mikes art thread
hi, this is my first post, most of the images are created in 3dsmax and photoshop for doom3/quake4.
Cool site BTW im seeing some great artwork here.
http://www.esnips.com/doc/3d8c5d1c-0061-4242-b9ba-e6124b3ae596
Cool site BTW im seeing some great artwork here.
http://www.esnips.com/doc/3d8c5d1c-0061-4242-b9ba-e6124b3ae596
Replies
I love how detailed you get your highpoly models. I'd be interested to know how you made that ivy growing on the walls in 3dsmax.
The colour of the ivy in the first screenshots seems a bit odd, I think it's too light and green, and there's not enough contrast between the bricks below and the ivy on top (maybe needs a some shadow there to pull it out a bit).
Some of the City screenshots look a bit blurry? Are those in-game shots of the buildings, or renders? If they're renders, it looks like you need to play around with your filtering settings to get a sharper render.
Nice work all round though, I look forward to seeing more!
cool stuff! These are nice environments.. the texturing really bothers me, I agree with MoP on the contrast and color choices. Honestly, it's just that Normaly Doomy3 look, not enough baked in light/contrast info in the texture. I'd encourage you to keep playing until you find a good balance, the rendering of normal maps is nowhere near perfect yet, so you still have to fake a bit.
The highpoly 3d however, in my opinion, is just great. That blown out arch is very volumous, and just *feels* like you could reach out and pull a brick out. Some crits though, the detailed scrolly work around the arch seems arbitrary, a bump here, a bump there. Infact, all the of the scroll work seems arbitrary. I'm no master at victorian style scroll work, but it's been around long enough for almost anyone to recognise wether or not it looks right.
I really liked the last city shot, with the white BG. I actually liked it more before I read the filename, it feels other-worldly, and is very interesting to me. It has interesting shapes, but also just seems to have a lot of character to me, as in, on what kind of world you might see those things, what the geographical and world history might have caused something like that. Tons of ideas come to mind immediate, and that's what makes me like that shot the most. It's not incredibly clear and concise, but there's still a very inspiring aspect of it to me.
Cool stuff, definitely keep posting your work here
MoP, I could be off but it looks like the ivy is just splines with leaves scattered along them. At least that is what I do. I use the advanced painter script to paint random ivy, then use the same script to scatter leaves along the surface of the spline.
I only wish max would let you set the radius to different values along the spline. using extrude along spline lets you taper it, why they don't add that functionality to a regular spline I have no idea...
Back on track
The one thing that stands out mostly in this shot. Is the lack of unifying grime/char marks. It all depends on how long the building has been like this and what type of object struck this building but you would expect to see, burn/scorch marks if it was a projectile, brick dust scattered on the white tiles regardless of the type of object, and weather grime if it has been left unattended long enough for ivy to start growing. You have to think about all the bricks and mortar that where pulverized, some turned to dust and settled, that dust when mixed with rain would leave stains and streaks.
Adding unifying grime would help tie each of the separate pieces together. Just don't go too over the top with it as it will start to hurt each piece rather than tie them together.
In this shot you have what used to be glass doors/windows but there are no remnants of glass? a force so strong that it removes all the glass would serriously mess up the frame of the glass also. A few alpha planes of glass would also help cover up and break up the black void behind the frames.
Adding some simple rubble or a broken support beam behind the glass doors would also help fill up the void.
Is any of this stuff normal mapped/lower poly? Or are the high poly assets in game?
Just some stuff to think about. Really great stuff, top notch work! I can't wait to see more!
For the building model in the top 3 pics; its a low poly model with diffuse and normal maps baked from a highpoly model using the projection modifier in max and then the specular has been taken from the diffuse.
Its my first proper go at working in this way, meaning from highpoly models, I knew I had a few problems with the textures but they were produced quite quickly, and havent been touched in photoshop, except I made the mistake early on of using the Nvidia normal map generator on the diffusemap (and didnt use it properly btw) and then overlayed it over the normalmap and it blew out alot of the detail, I think thats why it looks so flat, I should of used a bump map in max wich I later found out gets added into the baking of the normalmap.
