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I GIVE UP

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AliArto
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AliArto polycounter lvl 2
Hi guys i am thinking about giving up on digital sculpture i can't get the work done i study anatomy i get it but still hard to make it right pls any advise for me 
btw i am at age 25 is it late for me ?

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  • Brian "Panda" Choi
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    Brian "Panda" Choi high dynamic range
    @AliArto
    Would you mind posting images of the sculpture her so we can deteremine what you can do?
  • Alex_J
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    Alex_J high dynamic range
    Take a break. Try again. Just don't quit.
  • carvuliero
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    carvuliero ngon master
    I don't think dreams have age limits , so its up to you
    If you cant get good results out of your studies change the way you study or even better the way you think about the things you study
    Game artist /digital sculptor is not a easy job, it take a lot of time, knowledge and dedications and if you gave up that easily its definitely not for you
    I strongly suggest to check both movies below before you made your final decision :
    https://www.ted.com/talks/steve_jobs_how_to_live_before_you_die
    https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0496201/



  • AliArto
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    AliArto polycounter lvl 2
    these my study ive been 7-8 month since i start anatomy study and sculpting 

    and these some last month i did when i was study body anatomy  i switch to focus on face 

  • AliArto
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    AliArto polycounter lvl 2
    thanks guys for the comment yes i don't want to give i say it to my self everyday i even wrote on paper "don't give up" set it next to screen not joking 
    but the result gets me frustrated 
  • carvuliero
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    carvuliero ngon master
    Been frustrated is natural part of the learning process , just turn it around and use it as motivation .Learning the basics this will boost your confidence and frustration will start fading away .Make yourself a study schedule and stick with it , change the way you study and subject you study from (books, images 3d model/3d scans ,medical data. casts, live model or yourself )Get a mentor or study buddy someone more experience .Start drawing even if its just tracing over images . Learn to see .Read this book :
    book : modeling a guide for teacher and students E. Lanteri
  • pixelpatron
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    pixelpatron greentooth
    The line between success and failure is super thin. Keep going!!!! Failure is only achieved when you stop trying.

    To have the things you've never had, you must do the things you've never done.
  • slosh
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    slosh quad damage
    For your anatomy studies, focus on proportion first.  Getting the basic shapes in the right places is the first step.  You are jumping into muscles before the proportions look right and it shows...esp on the female.  Once you get the overall shapes looking good, then start doing muscle groups.
  • AliArto
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    AliArto polycounter lvl 2
    I think your only issue is that you are focusing on each muscle,
    yes that my issue there i'll try focusing on group muscle 
    and about
    working on something other than human anatomy

    why is that i get a lot of artist telling me that ?

  • AliArto
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    AliArto polycounter lvl 2

    carvuliero
    Spag_Eddy  
    thank  guys for the comment this really helped me i needed this 
    thanks again 
  • Alex_J
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    Alex_J high dynamic range
    AliArto said:

    why is that i get a lot of artist telling me that ?


    Probably because the problem you seem to have (which is the same problem every beginning artist ever has had) has nothing to do with anatomical understanding whatsoever. Anybody can learn where the muscles are, right? You can teach a dog to pick things out of a pile. But what you are doing is skipping the most important steps and going straight to the details. It's easy to do because the underlying forms of the object are much more difficult to discern than the details. 

    So a human body isn't only a complex and subtle thing, it's also super familiar to us and so it's very easy to spot problems, even if we can't say for sure what the problem is. This is why starting with something more simple is a better way to train your artist eye. You can continue hammering away at the hard stuff of course, but understand it will lead to lots of frustration. 

  • Brian "Panda" Choi
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    Brian "Panda" Choi high dynamic range
    @AliArto
    Have you taken figure drawing classes before, or is that a resource that is immediately unavailable?
  • AliArto
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    AliArto polycounter lvl 2
    AliArto said:

    why is that i get a lot of artist telling me that ?


    Probably because the problem you seem to have (which is the same problem every beginning artist ever has had) has nothing to do with anatomical understanding whatsoever. Anybody can learn where the muscles are, right? You can teach a dog to pick things out of a pile. But what you are doing is skipping the most important steps and going straight to the details. It's easy to do because the underlying forms of the object are much more difficult to discern than the details. 

