using roughness/gloss maps with PhongE or Phong shaders in Maya

mouse_marple

First time poster, but I've lurked for a while and found many helpful tips here.  Now for the Maya question.

I've just started doing some game modding, but due to limitations with the mod tool, only FBX models are accepted.  Unfortunately, I can't get any PBR stuff to export (or appear in game) so it looks like the only shaders (so far) the mod tool accepts are basic ones like Blinn, Lambert, Phong and PhongE (I'm new to all of this but as I understand it, most engines need some sort of interface to translate the 3D editor stuff to the game engine).  I've found places for the specular map, normal and diffuse map in the Phong shaders but how can I apply the roughness/gloss map?  Based on research, it looks like the roughness map goes into the cosine node on a Phong shader and the "highlight" node on the PhongE?  Do I need to place any node between those two?  Thanks for any help and I apologize for the lack of clarity (still learning all this).



[a more general question: can basic shaders like PhongE be made to accept more complex PBR maps?]

fmnoor

The short answer is the phong material in Maya is not only not physically based, those maps are also probably made for a different specular model ( most engines have adopted a different specular BRDF ).

If you have a newer version of Maya, you can use the directX11 plugin and AutodeskUberShader ( https://knowledge.autodesk.com/support/maya/learn-explore/caas/CloudHelp/cloudhelp/2015/ENU/Maya/files/GUID-21D2A020-EC76-4679-B38A-D5270CE52566-htm.html ). You should still be able to export the mesh as an FBX just fine, however.

sprunghunt

which game are you modding? 

mouse_marple

fmnoor said:

The short answer is the phong material in Maya is not only not physically based, those maps are also probably made for a different specular model ( most engines have adopted a different specular BRDF ).

If you have a newer version of Maya, you can use the directX11 plugin and AutodeskUberShader ( https://knowledge.autodesk.com/support/maya/learn-explore/caas/CloudHelp/cloudhelp/2015/ENU/Maya/files/GUID-21D2A020-EC76-4679-B38A-D5270CE52566-htm.html ). You should still be able to export the mesh as an FBX just fine, however.

Thanks!  I'll give that a try.  I'm using Maya 2018.

mouse_marple

sprunghunt said:

which game are you modding? 

I'm modding Final Fantasy XV Windows edition.  They released a Mod Organizer in early June.  It's basically a model swapper and doesn't give us direct access to textures or models.  It just appears that most of the influences are not exporting with the FBX models and people are getting some scuffed results because of it.

sprunghunt

mouse_marple said:

show previous quotes

sprunghunt said:

which game are you modding? 

I'm modding Final Fantasy XV Windows edition.  They released a Mod Organizer in early June.  It's basically a model swapper and doesn't give us direct access to textures or models.  It just appears that most of the influences are not exporting with the FBX models and people are getting some scuffed results because of it.

Does the mod organiser come with existing FBX files?  - if it does I'd open them in maya and have a look at how they're setup. 

mouse_marple

sprunghunt said:

show previous quotes

mouse_marple said:

sprunghunt said:

which game are you modding? 

I'm modding Final Fantasy XV Windows edition.  They released a Mod Organizer in early June.  It's basically a model swapper and doesn't give us direct access to textures or models.  It just appears that most of the influences are not exporting with the FBX models and people are getting some scuffed results because of it.

Does the mod organiser come with existing FBX files?  - if it does I'd open them in maya and have a look at how they're setup. 

yes it does and I have looked at those.  They seem to have roughness map going to "cosine power" on Phong materials.  But they haven't applied a number of the textures that are attached to the models.  It's a bit of a guessing game.

sprunghunt

mouse_marple said:

show previous quotes

sprunghunt said:

mouse_marple said:

sprunghunt said:

which game are you modding? 

I'm modding Final Fantasy XV Windows edition.  They released a Mod Organizer in early June.  It's basically a model swapper and doesn't give us direct access to textures or models.  It just appears that most of the influences are not exporting with the FBX models and people are getting some scuffed results because of it.

Does the mod organiser come with existing FBX files?  - if it does I'd open them in maya and have a look at how they're setup. 

yes it does and I have looked at those.  They seem to have roughness map going to "cosine power" on Phong materials.  But they haven't applied a number of the textures that are attached to the models.  It's a bit of a guessing game.

is there any other data attached to the models? For most engines the texture assignments isn't done in the shader in the FBX. It's a separate file that assigns the textures.

They might even be automatically assigning the textures using their names.