Wow, already found some kind of bug OR i never noticed it before.
Right after rotating the view with alt+lmb you cant use ANY of the hotkeys, you have to click again on the viewport to be able to use them again.
Edit : Lol, now its working, what the hell happened.
Well with this fixed i can say that its an awesome release from autodesk, its very fluid and MCG is very nice.
I guess you see the menu underlines appear when pressing ALT ?
Thats the standard windows menu shortcut activation becoming active
I think in the case of Max it's a timing issue how fast you press ALT and the mousebuttons. The usual thing i do if this gets stuck is hammering the ALT key several times, usually this cures the issue
Can anyone comment on any improvements to the Layers/Scene explorer?
Trying it in 2015 it just had a lot of weirdness to how I used it.
Not sure what your weirdness is specifically, but for me it has been improved quite a bit. There is added functionality and it doesn't automatically re-order the list when you create a new layer. There is also a batch renaming tool in it that is quite nice.
By chance did they readd the move selected objects to layer button back into the scene explorer window? I can't stand having to use the button on the mini version where the layers are a tiny drop down menu.
Will 16 be the last version available to purchase outright? Or was that 15 and below?
I'm pretty sure I read in some other thread someone from AD saying that the last month you will be able to purchase will be January or February 2016. So I assume you will be able to purchase the 2016 version.
Un-freaking-believable improvements to the cut tool. It's such a nightmare to use now. It connects to the nearest vertex every time you make a cut hence creating this edge mess! The old cut tool was much better in my opinion
Un-freaking-believable improvements to the cut tool. It's such a nightmare to use now. It connects to the nearest vertex every time you make a cut hence creating this edge mess! The old cut tool was much better in my opinion
Well I just discovered that this is some sort of bug with the cut tool. After I saved the scene, closed max and then reopened the saved scene again all that edge mess is gone and the mesh looks exactly the same as in the picture from max 2015! Great job on testing the software, Autodesk
like mine crashes at least 5 times a day and I have a sturdy system as wel, I just find it kind of disgusting that they would put out such a buggy product
Un-freaking-believable improvements to the cut tool. It's such a nightmare to use now. It connects to the nearest vertex every time you make a cut hence creating this edge mess! The old cut tool was much better in my opinion
Could you log this as a bug with repro steps? I tried reproducing, but I wasn't able to get the results you did in 2016. My results look like your 2015.
Great release, they finally added dragging out of hierarchies in scene explorer, yaaay!
Also like the concept of local versus global explorer, nice.
@coven, quick question, will you be creating all new modifiers through MCG from now on as opposed to native compiled ones? asking because MCG modifiers right now are slower than compiled plugins(especially when it comes to deforming objects), and I'm seeing some of the requested modifiers in the uservoice as being marked as solved, which is kinda unfair if you ask me, currently I think MCG is great for prototyping or putting together tools when you don't have enough resources for a full fledged plugin, but you guys do have the resources and I really expect the tools that come out of the box with Max at least be fast enough to be used in production environments...
Another question is, you said MCG is running on something called the MCG Engine and not maxscript, does that mean we can see performances close to compiled plugins in the future?
I have to say my foray is a bit dissapointing from the start, this is from official Known Issues with 3dsmax 2016: "If you quit 3ds Max with the Default Enhanced Menus workspace active, the menus dont appear after you restart. The workaround is to press X and then search for Enhanced Menus."
I'm trying to give it a go, but I can't even make the interface work, what happened guys? Enhanced menus work fine in 2014. Now there are UI files in program files/autodesk/3dsmax/en-US/UI, then in appdata/local ... and then under usersave or in the root folder.
If I choose Save custom UI scheme sometimes it points to one folder, sometimes to another ... and then it reverts to default at each startup, forgetting my changes ... can't make much sense of this. I used to save custom UI as Maxstart.ui and it worked, but now it seems to revert to default after 2 startups.
Could you log this as a bug with repro steps? I tried reproducing, but I wasn't able to get the results you did in 2016. My results look like your 2015.
