm... there have been changes.
So, tell me what u think!
i'm having trouble with the legs in terms of adding mid-res details (dunno what to add). Also, i'm trying to not make him _too_ muscular.
I did a sketch over one of your older models showing generic muscel structure. You will probly notice, like did when drawing it, that your character dont have an ass. I personaly find it hard to create leg muscelature with one of the largest muscels gone. Now I know the muscel stucture I drew makes your guy bigger but I was trying to exagerate were the muscels would be visible.
The second thing I noticed is that your guyz centre of gravity is off (the red line indicates were his COG is}. If he is to stand in that current pose in real life he would find himself falling backwards. You need to pull his legs and head back alittle to re-centre his gravity.
Righting the COG will help when you rigg him to put him into pose, other wise I have had troubles in the past when creating a rigg were the legs were giving me trouble when I tried moving them.
thanks, cridder, for the two images. I'm tryin to implement the muscle structure u've drawn without bulkying up the character too much, and i think its coming along okay. as for the COG, i think i'll fix that after i've baked the normal map... on the low poly mesh, shouldn't be too much trouble to do it then either?
in general, i really need to hurry up cuz:
1) i have final exams starting this friday, and my pace will slow (possibly :P)
2) i'm slow at the texturing and riggin parts, 2 things which i'm feeling really nervous about...
so i wanna wrap up the high res asap.... unfortunately....
----
UPDATE:
i've been working on levels 2 and 3... but i took these shots on the highest level (lvl.5) i'm being really careful not to overdo the muscular struture.
well, its coming along, but its like pulling teeth
you've been great about implementing all the sweet pro-tips except for the big one... alter that silhouette! When they say go crazy, they don't just mean add some muscles in the existing streamlined meshsmoothed form. We want to see massive globs of flesh pulled and pushed. At this point I'd love to see you go way too far and have to dial it back than what you've been doing. You'll get there, I've no doubt, but as this is a timed affair we're going to be behind you pushing you to the finish line. whether you like it or not!
massive globs of flesh: arise!
well not yet, just a small flesh-glob now. i have to study ....
here's the update. Just added an extension of the pelvis at the back, modified his "exo-rib" a bit and added a magnet on his back where the gun gets "holstered".
okay, i wont really call this much of an update, but thought id put it on nonetheless.... i feel kinda' strange whenever i work on this guy nowadays. And not the giggly hee hee strange... like a creative-block after a halfhours work. Kinda' annoying really!
go back and read all of spacemonkey's posts in your thread again, as well as rooster's on this page. your model is improving, yes, but it's also suffering in exactly the manner that spacemonkey and rooster are telling you. i shall attempt to use my incredible powers of description in order to let you see your error, since i cannot show you visually!
art and composition is all about starting with the general and working toward the specific. you lock in the big stuff before you lock in the small stuff. if you were building a house, would you start with digging the foundation, or would you start doing 3cm detail work on the brass hand railing out front?
that seems an absurd comparison, but that's what you've been doing with your high poly sculpt of this model. you should be figuring out the house's overall dimensions still, but you're over with an interior decorator picking out curtains.
look at your latest screenshot and squint your eyes, so that you can just barely see it. what do you see? you can see the silhouette, but not a whole lot more than that.
now go over to spacemonkey's thread (or a dozen other good artists' threads) and repeat the same trick: notice how with strong shapes, they pass the squint test that much better than yours? how spacemonkey's tentacle monster is still pretty recognizable, even when you can barely see it?
so like they keep telling you, you need to resolve bigger areas of detail before you start on the smallest ones.
you honestly can't study the good stuff too much in order to learn what you're doing wrong, frankly. in fact, learning to see, to sensitize yourself to the nuances of drawing, of sculpting, of color and texture and on and on are the only way you'll improve as an artist.
you know how to women in general--moms and sisters and girlfriends, some things always look the same? guns are all the same. jet fighters all look pretty much the same; all those things boys are interested in tend to look the same to them. they couldn't tell you the difference between a Glock 18 and a 1911 or a 5-7 pistol to save their lives, because they just don't care. they haven't sensitized to those details.
