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Angel, Knight, and Death.... Need advice!

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polycounter lvl 18
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- FredH - polycounter lvl 18
Hi, I thought I would post my work here to get some much needed advice. I am working on creating a scene with a Paladin as the hero and a captured Angel. Death will be her master.

I just need advice for the models as they come out. As for the concepts themselves, I won't have time to fix them. (although, it would still be interesting to hear your comments so that maybe I can fix them sometime in the future)

Here's the main idea:
mainsketch.jpg

And here is the concept for the Paladin:
Artbyfh_Con_Palad_L.jpg


Many Thanks:)

_FreD_

Replies

  • IceWolve
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    IceWolve polycounter lvl 18
    Looks bad ass, can't wait to see it in 3d.
  • Sean McBride
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    Sean McBride polycounter lvl 18
    :O HOT! Really looking forward to these laugh.gif
  • - FredH -
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    - FredH - polycounter lvl 18
    Here's the model for the Paladin. Right now, I think the major problem is his waist area. I believe it's too low compared to his elbows... but, I am not sure. I will have to take some time away from the model so that I can see it with a fresh eye. he is 5311 polygons so far. I am aiming for 5k max.

    I just started working on Death, I'll have him up in a while.

    Knight.jpg

    _FreD_
  • rooster
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    rooster mod
    sweet! I don't see anything that would need fixing, unless colour counts tongue.gif. Lookin forward to seeing this develop, great start!

    edit: whoa that was quick! laugh.gif. Awesome smile.gif
  • -=Warhead=-
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    -=Warhead=- polycounter lvl 18
    holy shit, thats really.. really.. really! good.. im really amazed, nice job man
  • Jerome
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    Jerome polycounter lvl 18
    ahh, imm jealous of your skill. its awesome, may be a little more hair in the front would be better, and i think it could be relaxed a bit where its more drupey
  • Bradfordart
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    Bradfordart polycounter lvl 18
    Looks greats, seems like you followed to concept really closely. Is this rigged? Would be cool to see some posing working before you jump into texturing.
  • rawkstar
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    rawkstar polycounter lvl 18
    looks cool, the concepts are badass, one thing I can think of is that the model of the paladin doesn't look quite as dynamic as the concept.
  • Josh_Singh
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    Josh_Singh polycounter lvl 18
    Noice Fred. This wouldent be for the master/servant challenge on cgtalk would it? Like Rockstar said, those concepts are badass, fo sho'! I really like the paladin, and i think once textured will look really dynamic. Get to work on that death and angel man!!
  • Weiser_Cain
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    Weiser_Cain polycounter lvl 18
    Looks badass, I need to get a printer...
  • KDR_11k
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    KDR_11k polycounter lvl 18
    Nice, those concepts kinda remind me of the style common in japanese RPGs nowadays.

    Now let's just hope this isn't D&D or he'd be dead in no time with an AC of 50...
  • Fishypants
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    Fishypants polycounter lvl 18
    Wow, really dig the designs. Can't wait to see them finished. Keep up the great work.
  • poopinmymouth
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    poopinmymouth polycounter lvl 19
    Holy crap these concepts are awesome. You just get better and better. The paladin concept is particularly wicked.

    I'm gonna go with rockstars suggestion to pose the knight for texturing time. I think he looks a bit rigid as well, and a dynamic pose could help you infuse some of his attitude while texturing.
  • Sean McBride
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    Sean McBride polycounter lvl 18
    Aye, i agree with poop and rockstar. I think if you arched his back with his chest stuck out and turned his feet out like the concept it would make him really really pop... but wow. This is going to be very very good! smile.gif
  • Asherr
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    Asherr polycounter lvl 18
    [ QUOTE ]
    Now let's just hope this isn't D&D or he'd be dead in no time with an AC of 50...

    [/ QUOTE ]

    only if you are still playing by second edition rules. 3rd and 3.5 edition rules start your AC at 10 and go up from there. so with an AC of 50 someone would have to get a total of 50 on their attack roll to hit him smile.gif
  • - FredH -
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    - FredH - polycounter lvl 18
    Hey! thanks guys, I am glad you like it soo far.