It looks like some sort of graphical glitch when I use Nitrous Direct3D 11 display in max 2016. Basically every time I left click on the geometry while in cut tool and create a new cut, the new vertex is connected to the nearest two vertices of the polygon and those edges are like ghost edges, they are there but I can't even select them.
This may be the NVIDIA drivers conflict with max's 2016 Nitrous Direct3D 11 viewport or something like that, because max 2015 works just fine with the same settings and driver configuration on my machine. And like I mentioned on Autodesk forum, switching the display driver to Nitrous Direct3D 9 fixed the glitch
what about those of us that can't afford to spend 185 dollars a month? that's about as much as leasing a car! I was hoping to eventually save enough to buy a license, but with a subscription model it leaves people like me who just get by in the dust.
And this is the only way I'm gonna be able to get this come next year? That's rediculous. I've been using Max for years, and this really makes me want to stop. I'd swap to something different, but having to learn new interfaces after this long isn't something I look forward to.
Wait wut? last time i checked the price was nowhere near that for a subscription. As an indie startup trying to push down costs and therefor risk this really screws us over. Either we re-train or take a big hit to our living costs.
Apart from that this looks like a great release. I have just put the latest version of GhostTown through its paces and the potential for node based creation is clear.
If you go for an annual subscription, the price does go down a bit. But it is still too expensive. For large studios it might be affordable. Hard to pay those amounts if you're a small studio or freelancer. Autodesk must remember that a freelancer is paying for other software as well, and that they may also struggle to gain the momentum of a decent, dependable income for the first year or two.
I'm hoping that when their software goes rental-only, they'll bring down the price a bit more. We'll see.
For people who do not yet own a license it's either pay 5,000$ for this last "regular" release and work off that for the next couple of years, or swallow that 185$/month subscription fee. Maybe it's time for Blender after all.
Modo + Houdini is a popular direction for those that want to jump off from Autodesk train. It's also double good directions because you don't need ton of plugins to make each of those programs work.
well for freelance if you already have a license why not stick with your current version for working and factor the subscription to latest&greatest into your project bid for it's duration? then use it only for data exchange with the client but keep your workfiles in whatever your fixed-license version is so you can always access those.
it's not like there's a lot of essential modelling/texturing/game art related functionality that has shown up in years, is it? viewport functionality - honestly i just go straight to marmoset these days, looks better anyway. too many problems with stability and performance in fancy viewports as it is - not just in max. or just lack of decent preview features - transparency, sorting and the like.
but yes, high time to consider switching the essential parts of the work over to blender, i think. interesting stuff going on there. and just use max, maya as the apps to setup your assets in for a client. let the studios you work for pay those subscription fees and keep your data reusable without having to shell out monthly.
For people who do not yet own a license it's either pay 5,000$ for this last "regular" release and work off that for the next couple of years, or swallow that 185$/month subscription fee. Maybe it's time for Blender after all.
Currently you still can buy a maintenance subscription when buying a new Max version ( maintenance is the usual old standard subscription ). And my current knowledge is that people on maintainance subscription still can renew after a year, even after that ominous 2016 deadline. And exactly that leads to a perpetual license for all the coming Max releases (as long as you pay the yearly maintenance sub fee ). Until AD changes that too...
Not sure why the entertainment suite isnt listed when you click the "suites" button at the top... all of the FAQs and info about the entertainment suite read very vaguely without any specifics about what it actually includes.
what is the difference between Max/Maya and Max/Maya Creation Suite? What is included in the Entertainment Suite? Am I missing something somewhere that describes this?
from faq:
Access character and effects capabilities that help you model, texture, animate, and simulate more efficiently.Comprehensive toolsets in Maya® Entertainment Creation Suite Standard help you to:
Choose from a selection of included software for more flexible production pipelines based on project or client requirements.
What is the "selection of included software?"
too many options, very hard to understand, this should be dirt simple the subscription pricing is a bit less expensive which is nice, but the lack of real, informative information as opposed to straight marketting speak makes shopping difficult.
