EU vs. USA?

KDR_11k

Just a random idea:

If someone were to make a not too realistic (but well balanced, of course) MP FPS or RTS title depicting a fictional war between the US and the EU, let's call it Battlefield Europe, what characteristics would both sides have? (imagine trade of technology stopped some time ago)

Foehammer

hmmmmmmm......SAS vs. American Special Forces? cool scenario, i'm dwelling on it, heh!

MoP

Bunch of burly Scottish guys wearing berets and armed only with black knives, versus Texans driving SCUD missile launchers.

I think it'd probably balance out quite evenly.

Prs-Phil

noooooo you shouldnt have started this thread man, this is going to get really dirty

I´m not going to comment on this or I´ll be classed as the person starting the real war

motives

hmm let me see, US would gain advantage by using the arrogance gun and take control over spain until the united cheese-eater brigade strike back?

Slayerjerman

Easy war. We'd just have the CIA start an internal war between all the EU nations and we waltz in and clean up the mess.

Paul Jaquays

Why even trouble the CIA with starting a war? I'm predicting the EU will defeat itself and dissolve within 10 years (based on recent votes regarding the constitution).

sonic

I can't speak for EU, but the majority of American citizens would shit their pants and stock up on freeze-dried food. Meanwhile the Scotts are headbutting the concrete to pump up for the fight and us Texans are drivin around in our useless jacked up trucks shootin at random things for target practice hahahahahah

But it really comes down to... Which country has the most ninjas?

ElysiumGX

I'm tired of battling the Chinese and Middle East. Let's fight France. Just because they're French, no real reason. And Sweden, because they have all the hot womens and need the practice. That's fictional enough. A Swedish military.

edit: oh wait, the Swedish could use their deathmetal genre music pumped through loud speakers to scare away all the bible thumping american soldiers.

Ryno

If France fights for the EU, USA would mop the floor with them.

Has France ever won a war since Napoleon? WW1 didn't go to well for them. They got steamrolled in WW2. The Indochina/Vietnam war went pretty badly for them too.

Hmmmm....

KDR_11k

Paul: Because... uh... We're talking about a game and geopolitics aren't much fun when applied to an FPS?

MoP: Hm, yeah, though I guess the Texans don't have a chance because of the rampart teamkilling.

Hm, make US soldiers see one out of ten friendlies as an enemy?

Scott Ruggels

Dangerous Topic, and to make it a "balanced game" there would be way too many changes and would make the game laughable, or at least highly implausible.

Scott

KDR_11k

Nobody thought BF Vietnam was implausible just because the US and NVA had about equal losses, did they? What about the [whatever you're fighting] in BF2? I'd say the EU would have a much more powerful army than some middle eastern dictator who fights with leftovers from the Soviet Union. There are far too many games with even more inequal sides that are completely balanced.

jzero

I think the most implausible aspect of this idea is that the US and EU would even consider armed conflict. I think we did that one twice in the last century and nobody wants to repeat it. Now, if you moved the conflict area just a bit east, past the Balkans, into places like Abkhazia, Georgia or Chechnya, then you could get some action. But that would be like another US incursion...

There's a funny footnote in one of Bruce Sterling's recent books, 'Distraction', in which the future US declares war on, uh, The Netherlands. But it's over in about three days, and nobody mobilizes jack, and the Prez does it as a PR stunt. Go figure.

Anyone else here old enough to remember the day in '73 when Nixon put the US military on full alert? For a single day? It was during Watergate. No surprise there.

/jzero

Thermidor

I dont think ive ever seen a game where USA is defending its own boarders , that would be quite a fun setting, well different. sorta famous cities that have been invaded and you have to take em back , or you are defending the last lines trying to keep the city under allied control.

as for a EU v USA FPS, would the USA still use M4s? or wotever they use now?, and the EU would use some sortof HK weaponary. hey , at least no one would have trouble manufacturing again, going from metric to impirial , and back again...

