Questions about 3Ds Max -> Zbrush workflow

DanRileyCG

Hello fellow artists,

I'm having some problems with the 3Ds Max o Zbrush work flow and would greatly appreciate the help.

1. What's the best way to bring a low poly object into Zbrush that you are going to further subD in Zbrush?

I haven't found much success using the crease function in Zbrush, as it would crease things I didn't want, or not crease enough, and I would get oddities in the mesh when it sub divided, not to mention if it wasn't creased enough I would lose a ton of shape.

My attempted fix:

I tried creasing any and all edges in 3ds Max with the crease function, setting creased edges to 1.0 (from 0.0), and then applying a turbosmooth to the mesh to preview what it would look like with more subdivisions. I tried applying 4 or so iterations of turbosmooth to my low poly objects, with the specified edges creased and it looked flawless in 3Ds Max. When I use the GOZ function, to work on it in Zbrush it looked perfect. Now I used the "reconstruct subD" feature a few times to bring it back down to it's lowest poly count. I kept the 3 or 4 levels of higher subDs so that I could start sculpting at the lowest level, and work my way up one level at a time (I understand it's valuable to work with as few polygons as you need at a time, only moving up subDs when you really need to-- this was my plan anyway.

The HUGE problem? Even though I used GOZ and I reconstructed subD to lowest subD and kept the higher subdivisions (because they weren't deformed) I'm not able to edit the mesh, at all. Not a single tool edits the mesh at all... not the move brush, standard brush, nothing. Also, the brush size for the brushes cursor doesn't show up on the mesh, even when I hover on it. If I change the brush size it is only indicated by the numeric change at the top.

Does ANYONE know why this is happening? I have NO idea how to fix his problem. I thought for sure this method of creasing and subdividing in Max, THEN bringing the mesh into ZBrush and reconstructing the SubD would work really well. There must be something I'm missing.

Thanks for the help guys!
Dan

cryrid

It's possible your mesh is so large that even the highest brush size wont show up. What does it look like in the Tool Preview window, and have you turned dynamic brush size off?

DanRileyCG

I haven't turned off dynamic brush size, and I don't think it's a size problem. I don't have access to my computer atm, so I can't take any screenshots.

Does anything sound wrong with the following workflow:

A) using turbosmooth + creasing in Max to get geo to look the way you want when it's supdivdied
import that mesh into zbrush with GoZ only to reconstruct subD to get back down to lowest subD level
C) start sculpting in Zbrush at the lowest level, leaving the higher levels that you reconstructed sub divisions from for when you actually need to move up in geometry?
D) The reason I don't delete the higher sup division levels is because if I subD at the lowest level in zbrush then a lot of the form will be lost--- this would make the above steps useless. Maybe I'm just bad at creasing in Zbrush, but i've found a lot more control in creasing in Max before hand.

Moutrave

Hey,

i personally setup the creasing of my edges in Max as well, but with support edges and loops at the right places. I just use turbosmooth to check for any "collapse" but then I remove it and export the low poly as is in zbrush and that works fine.
BUT I had issues with the GoZ function from Max : when I use it, I cannot apply a surface noise or do other geo modification. Since I had no idea how to fix that, I now export my max geo as an Obj and import it in Zbrush. you could try to do that and see if you still cannot edit.

Also, how does your object look like in Zbrush when you on the polyframe ? At its lower subdivision I mean. Did you try to make it a polymesh 3D in the tools menu ?

DanRileyCG

@Moutrave,

Hmm, I didn't think of trying to just add some support edges/ loops in the right places, that might be a good fix to the method. I'll have to try. It looked normal in poly frame, nothing stood out. I did try making the polymesh 3d, and it still wouldn't let me edit the mesh. Thanks for your input man!

I'm kind of at a loss because I desperately want to rush home and experiment more, because I have to figure this stuff out. But my computer died a few days ago. I already ordered a new one, but am waiting for the parts. I'll probably have the new computer fully assembled in two weeks (what with shipping time and what not). It's killing me.

I figured I'd try to be productive anyway (even without a computer) and try to investigate the problem I was having just before my computer crapped out. I really want to hit the ground running as soon as I get my new computer so any incite here on workflow and the problem I was having is highly appreciated.

That said, thanks for the input guys, and i look forward to even more.

Would anyone else like to share their workflow for low poly-modeling 3dsmax -> Zbrush? The only part that I'm really not sure how best to handle is subdividing a low poly object in Zbrush in a manner that doesn't deform the geometry. Added extra edges to hold shapes may be the answer, what do you guys do?

Moutrave

If you have Zbrush 5R6 you can also control you creasing in a better way by adjusting a slider instead of using crease all.

Also if you want to share your model so someone could take a look and try to solve that issue of yours don't hesitate, I'd be glad to try for one.

Good luck !

DanRileyCG

@Moutrave,

I didn't know about the creasing slider. As soon as I get my new computer all set up I'll experiment with a bunch of stuff. Fantastic idea regarding uploading my model for others to check out. I didn't even think of that. I'll be sure to do that if I can't figure out the problem.

phixel

A method for controlling creasing in zbrush that I used recently which I found to be quite practical was by importing my lowpoly from max and making polygroups of different surfaces. By isolating each polygroup and creasing them individually, I could better control the crispness of my edges by adding or removing the crease before subdividing.

It might require a little more setup time initially to make your polygroups and may depend on the type of object you are working with, but for the project i was working on, this method worked well for me.

Ghogiel

Yeah setting up some poly groups is a good way. In max just set up some smoothing groups, then unwrap UV> exploded flatten by smoothing groups. That should make all smoothing groups a separate UV shell.

Then in ZB under polygroups >poly groups by UV, then use crease PB. That will give you some shape when subDing. Some decent control in there, you can go up a couple subDs and turn off crease so that when you want to get to higher sub D levels it'll sub normally.

DanRileyCG

@phixel: I don't think I've been using polygroups correctly. I recently learned how to create separate poly groups to crease edges, but didn't know how to make use of it in Zbrush. I'll have to try this method again! Thanks for the input!

@ghogiel: thanks for the tips man! I don't know much about UVing in 3Ds Max, so this will help. Also, thanks for that info regarding Zbrush!

I'm really excited and eager to try this stuff! Can't wait until my new computer is all set!

phixel

That's a good idea Ghogiel, using 3ds max's smoothing groups would make the polygrouping process in Zbrush quite simple.

@DanRileyCG: Like I mentioned in my earlier post, by using isolated polygroups in Zbrush, you can be more selective with your creasing. Creasing an edge on a low subdivision, then subdividing a level or 2 and then deleting the crease will help you control how crisp you want your edges, seeing as you can delete the creasing from your polygrous at different subdivsion levels.

Moutrave

Ghogiel wrote: »

Yeah setting up some poly groups is a good way. In max just set up some smoothing groups, then unwrap UV> exploded flatten by smoothing groups. That should make all smoothing groups a separate UV shell.

Then in ZB under polygroups >poly groups by UV, then use crease PB. That will give you some shape when subDing. Some decent control in there, you can go up a couple subDs and turn off crease so that when you want to get to higher sub D levels it'll sub normally.

Smart ! I'll give that a try as well :d

bp72

Had a similar problem and clicking Dynamic next to Draw Size was the solution.