    Actually, I am pretty far with the Angel already, but it is stuck in transit between work and home (I shouldn't have done it at work argh!). Hopefully, things will clear up soon and I'll be able to post it.

    My deadline for this is the 18th of May. I have to finish 3 characters and one large environment. So, nope, there will be no rigging until the very end. Unfortunatly, I only have time to do it once, so it is going to have to count. Hopefully, the characters will all work out fine, but, I am having doubts with the Paladin. I will keep playing around with him to see if I can make the proportions more soothing to the eyes.

    Many thanks for the crits thus far. I'll be sure to make him as dynamic as the concept:)

    ghost_rider --> Master and Servant contest... I don't know what you are talking about, I never heard of it:p

    Jerome --> More hair you say? Ok, will do, many thanks!

    Bradfordart --> Rigging? Impossible! I will have to take my best guess and cross my fingers it works. Otherwise, I am glad you like it!

    mr_Rockstar --> Dynamic you say? Then Dynamic it shall become! I will keep playing with him until it hurts and my mind and I can't take it anymore (hopefully, it will get better before the very end... hehe). Thanks dude!

    KDR_11k --> No comment... Obviously you did not play 3rd ed yet. Put your head down in shame dude hehe. But, I was just fooling around with the text anyways, so I just wrote anything..

    Asherr --> Yes, by 3rd ed rules, he would be a monster! AC 50 is really hard to hit.... I miss DnD, such good memories ahhhh

    poopinmymouth --> I wish I had time, but rigging him now would be impossible. I'll keep correcting his proportions before and during texturing and hopefully, by the time I get to the rigging, he will be up and ready to go! Otherwise, thanks for confirming something is wrong with him. I too think he is a bit... boring and wrong at the moment. I'll keep playing around with it.

    n30g3n3s1s --> Ok, I will try the changes you suggested, many many thanks!

    _FreD_
  • Renaud Galand
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    Renaud Galand polycounter lvl 19
    awesome concept !! the captured angel remind me the work of Dorian Cleavenger for some reasons.

    By exemple :
    F08.JPG

    I think that if you are looking for some great background atmospheres , you should take a look @ http://www.dorianart.com

    Anyway, you have a great style, and I really love the paladin (like all of us smile.gif)
  • moose
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    moose polycount sponsor
    cool model dude, texture him up! go go go

    as for the proportions, i dont think the waist is too low at all, in fact the waist/ass looks like its too high. In that pose he is in, the elbows should come in line *about* with the lower extent of the ribcage (give or take 1-2 ribs), with the waist meeting up with the arms about halfway through the forarm. Judging proportion and anatomy is a lot easier when you do it by comparassion, and helps make for a stronger form. Even when it comes to stylization (which is a wonderful thing), keeping somewhat accurate body "distribution" will help the overall shape.

    you've got some cool shapes going on there, tweak up those proportions, solidify them, and this will be a bangin mesh. smile.gif
  • Vitor
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    Vitor polycounter lvl 18
    Awesome work as usual wink.gif
    It's been a while without seen your work around frown.gif
  • b1ll
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    b1ll polycounter lvl 18
    This is cool.

    I think the problem with the model is that it doesnt realy read weel. There is some area where I would have place polys and some less.

    I realy like the massive shoulders, thats cool, But they do not stand out well with the long and legs and the the high waist.
    Like moose said, Its cool stuff, Just solidify it man.

    b1ll
  • - FredH -
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    - FredH - polycounter lvl 18
    Thanks for the additional comments:) I'll be sure to make the changes right before I start texturing him. Right now, I am just finishing the base models for everything. Today after work, I worked on Death. I'll be finished with the model tomorrow (I know about the pertruding faces everywhere, I'll fix that). I am going to make layers of polygons for the cloth so that I can get a good torn cloth look. In theory, this should be an easy character to do... I am hoping:p

    Although not much, I just thought I would post it to show my progress...
    death_01.jpg


    Moose and B1ll --> I certainly agree with you, it doesn't stand out well at the moment. Thanks for confirming my doubts. I always get amazed how the smallest changes can make such a big difference. I'll keep pushing and pulling until it just... pops and I know it's finally right:) Thanks you two!