-=Warhead=-

Umm.. The americans.. well.. all we have to do is get all the overweight men/women.. get them to fart in their face.. and or sit on them.. and woot.. we win !

Europeans.. uhhh.. who >.>

I think they would both win..
I'm a hippy..
I LOVE EARTH!!

*Covers up not to get flamed*

sundance

EU:
apaches, tigers, augusta mongoose
ef-2000s, mig-29s (germans have them), tornados
challengers, leopard IIs
hk g36s, steyr AUGs, FN FALs, HK mp5s, HK mp-9s

USA
apaches, huey cobras
f-22s, F-117s, B-2s, B-52s, b-1s, F-15s, f-16s, F/A-18s f-14s
abrams 2s
m-4s, M-16s, barret light 50s, MAC-10s

units:
EU
SAS, royal marines, SBS, paras, royal dutch marines, fallschirmjagers, KSK, norweigan jaegers to take alaska, belgian para-commandos

USA
special forces, navy SEALS, rangers, 160th SOAR, 101st airborne, buncha CIA officers who can't find their ass with a recon sat.

danr

the US have a special attack : they send troops over to York in their thousands, where they proceed to shit so much that the sewers really start to fuckin' stink, weakening the indigenous population

oh, hang on ... sorry, this is a fictional game?

diZzyWalnut

What's wrong with EU that You want to make a war against.
Hmmm, maybe there's something wrong with US 'cause they want to fight always.
Cowboys.
America doesn't know what's a real war -... in Your country , at Your home , in front of Your windows and doors. When all Your buildings fell down, no bus , no tram, there's nothing to eat and drink 'cause all industry is destroyed and your children are hungry and crying, nowhere to go , nowhere to hide .....and x millions innocents civils is dying .... not soldiers , but innocents. That's the real war ( no Hollywoods movies ).
I'm sorry but Your idea is verry bad ....

PLEASE , MAKE A VIDEOS GAMES MORE FUN, NOT WAR
... AND NO POLITICS AND RELIGIOUS
SHITS AT THIS GREAT AND UNIQUE FORUM. ONLY ART .

Ramucho

Africa will rule the world!!

adam

*PEACE KEEPERS UNITE*

Seriously guys, lets just shake hands and eat some bacon.

Jeff Parrott

That's a Canadian answer Adam.

sonic

[ QUOTE ]
What's wrong with EU that You want to make a war against.
Hmmm, maybe there's something wrong with US 'cause they want to fight always.
Cowboys.
America doesn't know what's a real war -... in Your country , at Your home , in front of Your windows and doors. When all Your buildings fell down, no bus , no tram, there's nothing to eat and drink 'cause all industry is destroyed and your children are hungry and crying, nowhere to go , nowhere to hide .....and x millions innocents civils is dying .... not soldiers , but innocents. That's the real war ( no Hollywoods movies ).
I'm sorry but Your idea is verry bad ....

PLEASE , MAKE A VIDEOS GAMES MORE FUN, NOT WAR
... AND NO POLITICS AND RELIGIOUS
SHITS AT THIS GREAT AND UNIQUE FORUM. ONLY ART .

[/ QUOTE ]

You missed the point.

GAME

Daz

Well this thread isn't gonna end in tears now is it?

I look forward to the insight from mr. Cain.

Scott Ruggels

Daz, you amake me laugh.. a lot.

Scott

MoP

REAL WARFARE WITH REAL GUNS AND REAL PEOPLE!!

But in a game.

Daz

I didn't even see who I was killing in BF2 at the show. Was it the Chinese?

Justin Meisse

America will win the prisoner torturing mini-game!

Scott Ruggels

Yes, the Chinese, but a whole lot of interesting eapons.

Scott

sonic

[ QUOTE ]
America will win the prisoner torturing mini-game!

[/ QUOTE ]

You're not serious are you?

