Next-Gen Jak (WIP)
polycounter lvl 12
Hi all!
I was recently inspired by the scrapped Jak 4 concepts in Naughty Dog's artbook, and decided to have a go at making a model of him (and possibly Daxter?) in my minuscule spare time.
I'm using this concept as a rough guide, although adapting it slighting as there were some features I wasn't really a fan of such as the face and the hair (this concept isn't mine, photo taken from the Naughty Dog art book):
WIP shots:
Forgive the horrendous draw-over hah.
My original base sculpt which is going to be chopped apart eventually, still want to fix things such as the lack of tailbone on the spine however
I don't have a tonne of experience modelling and sculpting clothes, so this should be a fun challenge! I attended a 1 hour web seminar with the Lead Character Artist at Naughty Dog, Frank Tzeng, last night which was super useful.
I'll keep this thread updated with progress (it'll be extremely slow :<)
I was recently inspired by the scrapped Jak 4 concepts in Naughty Dog's artbook, and decided to have a go at making a model of him (and possibly Daxter?) in my minuscule spare time.
I'm using this concept as a rough guide, although adapting it slighting as there were some features I wasn't really a fan of such as the face and the hair (this concept isn't mine, photo taken from the Naughty Dog art book):
WIP shots:
Forgive the horrendous draw-over hah.
My original base sculpt which is going to be chopped apart eventually, still want to fix things such as the lack of tailbone on the spine however
I don't have a tonne of experience modelling and sculpting clothes, so this should be a fun challenge! I attended a 1 hour web seminar with the Lead Character Artist at Naughty Dog, Frank Tzeng, last night which was super useful.
I'll keep this thread updated with progress (it'll be extremely slow :<)
Replies
Naughty Dog decided to do the Last of Us instead because Jak wasn't working out. In all fairness, I think the Jak games probably would be better sticking to its stylistic routes, but it would have been really interesting to see how a more realistic game would have looked and played.
How the heck did you get that skin polypainted that well?
For the Polypaint, I think I used a speckled Alpha and had the brush style on the splatter mode to give the skin a more dappled look. I made redder areas such as the end of the nose and cheeks, and the areas where his beard/stubble show through I made a more grey/blue. The lips were just from a photo though. I think the skin looks a bit too dirty for what I was going for, but then... I suppose he is a rugged desert man huh
Feedback greatly appreciated!
In regards to the thickness of the lips, just try overdoing it first so it's easier to just use the Move tool to pull things back, instead of inching forward to the ideal. Think phenotypically African in terms of "over-doing" since archtypically, they tend to have nice, full lips.
That was sightly racist. But . . .
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I wasn't using Dynamesh (in hindsight, it probably would be better for the head). I was using subdivisions, and then when I ran out of polys I would use Z-Remesher, and then project my high detail back onto the newly generated low poly version (that way I don't lose my subdivision levels). But really, I could probably do the exact same thing with Dynamesh hah. I avoided it on the body as I kept getting weird artifacts with Dynamesh (it kept bridging between the legs), so I used remesher instead. But for the head, Dynamesh would probably be perfect.
In super super hindsight, perhaps I should work on a base model in Maya with good topology to start, hah.
Good tip on the lips. I also always seem to get them to look... not quite relaxed? Like the character is squeezing them together, or doing some odd expression with them.
Kept his large-ish nose from the original games
Your nose here is also strange look out of all the major hills and valleys on whatever refs you're using, this looks a bit blobby.
Source: https://www.anatomy4sculptors.com/anatomy.php
You're also missing proper eyelids and the folds and overhangs in that area are confused. Perhaps try something like this to fix that up:
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Finally, make up your mind whether or not you're following the concept/style (make your own if you're not, everything is confused as it stands). You're at too high a subdiv for the structure changes you're making. Your result doesn't look like Jax, because you're deviating too far. Despite being cartoon-y anyway, he looks young, has this punk-y teen face (that's why the more realistic concept you posted originally has this kinda skaterdude face).
He looks old and stocky from this latest face, I think it's the wrong direction. If I may, a liquefy paintover:
Stop trying to define your forms with lines, you should be defining form by building up the form!