    So a human body isn't only a complex and subtle thing, it's also super familiar to us and so it's very easy to spot problems, even if we can't say for sure what the problem is. This is why starting with something more simple is a better way to train your artist eye. You can continue hammering away at the hard stuff of course, but understand it will lead to lots of frustration. 

    i spend around 1 hour in blocking forms when i see it right i go to details and muscles 
    so should i spend more in blocking and setup the forms ?
    yes sculpt it's new to me i start 7 month a ago but i have modeling background 
    this my artsation https://www.artstation.com/aliheroah this first portrait it's takes me 2 weeks i use ref overlay i cheated it 
  • Amsterdam Hilton Hotel
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    Amsterdam Hilton Hotel insane polycounter
    AliArto said:
    working on something other than human anatomy

    why is that i get a lot of artist telling me that ?

    Working on different subjects will train your observation and technique in ways that will feed back and improve your character art. Staying within a comfort zone can create a plateauing effect where you aren't sure what, or how, to improve.

    Don't let frustration discourage you at this point. I bet if you look back on your first stuff you'll see you've improved. It's natural when you're still in the early phases of learning to get aggravated because you know what you want to produce but you can't make it happen the way you want. With time and practice you get to a point where that goes away. Until then you have to deal with frustration and keep coming back. 
  • AliArto
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    AliArto polycounter lvl 2
    slosh said:
    For your anatomy studies, focus on proportion first.  Getting the basic shapes in the right places is the first step.  You are jumping into muscles before the proportions look right and it shows...esp on the female.  Once you get the overall shapes looking good, then start doing muscle groups.
    so how much time should i work on proportion i work on this 1 hour and thin setup muscles 

  • AliArto
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    AliArto polycounter lvl 2
    @AliArto
    Have you taken figure drawing classes before, or is that a resource that is immediately unavailable?
    no i never take it 
  • Brian "Panda" Choi
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    Brian "Panda" Choi high dynamic range
    I'd recommend getting started studying on it, either with an actual class deepending on where you live or some guided self-learning with a book in hand (I'd personally recommend "Figure Drawing for All It's Worth" by Andrew Loomis).  I am not certain of your access to certain materials in your end of Iraq.

    Satoshi rightly mentions proportions as something you need to look into, but maybe to make it a little more long-term goal oriented, 'learning to get better at figure drawing/sculpting" will give you  a large berth to move forward on. It will tackle not just proportions, but gesture, line of action, composition, etc.

  • AliArto
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    AliArto polycounter lvl 2
    AliArto said:
    working on something other than human anatomy

    why is that i get a lot of artist telling me that ?

    Working on different subjects will train your observation and technique in ways that will feed back and improve your character art. Staying within a comfort zone can create a plateauing effect where you aren't sure what, or how, to improve.

    Don't let frustration discourage you at this point. I bet if you look back on your first stuff you'll see you've improved. It's natural when you're still in the early phases of learning to get aggravated because you know what you want to produce but you can't make it happen the way you want. With time and practice you get to a point where that goes away. Until then you have to deal with frustration and keep coming back. 
    i see thanks finally i got the answer 
  • AliArto
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    AliArto polycounter lvl 2
    I'd recommend getting started studying on it, either with an actual class deepending on where you live or some guided self-learning with a book in hand (I'd personally recommend "Figure Drawing for All It's Worth" by Andrew Loomis).  I am not certain of your access to certain materials in your end of Iraq.

    Satoshi rightly mentions proportions as something you need to look into, but maybe to make it a little more long-term goal oriented, 'learning to get better at figure drawing/sculpting" will give you  a large berth to move forward on. It will tackle not just proportions, but gesture, line of action, composition, etc.

    so should i get better in drawing ? or just sketches to understand the proportion ? and sorry i know it's stupid question !
  • Brian "Panda" Choi
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    Brian "Panda" Choi high dynamic range
    If you can do it in 3D, do it in 3D.  If you can do it in 2D, do it in 2D.  I'd argue that you should do it in 2D so you're more handicapable as an artist.  And regarding volume of drawings, it'll be faster.