Weiser_Cain

Actually diZzyWalnut american has experienced war up close and personal, we call it the civil war. Also, cowboys don't fight they tend cattle, please stop using that term.

This is a fun topic. With an expanded EU in theory they'd have more firepower than us, but there's some doubt that they could work well together, so they get a penalty to attack and an increased chance of friendly fire casualties(we get a bonus on covering it up). The europeans are a bunch of peaceniks so they run a high chance of riots if military spending gets too high, penalty to war budgets.

I've got to think that occupying the US has got to be one of the most difficult things to do. How do you subdue a bunch of gun totting religious fanatics that think god's ok with blowing the heads off a couple of frogs(this sounds familiar)?

It'd make an interesting game though I think it'd be more interesting to play as the euros(strategize/compromise), though I'd lose on purpose everytime, at least I'd get a kick out of surrendering(skipping the obvious french joke).

Hmmm I seem to have forgotten to factor canada in... Oh well it's not like they'd make a difference either way.
Ok, have I offended everybody this time?

Scott Ruggels

Careful. In previous wars Canadian involvement was decisive, such at Vimy Ridge, in WW1, then D-Day, and the advance across the Netherlands in WW2.

Same with the Australians. Decisive...

Scott

JKMakowka

What about a game where the people fight against the gouverment? That is actually much more likely since both the EU and the American gouvernment show frightening undemocratic tendencies lately (or not so lately).

Weiser_Cain

Yeah scott but the world was much diffrent then, plus I'd think canada would have to spend more than a buck fifty to make a diffrence in this fictional war, unless this is a comedy, then all they'd need is a spork and carefull comedic timing.

rooster

I think Benton Fraser should be Canadas champion unit

MoP

Don't tell me you used to watch Due South too?! What's that... 6-7 years ago now? His dog was cool.

rooster

due south rocked :] good ol Diefenbaker hehe, I always wanted a dog/wolf like that

flaagan

[ QUOTE ]
I dont think ive ever seen a game where USA is defending its own boarders , that would be quite a fun setting, well different. sorta famous cities that have been invaded and you have to take em back , or you are defending the last lines trying to keep the city under allied control.

as for a EU v USA FPS, would the USA still use M4s? or wotever they use now?, and the EU would use some sortof HK weaponary. hey , at least no one would have trouble manufacturing again, going from metric to impirial , and back again...

[/ QUOTE ]

http://www.pcgameworld.com/game.php/id/1899/Freedom_Fighters/

Freedom Fighters...
f'ing awesome game..
Soviet military comes in and quickly takes over the US, and you fight in the streets of the eastern US (NY and the like) as a rebel force to take back control.

KDR_11k

At first it was supposed to be set in Europe, probably in one of he actual soviet states but the publisher decided that american gamers could identify more closely with the game if it played in the US. Should've named the game "American Terrorist", just for the kicks .

Weiser_Cain

How about Syndrome: McVeigh?
I'll go ahead and apologize to anyone affected by the attack in Oklahoma.

Jeff Parrott

[ QUOTE ]
I think Benton Fraser should be Canadas champion unit

[/ QUOTE ]

Ah, Howie Mandel is from God's Country also. I think we all know who would be running things.

diZzyWalnut

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
What's wrong with EU that You want to make a war against.
Hmmm, maybe there's something wrong with US 'cause they want to fight always.
Cowboys.
America doesn't know what's a real war -... in Your country , at Your home , in front of Your windows and doors. When all Your buildings fell down, no bus , no tram, there's nothing to eat and drink 'cause all industry is destroyed and your children are hungry and crying, nowhere to go , nowhere to hide .....and x millions innocents civils is dying .... not soldiers , but innocents. That's the real war ( no Hollywoods movies ).
I'm sorry but Your idea is verry bad ....

PLEASE , MAKE A VIDEOS GAMES MORE FUN, NOT WAR
... AND NO POLITICS AND RELIGIOUS
SHITS AT THIS GREAT AND UNIQUE FORUM. ONLY ART .