Currently you still can buy a maintenance subscription when buying a new Max version ( maintenance is the usual old standard subscription ). And my current knowledge is that people on maintainance subscription still can renew after a year, even after that ominous 2016 deadline. And exactly that leads to a perpetual license for all the coming Max releases (as long as you pay the yearly maintenance sub fee ). Until AD changes that too...
I would get some clarity on that. Because, there is a period of time after a maintenance subscription stops that you can just renew and get back on. But if that time elapses and you don't renew, then that's it, you have to buy a new seat if you want the latest version. And Autodesk have now stopped upgrades, so you can't just pay abit and get up to date.
Does anyone have problem with orbit in 3ds max 2016?
With standard orbit mode it loses it's virtual center when working with sub-objects.
With orbit sub-object mode it loses virtual center when deselect sub-object, or when orbiting around object.
In 3ds max 2015 and earlier versions I used standard orbit mode anywhere and it was working fine, except that issue with adaptive navigation in 3ds max 2015 sp1.
Really frustrated about that...
Also!
In editable poly every sub-object mode now toggles to object mode with the same shortcut!!!
It really breaking my workflow.
Why did they leave then shortcut for returning to object mode...
Guys, any help with that? )
I would get some clarity on that. Because, there is a period of time after a maintenance subscription stops that you can just renew and get back on. But if that time elapses and you don't renew, then that's it, you have to buy a new seat if you want the latest version. And Autodesk have now stopped upgrades, so you can't just pay abit and get up to date.
I was not talking about the 1 year "grace" period one usually got after the subscription was dropped ( it used to be possible to renew AFTER you let subscription drop, by paying a "late fee" ). I talked about the regular 1 year subscription: if you renew towards the end but STILL WHILE you are on subscription. I can't imagine a reason why this should not be possible...
But you hint that the 1 year "grace" period i mentioned in the first sentence does not exist any longer ? Well - if that's the case, this just proves once more that Autodesk is not a customer-friendly company. But most people already knew about that. Autodesk is only consequent in one thing: building an aweful reputation amongst it's customers...
I was not talking about the 1 year "grace" period one usually got after the subscription was dropped ( it used to be possible to renew AFTER you let subscription drop, by paying a "late fee" ). I talked about the regular 1 year subscription: if you renew towards the end but STILL WHILE you are on subscription. I can't imagine a reason why this should not be possible...
But you hint that the 1 year "grace" period i mentioned in the first sentence does not exist any longer ? Well - if that's the case, this just proves once more that Autodesk is not a customer-friendly company. But most people already knew about that. Autodesk is only consequent in one thing: building an aweful reputation amongst it's customers...
I think you're perhaps getting wires crossed on two separate things. Which is why I suggested getting some clarification.
If you're on maintenance subscription, and come the renewal date, you let it drop. You have a year to get back on, and pay a late fee. To the best of my knowledge, that's still currently allowed.
If you let your maintenance subs drop and a year passes, then you're kinda stuffed. Once that year passes, you can't simply pay the Subs and late fee to get current. That would count as an upgrade and Autodesk has discontinued them. Whatever version of software you were on, that's what you stay on. If you wanted the new version, you'd have to purchase a whole new seat.
I think you're perhaps getting wires crossed on two separate things. Which is why I suggested getting some clarification.
I've got no wires crossed. I've written exactly the same thing as you did now.
The "late fee" thing is already a special case where you already let your subscription end date pass by. But you get a year grace period to renew. To renew in that case you have to pay the late fee + the subscription fee for the year (even if you renew late in that one year grace period).
Good that this seems to be still posssbile according to your post.
But the general impression amongst AD customers seems to be that maintainance subscription ceases to exist totally after feb. 2016 - and thats not true . Autodesk really should make this more clear officially .
I can't wait to get away from 3DS Max. It seems clunky and unpolished to me. I feel like i could go 3 times faster with some logical, simple tweaks and additions. The doubled interface from the Graphite tools is super annoying on a 17" 1920 monitor. The command panels re-order themselves all the time leaving me searching for the FLIP command etc all the time even though i only use about 15% of that entire selection of functions. If we could re-arrange just the buttons we needed that would be such a big help.