    Vitor --> Hey you! I know, I haven't posted much recently. I took a small... uhmm, brake from art, but I am glad to see that you are still around. I haven't been much to 3dtotal these days. Things have really changed there.. for the better I am sure. Nice to see you again:)

    _FreD_
  • Josh_Singh
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    Josh_Singh polycounter lvl 18
    Really cool. Makes me want to make a death model. One thing is you migh want to add an edge there on his Hump on his back. Really cool man.
  • - FredH -
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    - FredH - polycounter lvl 18
    Ok, played around with the polies some more and came up with this. I'll start texturing it this weekend. It will probably change a little more during texturing, but not by much.

    death_02.jpg
  • rawkstar
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    rawkstar polycounter lvl 18
  • Hollowmind
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    Hollowmind polycounter lvl 18
    That's seriously bad-ass although his arms seem stubby.
  • - FredH -
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    - FredH - polycounter lvl 18
    Ya, a friend at work suggested,

    - loose the back hump to make it look more pround like in the concept.
    - Lengthen the arms...alot. This will help show that he has no legs.
    - make arms more narrow to make it look like there is only a bone structure underneath
    - and make scythe rounder

    Now that everything is in the model, it will take no time to tweak it some more:)

    If anyone ever has any further suggestions during my updates, let me know ok?

    Ciao for now!
    _FreD_
  • jzero
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    jzero polycounter lvl 18
    Fred, truly nice concepts and models, all around.

    Definitely lose Death's hump. I also have one suggestion for you about Death's hood. I made a costume hood for myself years ago, and I came to see how the top edge of it forms a peak and hangs over the shadowed face, giving that extra-sinister appearance. Your flat-peaked hood seems to imply that Death has a forehead shaped like the edge of a brick, as opposed to a skull as you might expect. I would suggest that you try making the hood peaked, and see if it adds to the threatening appearance.

    Good Luck!

    /jzero
  • PeteJ
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    PeteJ polycounter lvl 18
    liking the death model, i've always had trouble modelling flowing forms like that.
    a little sugestion for the face area, perhaps have some swirling smokey bits in the hood of the cape, would look sweet with alphas.. laugh.gif
  • - FredH -
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    - FredH - polycounter lvl 18
    Ok, here's just an update of Death. I made a few changes to him thanks to the great feedback recieved from here:) I should be done with him tomorrow (or monday because it's mother's day tomorrow argh). Then I'll work on tieing in the Angel.

    death_03.jpg


    Cuban_pete --> For now, I am just going to leave his insides entirely black, however, I imaging I am going to try and put some black auras/smoke around his entire body when I am finished with him.

    Jzero --> The 'edge of a brick' comment made me laugh. Ok ok, I changed it hehe Thanks dude!

    _FreD_
  • KdS
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    KdS polycounter lvl 18
    texturing pass looks awesome oO
    although the pic seems a bit pixelly frown.gif

    is it possible to take a look at your texture sheet? ooo.gif
  • Thegodzero
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    Thegodzero polycounter lvl 18
    Nice! Its got a very nice ring wrath/death thing going on with it. I was just about to make a char that looks not too diffrent from that here soon.
  • - FredH -
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    - FredH - polycounter lvl 18
    Ok, Death is finished:) If there is anything that you think needs correcting (besides symmetrical issues, I don't have enough time to make it un-symmetrical argh!), let me know ok?

    KdS --> Ok, I included a 512 version of my texture sheet for ya:) The 1024 I think is too big for the web.

    death_04.jpg

    death_05.jpg

    Next up... Angel!!

    _FreD_
  • Cubik
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    Cubik polycounter lvl 18
    HELL YES!

    Quite possibly the best work I have seen on Polycount. I'll let someone else find possible flaws because I sure as hell can't.
  • MoP
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    MoP polycounter lvl 18
    That's very, very cool. I love the colour variation in the robes.

    Only thing I'm not sure of is the way the cowl peaks at the top of the head - just looks weird and unexplained. Looks like there should be horns holding up those folds, but there's nothing there.

    Beautiful concepting, modelling and texturing work though. Most impressive.
  • - FredH -
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    - FredH - polycounter lvl 18
    Oh crap! I hadn't noticed that. From this angle, I agree, it looks really wierd argh! This could be a big problem for my final composition because this would most likely be the angle from which they are seen. Thanks dude for the warning, I'll fix it!