but of course, we're all like that in the areas that are outside our expertise. just like most women can't 'see' guns, you probably can't 'see' women's clothing anywhere like how they can. (if you can, well, then it's probably time to have a different kind of talk with your parents.)
and it's exactly that kind of process that you need to go through in order to become a better artist--you need to be exposed to good examples of what it is you're trying to learn about, and you need to pay attention to all the details that you never did before. learning technical terms or specific names of things (especially in the case of anatomy) will often help you out in these areas. specialized lingo is a very good way of sensitizing to a whole world of naunce that you previously were oblivious too--and sensitivity to shapes, colors, proportions, surfaces, textures, and what have you, is what being an artist is all about.
so apart from the lecture about sensitizing yourself, go back and re-read my post again a couple of times. i know, i know, it's a lot of wisdom to absorb, so you'll need to read it a few times. so take time to really LOOK at the entries you know are well-put together sculpts, and then compare them directly to your own model. it may be discouraging and sort of obvious, but do it and be specific about calling out all the different ways that your model isn't like them. contrary to what some people will tell you, just working and working doesn't guarantee that you'll learn shit. you have to be aware, and keep growing that awareness, in order to internalize the necessary lessons.
it seems unfortunate that such a long, detailed piece of advice can only be responded to by the following words:
I see what you're getting at!
Thanks for the crit, though... i get what u mean by the squint test... interesting idea that. And i guess i'll have to go crazy with the sculpting (as has been suggested before, but i guess im 'afraid' ?!) once again, thanks for the advice.
UPDATE:
can u see a change? cuz i can't... lol!
okay, i just modified his 'wings' before responsibility struck me and i realized i should study for friday...
tell me what u guys think. any comments and crits are welcome. They don't all have to be as in-depth as the "Gaussian" ones .
I'm off to study the Rise of Indian Nationalism... (studying Gandhi during wartime?!!!)
watch it with the "gauss-ian blur vision," smartass
you may not have changed much, but it's actually very much more a step in the right direction. compare how much you've modified the wing geometry between this update and the previous update--we simply want to see that degree of large-scale form sculpting/manipulation on the rest of the model. and just as when you're sketching, don't get timid just because you want to preserve work you've already done (like all the teeny weeny detailing on the torso and such). this is digital art, there's no possible way you can "ruin" it--so just save out an instance and then go nuts. if you need to revert, you can, but this isn't a priceless block of marble, it's digital clay that you can re-attempt sculpture of endlessly. be bold! don't worry, we'll tell you if you need to scale it back
you don't even need to save an instance, just make a new layer and if you do something you don't like you can erase the area and the original shines through.. theres no excuse to be timid
wow its been some time since i posted.... well, im missing this mornings post at least.
uhh, okay, im glad that the radical change has brought some positive feedback (sorry bout the gauss-ian blur vision... spur of the moment )
now then, this post comes after only 25 minutes of work (can't get my mind off the exams) so its not _as_ substantial, but its an attempt at breaking / changing the silhouette in some other places.
(note the lack of the gauss-ian blur vision... oh noes...! im srry, im doin it again......)
thanks for the crits rooster and gauss, they're extremely helpful, so please do keep 'em coming.
and to the others... please do rip me apart!
August 15 1947 approaches.........
oh and armageddon begins tomorrow
@Xaltar -i understood that bit... i was confused about the "muddy look"....
good luck with ur sculpting! and thanks!
okay, feeling fairly uninspired at the moment for the body. No radical ideas are coming to me, so i decided on starting the model for the gun. This is the high poly, its not done yet though. Just wanted to get some comments on it...
maybe not enough work done on the gun to have it commented on i guess...
but any thoughts at all are good!
here's an update on the gun model. I think its coming along fairly nicely, just need some good crits to fix up problems i might not be seeing.
once again, any comments are welcome
thanks in advance...
that in my opinion is a fake highpoly , if you throw down a urbosmooth or meshmooth, all that would smooth horribly . id advise to lern some hard edge modeling before attempting a model that comples
also about the muddy look , is something when people look at your model, and can see loas of blits and blobs that simply look out of place to fake "realism" .
good luck with this man, its good to see your dedication
I dont quite get the reason why there is an open door on the "CPU Fan" on the gun. I think you should either see the fan or the pannel, its a waist of detail that will not be seen unless the gun was animated and parts were to be taken off it.