When I go back to it i think ill kind of start over and try and improve it and recycle what I can, im finding alot out about the projection modifier in max, its a great tool I realy enjoy experimenting with it.
Ive put this little project on hold while I do some work on 'the dark mod' a theif style mod for doom3 id love some feedback on these models and textures, Ive basicly made them in the same way as the building but ive spent more time on the materials in max wich are used for the high poly models
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hey mike,
cool stuff! These are nice environments.. the texturing really bothers me, I agree with MoP on the contrast and color choices. Honestly, it's just that Normaly Doomy3 look, not enough baked in light/contrast info in the texture. I'd encourage you to keep playing until you find a good balance, the rendering of normal maps is nowhere near perfect yet, so you still have to fake a bit.
[/ QUOTE ]
thats interesting that you should say that about faking light/shadow detail into the diffuse, I here so often that diffusemaps in doom3 should only contain colour information, maybe thats the way id software did it, I dont know but im seeing a whole lot of great looking 3d game work coming out with fake detail on the diffuse especially from textures made from photos.
Thanks for pointing that out about the scrolling, Ill definitly fix that up by spending some more time on the model, im not all that happy with it either.
The old city shots are, well.. realy old, and at the time I didnt know how to produce a decent render from max I think I found out shortly after those shots were taken, then I lost the origional max file somehow I think it was a virus or something it was a while ago, but its all gone
Thanks for the descriptive feedback Vig, ill keep those ideas in mind
Thank you so much everyone for the feedback, Ive never had better from any other forum
For the building model in the top 3 pics; its a low poly model with diffuse and normal maps baked from a highpoly model using the projection modifier in max and then the specular has been taken from the diffuse.
Its my first proper go at working in this way, meaning from highpoly models, I knew I had a few problems with the textures but they were produced quite quickly, and havent been touched in photoshop, except I made the mistake early on of using the Nvidia normal map generator on the diffusemap (and didnt use it properly btw) and then overlayed it over the normalmap and it blew out alot of the detail, I think thats why it looks so flat, I should of used a bump map in max wich I later found out gets added into the baking of the normalmap.
When I go back to it i think ill kind of start over and try and improve it and recycle what I can, im finding alot out about the projection modifier in max, its a great tool I realy enjoy experimenting with it.
Ive put this little project on hold while I do some work on 'the dark mod' a theif style mod for doom3 id love some feedback on these models and textures, Ive basicly made them in the same way as the building but ive spent more time on the materials in max wich are used for the high poly models
[ QUOTE ]
hey mike,
cool stuff! These are nice environments.. the texturing really bothers me, I agree with MoP on the contrast and color choices. Honestly, it's just that Normaly Doomy3 look, not enough baked in light/contrast info in the texture. I'd encourage you to keep playing until you find a good balance, the rendering of normal maps is nowhere near perfect yet, so you still have to fake a bit.
[/ QUOTE ]
thats interesting that you should say that about faking light/shadow detail into the diffuse, I here so often that diffusemaps in doom3 should only contain colour information, maybe thats the way id software did it, I dont know but im seeing a whole lot of great looking 3d game work coming out with fake detail on the diffuse especially from textures made from photos.
Thanks for pointing that out about the scrolling, Ill definitly fix that up by spending some more time on the model, im not all that happy with it either.
The old city shots are, well.. realy old, and at the time I didnt know how to produce a decent render from max I think I found out shortly after those shots were taken, then I lost the origional max file somehow I think it was a virus or something it was a while ago, but its all gone
Thanks for the descriptive feedback Vig, ill keep those ideas in mind
[/ QUOTE ]
can you upload some of your textures? i'd be interested in examining them more closely, if that is ok wiht you.
freaking great work so far.
About painting or baking lighting into diffuse textures when normalmapping... a little bit usually helps a lot, as long as it's not "directional" light - ie. don't highlight the tops of every brick, or the texture will look weird in certain situations.
A subtle GI or ambient occlusion lighting bake multiplied over the diffuse texture is usually enough, and then you can pick out any sharper edges by painting more darks in.