I have no experience modelling/UVmapping/baking in other major programs so i don't have much of a relevant perspective, but a new'ish user like me shouldn't be able to design a 10x (edit: to note slight exaggeration...) more efficient interface, hotkey configuration i don't think. To preview the final turbosmoothed result, i have to press 3 key combinations, it should be one "preview end result" hotkey. Then i have to press them again, to re-enable the wireframe, hide turbosmooth and re-enter sub-object mode and sometimes just that process can be very temperamental. Lots of little things, like the CUT TOOL cursor and other specialized mouse cursors not properly signifying when they were actually off, leading me to start cutting again. For me snap wouldn't always toggle off when i hit the key. Cutting with the snap tool wouldn't always snap verts together, they were just extremely close. Saving out configuration profiles was confusing as hell, one for hotkeys another for colors and menus etc and then another "maxstart.max" file for other stuff! How about a dang profile files manager allowing you to drag and drop with a simple interface?
I wish i wrote all the little things that i thought would help that they could change but choose not too down because i found it quite stunning and i hope you vote with your dollars/time what software you think should get your monetary reward.
Tor Frick doesn't seem to have much problem churning out entire levels in Modo, Thats where i think im headed next, or Zbrush if their new polygon modelling is recommended by others to use as a sole 3D modelling tool.
I jumped ship as well. I was a long time 3ds Max user, but since going back to school I picked up the education creative collection from modo which is like $150. This includes Modo Mari and Hiero player. Upgrading to to commercial licences will be $545 for the software. This seems to be the best way to get away from Autodesk while also having a professional piece of software. For those insterested I was told that the Production collective upgrade cost is 1,920, but that includes NukeX, Mari, Modo and Hiero Player.
well from a quick glance the zbrush modelling tools require you to remove all subdivisions on the mesh before you're able to use them. when these were announced i expected to be able to change the topology of a sculpt while preserving it's subdivisions and layers. in the current state and unless i missed something major these modelling tools seem quite pointless especially where precision is required. more of a starting point to base a sculpt on.
i agree about max feeling old and creaky with lots of patchwork tacked on. as a longtime user myself i'm currently happily flirting with blender. the defaults are absolutely from another planet and ruin the first impressions of the program but you can customize it very extensively and much more so than is doable with max or maya (to my knowledge), making it possible to properly bend to your ways of working - even stuff like selection behaviour can be set up any way you like. it's also the only other 3d software with a modifier stack which i find quite the essential feature to have.
for creating models this looks like it'll replace max over the course of this year for me. have not dabbled in rigs/animations nor rendering as of yet but generally have little use for that anyway.
it's also the only other 3d software with a modifier stack which i find quite the essential feature to have.
Huh, I never knew - been ages since I last uninstalled Blender after another frustrating hour or two. Waiting for their next big version with the supposed UI overhaul, then I'll give it a try again!
Replies
I guess you see the menu underlines appear when pressing ALT ?
Thats the standard windows menu shortcut activation becoming active
I think in the case of Max it's a timing issue how fast you press ALT and the mousebuttons. The usual thing i do if this gets stuck is hammering the ALT key several times, usually this cures the issue
no seriously though, looks pretty dope =P
Trying it in 2015 it just had a lot of weirdness to how I used it.
Not sure what your weirdness is specifically, but for me it has been improved quite a bit. There is added functionality and it doesn't automatically re-order the list when you create a new layer. There is also a batch renaming tool in it that is quite nice.
I'm actually interested in this as well. Last pre-cloud chance?
WarrenM: and radial symmetry!
I'm pretty sure I read in some other thread someone from AD saying that the last month you will be able to purchase will be January or February 2016. So I assume you will be able to purchase the 2016 version.
kill it kill it now
Why is 2016 so buggy
Isn't this the case with every new Autodesk release?
