Thought I'd give an update showing the deadends I keep meeting, I just end up doing something like the picture below. Looks like a 5 year old's attempt..
In the meantime I'll keep trying, but if someone can point out where I'm going wrong and how I should approach it, I'd be really grateful
Thanks StevenZer, I'm pretty happy with the wood texture, because I'm still a noob and its a pretty big improvement from my older textures, its just the metal I'm really struggling with.
I've never actually properly used AO, but I think its something I'll definitely look at. The meshes will end up in UDK and I'll get around to making AO maps (though it'll be a new process for me).
But first I want to get the texture nailed down first, and the metal is getting frustrating.
EDIT: That video of the time-lapsed axe paint is awesome, but I can't get my brush to blend as well as his, and I don't see his brush options open during the video
Oh nice, that'll be helpful and from the looks of it, it creates a new image file which I can import into UDK? (I thought I'd have to do it in Photoshop) Thanks a lot man, that'll save me some time down the road ^^
EDIT: I'm going to buy Tyson Murphy's tutorial and take a break on the mine cart for the next few days whilst I work on the tutorial. Hopefully I can come back to it knowing a few more extra bits.
i would suggest to map this model in a way that you can reuse space of texture and straighten the uvs(this is really important if you would want to resize textures later). For example like i did. Flat render from blender viewport,
Nice metal paint Riceart!
I agree with you the uv layout should be straightened up. I think he just did an automatic mapping and arranged them he didn't work much with UV mapping He is still learning.
Really good point riceart, I'm going to start condensing down my UVs, that metal texture is exactly what I want! (Really good job) What options do you use on your brush whilst painting it?
Also on a note, I'm going to spend another couple of days on the mine cart, and if I get no further I'll start the Tyson Murphy tutorial.
StevenZer, yeah I didn't put too much thought input into my UV layout, but I did think that the trims would need different UV space (Because the bottom layer is thicker and the inside layer is shorter) but riceart proved me wrong. Also thanks for that paint over, I need to add that highlight gives the plank a better edge Thanks
You can see that in the metal texture those stripes are totally seperate from each other so it will be hard to add edges detail and highlights for them. You should connect the uvs of metal stripes together. Just like riceart did her metal stripes are together.
Yeah, I'm just fiddling with the geometry and UVs, going to try and get them all on the same UV space, I'll post a picture of my UV layout when I'm done
here you can see how this might look like in a bit more advanced game engine like marmoset toolbag @choppz in blender and gimp i use same default hard round brush, nothing fancy
Looks really good, do you use opacity on your brush? Even when I use hard brushes, it never blends well, and when I lower layer opacity it just ends up blurring the surface. Like whats your workflow? Could you show me a really quick breakdown? That'd be really awesome, I really admire both the paint overs you've down for me
Oh really nice, in fact I noticed that the guy painting the axe in the video always uses his color picker when hes painting, while I tend to just stick to one colour and change opacity through layer properties.
Nice StevenZer, yeah I have some experience with UVs but nothing really past basic. I took your advice for optimising the amount of seams in my texture and I managed to get this. I flipped the lower trim UVs upside down and sew the edges to that, so I can cover the seam and still add individual detail to the top side of the bottom trim (its different size/shape to the other seam) Now I've got loads of UV space left:
Looks good. I think you should straighten the uvs more. Just turn on the snap to grid option in Maya and then go to uv mode in uv editor and start snapping the points to straight the uvs.
The uv's look better but I'm having trouble figuring out what is what now. What are the pinkish pieces over the darker blue shells-or am I trippin? The painting is coming along better also. I need to jump into some more practice myself later today maybe.
Well I only rearranged the UVs for the metal trim, and they are all aligned and straight (I'll reorganise UV space later, and I'll leave the wood for now, because thats basically finished, but when I get to doing the smaller vertical trim and the wheels I'll optimise UV space for those too
Thanks spectre Yeah I shaded UVs basically the pink/purple are a mix of inverted UVs (flipped some UVs for the 4 wheels) But I'll get around to properly organising them once I finish the metal trim
Here's a quick little trick that will immediately sell the base metal you have as more metallic:
Make the planes darker or lighter based on their angle. Surfaces that make a right angle with the direction of the light should get the brightest highlights. So in this case, all top-facing surfaces would be the brightest. As the surfaces turn away from the light, they get progressively darker. So, any down-facing planes would be the darkest.
Here's what that theory looks like applied to your mine cart:
I did no painting on this at all. I literally just made a selection out of the top edges of your trims, and bumped the levels up by about 50%. Then I made a selection out of the bottom edges of your trims, and bumped the levels down by about 20%. Really easy to do, but it makes a lot of difference.