For example where I think this would benefit your textures, is to add a little shadow under the ivy leaves when they overlap one another - this'll help separate each leaf, and will result in a deeper, more 3d effect. At the moment your ivy diffuse/spec is looking very flat, some dark outlines where leaves overlap would help this a lot, I think.
BTW I'm interested as to your approach to modelling the highpoly for stones/bricks - I noticed a lot of the brickwork has tiny chips and cracks which look awesome, but must have taken a long time to create... do you make a set of a few different broken bricks, and use some sort of array or scatter to lay them out into the wall shape? That stone wall almost looks like you positioned them by hand. Either way it works well, I'm just wondering how time-consuming it is.
Keep up the good work, I like where this is all going!
this is a basic tutorial of how these models were built
http://www.doom3world.org/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?t=17688
Also tapering in each brick slightly would help give the NM some depth, at the moment (and the AO render would help here too) the bricks seem almost flush with the mortar.
Thanks for sharing
Some of the bricks are pretty much flush with the mortar I thought it had an interesting effect at the time, kind of a patchy look but I agree, it dosent look realistic
Thanks again for all the comments guys
Ive been experimenting with the material editor in 3dsmax. Ive multiplied several images into one material, then rendered them to texture to get diffuse, spec and local maps and then added final touches like the tagging, I still think it might need a bit more though.
edit: deleted links, you can access the images from the 2 thumbnails below
I didn't see it in posts higher, but maybe i missed some, the shots are from doom3/quake4 engine or from max?? They are look like from engine but i'd like to be sure 'cos i have always problems with lighting in max and here it looks awesome.
but i couldn't see all images, cause they are TOO heavy.
can u compress it somehow?
im not too sure about the second one either I like the colours but I think maybe they take up too much space, its hard for me to tell what it will look like until I put it in a scene, thanks for being honest
Askhat; do you mean they're too big? sorry mate, heres some thumbnails.
some more HP stuff, Ive been spending alot more time on textures lately and also trying to find the right balance of using bump and normal maps combined with geometry rather than just modeling everything like in my previous attempts at this method.
and ive been having some fun with the LP ivy there too
spent a bit more time on the lighting and added the rosery thingy.
Ive managed to create (with some help with the shader) a good solution for current gen foliage using vertex blending for shadow in doom3/quake4.
You can also see below how I set up the model for lighting and projection, it basicly follows the same principals as this tutorial, except its been reduced to a plane and your working with alpha channels instead of solid geometry.
The black sheet in between the projection plane and the model (wich must be full black) is used to insure that your alpha channel is solid without any unwanted white bleeding through.
I then extracted the full black area in photoshop by 'select', 'colour range', 'sampled colours' and then copied the black background and paste it into the alpha channel.
I just thought it might be useful to anyone making foliage for trees, if you want to know more go here: http://www.doom3world.org/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?t=18834
like so
these are max renders just two omni lights, one with area shadows.
Thats awesome works man. If U wanted to depress us , U did it
P.S. This will be a big trouble to show us a wireframes, especially with ivy?
I've just kind of been chipping away lately, i've added some new tiling ivy textures, they're good for covering large surfaces or for wrapping around framework, anything pole like. The Ivy is a really easy system to use, and at a very small poly cost.
heres some renders and wireframes:
thanks again
If anyone recognises what these plants are please let me know, I just spent about 1hr on google trying to identify them but couldnt find their name, it would be nice to name them something other than weed01
This is bloody awesome work. Bricks looks gorgious.
I ask my mom about the plants, maybe she will know.
Gratz for the skills man.
U have 1 more fan - me
Its so hard to find good envi artist works in the web, and I was looking for somone who has works that can push my skills forward. U'r the one. Bug thx for that
Ive been doing a few expirements with grass in 3dsmax8 and getting some pretty convincing results.
I started by baking diffuse, specular, normal and ambient occlusion maps from high poly geometry to get the first layer; the underlying earth and leaves.
The earth is a flat plane with _d, _s and a bump map and the leaves are highpoly models also with the 3 maps applied.
After its been baked I use the earth and leaves texture for the base of the next layer where I placed models of grass, twigs, small weeds, and some less dead looking leaves to create a realistic looking ground texture, all these models have the 3 maps also.