Other wise the gun looks like it is comming along, hope you get it finished soon you you can finish your character. Keep the hard work
I'm concerned with how well this will normal map (the gun) It looks like you have a lot of 90 degree angles, which won't be picked up well and itll end up looking flat. I'd do a quick test normal map to see how it comes out
@ Johny - thanks for clearing that up. i understand now. and u were right about the turbosmooth thing. lol, trust me you were dead right!
@ Cridder - i agree that it _is_ a waste of detail. But i was thinking that (even though we don't make anims for the compo) i might make some practice anims with this guy in the future, so i might wanna 'coolify' some mechanical parts on the gun. Or should i cancel that idea and use them polies to help change the silhouette? oh and thanks for the support!
@ Rooster - ill do that right away! i don't want a problematic normal map close to deadline... but i figured that the 90 degree angles ur talking about are where the outer edges of the gun meet? well, i had chamfered those for a smoother look, will it read okay this way? even still, i should do a test map.
=====
UPDATE:
okay, this time around, i've only chamfered and cleaned up the gun alot. I've applied a turbo-smooth to many of the portions (yes its many different meshes). The other parts still need too much cleaning up to display wit a turbosmooth.
[im going back to using thumbnails... even my net was slowing down by the end of the last page]
I'll be rendering a quick normal map just to test it (don't really need to do a perfect UV Template for a test do i?) and see what else i need to fix up.
okay, unhappy that i haven't been able to post an image update today... maybe tomorrow. But thought i'd at least keep all notified of what i've done today.
The test normal map was coming out crappy (the thing i've got going in the front wasn't reading at all) so i modified the low poly silhouette a bit, and i lessened the angles on all that stuff. (i guess anything less than 90 degrees reads well?)
also, i scrapped the panel idea, it was eating too many polies, and i decided to change the silhouette instead. I'm extremely close to the limit of 1000, and the only other 'accessories' would be the ammo pieces. so it should all fit in.
I've also modified the back section of the gun (added a few details), and am scrapping my idea of giving it a trigger (my other idea was the whole "thought-controlled" thing).
i'd say that my gun is "done." i'll show it tomorrow to see if there are any easy modifications or glaring problems with it. The thing is that i wanted at least 10 days for texturing + rigging... so thats until this friday for finishing the high-polies. :gulp:
right here's the update:
i (for some reason) lost a bit of detailing work i did late last night.... i might make that again, it wasn't much though....
tell me wat u guys think please!
The gunz grip (handle) looks like it would brake off it off if held one handed. I suggest making it bigger and more sturdy looking, also if this is realyy a large gun then I suggest having another place that the other hand can hold/rest.
hmmm i guess ill make it more sturdy then. as for the other hand, i thought it could grip the side 'railing' or something. thanks.
===
okay no update yet, but :
i just came back from a potentially high-scoring maths final exam, and have 8 days to "study" for english. So, today i will be working for hours on end, and the crits i could get in "right now" would be extremely helpful. Hopefully i can get alot done starting after lunch. That gives me ~ 30 mins... when i'll come back and c if there r new crits, and ill implement them.
Wish me luck... i want my eyes to burn out by the end of today!!
lol, what r the chances. i had a 5 hour marathon planned yesterday, and :
1) a one-hour powercut slows me down
2 my LAN provider craps out. Well, at least the nets working now.
====
alright, yesterday, i got some sculpting done, not much, so i won't show it yet. What i _did_ complete however, was the UV template for the gun + accessories and projecting their normal maps.