@DemonPrincess
Really nice, thanks again for the input Acted on that now in the screenshot below. I really need to start including processes like that in my workflow. I thought lighting wouldn't be much of an important factor at this stage of the texture, but that proved me wrong. Thanks once again ^^
EDIT: I started tweaking the level settings again and found a better outcome, had to soften up the edge of the mask with the eraser to get rid of a hard edge which resulted (re-uploaded picture)
@StevenZer
Its really late here but I'll give it a go now and see what I can produce I'll post a screenshot later of the outcome (though I would need to do another AO for when the texture is completed).
ohwell yea if you will add changes around in uv maps but AO baking only take 2 or 3 minutes for me and it takes one extra minute for overlaying it ontop of texture.
Yeah followed that AO tutorial, but it gives weird results. My friend is telling me its because when UVs overlap, it gives weird results. I'll link a picture below of what happens
EDIT: Thanks Danielj_B I hope I am slowly improving
Update: Did a bit more work on the base layer of the metal trim, tried adding some subtle brown/light blue into the texture. Looking for feedback and suggestions, I'm thinking about starting on the scratches and other decal soon
Thanks for the feedback Low I decided I didn't want to clutter it with detail (that old marking looked pretty bad so I removed it) I tried adding a bit more colour to the metal, mostly making it overall darker, and trying to add some more blue into it with a low opacity brush. Also the vertical trim isn't going to stay that colour, eventually I'll use some masks to make it a brighter colour to add some variation.
Thanks for the feedback Low I decided I didn't want to clutter it with detail (that old marking looked pretty bad so I removed it) I tried adding a bit more colour to the metal, mostly making it overall darker, and trying to add some more blue into it with a low opacity brush. Also the vertical trim isn't going to stay that colour, eventually I'll use some masks to make it a brighter colour to add some variation.
Still looking for feedback and suggestions
EDIT: Forgot screenshot ^^
Yea man, that is the problem when overlapping shells like that. It saves uv space but when you have apparent damage like that it will produce obvious tiling/repetition on all the pieces. Try just overlapping by 2's and not all 4 pieces, and you'll get less repetition like that.
Also, when you bake ao/normal maps you can't have overlapping uvs at all really or you'll get the result you showed earlier. You have to offset the overlapping shells by exactly 1 unit in any direction outside your uv space-bake-reset shells by exactly 1 unit back into the exact spot they started from.
I'm not sure of the process in Maya, but if you're not sure what I'm saying just holler and I'm sure someone else that uses that app. can show the way.
Hey Spectre, thanks for the feedback (and sorry for the late reply, I've been at work) Yeah your totally right about repetitiveness. The plan is that once the current metal texture is complete, the vertical trim will have its own UV space so I can mask it and make it a different colour ( also I can then add/remove extra detail.
But yeah like you say, if you look actually inside the cart at the interior trim, you can see the corner cut, it looks really out of place (and also the fact it doesn't carry onto the top of trim either) so I'll make some UV space for that, seeing as I've got a load spare at the moment
Hey CHOPPZ... this one is for you so far your work is looking fantastic with all the help of everyone else on this thread. I was a little late coming into the battle, but here is a quick little demo to to punch out your metal just a little more
So been playing around with the stuff I learned from that video (that neutral grey overlay technique is awesome!) and this is what I got.
New:
Pretty exhausted from work, I could probably have done a better job but I think its looking better. Would love to have some feedback and suggestions on what I could do better
EDIT: Maybe the dodging is too bright in some areas? Or maybe I'm just not that confident, so I want to make my details less noticeable xD
Hey guys, been at college today and I can't use my tablet here (or any tablet because we cannot install drivers..) So just did a quick tweak in photoshop and added the vertical trim texture with a Levels mask. Just want to get some feedback and suggestions on anything I could change.
Also a really big thanks to everyone whose helped me so far, learned more in the last week from Polycounters, than I have from the course I've been on (seriously)
Update: worked on metal corner seams, and vertical trim. Also tweaked the wood with some more random slightly darker areas, as well as some slightly darker areas where the wood meets metal. Hopefully tomorrow I'll start on the wheels, but if someone thinks something looks wrong with the mesh, tell me how to improve it ^^
Been working on the wheels, but hugely struggling with seams (making them blend well, or adding edge highlights on UVs not connected) My current plan is to just do what I can and continue. Though if people have solutions or can point out faults with my UV layout, I would hugely appreciate it.
Did a quick import into UDK before I head off, doesn't look that impressive right now. Still needs a spec map and possibly a normal map.. and a light map
You should try out Ndo2 and DDo for this it's amazing for this kind of job! It can make Spec, Normal and Ao map just out of your textures. check it out. http://quixel.se/
Thanks StevenZer, yeah I'm going to make some maps when the mesh is finished, and also look into creating a good shader network inside UDK.
