Artwork looks good, not crazy about the voice over as far as trailers go.
I tend to stay away from MOBAs even though gameplay wise I like them, it's the general communities that scare me away. Never thought I'd see the day where counter-strike's community is relaxing compared to others.
Spot on with the marketing message, I thought that was a little peculiar with the 20 minutes thing. The whole trailer has the feeling of being passed on to a marketing agency that has never played a MOBA game before and decided to make a tutorial on what they learned.
I can get that for a tutorial video in the game, but not so much for gaining some public hype. Bonus points though for showing actual game footage vs the current trend of showing gamers playing the game and saying how cool it is rather than showing how cool the game is itself. (Slightly off topic, but I really dislike that whole marketing trend)
Now the old Battlefield 2142 intro trailer... that was a tutorial trailer done right!
I'm a little confused with the voice. Made it seem like this is marketed for children? It's the voice I'd expect to hear on a children's programme on the BBC...
Seems like not so subtle digs at leagues & Dota for the 20min mark.
Looks really bland mechanic wise, almost like coddling?
Dont worry! you dont need to go back. you dont need to do anything really. just run at them, yeah or don't if you dont want too whatever works. This agony is over in 20mins
I think the 20 minute matches is a great idea. MOBAs are constantly criticized for being slow paced and this is partly due to gold farming phases. There's really very little skill involved with farming gold, it's just a boring task that changes slightly depending on your hero and position.
I'd also be welcoming of some more casual MOBAs. Dota/LoL are well made games, but playing them feels like a chore for people like me who rarely touch the genre and that is due to the fact that every other match you get thrown in with toxic players with thousands of hours clocked into the game. I'd play this if it was the type of game that I could have fun on once every week or so, not everything has to be designed around professional competition.
I wish the art style was more unique though. It seems like every other MOBA released has the same exact hand painted art style, the terrain even looks the same as other games in the genre.
I think the 20 minute matches is a great idea. MOBAs are constantly criticized for being slow paced and this is partly due to gold farming phases. There's really very little skill involved with farming gold, it's just a boring task that changes slightly depending on your hero and position.
I'd also be welcoming of some more casual MOBAs. Dota/LoL are well made games, but playing them feels like a chore for people like me who rarely touch the genre and that is due to the fact that every other match you get thrown in with toxic players with thousands of hours clocked into the game. I'd play this if it was the type of game that I could have fun on once every week or so, not everything has to be designed around professional competition.
I wish the art style was more unique though. It seems like every other MOBA released has the same exact hand painted art style, the terrain even looks the same as other games in the genre.
thing is that blizzards heroes of the storm does the exact same thing.
they all just copy LoL without knowing why its succesfull.
Yeah that's what I felt like while watching the trailer. I really wonder who thought it was a good idea to release that video. :poly122:
On topic I doubt this game will be helping Cryteks financials. However it seems like they are out of trouble for a while if that statement is to be believed.
There really isn't. It doesn't take skill to take out an AI enemy that is designed to be weaker than you, the only skill involved with the task is learning how to get the last hit but even then, one can learn how to do that after a couple of matches.
I suppose you could argue that skillful play during the gold phase comes from the moments where other players will try to poke you, but those encounters occur throughout an entire match and are not limited to any individual phase of play.
Of course, I don't enjoy MOBAs in general because of the fact that they all seem to be designed with the idea of punishing the player for making a mistake. If you die in the beginning of a match in Dota 2 for example, you give a huge advantage to the opposing team that could very well haunt you up until the end of the 40+ minute match, and that's bullshit.
Compare that to a game like Counter-Strike where, you could mess up and it'll only haunt you for a handful of rounds after that at the most and therefore allow you to come back even if the odds are against you.
You should go carry the next international and win 10 million usd, while you still know how to farm
Attempt at a joke, not trying to be rude
Of course, if you simplify it by saying that farming is just last hitting a small AI creep, then I can say counter strike takes no skill because you just leftclick the mouse when an enemy is at the center of your screen. See the flaw?
It's the game, the mechanics, the theory, the psychology AROUND those mechanics that are difficult. Like everything in life, the more you get to know about a subject, the more you realize you don't know
I don't mean to derail this thread, I am going way off topic.
Oh man, I can just imagine a bunch of Crytek execs sitting in a meeting room, and deciding to make more money, they should just copy whatever else makes a lot of money.