Don't worry, they will fix it with a service pack in about 6 months.
:poly116:
yeah, I just hope we get some more killer modifiers
Could you log this as a bug with repro steps? I tried reproducing, but I wasn't able to get the results you did in 2016. My results look like your 2015.
Thanks!
Martin
Also like the concept of local versus global explorer, nice.
@coven, quick question, will you be creating all new modifiers through MCG from now on as opposed to native compiled ones? asking because MCG modifiers right now are slower than compiled plugins(especially when it comes to deforming objects), and I'm seeing some of the requested modifiers in the uservoice as being marked as solved, which is kinda unfair if you ask me, currently I think MCG is great for prototyping or putting together tools when you don't have enough resources for a full fledged plugin, but you guys do have the resources and I really expect the tools that come out of the box with Max at least be fast enough to be used in production environments...
Another question is, you said MCG is running on something called the MCG Engine and not maxscript, does that mean we can see performances close to compiled plugins in the future?
I'm trying to give it a go, but I can't even make the interface work, what happened guys? Enhanced menus work fine in 2014. Now there are UI files in program files/autodesk/3dsmax/en-US/UI, then in appdata/local ... and then under usersave or in the root folder.
If I choose Save custom UI scheme sometimes it points to one folder, sometimes to another ... and then it reverts to default at each startup, forgetting my changes ... can't make much sense of this. I used to save custom UI as Maxstart.ui and it worked, but now it seems to revert to default after 2 startups.
Hi, Martin.
I submitted the report on autodesk forums here http://forums.autodesk.com/t5/3ds-max-3ds-max-design-general/major-3ds-max-2016-cut-tool-bug/td-p/5611608
It looks like some sort of graphical glitch when I use Nitrous Direct3D 11 display in max 2016. Basically every time I left click on the geometry while in cut tool and create a new cut, the new vertex is connected to the nearest two vertices of the polygon and those edges are like ghost edges, they are there but I can't even select them.
This may be the NVIDIA drivers conflict with max's 2016 Nitrous Direct3D 11 viewport or something like that, because max 2015 works just fine with the same settings and driver configuration on my machine. And like I mentioned on Autodesk forum, switching the display driver to Nitrous Direct3D 9 fixed the glitch
And this is the only way I'm gonna be able to get this come next year? That's rediculous. I've been using Max for years, and this really makes me want to stop. I'd swap to something different, but having to learn new interfaces after this long isn't something I look forward to.
Apart from that this looks like a great release. I have just put the latest version of GhostTown through its paces and the potential for node based creation is clear.
I'm hoping that when their software goes rental-only, they'll bring down the price a bit more. We'll see.
it's not like there's a lot of essential modelling/texturing/game art related functionality that has shown up in years, is it? viewport functionality - honestly i just go straight to marmoset these days, looks better anyway. too many problems with stability and performance in fancy viewports as it is - not just in max. or just lack of decent preview features - transparency, sorting and the like.
but yes, high time to consider switching the essential parts of the work over to blender, i think. interesting stuff going on there. and just use max, maya as the apps to setup your assets in for a client. let the studios you work for pay those subscription fees and keep your data reusable without having to shell out monthly.
Currently you still can buy a maintenance subscription when buying a new Max version ( maintenance is the usual old standard subscription ). And my current knowledge is that people on maintainance subscription still can renew after a year, even after that ominous 2016 deadline. And exactly that leads to a perpetual license for all the coming Max releases (as long as you pay the yearly maintenance sub fee ). Until AD changes that too...
Thanks Fwap helped me out bigtime
what is the difference between Max/Maya and Max/Maya Creation Suite? What is included in the Entertainment Suite? Am I missing something somewhere that describes this?
from faq:
What is the "selection of included software?"
too many options, very hard to understand, this should be dirt simple
Yeah, that's pretty ridiculous. They should let indie guys have a shot at the prize too.
I would get some clarity on that. Because, there is a period of time after a maintenance subscription stops that you can just renew and get back on. But if that time elapses and you don't renew, then that's it, you have to buy a new seat if you want the latest version. And Autodesk have now stopped upgrades, so you can't just pay abit and get up to date.