    Cubik --> Thanks dude, I am glad you like it!
  • cholden
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    cholden polycounter lvl 18
    I don't like Death's robe texture at all. It looks to me like a blurry picture tossed on with a dirt overlay. The hood front and back sections almost work, but the rest, especially the sleeves is just a mess. Also, I can't make out what that thing on the right arm is at all. Personally, I'd repaint this with a texture that shows form, and made to enhance the model, like the blade.
  • JordanW
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    JordanW polycounter lvl 19
    one thing that i notice is that the texture is mostly high frequency detail, there's very little medium or low freq detail in there, this could be a problem if the character is viewed from a distance, it could end up just looking like a lot of noise. The character does look good though, I really like the feel of this character.
  • - FredH -
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    - FredH - polycounter lvl 18
    Tinman --> I haven't even thought of that. I will be sure to fix that by adding more med ranges in. I'll think about which areas to put that in while I work on the angel (I already have an idea of where I can do it). Thanks!

    Cholden --> I could make it a little clearer on the arms so that it looks more like it's rapped, but, I can't change the entire base texture for now. But, I'll consider your suggestion for after my deadline. Thanks!

    _FreD_
  • lkraan
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    lkraan polycounter lvl 18
    Holy crap that rocks!!!
    I love the texture of the robe. Such a great balance between the folds and dirt.
  • b1ll
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    b1ll polycounter lvl 18
    I think the problem is That u lack interesting contrast

    Texture look nice, but u cant see the different elements well, Unless u cross ur eyes and turn ur head to the side while standing on 1 leg Ya know

    Try sharper highlight, backlight anything to make thoses details POP without confusion..

    b1ll
  • moose
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    moose polycount sponsor
    ooooooo

    dig it! i agree with bill, the cloth does kind of meld together. i kind of like it though, creates a nice feeling of chaos in the cloth. My only crit would be that the pieces that arent cloth dont stand off well, since the values and hues are very similar. My guess would be that the scythe would be much more visibile in motion and with fx, but it could use some extra color to really pop it off as a 'weapon' instead of an extension of the bone arm (which could be badass!). the design of the scythe hilt rules.

    the skele hand could pop a bit more, soul had some interesting comparrasions in his samurai thread about bone color and the overall feel of the mesh/texture, maybe worth glancing at.

    dig it though, cant wait to see that angel!
  • shotgun
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    shotgun polycounter lvl 19
    There is an odd feeling of sickening (?) coming from this guy, despite - or perhaps as a result of the very dull, photorealistic quality of it all.

    I think the robes are fine, overall. It work so imo don't fix it if its not broken. A soft, warm "inside glow" would be rad though..
  • - FredH -
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    - FredH - polycounter lvl 18
    Ok, here's a w.i.p on the Angel. I still have to add in cuts and scratchs, and a broken wing. There is still quite a bit to do. If you seee something that needs love, let me know ok?

    About Death, your suggestions have certainly been noticed. I will try them out soon. Many thanks guys!

    angel_02.jpg

    _FreD_
  • - FredH -
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    - FredH - polycounter lvl 18
    p.s, don't mention the seem right across her belly:p This angel was a product of bad planning. I'll try and blend it in as best as I can once she is finished.
  • rooster
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    rooster mod
    gorgeous, love the glowing feeling of the wings and cloth.. great design.
  • steady
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    steady polycounter lvl 18
    god damn dude
    awesome work
  • notman
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    notman polycounter lvl 18
    Damn, I was so caught up in the beauty of that angel that I wouldn't have caught the seam....But then I noticed her thumb seems a little large too. Awesome work though
  • palm
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    palm polycounter lvl 18
    God damn great!
    Lots of character.

    Cheers
    /Palm
  • achromatic
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    achromatic polycounter lvl 18
    WOW, that angel is beautiful

    good job
  • MoP
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    MoP polycounter lvl 18
    Yeah, her thumb and the palm of the hand area seem a little thick to be feminine. That's an easy fix though.
    The rest is just gorgeous. Really nice work.
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