I've played Dota2 for over 1000 hours and I still suck at last hitting. Yes the concept of last hitting is simple, but being good at it is different. There are additional layers to being a good farmer. Controlling your lane, so you're on high ground or close to your tower. A lot of farming heroes have very low base damage, making last hitting hard, and even harder if you're laning against someone with higher base damage early game. Zoning and denying the opposite player. Knowing not to get too greedy depending on who's laning against you because they might punish you for getting to close hitting those creeps. Efficiency moving around the map, clearing jungle, pushing out lanes, clearing Ancient stacks, while having good map awareness do you don't just end up getting ganked every time you make it to a location. Some heroes like Naga Siren or Phantom Lancer require an additional level of micro because you can farm with illusions. Again efficiency spreading out illusions to farm neutral camps without blocking the camp spawns, and keeping an eye on your main hero last hitting the lane creeps.
Anyway, this Crytek game, idk seems okay for the casual gamer. It's not for me though. Seems like they are saying, "Hey MOBAs suck so good thing if you even bother to play this game it'll only last 20 minutes." Congrats? I enjoy the sense of victory in Dota2 because we defeated the enemy team, not because time ran out.
couldn't finish the trailer. that voice. ugh.
and it really does look exactly like league. i don't mean the gameplay - the effects the UI the art direction...it just looks like a watered down league...
i don't anticipate it doing well...MOBA players are awfully invested in their games (whichever it might be) and it takes something pretty special to make them switch...this doesn't look like it intends to provide that.
so that means they're going for a fresh audience without ties to an existing moba that are interested in the genre. i'm not sure this audience really exists (at least not in any population large enough to bank on)
add to that that god-awful trailer...
when you think crytek couldn't crap the bed any worse they go and do it some more. how much longer until they completely screw themselves and cost a ton of people their jobs?
I actually think the voice in the trailer is refreshingly different.
But then I'm from Europe. I often don't get it when people complain about voice acting. Apparently a lot of people expect game sounds to stay within well accepted cliches :-( I also smell a dose of cultural arrogance when it comes to dialects (and female voice actors.)
I find the whole Red Riding Hood against Fenrir thing kinda random - if you use mythology or folk tales in your game, at least do it right - but everyone else fails at this too, so ...
About the 20 minute thing: I know a lot of older people (over 30...) who don't play a lot of games because it requires too much time to get invested in them (and to get any good at them.) So this makes complete sense - the problem seems more that the game is apparently aimed at 12 year olds, who have LOTS of spare time. So there's a contradiction there.
As for whether this game has any chance to make a lot of money, I don't know. It's always hard to predict.
The only reason those particular characters are in the game is because they are all in public domain and don't need to be paid for, but still come with some recognition factor for most people. It feels very slimy to me.
All of the "this game only takes 20 mins" marketing reeks of focus testing people on "What is your major issue with current MOBA's" and building an entire game out of what people DON'T like about Moba's. Without understanding why the designs are the way they are.
I hope this does well, at least for the artists who work at Crytek, but the marketing/design team at Crytek needs a bop on the head.
Of course, if you simplify it by saying that farming is just last hitting a small AI creep, then I can say counter strike takes no skill because you just leftclick the mouse when an enemy is at the center of your screen. See the flaw?
It's the game, the mechanics, the theory, the psychology AROUND those mechanics that are difficult. Like everything in life, the more you get to know about a subject, the more you realize you don't know
I don't mean to derail this thread, I am going way off topic.
Your comparison isn't exactly equal though. Dota 2, like many other competitively designed games, obviously has a lot of psychology to it, but that psychology isn't limited to gold farming. Theoretically speaking, if you take out gold farming phases, then what are you left with? You'll probably be doing the same thing - taking map control in order to ultimately kill an enemy player.
I understand there are a lot of complex gameplay mechanics set in place in MOBAs like Dota 2, LoL, etc. but gold farming is literally just killing AI creeps for gold. Other players will no doubt try to prevent you from accomplishing that goal, but again, think about what it would be like if players didn't have to kill AI creeps for gold, it would be the same exact thing - other players trying to prevent you from taking control of the lane.
I'm not saying Dota 2 is a bad game or that it takes no skill, I'm simply trying to explain why I don't enjoy playing it (my main point still stands, due to the heavy RPG mechanics, "epic comebacks" don't really happen in the same way that they happen in a game like CS.)
Anyway, I've already stated why I dislike MOBAs in general so I'm not going to derail anymore. I'd like to see Crytek (or anybody, really) take a completely different spin on the genre but everybody seems to want to copy each other even down to the tiniest art details.