It gives me some confidence now that i've projected my first normal map for this compo... makes me feel like i can do it.
normals need some repair work. Im guessing i could simply paint over the ugly-green parts? But how is the template? I'm not too good at figuring out what should be how big... now: back to sculpting! or possibly repairing the normals map...
Exhibit A:
Gun with some diffuse work
any suggestions about colour scheme etc. r welcome... i had tried the browns, but they didnt look cool... so decided to go with greys instead. Oh, and the grip [or a part of it] is gonna be wrapped in leather.
Exhibit B:
I'm completely out of ideas as of what to do with sculpting. I added so little, i actually feel like i went back a few steps!!! i don't wanna call it though {ie. i dont wanna leave the sculpt like this, i want to improve it}. any suggestions?
alright guys, thats the last update for the day...
any suggestions about any aspect (particularly the ones i'd asked for above) would be great.
Replies
not much really... reworked the feet a bit, began the shoulder pads (they're symmetrical now... not for long) and changed the head about a bit...
as soon as i get a confirm that the legs are looking fine, that symmetry modifier is gonna get collapsed!
any and all crits and comments are welcome
symmetry is still on, the shoulderpads and retractable blades are seperate objects i'll attach later...
and now, for my first ever mudboxed piece... after hours and hours of struggling... i give you.... his first set of teeth:
how do they look?
okay, seriously though... any comments and crits are good. I'm guessnig the legs r fine now, so i'm leaving them alone for the time being... gonna work on shoulder-pads and blade.
BTW: im approaching 4000 tris already... is that bad? i think there are some polies i should look to delete.
thanks guys, once again _any_ comments are good!
his legs are looking much better... more believable now.
for his chompers... needs to be much sharper, right now it suffers from mudboxitis: far too blobby for its own good.
anyways:
glad that the legs are looking better. i guess i can consider that hurdle crossed?
now his teeth... mudboxitis eh? I guess i could do something (alot-things) to fix that. But as of now, i present both sets of teeth, "complete"!
the first set (like the ones above) are used for crushing and grinding bones and marrow into powder. i guess they need to look more like molars?
the second set (the pointy ones) are canines for ripping out meat and what not...
hope u like 'em!
i dunno if it's clear or not, but its supposed to be a weird animal skull that he's embedded into his arm. I'm thinking of making the rest look like a spinal column and the part that attaches to his arms look like ribs or more teeth (teeth in the stomach of the beast?)
its not done yet (need to add nose hole and eye sockets for example) but even still..... any thoughts?
thanks.
front and back/bottom of the thing. didn't overlay a colour this time though...
and here are two shots to show how the high-poly fits onto the low-poly body... im a bit worried about the wrist area as there is a curve to the side over there... don't think it'll cause a problem during riggin/posing though?
the crappy colouring is just to show that some bumpy parts are actually under the skin
and now im beginning to think that i'm spending too much time on this thing... must move back to the main mesh!!!
any comments, crits, complaints, insults, are completely welcome
Keep up the hard work and lest see a well rounded model.
here's the head, with the suckermouths (which also have teeth by the way).
As for the composition, I think you'd be better off going in a single direction. The smooth contours of the battle suit seem to contrast the roughness of the wings and tail. You might find better reactions if you stick with a certain basic concept and continue with it.
-Dread_Reaper
a) the wings weren't my concept
b) the 'battle-suit' u refer to is his boey armour i suppose? in which case, the contrast between the two (in colour aswell as shape) was something i _wanted_... is that a bad thing?
----
UPDATE:
alright, did the torso a bit.... the model has reached 2 mill polies, and the lag is killing me! im glad masking in mudbox works like it does!!!
tell me what u guys think....
thanks in advance
-Dread_Reaper
and spacemonkey... hmm, okay please don't take this as a dismissal of ur advice, but isn't it also possible to do this:
1)low poly "sketch" in max
2) make 'sketch' hi-res [with _all_ details]using mudbox/zbrush...
3) import highres model into max
4) conform the low poly to the high poly (while adding cuts and whatnot). this would become the final low-poly model.
