Should I Go Back To College?
polycounter lvl 10
I went to a very shotty college. They screwed me over and no I am in debt. I have been busting my ass for over a year teaching myself. I feel like I am at a dead end. All I get is either a no or be ignored from companies. I love this field so much. I have put so much into it. I feel I may need to go back to school. I have been thinking about going to futurepoly because its cheap and I hear its a good place. I have watched just about every video from lynda , digital tutors, 3D motive, eat 3D and gnomon that relates to my field. I have been considering enrolling in a workshop from gnomon as well.
Here is my portfolio
www.chrisc3d.com
Here is my portfolio
www.chrisc3d.com
Replies
With that said though there are people are there that need school to push them in the right direction and actually get started, but you should really try just making more things. Even if it comes out bad, its experience and that's what is important. Keep improving and as you do so keep applying for jobs. You are bound to get one sooner or later if you keep doing that!
Overall it really is up to you to decide if you need more education though. Just keep in mind that going to college, especially in this field, does not guarantee you a job at all, you must really put in all the extra work outside of school, and that a strong portfolio is everything.
Your portfolio seems "solid" (meaning it doesn't jump out at me as a warning to stay away), but you've only got one environment and it's not exactly outstanding. Do another, do it better, post your breakdowns. Rinse, repeat.
Right now you have that one small environment that is looking a tad dated, and five low-level props. Sure, quality over quantity, but the quality is just not high enough to justify having this little. None of these props are super interesting, they're something you'll see on any student portfolio and aren't very exciting. A barrel, a rock, an axe... Try making some cool props. Something you'd enjoy making that's perhaps a little more complex, that stands out a little more.
Make a slightly larger environment, maybe, show you can make it modular and use texture space efficiently. Teach yourself some PBR stuff. Try out UE4. Show you can keep learning, and that you're making an effort to learn new tech.
Practice your lighting and composition. The tavern scene feels like a walled garden, and the building itself doesn't really feel like the hero. It looks abandoned, in fact. Wheres the atmosphere? Discarded bottles, a sign with some tacky tavern name, windows hinting at life inside...? It's the little things that will sell the scene...
And the sign says danger? Why is it dangerous? Show me, don't tell me. Is the building going to collapse? If so, some collapsed parts and some overgrowth might help sell that. Or has a witch moved in, or maybe a dragon lives nearby, perhaps there's an ancient indian burial ground under it, I don't know. Because you're not showing me, all I know is that it's somehow "dangerous" because that's what you're telling me. And that ends up coming across as an excuse for a boring setup.
Make an effort to bring the lighting, composition and assets together in your scene to hint at a story. Not necessary to get a chance at a job, perhaps, but it might help to bring your portfolio to a higher level so that people won't just skim over it.
Other than that ultimately generalized crit, keep applying and networking. It can take a while for the best of us to get picked up, sometimes it's just circumstance. So just keep iterating your portfolio and applying until you get given a chance.
Are you applying to local studios? Considering smaller ones, as well? If not, consider doing so. If there are no local studios, consider moving to where there are some. Might be a chance you have to take.
I'm a senior now in my digital art program. I want to say 90% of what I've learned was either through Polycount, tutorials, or internships. All of the info you need exists online. For example, there is the PBR encyclopedia that was recently released fo free!
I see your post about doing a new environment in UE4, but I'd take a quick step back.
Listen to what Higuy said (although I disagree about the concept part). Pick an interesting REAL LIFE object (not a axe or hammer or anything common) that you have an insane amount of reference for. Looking at your work style, maybe search for colonial wood working or metal working (not the name for it) objects so that people see it and are like "wow, this is different). Make sure the object has a few different materials that are interesting and common. I say real life because for PBR materials it will be easier to do something from real life to match your textures with 1:1 instead of guessing off of a concept.
Then, you seriously have to just put in a ton of time to make that object look awesome. Make sure the high to low poly bake looks good. Figure out a tri count that is more modern so that your work doesn't look dated the moment you post it online (if realism is what you're going for). Then, work on the textures and really make sure the material definition is spot on. This is where the photo ref comes in. If it doesn't look almost exactly like the photo-ref, you know it's wrong. There's no way to bullshit that. Oh also, if you can self-critique your work (which everyone should be able to), you'll know if the object looks right or not. Like you see the photo, look at your object. Does it match? No? Needs to be changed. All a teacher is going to do at that point is tell you what you already know.
After you finish that prop, you're going to be much more comfortable with approaching a larger scene, as you'll have an idea of what materials can work where. Maybe you can setup some master materials in Substance Designer that can be tweaked and applied to texture maps (masked with Color IDs) to make texturing quicker.
I write this all out because I finished a camera a few weeks ago and now my environment is going much more smoothly as a result.
Oh and with the money you would have spent on school you could maybe purchase the Quixel Suite and/or Substance Suite cause they are awsum.