I actually think the voice in the trailer is refreshingly different.
But then I'm from Europe. I often don't get it when people complain about voice acting. Apparently a lot of people expect game sounds to stay within well accepted cliches :-( I also smell a dose of cultural arrogance when it comes to dialects (and female voice actors.)
well i think its going the way like it is here in germany, where dialects are never used for translation because they always sound funny, no matter how serious you try to act.
its pretty easy to break immersion with an unfitting or unexpected dialect, so IMO its better to not take chances with this.
reminds me of this british series "Made in Chelsea" where all the actors have this horribly funny accent, but its supposed to be a drama. i realy coudn't watch that shit without laughing.
Man, just noticed something. A company we were loving so much, now is just a source for jokes.... After using CryEngine and playing Crytek games all these years...I don't know what to say.
Crytek should be a textbook study for every aspiring entrepreneur out there.
i think we should take a moment to recognise that the video we've seen is the result of bad decisions by management and upper management. in terms of artwork, i can't see anything there that isn't solid.
do i wish they'd stayed away from the LoL/Dota type stylised look... absolutely, but that doesn't mean it isn't executed well. the characters look good!
the animations look good too, if a little clunky here and there (but we don't know at what stage of progress the video was shot).
overall, everything is very clean and consistent, which is a great achievement for everyone working on it. it's just a shame they went consistently in the wrong direction, a direction they probably had no control over.
How would you guys create this trailer? How would you make it seems ok, or even great?
Problem 1 is releasing a MOBA in an over saturated market.
But if you want to make this trailer better: Focus on what actually makes it different, show, don't tell. Rather than 'a'vin' cockney Jane blather about everything that you can SEE IS HAPPENING you should: Show parts of an actual match, proper gameplay footage, different hero abilities in different situations, what sets this MOBA apart from Dota 2, HOTS, LoL, HoN, Smite, MNC etc
Your market is other MOBA players, so show them what may interest them. If you can't do that, then why the hell are you making a MOBA in the first place?
i think we should take a moment to recognise that the video we've seen is the result of bad decisions by management and upper management. in terms of artwork, i can't see anything there that isn't solid.
do i wish they'd stayed away from the LoL/Dota type stylised look... absolutely, but that doesn't mean it isn't executed well. the characters look good!
the animations look good too, if a little clunky here and there (but we don't know at what stage of progress the video was shot).
overall, everything is very clean and consistent, which is a great achievement for everyone working on it. it's just a shame they went consistently in the wrong direction, a direction they probably had no control over.
Of course, I have no problems with the " technical" aspect of the game. It looks solid as it should. In fact for a MOBA even better than most.
Problem 1 is releasing a MOBA in an over saturated market.
But if you want to make this trailer better: Focus on what actually makes it different, show, don't tell. Rather than 'a'vin' cockney Jane blather about everything that you can SEE IS HAPPENING you should: Show parts of an actual match, proper gameplay footage, different hero abilities in different situations, what sets this MOBA apart from Dota 2, HOTS, LoL, HoN, Smite, MNC etc
Your market is other MOBA players, so show them what may interest them. If you can't do that, then why the hell are you making a MOBA in the first place?
Problem 1 is releasing a MOBA in an over saturated market.
But if you want to make this trailer better: Focus on what actually makes it different, show, don't tell. Rather than 'a'vin' cockney Jane blather about everything that you can SEE IS HAPPENING you should: Show parts of an actual match, proper gameplay footage, different hero abilities in different situations, what sets this MOBA apart from Dota 2, HOTS, LoL, HoN, Smite, MNC etc
Your market is other MOBA players, so show them what may interest them. If you can't do that, then why the hell are you making a MOBA in the first place?
to be fair they do all that except the hero abilities.
their USP seems to be that 20 minute timelimit and that you can win by points, and the trailer is stating all the ways you can win the game.
also they mention that there are no downtimes where you have to go back to the base, though its all communicated in a way that doesn't highlight the information and is rather focused on "atmosphere"
the other USP is the characters wich they spend a lot of time introducing.
they seem to know that their abilities and stuff are lame and there are no items anyways, so they focus on what sets them apart, because the actual coregameplay is designed to be like LoL, cause thats the most popular moba.
so the message seems to be
"this is exactly like league of legends, only simpler and shorter"
and the trailer communicates that. sort of.
still think the game is not going to be be any good though.