[/ QUOTE ]

You missed the point.

GAME

[/ QUOTE ]

You missed the point as well.The conception of games should be entertainment = pastine = to enjoy the game and his idea and not harmful or injurious.

Some games brings very bad ideas to person ( young -unripe ) which is playing games like this.
They are not able make a difference between games and reality and than they grow up with ideas as EU or US is the bad ... and the hate is born.
All want I want to say is - don't bring a politic and religion in a games.


[ QUOTE ]
Actually diZzyWalnut american has experienced war up close and personal, we call it the civil war. Also, cowboys don't fight they tend cattle, please stop using that term.


[/ QUOTE ]
Are You talking about a war Nord/South = only one ; and be sure that I'm happy for US that there is no more war like this on US ground ... ,but I remind You that in Europe's history, there was several wars like this (even worst), You know it ?
That's why the position "peaceful" mine and Europe present.

KDR_11k

There are US vs. Arabs, US vs. Russians and US vs. Chinese games and you say that another game like that would breed prejudices?

The game shouldn't fall into the hands of unripe persons but that's the job of the rating system and responsible parents. Just because some people might not like or be able to handle it doesn't mean it shouldn't be made as not everything can be completely harmless and unoffensive to everybody. Hell, some people shouldn't watch porn but try outlawing it.

I'm thinking that Sundance's list lacks a few ground vehicles. Stuff like artillery, jeeps, APCs and various missile launchers.

sundance

i was mostly going off the top of my head...

USA
MLRS, Humvees, M-113s, Avengers, Patriots

EU
land rovers, saracens, crotales

it's also missing squad automatic weapons, shoulder-fired SAMs and light anti-tank weapons...

Jes

[ QUOTE ]
There are US vs. Arabs, US vs. Russians and US vs. Chinese games -

[/ QUOTE ]But then again, the last two of those also show their non-US nations as having unlimited supplies of CanO'WhoopAss at their disposal! (C&C Generals, RA1/2)

Scott Ruggels

DizzyWalnut I will give you the first rule of game marketing and design"
<font color="red">
PACIFISM
DOES
NOT
SELL!!!

IT'S
NOT
ENTERTAINING!!!</font>

Games are cathartic, where we expunge our base impulses into the game, so we don't choke the shit out of our neighbors. Gaminng is not about Virtue, but excercising vice and expunging it in a safe manner.

Go do your homework.

Scott

Weiser_Cain

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Actually diZzyWalnut american has experienced war up close and personal, we call it the civil war. Also, cowboys don't fight they tend cattle, please stop using that term.


[/ QUOTE ]
Are You talking about a war Nord/South = only one ; and be sure that I'm happy for US that there is no more war like this on US ground ... ,but I remind You that in Europe's history, there was several wars like this (even worst), You know it ?
That's why the position "peaceful" mine and Europe present.

[/ QUOTE ]
Hey guy that was the bloodiest war we were ever involved in, it was enough by itself. But we also had the war of texan independence and the war of 1812. And it's not like all those guys we sent to fight in wars across the world somehow missed out on the horrors of war because it wasn't happening in their hometown. For good or ill americans know war. But we're getting off track since what we're really talking about is a videogame, this isn't a serious talk on a real war between the US and the eu, so relax.

Lore

A USA vs Europe proves only one thing; "How much the Germans love David Hasselhoff" - Norman McDonald.

ironbearxl

The British are coming, the british are coming! I think this has been done before?

diZzyWalnut

oki doki ,
it was just mine opinion ( position personal ),
nothing against blood-violence, cause I like games as Silent Hill,HL2,Doom3, etc., but I don't like the game of war which could be present as a possibility of future war between the nations , continents pr

palm

The US wouldnt stand a chanse.
Germany would blitzkrig trough your whole country.=DDD

Dont listen to me, im just trying to stir things up.;)

/Palm