5)UV mapping and tex baking etc. etc.
im new to normal mapping (at the scale of a whole character at least) so i'm just wondering if this is also good?
plus, to work at the lowest sub-d i would have to work im max right? to add the new cuts etc (is it possible in mudbox?)
thanks
You need to bring out the forms in the lower subdivisions before you crack it up and start working on the micro-detailing. This will get rid of the meshsmoothed-with-fiddly-bits-on-top look its currently suffering from.
so i decided to go into the 5000s-10,000 polies and add details like muscle definition (eg. biceps), knee caps, elbows, underside of the hand etc. these would count as medium res right? and then i'll go up the lvls and high-res it while giving tighter defs to the muscles etc....
so i think i got it?
thanks guys...
----
okay, i was gonna update the post, but im having problems with imageshack and slibe using opera and internet explorer... so i'll post an update later.
once again, thanks!
2 shots... one is subdiv X2 and one is subdiv X3 (or 4, can't remember). Just to show what type of 'construction' is going on.
any c'n'c is cool... it all helps!
thanks!
You'll also want to work on the wings and tail to make sure they look like they are appart of the model and not just stuck on.
Keep up the hard work
@ Rooster - layers ftw! i never even noticed (i kinda just got mudbox and didn't have time to mess wit it before the competition!)
@ Cridder - thanks for the analogy... good help... and good point about the 'wings' + tail... i'll have to devote some time to them, soon...
---
Update:
alright, i _had_ gone a bit crazy wit the sculpting (timidity begone!) but then i realized that i should probably define his structure properly first (like bone/muscle definitions). So i deleted the layer (oooh layers!) and got to work on the definitions. I don't know if there have been any striking changes, but... ummm... there have been changes.
So, tell me what u think!
i'm having trouble with the legs in terms of adding mid-res details (dunno what to add). Also, i'm trying to not make him _too_ muscular.
any crits and comments are welcome!
thanks again!
The second thing I noticed is that your guyz centre of gravity is off (the red line indicates were his COG is}. If he is to stand in that current pose in real life he would find himself falling backwards. You need to pull his legs and head back alittle to re-centre his gravity.
Righting the COG will help when you rigg him to put him into pose, other wise I have had troubles in the past when creating a rigg were the legs were giving me trouble when I tried moving them.
Keep up the hard work
in general, i really need to hurry up cuz:
1) i have final exams starting this friday, and my pace will slow (possibly :P)
2) i'm slow at the texturing and riggin parts, 2 things which i'm feeling really nervous about...
so i wanna wrap up the high res asap.... unfortunately....
----
UPDATE:
i've been working on levels 2 and 3... but i took these shots on the highest level (lvl.5) i'm being really careful not to overdo the muscular struture.
you've been great about implementing all the sweet pro-tips except for the big one... alter that silhouette! When they say go crazy, they don't just mean add some muscles in the existing streamlined meshsmoothed form. We want to see massive globs of flesh pulled and pushed. At this point I'd love to see you go way too far and have to dial it back than what you've been doing. You'll get there, I've no doubt, but as this is a timed affair we're going to be behind you pushing you to the finish line. whether you like it or not!
well not yet, just a small flesh-glob now. i have to study
here's the update. Just added an extension of the pelvis at the back, modified his "exo-rib" a bit and added a magnet on his back where the gun gets "holstered".
will go ahead with going crazy this afternoon
well, anyways, here's the update:
art and composition is all about starting with the general and working toward the specific. you lock in the big stuff before you lock in the small stuff. if you were building a house, would you start with digging the foundation, or would you start doing 3cm detail work on the brass hand railing out front?
that seems an absurd comparison, but that's what you've been doing with your high poly sculpt of this model. you should be figuring out the house's overall dimensions still, but you're over with an interior decorator picking out curtains.
look at your latest screenshot and squint your eyes, so that you can just barely see it. what do you see? you can see the silhouette, but not a whole lot more than that.
now go over to spacemonkey's thread (or a dozen other good artists' threads) and repeat the same trick: notice how with strong shapes, they pass the squint test that much better than yours? how spacemonkey's tentacle monster is still pretty recognizable, even when you can barely see it?