Anyways, good luck :thumbup:
Edit: Are you concepting your own work by the way? If so, stop. I tried concepting work for awhile and I got decently far but I would have learned a lot quicker if I had just worked off of concepts. You're going to be working off of other peoples concepts/images in the work-place anyways.
Why don't you make a lot of little environments instead of a really big one? You would learn and practice way more in my opinon.
Your work is pretty cool, and I feel your love for the industry, don't give up man !
Digital tutors and eat 3D would make for a good start.
The celery land online school seems really good too for a reasonable price if you want class structure.
Some of the jobs I've been looking at require degrees, but if you work hard now, get your foot in the door, and go back to school debt free and with what you learned, you'll ace school in no time!
When you find something you enjoy AND where you get good results, then this is a strength. As specialization is important, especially for entry level jobs, rather work on strengths than an weaknesses. This is easier, and also more rewarding. Then search for online training that can help you to grow in these strong areas.
I also agree with what PyrZern said. Work on something small of limited scope. Why? Because taking a small asset to perfection can be a lot of work. Trying to do this with a whole environment could be just too much. And the chance of getting hired with 1 or 2 highly polished props is MUCH higher than getting hired with a mediocre environment.
Also, with Gen4 being here, studios expect a LOT of detail these days even in the smallest props. Recently we had a client where we even ZBrushed cardboard box props!
It seems like you have all of the nuts and bolts how to learning done and out of the way, what you need now is practice and you don't have to pay someone else to do that.
What I'm about to bring up might be demoralizing but honestly its all stuff you should already be aware of. I hope you walk away from this determined to dig deeper and push yourself harder than you ever have, that's how we grow. If not then it's probably a good time to think about doing something else.
When you are your own harshest critic it will keep nit-picky assholes like me from ripping into your stuff. =P
Going over your portfolio I see a few things that would probably send up a red flag or two at a lot of places. At first glance the environment looks pretty good, it has fairly decent composition and the lighting is pretty good. But when I look a little closer I start to get a little skeptical.
An artists needs to be their own harshest critic and for good reason. If you have to rely on someone else to tell you what is wrong with your scene, you are wasting production time creating something that has to be fixed. That doesn't generate a lot of trust if they have to scrutinize everything you do and then tell you to fix it. The best employees get the overall goal and vision and nail it.
Here is what I see and what I hope you see...
The sign
1) The writing on the sign is a modern military font, but the scene is medieval?
2) The story behind the sign doesn't really make a whole lot of sense, someone made a fairly elaborate sign just to stencil the word danger on it? Suposidely someone at some point cared enough to build the place and probably was proud of it. People don't start a "dirty run down tavern", they end up becoming that way after years of neglect or apathy. It's your job to tell that side of the story, that sign isn't doing it.
The outhouse
1) It's placement is... not the greatest. It's a loosely framed structure over an open pit of human waste. Marinate on that for a second or two, think back to the last time you where in a port-a-potty and know that they clean those out regularly and use a lot of chemicals to help control the smell. It looks like it's been there a while so why is it right next to the front door
2) What is going on with the shading above the door? Those two areas are not blending well.
3) You put a path from the front door to the outhouse, but people are going to walk all over that area. People take the shortest possible path to their destination and that isn't always the same for everyone. This gives you a plausible way to treat the ground in front of the tavern, it allows you to save on grass cards and helps you fill in the back story.
The barrel
1) It seems like a good place for a sign? If that is what that is meant to be, I don't think that is communicating it all that well. Barrels where the cardboard boxes of their day, lots of stuff went in them and just seeing a barrel above a door doesn't tell you much about what is inside, the barrel or the place. Pickles? Nails? Rags? Fish heads? Beer? Put a tap or a spigot on the barrel and we're getting closer but not close enough.
2) It took a lot of work to make barrels, especially ones that where going to hold liquids. Barrel makers took pride in their work and made a lot of money. What would a barrel maker say about the barrel hanging above this place? The point being the sign can be a major piece of the scenes history and you seem to have cheesed out.
3) The condition of the barrel doesn't really match the condition of the building. You have a great piece of brick detail being covered perfectly by the barrels shadow. This is not a happy coincidence... These are two details that shouldn't be perfectly overlapping. An art director might ask you to move the brick detail into another spot, is your texture set up in a way that allows for that to happen?
Now you could say that these tragic mistakes where what lead up to its current condition but honestly I think those would be excuses that came after the fact, not part of a carefully crafted back story. Sort of like how some aspiring character artists only tackle aliens because it conveniently explains away their lack of proper anatomy. Don't be that guy who comes up with that stuff after the fact to explain away flaws. It never works, everyone sees the giant festering wound under the band-aid. No one likes working with people who spend their time making excuses instead of making art.
The tree(s)
1) There appears to be a fallen tree that landed on the building? A tree that massive would have done a lot of damage, maybe even flattened it.
2) The end of the tree is weathered more like a 2 billion year old rock than a tree.