    Right now, drawings roughly equals sketches in my previous posts. There's no real significant difference.
  • AliArto
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    AliArto polycounter lvl 2
    If you can do it in 3D, do it in 3D.  If you can do it in 2D, do it in 2D.  I'd argue that you should do it in 2D so you're more handicapable as an artist.  And regarding volume of drawings, it'll be faster.

    Right now, drawings roughly equals sketches in my previous posts. There's no real significant difference.
    thanks i'll study it soon
  • diegohj
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    diegohj polycounter lvl 4

    Hi, AliArto! I think that every artist on this forum already had this problem. You don't need to be so hard on yourself because of your age or your studies.

    I’ve started at the age of 26 thinking just like you and here’s my advice: art doesn't care if you want to learn fast. These studies take a lot time until you feel some kind of evolution. Take a break, learn with your own frustrations, go back to the beginning and fail more. In time you'll notice the evolution in your work.

    Keep posting it and ask for suggestions. Here's an awesome place to do this. Don't give up, bro :)

  • Mehran Khan
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    Mehran Khan polycounter lvl 6
    AliArto said:

    carvuliero
    Spag_Eddy  
    thank  guys for the comment this really helped me i needed this 
    thanks again 
    am glad it helped,
    AliArto said:

    working on something other than human anatomy

    why is that i get a lot of artist telling me that ?

    Because you have to first find what is your strengths when it comes to forms, human anatomy has very specific forms and if you are not good with them you might end up being frustrated. BUT if you take the other route and do forms which you are comfortable with,you will learn faster and have a far less frustrating feedback loop, this helps a lot with building confidence. For example if you are good with rock faces then you can do some statues, mannequins or even stylized characters  and once you are great with it, you can  move into human anatomy with far more confidence.
        
              Now obviously this is me telling you to find a comfort zone, and conventional logic tells people that real success is out side of the said "comfort box/zone" , but  that does not apply to your case because you do not really have a comfort zone right now :D
  • Mehran Khan
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    Mehran Khan polycounter lvl 6
    Visum said:
    I started my serious 3D adventure at the age of 37.
    Age is a state of mind my friend.
    thanks man, I needed that :) 
  • AliArto
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    AliArto polycounter lvl 2
    hi guys so i did some figure drawing "skull" with and without reference 
    in the end i did sculpt it in zbrush without reference i'll do another one with reference after study it and see what are my issue 
    what do u think is this the good way to study ?
    and btw like what u say about sculpt non human anatomy 
    i did some bird sculpt i'll do another one rocks maybe
    and what do u think do i need study full body or sperate after finish the head and get decent sculpt thin go to study figure  body ?

     



  • AliArto
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    AliArto polycounter lvl 2
     yes that my issue am new to sculpt i wish i had started on zbrush before i was wasting a lot of time before 
    thanks :smile:

  • AliArto
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    AliArto polycounter lvl 2
    diegohj said:

    Hi, AliArto! I think that every artist on this forum already had this problem. You don't need to be so hard on yourself because of your age or your studies.

    I’ve started at the age of 26 thinking just like you and here’s my advice: art doesn't care if you want to learn fast. These studies take a lot time until you feel some kind of evolution. Take a break, learn with your own frustrations, go back to the beginning and fail more. In time you'll notice the evolution in your work.

    Keep posting it and ask for suggestions. Here's an awesome place to do this. Don't give up, bro :)

    thanks a lot am new to this froum i was on fb posting and wait for feedback but there is not a lot good solid feedback 
  • Brian "Panda" Choi
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    Brian "Panda" Choi high dynamic range
    Skulls are a good start.  The bird doesn't look like its a focused study; can't tell if you were being painstakingly specific about the bird's feather directions with those lines oyu make into the surface of the sculpt.

    I would encourage you to push into bigger picture stuff, instead of focusing on specific parts of the body.  Once again, just knowing one element perfectly doesn't mean it'll all fit together neatly.  Anatomy can't solve bad overall forms, gesture, etc.

