Games taken further?

cochtl

There are some games that I would like to see taken further, either with story or game play elements that would be pretty cool to do. Usually there are some unique features or elements to certain games that would be just totally awesome to see translated into another game type or just refined more.

For instance, I’d like to see a metroid game that has a well developed backstory for the single player part of the game. Seeing samus blow the crap outta space pirates and other bad aliens while back tracking for loot isn’t good enough to hold my interests very long anymore. Scanning plants and rocks doesn’t count as adding to the story either. I’d also like to see a class based multiplayer metroid game similar to team fortress. Using samus’ suit variations and dif combinations of weapons would be really cool to see in action, especially if the levels could allow for all or some of the wonderful stuff that can be done in the metroid series of games.

Dawn of War would also be the perfect game to make as a battlefield2-like game. It pretty much has most of bf’s game play elements already, but in an rts form. Megaman could be ported over as a battlefield-type game as well, or as another team based type game similar to metroid example mentioned above. And megaman has TONS of stuff to pull from.

Anyone have any other games in mind that would be awesome or even more awesome if taken further?

aesir

Hmmm, thats a great idea, giving metroid strong story elements. I'd love to see that done, rather then just using the metroid franchise as an excuse for a mindless shooter (not that I didnt like it ).

Personally, Im still waiting for more online medieval war games with massive amounts of AI troops to supplement the real players playing online.

Joshua Stubbles

Something like Rome: Total War, aesir? That game pushes a lot of boundaries as it is. To get 'massive' amounts of troops on screen though, they'll probably all have to be sprites. I can get 7-8000 troops on screen in Rome, before it starts chugging really nasty.

gauss

i agree that some games should be "taken further", but all your examples are mostly just existing franchises made into different, existing games.

oXYnary

not to mention there are mods striving for some of that...

what? what?

aesir

nah vassago, I wasnt thinking along RTS lines, but more along a first or third person view type of game. And the term massive would be relative I suppose, but Im betting with low specs you could put several hundred units in a game and eventually, that number will grow as comps improve.

Weiser_Cain

I've had this thought often with certain games

arshlevon

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i agree that some games should be "taken further", but all your examples are mostly just existing franchises made into different, existing games.

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Thats really all you can do.. there are only 2 forms of creation.. variation of theme.. what cochtl just explained.. and something completly new.. and that one Almost Never happens...mario wasnt a new type of game,he was an existing franchise(donkey kong) made into different, existing type of game(side scroller).. it just upped the anti on platform games.. doom wasnt a new concept.. it was just like wolfenstien.... even Wolfenstien wasnt the fist FPS... FPS games are based on games like Spasim and Maze War.. they were createe circa 1974.. doom was a really really really old idea... i think cochtl just wanted games he likes to play to be taken to new levels..and see if anyone else had the same ideas while playing.. and yes i do too!!.. i wish there was a hot coffee mod for spongebob.. all those holes!!! so much fun.. and it could be a minigame like the bop the gopher on the head game.. a hole would light up and you plunge your hard bopper into the hole for more points and flashy lights would go off..

Weiser_Cain

yes and no. You can make a game based on preexisting elements that combines them in a diffrent way to create somethiing new gameplay-wise and as a whole. Or mix elements in a way no one else has. Sure if you pick it apart it's almost all been done before but seeing it all in place will be something new.

gauss

thanks for... the ellipses heavy... commentary on design, arsh. i agree that basically everything has already been thought of and that any "new" game ideas are going to come from crossbreeding existing genres and/or developing an existing idea further.

but in my mind "taking things further" has more to do with deepening and nuancing a given experience, instead of just changing every game into the gameplay style du jour. which these days is still mostly either team-base multiplayer with objectives, or trying to copy GTA. or some horrible MMO variation on the preceding two.

so to clarify my first post, i think cochtl's right when he says that Metroid could be furthered considerably with the integration of a meaningful plotline, but disagree that turning it into yet another team/class-based multiplayer game with objectives is a good idea.

Weiser_Cain

This might seem like an odd question but what would you consider a 'new' idea?

arshlevon

wasnt trying to make a commentary on design.. casue i know absolutly nothing about it.. i do know about creation and was just spouting off some of the mumbojumbo i learned when getting a useless masters in fine arts.. i just thought the tone seemed like you were telling cochtl his ideas were pointless cause it wasnt new or fresh enough to be considered cool from the standpoint of a master designer... i see that was not the intention.. thanks for clarifying.. and cochtl is my dawg.. we use to throw rocks at girls together..(when we both worked at mythic )

gauss

weiser: about the closest thing recently to a "new" idea in videogames that is a complete success is Katamari Damacy. that's got its own precedents as well. your last post basically has it: putting together old stuff in a novel fashion.

personally i'm not really interested in "new" ideas at all. just making what we've got deeper and play better is more than enough for me. take for example Resident Evil 4: it's the 4th in the series, none of what we see in the game has really never been done before, but the sum is greater than the parts. it's a game with a great amount of polish and attention lavished onto it, and it shows.

cochtl

Hmm… I guess I should have better explained what I was trying to get to. I’d like to see a new take on an existing game by emphasizing or strengthening key elements in that game that makes it unique.

I would honestly like to make a team based metroid mod if it could be done well (and if Nintendo wouldn’t shut it down when they caught wind of it for that matter). The metroid team based example would use game play elements and themes that are unique to the metroid series. And with that, any of you could play any or all of the metroid games and say to yourselves “hey, wouldn’t it be cool if weapon x and game play mechanic y were combined into one game with multiple players at once using each character’s strengths and weaknesses to complete objectives? And wouldn’t it be cool to see the game based on the metroid universe with all of the nuances that it holds to see that realized?” Something like that. It doesn’t have to be something totally new, different or innovative to be unique. I just figured it would be cool to see a certain game or the particulars that make that game cool or unique used in a different way that in turn would make it more fun or enjoyable.

I guess a realized example of what I am getting to is mega man soccer, even though it really didn’t combine elements in a way that I liked all that much. A better example is splinter cell’s multiplayer; first and third person views together as part of game play. Pre-existing elements that focused on and complemented the stealthy game play mechanics already part of splinter cell to begin with just made that fun, imo. Resident Evil 4 is a great example of a game that has been heavily updated to make the experience that much better. The designers saw the series’ best assets and flaws and made a better representation of the series. But even that still finds itself being terribly specific the RE series and that series alone. AS mentioned before, my take on all of this was to use elements unique to a particular game and use them in a way that was not normally used in that game to begin with.

As for a new idea, I’d think of it more as a new implementation of pre existing concepts, and that has already been mentioned here. I know that there are modders out there trying to do things like that, but to find a completed mod based on an existing game is hard to come by. This thread was just supposed to have people get creative and give their thoughts on a certain game or games and focus on the strengths or weaknesses to make it better in a new way.

Weiser_Cain

mod

gauss

killing people pointed me to chris bateman's site that talks all day and all night about game design stuff... but the bit on different types of innovation is very well written and cogent to this discussion:

http://onlyagame.typepad.com/only_a_game/2005/09/flavours_of_inn.html

it's a great site generally. bateman is maybe a little too wrapped up in an extremely specialized lingo, but hey, maybe that's more of what we need so that we know what each other is talking about.