How to use both tiling and not-tiling textures on large objects

stefan spod

Hello guys!
It is a pleasure to finally be part of community of Polycount.
I have a problem with texturing bigger objects like walls. Attached picture is an example of final effect i want to reach:

-two blended tiled textures,
-one horizontal tiled texture on top/bottom,
-few decals textures in specific areas.
And that all without floating geometry.
My ideas how to achieve this in 3ds max:
1) create composition material,
2) use unwrap uvw modifier with channel 1,
3) use vertex color paint modifier and paint wherever i want one type of blended texture (picture --> brick or cement),
4) use blended material with brick and cement and use vertex color as a mask as a 1st material in composition material.
Here i have two blended tiled textures.
5) use unwrap uvw modier with channel 2,
6) put horizontal tiled texture (picture --> "top texture") as a 2nd material in composition material, change its parameters to 2nd channel, turn off vertical tiling, change its offset and size (tiling) to place it in correct position,
7) use unwrap uvw modifier with channel 3/4/5/6...
8 ) put decals textures as a 3rd/4th/5th/6th... material in composition material, change its parameters to 3/4/5/6... channel and change offset and size (tileing) correctly...

Another idea to put decals textures is to create one huge decals map but then i'm loseing its resolution.
And another is to unwrap object partially and place it in texture-box during unwrapping correctly on each decals texture (also possible for horizontal tiled texture).

So... it's possible but it is very hard, not very precise, needs many multipled channels (one for each decal!). Also i have a problem with visibility of all textures in composition material in 3ds max's viewport so it is even more hard. There must be an easy solution to make it work without that mess. And what about exporting it to Unreal Engine for example? Is it good to export composition material?
So... guys, I need your help with this! What is the best workflow for this case?

RN

Alright, so we're discussing possibilities.
For the decals you can also cut the geometry so you can map separate parts the way you want. What the software does internally is duplicate the vertices on the seams so you can have different UV coordinates for each channel for the "same" geometry vertex.



With this, you only need a composite material for the whole wall with the following layers:
1) Brick texture [UV channel 1]
2) Cement texture [UV channel 2] (With a vertex colour mask.)
3) Decal atlas [UV channel 3]

The compromise of this is that you cannot have overlapping decals, because each decal is separate in the texture canvas.
If you need overlapping decals, you'll have to use an additional UV channel with the same decal atlas so you can composite a decal on top of another.

A note on the "top texture - tiled horizontal." You can still have tiling decal textures from an atlas, you just have to also tile the quadrilateral used to represent it:



On desktop platforms the cost of that extra geometry is negligible.

Eric Chadwick

Some resources here on the wiki:
http://wiki.polycount.com/wiki/MultiTexture
http://wiki.polycount.com/wiki/Texture_atlas
http://wiki.polycount.com/wiki/ChannelPacking

If you're trying to edit this in the viewport in Max, be aware that Max's viewport materials can't show more than one UV channel at once. Sad but true.

However with Max 2015 you could use Shader FX to create a custom DirectX shader which would show as many UV channels as you want in the viewport. Shader FX shaders won't work with a Renderer however; they're only for the viewports.

If you're not concerned with live editing, then you could ignore the viewports and simply Render to see your work.

stefan spod

Thank you very much Kryzon! I thought that there is some *magic trick* that he can handle it ... But just like always, in 3d graphics, every detail needs a bit of love. No shortcuts.
I'll try your method soon.

And thank you Eric for your advices. I've never used ShaderFX and there is finally reason to check 3ds max 2015 (I'm student, free edu license).
I think it is a really big problem that 3ds max doesn't show up multiple channels in viewport. Anyway it is a great software so i won't grumble .

wapc

Hi. Is UV channel 2 for the cement necessary? If the the cement texture tiles just right in terms of scale he could use the 1st channel right?

JedTheKrampus

Sounds right to me.

Eric Chadwick

That's correct, you can use the same uv for both.

If you are using a game shader, you can adjust the scale (tiling) of each texture independently, even though they are in the same shader and using the same uv.

I am doing this in our mobile game in Unity, works great.