    I'm speaking of this kind of "big picture:"


    You could do something similar with rough sculpts.
  • AliArto
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    AliArto polycounter lvl 2
     so should i drawing figure and thin do it in 3d ? in zsphare without symmetry ?
     i did study the body anatomy and landmarks 3 things left for me lower leg and feet and hands so should i finish anatomy study and thin do figure drawing\sculpt ? or do it in the sametime sorry i am lost here am afraid if i study the wrong way and waste time 
    btw i am bad at drawing so will this effect on my study for 3d sculpt 

  • Brian "Panda" Choi
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    Brian "Panda" Choi high dynamic range
    Doing a drawing and then doing it in 3D may not be necessary?  Depends on what effort you put into the drawing.

    You could also do the study purely in 3D, you'll just be dealing with different tools.  As I've said before, if it's faster for you in 3D, then do it in 3D.  But regarding figure drawing, it seems to be mostly taught in 2D for a reason: both to get you better at drawing and so you can pump out volumes of practice pieces faster than a 3D sculpture.

    I'm specifically arguing you approach human anatomy via figure drawing so you get a better overalll sense of what makes the human figure work.  The ideas of gesture, proportions, etc. speak to bigger picture ideas than about where the deltoid inserts into the bicep, or how fascia stretches across a chest as a limb contorts or stretches.

    As the next baby step, I suggest gesture drawings/sculpts and/or learning what those are.
  • AliArto
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    AliArto polycounter lvl 2
    Doing a drawing and then doing it in 3D may not be necessary?  Depends on what effort you put into the drawing.

    You could also do the study purely in 3D, you'll just be dealing with different tools.  As I've said before, if it's faster for you in 3D, then do it in 3D.  But regarding figure drawing, it seems to be mostly taught in 2D for a reason: both to get you better at drawing and so you can pump out volumes of practice pieces faster than a 3D sculpture.

    I'm specifically arguing you approach human anatomy via figure drawing so you get a better overalll sense of what makes the human figure work.  The ideas of gesture, proportions, etc. speak to bigger picture ideas than about where the deltoid inserts into the bicep, or how fascia stretches across a chest as a limb contorts or stretches.

    As the next baby step, I suggest gesture drawings/sculpts and/or learning what those are.
    i'll try 3d but 2d it's faster for me am afraid if i did 2d and thin do it in 3d i must learn how the forms work together in 3d space 
    idk i'll try it
    i was now taking  Drawing Fundamentals course i just knew new thing like Negative Shapes and light and shadow measuring 
     btw my freind recomend me "Scott-Eaton  Digital Figure Sculpture Course" is it good course ? he using zbrush for figure sculpting if u know about it pls tell me what do u think about it 
  • Brian "Panda" Choi
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    Brian "Panda" Choi high dynamic range
    Scott Eaton's course is very good.
  • AliArto
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    AliArto polycounter lvl 2

    i am working on this base mesh using the rock refe is it good ? and is looks close to the rock ? 


  • AliArto
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    AliArto polycounter lvl 2

    c&c about the head anatomy i know it's not looks like the rock it's too soon to study likeness 

  • AliArto
  • AliArto
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    AliArto polycounter lvl 2
    am stuck here i did trace model over ref is this right way ?or this cheating ?

  • AliArto
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    AliArto polycounter lvl 2
    i finish it 
    so it's head study not likeness i tried to get close i can to the refe C&C

  • Brian "Panda" Choi
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    Brian "Panda" Choi high dynamic range
    @AliArto You should really post your future work to 3D Art Showcase.  This particular thread will not be good to get direct art feedback.
  • AliArto
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    AliArto polycounter lvl 2
    @AliArto You should really post your future work to 3D Art Showcase.  This particular thread will not be good to get direct art feedback.
    ok thank u @Brian "Panda" Choi i'll do in  future work 

  • bkost
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    bkost interpolator
    Wow, great work @AliArto overcoming your dejection and pushing through. The photo above proves it. I look forward to seeing what you create next! Keep it up!
  • Brian "Panda" Choi
  • wHromek
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    wHromek triangle
    Great work! You've really improved alot!
  • PedroCorreiaArtwork
    In just 2 years that's an amazing improvement!
    Keep going!
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