so like they keep telling you, you need to resolve bigger areas of detail before you start on the smallest ones.
you honestly can't study the good stuff too much in order to learn what you're doing wrong, frankly. in fact, learning to see, to sensitize yourself to the nuances of drawing, of sculpting, of color and texture and on and on are the only way you'll improve as an artist.
you know how to women in general--moms and sisters and girlfriends, some things always look the same? guns are all the same. jet fighters all look pretty much the same; all those things boys are interested in tend to look the same to them. they couldn't tell you the difference between a Glock 18 and a 1911 or a 5-7 pistol to save their lives, because they just don't care. they haven't sensitized to those details.
but of course, we're all like that in the areas that are outside our expertise. just like most women can't 'see' guns, you probably can't 'see' women's clothing anywhere like how they can. (if you can, well, then it's probably time to have a different kind of talk with your parents.)
and it's exactly that kind of process that you need to go through in order to become a better artist--you need to be exposed to good examples of what it is you're trying to learn about, and you need to pay attention to all the details that you never did before. learning technical terms or specific names of things (especially in the case of anatomy) will often help you out in these areas. specialized lingo is a very good way of sensitizing to a whole world of naunce that you previously were oblivious too--and sensitivity to shapes, colors, proportions, surfaces, textures, and what have you, is what being an artist is all about.
so apart from the lecture about sensitizing yourself, go back and re-read my post again a couple of times. i know, i know, it's a lot of wisdom to absorb, so you'll need to read it a few times.
in other words... dammit kid, mind your elders!
I see what you're getting at!
Thanks for the crit, though... i get what u mean by the squint test... interesting idea that. And i guess i'll have to go crazy with the sculpting (as has been suggested before, but i guess im 'afraid' ?!) once again, thanks for the advice.
UPDATE:
can u see a change? cuz i can't... lol!
okay, i just modified his 'wings' before responsibility struck me and i realized i should study for friday...
tell me what u guys think. any comments and crits are welcome. They don't all have to be as in-depth as the "Gaussian" ones
I'm off to study the Rise of Indian Nationalism... (studying Gandhi during wartime?!!!)
thanks in advance!
you may not have changed much, but it's actually very much more a step in the right direction. compare how much you've modified the wing geometry between this update and the previous update--we simply want to see that degree of large-scale form sculpting/manipulation on the rest of the model. and just as when you're sketching, don't get timid just because you want to preserve work you've already done (like all the teeny weeny detailing on the torso and such). this is digital art, there's no possible way you can "ruin" it--so just save out an instance and then go nuts. if you need to revert, you can, but this isn't a priceless block of marble, it's digital clay that you can re-attempt sculpture of endlessly. be bold! don't worry, we'll tell you if you need to scale it back
uhh, okay, im glad that the radical change has brought some positive feedback (sorry bout the gauss-ian blur vision... spur of the moment
now then, this post comes after only 25 minutes of work (can't get my mind off the exams) so its not _as_ substantial, but its an attempt at breaking / changing the silhouette in some other places.
(note the lack of the gauss-ian blur vision... oh noes...! im srry, im doin it again......)
thanks for the crits rooster and gauss, they're extremely helpful, so please do keep 'em coming.
and to the others... please do rip me apart!
August 15 1947 approaches.........
oh and armageddon begins tomorrow
sorry, but no updates today, i feel pooped after the exam today... so i guess ill wait till tomorrow.
till then though, any crits and comments are welcome...