Replies
I tend to stay away from MOBAs even though gameplay wise I like them, it's the general communities that scare me away. Never thought I'd see the day where counter-strike's community is relaxing compared to others.
It's over in 20 minutes, max!
You can end it early by doing X!
It probably won't last the FULL 20 minutes!
I like the graphical style.
EDIT: Props to the environment team though, looking sharp.
That was horrible... The future is grim for the guys at Crytek is this is part of their future strategy.
I can get that for a tutorial video in the game, but not so much for gaining some public hype. Bonus points though for showing actual game footage vs the current trend of showing gamers playing the game and saying how cool it is rather than showing how cool the game is itself. (Slightly off topic, but I really dislike that whole marketing trend)
Now the old Battlefield 2142 intro trailer... that was a tutorial trailer done right!
What the... wow. :poly122:
That trailer isn't doing them any favors.
Hate Robin hood's design. That guy should be stealthy, not bulky.
Seems like not so subtle digs at leagues & Dota for the 20min mark.
Looks really bland mechanic wise, almost like coddling?
Dont worry! you dont need to go back. you dont need to do anything really. just run at them, yeah or don't if you dont want too whatever works. This agony is over in 20mins
I'd also be welcoming of some more casual MOBAs. Dota/LoL are well made games, but playing them feels like a chore for people like me who rarely touch the genre and that is due to the fact that every other match you get thrown in with toxic players with thousands of hours clocked into the game. I'd play this if it was the type of game that I could have fun on once every week or so, not everything has to be designed around professional competition.
I wish the art style was more unique though. It seems like every other MOBA released has the same exact hand painted art style, the terrain even looks the same as other games in the genre.
So thats what happens when people don't get paid
thing is that blizzards heroes of the storm does the exact same thing.
they all just copy LoL without knowing why its succesfull.
its just like WoW all over again.
On topic I doubt this game will be helping Cryteks financials. However it seems like they are out of trouble for a while if that statement is to be believed.
what is this i dont even
Aaaaahhhh.....
I suppose you could argue that skillful play during the gold phase comes from the moments where other players will try to poke you, but those encounters occur throughout an entire match and are not limited to any individual phase of play.
Of course, I don't enjoy MOBAs in general because of the fact that they all seem to be designed with the idea of punishing the player for making a mistake. If you die in the beginning of a match in Dota 2 for example, you give a huge advantage to the opposing team that could very well haunt you up until the end of the 40+ minute match, and that's bullshit.
Compare that to a game like Counter-Strike where, you could mess up and it'll only haunt you for a handful of rounds after that at the most and therefore allow you to come back even if the odds are against you.
Attempt at a joke, not trying to be rude
Of course, if you simplify it by saying that farming is just last hitting a small AI creep, then I can say counter strike takes no skill because you just leftclick the mouse when an enemy is at the center of your screen. See the flaw?
It's the game, the mechanics, the theory, the psychology AROUND those mechanics that are difficult. Like everything in life, the more you get to know about a subject, the more you realize you don't know
I don't mean to derail this thread, I am going way off topic.
Anyway, this Crytek game, idk seems okay for the casual gamer. It's not for me though. Seems like they are saying, "Hey MOBAs suck so good thing if you even bother to play this game it'll only last 20 minutes." Congrats? I enjoy the sense of victory in Dota2 because we defeated the enemy team, not because time ran out.
and it really does look exactly like league. i don't mean the gameplay - the effects the UI the art direction...it just looks like a watered down league...
i don't anticipate it doing well...MOBA players are awfully invested in their games (whichever it might be) and it takes something pretty special to make them switch...this doesn't look like it intends to provide that.
so that means they're going for a fresh audience without ties to an existing moba that are interested in the genre. i'm not sure this audience really exists (at least not in any population large enough to bank on)
add to that that god-awful trailer...
when you think crytek couldn't crap the bed any worse they go and do it some more. how much longer until they completely screw themselves and cost a ton of people their jobs?
But then I'm from Europe. I often don't get it when people complain about voice acting. Apparently a lot of people expect game sounds to stay within well accepted cliches :-( I also smell a dose of cultural arrogance when it comes to dialects (and female voice actors.)
I find the whole Red Riding Hood against Fenrir thing kinda random - if you use mythology or folk tales in your game, at least do it right - but everyone else fails at this too, so ...
About the 20 minute thing: I know a lot of older people (over 30...) who don't play a lot of games because it requires too much time to get invested in them (and to get any good at them.) So this makes complete sense - the problem seems more that the game is apparently aimed at 12 year olds, who have LOTS of spare time. So there's a contradiction there.