With standard orbit mode it loses it's virtual center when working with sub-objects.
With orbit sub-object mode it loses virtual center when deselect sub-object, or when orbiting around object.
In 3ds max 2015 and earlier versions I used standard orbit mode anywhere and it was working fine, except that issue with adaptive navigation in 3ds max 2015 sp1.
Really frustrated about that...
In editable poly every sub-object mode now toggles to object mode with the same shortcut!!!
It really breaking my workflow.
Why did they leave then shortcut for returning to object mode...
Guys, any help with that? )
But you hint that the 1 year "grace" period i mentioned in the first sentence does not exist any longer ? Well - if that's the case, this just proves once more that Autodesk is not a customer-friendly company. But most people already knew about that. Autodesk is only consequent in one thing: building an aweful reputation amongst it's customers...
I think you're perhaps getting wires crossed on two separate things. Which is why I suggested getting some clarification.
If you're on maintenance subscription, and come the renewal date, you let it drop. You have a year to get back on, and pay a late fee. To the best of my knowledge, that's still currently allowed.
If you let your maintenance subs drop and a year passes, then you're kinda stuffed. Once that year passes, you can't simply pay the Subs and late fee to get current. That would count as an upgrade and Autodesk has discontinued them. Whatever version of software you were on, that's what you stay on. If you wanted the new version, you'd have to purchase a whole new seat.
The "late fee" thing is already a special case where you already let your subscription end date pass by. But you get a year grace period to renew. To renew in that case you have to pay the late fee + the subscription fee for the year (even if you renew late in that one year grace period).
Good that this seems to be still posssbile according to your post.
But the general impression amongst AD customers seems to be that maintainance subscription ceases to exist totally after feb. 2016 - and thats not true . Autodesk really should make this more clear officially .
I have no experience modelling/UVmapping/baking in other major programs so i don't have much of a relevant perspective, but a new'ish user like me shouldn't be able to design a 10x (edit: to note slight exaggeration...) more efficient interface, hotkey configuration i don't think. To preview the final turbosmoothed result, i have to press 3 key combinations, it should be one "preview end result" hotkey. Then i have to press them again, to re-enable the wireframe, hide turbosmooth and re-enter sub-object mode and sometimes just that process can be very temperamental. Lots of little things, like the CUT TOOL cursor and other specialized mouse cursors not properly signifying when they were actually off, leading me to start cutting again. For me snap wouldn't always toggle off when i hit the key. Cutting with the snap tool wouldn't always snap verts together, they were just extremely close. Saving out configuration profiles was confusing as hell, one for hotkeys another for colors and menus etc and then another "maxstart.max" file for other stuff! How about a dang profile files manager allowing you to drag and drop with a simple interface?
I wish i wrote all the little things that i thought would help that they could change but choose not too down because i found it quite stunning and i hope you vote with your dollars/time what software you think should get your monetary reward.
Tor Frick doesn't seem to have much problem churning out entire levels in Modo, Thats where i think im headed next, or Zbrush if their new polygon modelling is recommended by others to use as a sole 3D modelling tool.
i agree about max feeling old and creaky with lots of patchwork tacked on. as a longtime user myself i'm currently happily flirting with blender. the defaults are absolutely from another planet and ruin the first impressions of the program but you can customize it very extensively and much more so than is doable with max or maya (to my knowledge), making it possible to properly bend to your ways of working - even stuff like selection behaviour can be set up any way you like. it's also the only other 3d software with a modifier stack which i find quite the essential feature to have.
for creating models this looks like it'll replace max over the course of this year for me. have not dabbled in rigs/animations nor rendering as of yet but generally have little use for that anyway.
Yeah, or MODO. There is zero reason to lock yourself into Max these days. None.
Huh, I never knew - been ages since I last uninstalled Blender after another frustrating hour or two. Waiting for their next big version with the supposed UI overhaul, then I'll give it a try again!