He looks old and crinkly-- smooth out with a lower subdiv. Realistic =/= middle aged. The head is far too bulbous, take a look at some proportional charts and skulls.
My paintover is just trying to get back the vague essence of an angry youth/ basic proportional issues, so some of it is too idealized/stylish, but I'm of the opinion that if more time was spent (this took like 5 minutes), then you could easily keep the squatness in (since Jak always seemed quite stubby to me, I can see it working), and still get a more youthful aggressiveness.
A lot of the problems are related to where and how you added wrinkles, and the general muddiness and bulbousness of the skull/brow. The muddiness can read as skin sagging/stretching, just FYI, so try to work at much lower subdivs so the smooth tool actually works as intended.
Your earlier version was much better, despite lacking forms. It looked more youthful and the jaw/cheeks sold your vision of Jak a lot better than they do right now.
All in all, I'll just say it: Plan ahead instead of throwing stuff together in zbrush at super high details. It will save you time and energy.
Looking forward to seeing your progress, hope this post isn't too much haha.
I've been having a bit of trouble with the face wrinkles. I either make him look far too old (especially with the lines around the nose/mouth area), or I smooth them out altogether. I need to really focus on getting that balance.
Again thankyou so much for taking the time to give me this feedback! I'm glad I decided to keep this project posted here, everyone is super helpful
Keep on truckin Melazee, can't wait to see updates!
Tried to apply the feedback Bagelhero left. Still think there's more I can do, but I feel like it already feels like a much more solid form than my first pass up top. The hair parts are just stuck on top temporarily, I got a little bored seeing him bald so I quickly whipped him up some hair hah. Also gave me a good idea of where I will be headed (get it? Headed? Hah...ha).
Well that's it for tonight! No updates tomorrow night unfortunately
As usual, feedback greatly appreciated! I still feel like there's more much I can improve on this
EDIT- Did a fun little comparison image between the old and new versions, the feedback here is so helpful, thankyou so much guys:
It looks pretty good from the front, but the 3/4 view reveals that your brow is too far forward in comparison to the cheek. You may want to pull the cheeks forward a bit to match, or pull back the brow or both. The bridge of the nose, compared to the nostril area, is also a bit too concave for something sort of realistic. You might want to straighten that out a bit.
More redline suggestions.
Also just to make sure, is this in perspective?
Thanks again! Your last feedback helped a tonne for sure!
Kind of want to go back and refine his ear more too.
You know, looking at my original posts on this thread, I would have thought the exact same thing =P I really wish I had started using Polycount much sooner to be honest, the feedback and help has been astounding!
I've been reworking the jacket, don't have an image on me right now to show but yikes... I'm going for denim, denim sure is tough! I'll have some images up later to show my progress with it
(Oh yeah, ignore the hair in the back shot, it's really roughly done as a placeholder... still haha)
I'm loosely basing it on Jak's shirt from Jak 2... a mixture between that and the one in the Jak 4 concepts. I just loved the side buckles on the Jak 2 shirt!
http://www.selwy.com/2009/zbrush-clothes-tutorial/
Looks like you have a last of us clothing vibe going on, intentionally or not, here is a ref that you can copy some of the weight and form the jacket has.
And another super quick paintover of the kind of thing I have in mind:
The scarf hasn't been touched yet, I will fix that up.
That stroke/fold in the middle-left needs to blend a little more, right now it is clearly a stroke towards its end(the two little ones towards the bottom too).
But very nice update, keep working it
Otherwise it's looking good
The back of the head caught my attention, not sure if it is just the lack of hair, but perhaps some volume is missing, not exactly sure but wanted to point it out just in case there is some funny business going on. Specifically behind his ears, that bare area.
Otherwise no matter how long it takes I'd like to see the updates fill final
But thanks very much! I will keep plugging away at this. Might be needing a lot of feedback when it comes to texturing and such, not done much with different maps before for a realistic character.
Also pulled the hair around nearer to the ear since it was annoying me hah
Still completely open for any feedback too if anyone has suggestions! I feel that you stare at your own work for so long that sometimes, you miss mistakes/errors that jump out to other people hah.