3) I kind of see a hint of a root structure and I think you're getting it wrong. When they go, the root systems pry up a lot of top soil. Even after a lot of weathering quite a bit of the root structure will be intact, just worn down a little, that nub is all kinds of wrong.
If you're going to include something like that you need to research it.
Textures
1) Unwrapping. I see a lot of wasted space on your texture sheets. all of the sheets seem to be about the same size but some cover huge props while others cover little ones. This typically means your textel density is way off.
2) Mixed methods. I see obviously photo sourced textures next to hand drawn grass and flowers. This makes your piece look disjointed and lacking a clear cohesive goal/vision/workflow/plan, when it comes to materials. Its a HUGE part of the job.
3) That grass/flower texture is huge.
You could have gotten a lot of unique millage out of that sheet or used 10% of it to do what you did. The grass itself lacks believably, it lacks layers, there aren't old generations of grass. Its as if someone planted some very specific seeds and meticulously grew them and then groomed them. Grass isn't like that, its a crazy clustermuck of nature, doing what nature does. Research it, dig into it and then recreate it.
4) In general the texture sheets are very loosely packed without a lot of padding which means when the textures mip you'll get a lot of dead space bleeding into your textures, producing seams. Even if the game never mips a single map, the powers that be might come down and say "we need to down res our textures one step". The people who author their materials with that in mind do less rework and have a better chance of sticking around after the project is over.
5) There is a lot of lighting info in your diffuse/albedo, that might have been standard on the xbox and maybe even present on some early 360 titles but going forward that's not going to cut it. They are building the future right now, they need artists who can make it over that bar. They aren't looking to hire someone who can sort of make it over the old bar.
Don't live in the past
Don't judge yourself based on what your peers in school where doing, those aren't your peers. The people you want to work with are out in the industry, they're making the games that will drop jaws in 1-2-3 years from now.
Think about what they are making right now, its not the games you played 4-5-6 years ago.
They aren't going to hire you based on what you could potentially become. They will hire you based on what you can do, right now. They'll love it if you could outperform their expectations but they aren't going to hire someone hoping that they will raise up. That's a gamble that most places won't take, especially when there are other out there that are already at that level. Prove you are at their level that you can walk in off the street and nail whatever it is they are making.
I also agree about limiting the scope of your projects. Don't spread yourself too thin, focus on what you're working on and nail it. Don't half ass a bunch of things trying to fill out a large space. Not only will it look disjointed and half-assed but it will inhibit your learning and block you from drilling into the details of each object.
You have to focus a little harder than what the average player will see. They might not ever look at your grass texture but they will get a sense that something is off if you don't nail the details. They might not be able to tell you what is wrong but they'll know something is off.
I hope this helps, like I said this is all stuff that you should know and be able to see in your own work. If you do see it and don't fix it that sends a bad message.
I think you probably see this stuff and might be making excuses, so do yourself a favor and knock it off. Your stronger than you think, you can be a harsh critic of your own work. Don't just knock it down, but pick it back up and get it working again. That skill is incredibly important and one that isn't on display currently in your portfolio.
Check this out for why that is bad.
I agree that you should hold off on doing a full out environment and focus more on making a few small kick ass props. If the props you make have a thematic similarity you can use those to build out a scene after the fact. Win win.
TL;DR Make more art. Make more complex/interesting art. Post your stuff here for critiques, suggestions, etc. Apply critiques/suggestions. Rinse and repeat.
I went to the Academy of Art in San Francisco. I got a job weeks before graduating and also had an internship.
Now, as much as I want to say this was because of my skills, it was really about connections. My teachers had great connections and were able to get me in touch with recruiters at bigger companies. I worked at Sledgehammer Games on Advanced Warfare for 6 months and am working on Tomb Raider at Crystal Dynamics now. I'm not the most skilled artist. In fact my stuff is pretty average. But those connections make all the difference in the world.
A lot of people will tell you school isn't worth it. School is worth as much as you are willing to put into it. For me, school was successful because it gave me the connections and work ethic I needed to get a job. I worked very, very hard and my instructors and department head went out of their way to recommend me.
Many people will say school isn't valuable. I think they're wrong. Maybe it wasn't valuable to them, but I think most people don't take advantage of all the programs and help schools will provide.
The time frame and the health of the industry is also critical when school is involved. In my time, any person that can create 3d models and was able to UV map them and texture, was considered a professional. Today the saturation and the expections has increased so fast in soo few years. School for entertainment(art, music, acting,ect) in todays time and future time is useless.
One thing with education is the rapid change it is also facing with the emergence of MOOCS and soon accredited colleges without the financial bargain such as 'University of the People'. Worth taking a read and listening to some TED talks regarding future education. Sure there is no art programs, but that is pass the point.
My message is, if you are in a creative field especially 3D art, you are better off self teaching yourself and networking in the internet. Take advantage of what is available.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fzYC-0giKc4
Also, I'm glad to see that I could have helped you with my tutorials.