As for whether this game has any chance to make a lot of money, I don't know. It's always hard to predict.
All of the "this game only takes 20 mins" marketing reeks of focus testing people on "What is your major issue with current MOBA's" and building an entire game out of what people DON'T like about Moba's. Without understanding why the designs are the way they are.
I hope this does well, at least for the artists who work at Crytek, but the marketing/design team at Crytek needs a bop on the head.
As an Englishman, that's pretty much all i could think of when i heard the voice acting.
I understand there are a lot of complex gameplay mechanics set in place in MOBAs like Dota 2, LoL, etc. but gold farming is literally just killing AI creeps for gold. Other players will no doubt try to prevent you from accomplishing that goal, but again, think about what it would be like if players didn't have to kill AI creeps for gold, it would be the same exact thing - other players trying to prevent you from taking control of the lane.
I'm not saying Dota 2 is a bad game or that it takes no skill, I'm simply trying to explain why I don't enjoy playing it (my main point still stands, due to the heavy RPG mechanics, "epic comebacks" don't really happen in the same way that they happen in a game like CS.)
Anyway, I've already stated why I dislike MOBAs in general so I'm not going to derail anymore. I'd like to see Crytek (or anybody, really) take a completely different spin on the genre but everybody seems to want to copy each other even down to the tiniest art details.
As an Englishman, I found it so awful it was kind of offensive
I was just happy to learn that those fable voice actors weren't completely out of work...
You jst gave me the laugh mate
I just have that CHICKEN CHASER(!) soundbite forever buried in my subconscious, that and the voices of the children, good god... They haunt me still.
well i think its going the way like it is here in germany, where dialects are never used for translation because they always sound funny, no matter how serious you try to act.
its pretty easy to break immersion with an unfitting or unexpected dialect, so IMO its better to not take chances with this.
reminds me of this british series "Made in Chelsea" where all the actors have this horribly funny accent, but its supposed to be a drama. i realy coudn't watch that shit without laughing.
enough derailing for today now.
Wow. Yeah, as some have said, seems like some shitty kid's game made by Nickelodeon.
It's comical that the trailer is an 80% downvote.
I couldn't even finish watching it.
Ohh shi....
Man, just noticed something. A company we were loving so much, now is just a source for jokes.... After using CryEngine and playing Crytek games all these years...I don't know what to say.
Crytek should be a textbook study for every aspiring entrepreneur out there.
i think we should take a moment to recognise that the video we've seen is the result of bad decisions by management and upper management. in terms of artwork, i can't see anything there that isn't solid.
do i wish they'd stayed away from the LoL/Dota type stylised look... absolutely, but that doesn't mean it isn't executed well. the characters look good!
the animations look good too, if a little clunky here and there (but we don't know at what stage of progress the video was shot).
overall, everything is very clean and consistent, which is a great achievement for everyone working on it. it's just a shame they went consistently in the wrong direction, a direction they probably had no control over.
Problem 1 is releasing a MOBA in an over saturated market.
But if you want to make this trailer better: Focus on what actually makes it different, show, don't tell. Rather than 'a'vin' cockney Jane blather about everything that you can SEE IS HAPPENING you should: Show parts of an actual match, proper gameplay footage, different hero abilities in different situations, what sets this MOBA apart from Dota 2, HOTS, LoL, HoN, Smite, MNC etc
Your market is other MOBA players, so show them what may interest them. If you can't do that, then why the hell are you making a MOBA in the first place?
Of course, I have no problems with the " technical" aspect of the game. It looks solid as it should. In fact for a MOBA even better than most.
+ 1 to that.
to be fair they do all that except the hero abilities.
their USP seems to be that 20 minute timelimit and that you can win by points, and the trailer is stating all the ways you can win the game.
also they mention that there are no downtimes where you have to go back to the base, though its all communicated in a way that doesn't highlight the information and is rather focused on "atmosphere"
the other USP is the characters wich they spend a lot of time introducing.
they seem to know that their abilities and stuff are lame and there are no items anyways, so they focus on what sets them apart, because the actual coregameplay is designed to be like LoL, cause thats the most popular moba.
so the message seems to be
"this is exactly like league of legends, only simpler and shorter"
and the trailer communicates that. sort of.
still think the game is not going to be be any good though.
Maybe because expectancy of quality is pretty low because that is a MOBA ? I am not sure though.