I'll be having my first go at sculpting in a short while too so reading your thread is going to be useful to me too
Keep at it dude, I am really impressed at how far you have come.
good luck with ur sculpting! and thanks!
okay, feeling fairly uninspired at the moment for the body. No radical ideas are coming to me, so i decided on starting the model for the gun. This is the high poly, its not done yet though. Just wanted to get some comments on it...
any crits and comments are welcome!
but any thoughts at all are good!
here's an update on the gun model. I think its coming along fairly nicely, just need some good crits to fix up problems i might not be seeing.
once again, any comments are welcome
thanks in advance...
also about the muddy look , is something when people look at your model, and can see loas of blits and blobs that simply look out of place to fake "realism" .
good luck with this man, its good to see your dedication
Other wise the gun looks like it is comming along, hope you get it finished soon you you can finish your character. Keep the hard work
@ Johny - thanks for clearing that up. i understand now. and u were right about the turbosmooth thing. lol, trust me you were dead right!
@ Cridder - i agree that it _is_ a waste of detail. But i was thinking that (even though we don't make anims for the compo) i might make some practice anims with this guy in the future, so i might wanna 'coolify' some mechanical parts on the gun. Or should i cancel that idea and use them polies to help change the silhouette? oh and thanks for the support!
@ Rooster - ill do that right away! i don't want a problematic normal map close to deadline... but i figured that the 90 degree angles ur talking about are where the outer edges of the gun meet? well, i had chamfered those for a smoother look, will it read okay this way? even still, i should do a test map.
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UPDATE:
okay, this time around, i've only chamfered and cleaned up the gun alot. I've applied a turbo-smooth to many of the portions (yes its many different meshes). The other parts still need too much cleaning up to display wit a turbosmooth.
[im going back to using thumbnails... even my net was slowing down by the end of the last page]
I'll be rendering a quick normal map just to test it (don't really need to do a perfect UV Template for a test do i?) and see what else i need to fix up.
thanks for all the help guys...
The test normal map was coming out crappy (the thing i've got going in the front wasn't reading at all) so i modified the low poly silhouette a bit, and i lessened the angles on all that stuff. (i guess anything less than 90 degrees reads well?)
also, i scrapped the panel idea, it was eating too many polies, and i decided to change the silhouette instead. I'm extremely close to the limit of 1000, and the only other 'accessories' would be the ammo pieces. so it should all fit in.
I've also modified the back section of the gun (added a few details), and am scrapping my idea of giving it a trigger (my other idea was the whole "thought-controlled" thing).
i'd say that my gun is "done." i'll show it tomorrow to see if there are any easy modifications or glaring problems with it. The thing is that i wanted at least 10 days for texturing + rigging... so thats until this friday for finishing the high-polies. :gulp:
once again, thanks for all the help
i (for some reason) lost a bit of detailing work i did late last night.... i might make that again, it wasn't much though....
tell me wat u guys think please!
Looks pretty good though
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okay no update yet, but :
i just came back from a potentially high-scoring maths final exam, and have 8 days to "study" for english. So, today i will be working for hours on end, and the crits i could get in "right now" would be extremely helpful. Hopefully i can get alot done starting after lunch. That gives me ~ 30 mins... when i'll come back and c if there r new crits, and ill implement them.
Wish me luck... i want my eyes to burn out by the end of today!!
1) a one-hour powercut slows me down
2 my LAN provider craps out. Well, at least the nets working now.
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alright, yesterday, i got some sculpting done, not much, so i won't show it yet. What i _did_ complete however, was the UV template for the gun + accessories and projecting their normal maps.
It gives me some confidence now that i've projected my first normal map for this compo... makes me feel like i can do it.
normals need some repair work. Im guessing i could simply paint over the ugly-green parts? But how is the template? I'm not too good at figuring out what should be how big... now: back to sculpting! or possibly repairing the normals map...
oh, and thanks in advance!
Gun with some diffuse work
any suggestions about colour scheme etc. r welcome... i had tried the browns, but they didnt look cool... so decided to go with greys instead. Oh, and the grip [or a part of it] is gonna be wrapped in leather.
Exhibit B:
I'm completely out of ideas as of what to do with sculpting. I added so little, i actually feel like i went back a few steps!!! i don't wanna call it though {ie. i dont wanna leave the sculpt like this, i want to improve it}. any suggestions?
alright guys, thats the last update for the day...
any suggestions about any aspect (particularly the ones i'd asked for above) would be great.
thanks.