I bake it for a second time. All the diffuse, specular and normal maps are combined and the ambient occlusion map is then multiplied onto the diffuse.
Wireframe.
One reason I baked it twice is because; If I dont divide up the work like this my pc will simply run out of virtual memory and grind to a halt, im sure alot of you have more up to date computers than I do so it may not be a problem.
Another reason is that I can build upon the leaves base texture multiple times to create many variants of ground textures to be used for vertex blended terrain and ultimatly megatexture.
Heres the final result in quake4, the textures are 1024, and Ive put a single light above where the player is standing in these pics, theres a few specular highlights which were put in unintentually but Ive grown to like them, it makes the grass look wet like a morning dew in low light conditions and they disapear when the lights are brighter.
Good techniques.
unbloomed i guess.. anyways dont take my word for it
nice work though, its great to see someone taking the time to experiment and be creative with stuff like this. especially when the results is as convincing as yours.
@motives; hmm, yeah they do look alot like fireweed, I spent about 1 hr searching google and found about 8 different plants which closely resembled the one I made in Victoria alone, but I see this particular one everywhere where i live especially around old abandoned lots.
There must be hundreds if not thousands of weeds with simalarities all over the world, Im glad its pretty generic, thanks for the pic, it could make for an interesting scene i'd really like to do more experiments with colour like that.
http://www.doom3world.org/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?t=18079
http://www.doom3world.org/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?t=19173
http://www.doom3world.org/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?t=18240
http://www.doom3world.org/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?t=18932
Download tree model
In the .rar theres 3 .ase's;
1. poplar_base: tree with trunk and branches (no foliage)
2. poplar_foliage
3. poplar_full: tree model with full foliage
the poplar_full model is about 240tris.
You can add the 'poplar_foliage' model to the 'poplar_base' multiple times to create many tree variants.
Ive got it on 4x anti aliasing and theres some weird shit going on if you look closely at some of those shots, is this normal?
I just wanted to show you a wall texture I'm working on using your technique:
Still working on how to make my stuff look as good as yours, but you're helping me a lot!
As for the tree antialiasing issue, it's because the tree foliage is alphatested, it will always have hard edges, the engine can't antialias alphatest edges for some reason (our programmer gave me an explanation one time but I forgot exactly what it was - something to do with the way graphics cards' antialiasing works.
If you have an NVidia 7-series card you can fake it by running at 6xAA, it's not true AA, it actually supersamples the whole frame buffer so you'll notice a huge drop in performance cos it's basically running at double the resolution
Thanks for clearing that up about the AA, I just got a new graphics card and atleast now I know its not a hardware issue:).
Ive been trying to get this to work for foliage on trees but instead I ended up just creating a 6-tri cluster model (3 planes facing at each axis) for the foliage using the same material but removed the 'deform sprite' def and I personally think it looks ok possibly even better than it would have if i'd used sprites, but id still like to get them to work.
This is the shader im using:
<font class="small">Code:</font><hr /><pre>models/nature/tree_foliage01
{
deform sprite
noShadows
nonsolid
noimpact
twoSided
qer_editorimage models/nature/tree_foliage01_d.tga
{
blend diffusemap
map models/nature/tree_foliage01_d.tga
alphaTest 0.5
}
}</pre><hr />
This is what im getting:
basicly an unlit alphatested sprite.
I know its possible to get a particle effect sprite to use an alphatested shader, but havent found a way to get it to work through the shader alone using the 'deform sprite' def, im really not too clued up on doom3 shaders but it just seems like such a simple thing.
Would really appreciate any help from anyone one this
Its not showing the best fps there, nothings optimised in regards to textures and it seems to drop about 10 fps when I take a screenshot for some reason, but im not too concerned about the stats at the moment, ill be able to optimise it later if I need to, the shopfront model has 16 materials all up of many different sizes, ill try and get around to posting the maps up soon, I'd really like some critique on them, particually the specular maps.
Less draw calls should help a bit, but i dont know, its been so long since i used the d3 engine, and it seemed like just rendering a single large texture onscreen would kill performance. So what i'm saying here might be backwards