I decided to get the entire model painted quickly, I was having big issues with all the seams on the wheels, and with overlapping UVs, which restricted the lighting detail I could add at certain bits (having highlight edges on opposite sides of the wheel looked strange.. So unfortunately I couldn't add that sort of detail onto the wheels. The plan is to take it into mudbox and paint over the seams to make them blend better, but because of the overlapping UVs it is hard to do highlights etc. Just going to get the seams covered in mudbox then color correct it in PS afterwards and hope I can get away with it.
So yeah its been a while, and I thought I'd continue on with this thread with some of the work I've done over the last month, although I've been bogged down with the Christmas rush at my job, written work etc etc I managed to complete Tyson Murphy's tutorial and work on a new wood texture.
Had some progress but still quite a way to go, would appreciate any comments or criticisms, although at the moment I've got a lot of written work that needs doing, but hopefully I can show some frequent texture updates.
I've just about finished the wood texture for the beams just needs a little more tweaking, and next I've got to do another similar texture for the main overhead beam and some messy iron texture for some metal fittings on the beams.
If anyone has comments, criticisms, feedback or can show me an awesome technique they've picked up, I would greatly appreciate it.
Oh also realised I didn't post a finished shot of the minecart earlier:
It ended up being a little rushed but I learned loads from mistakes I made and the input from the community and I still plan to include it into my final project
Replies
In the meantime I'll keep trying, but if someone can point out where I'm going wrong and how I should approach it, I'd be really grateful
Screenshot:
PSD:
I've never actually properly used AO, but I think its something I'll definitely look at. The meshes will end up in UDK and I'll get around to making AO maps (though it'll be a new process for me).
But first I want to get the texture nailed down first, and the metal is getting frustrating.
EDIT: That video of the time-lapsed axe paint is awesome, but I can't get my brush to blend as well as his, and I don't see his brush options open during the video
This will help you abit with baking AO maps
EDIT: I'm going to buy Tyson Murphy's tutorial and take a break on the mine cart for the next few days whilst I work on the tutorial. Hopefully I can come back to it knowing a few more extra bits.
I agree with you the uv layout should be straightened up. I think he just did an automatic mapping and arranged them he didn't work much with UV mapping He is still learning.
Also on a note, I'm going to spend another couple of days on the mine cart, and if I get no further I'll start the Tyson Murphy tutorial.
StevenZer, yeah I didn't put too much thought input into my UV layout, but I did think that the trims would need different UV space (Because the bottom layer is thicker and the inside layer is shorter) but riceart proved me wrong. Also thanks for that paint over, I need to add that highlight gives the plank a better edge
@choppz in blender and gimp i use same default hard round brush, nothing fancy
http://enliighten.com/blog/opacity-jitter-overlapping-brushstrokes/
Really good link, thanks riceart for the help
Old:
New:
I hope this will help. :poly121::poly124:
Managed to get the base metal with a highlight on the edge done, still needs a lot of work but I think I can progress with this.
Open to suggestions and always looking for wise-men's knowledge
Make the planes darker or lighter based on their angle. Surfaces that make a right angle with the direction of the light should get the brightest highlights. So in this case, all top-facing surfaces would be the brightest. As the surfaces turn away from the light, they get progressively darker. So, any down-facing planes would be the darkest.
Here's what that theory looks like applied to your mine cart:
I did no painting on this at all. I literally just made a selection out of the top edges of your trims, and bumped the levels up by about 50%. Then I made a selection out of the bottom edges of your trims, and bumped the levels down by about 20%. Really easy to do, but it makes a lot of difference.
Really nice, thanks again for the input
EDIT: I started tweaking the level settings again and found a better outcome, had to soften up the edge of the mask with the eraser to get rid of a hard edge which resulted (re-uploaded picture)
@StevenZer
Its really late here but I'll give it a go now and see what I can produce
EDIT: Thanks Danielj_B I hope I am slowly improving
Should I try and avoid those weird holes and aim for more subtle details?
Still looking for feedback and suggestions
EDIT: Forgot screenshot ^^
Yea man, that is the problem when overlapping shells like that. It saves uv space but when you have apparent damage like that it will produce obvious tiling/repetition on all the pieces. Try just overlapping by 2's and not all 4 pieces, and you'll get less repetition like that.
Also, when you bake ao/normal maps you can't have overlapping uvs at all really or you'll get the result you showed earlier. You have to offset the overlapping shells by exactly 1 unit in any direction outside your uv space-bake-reset shells by exactly 1 unit back into the exact spot they started from.
I'm not sure of the process in Maya, but if you're not sure what I'm saying just holler and I'm sure someone else that uses that app. can show the way.
But yeah like you say, if you look actually inside the cart at the interior trim, you can see the corner cut, it looks really out of place (and also the fact it doesn't carry onto the top of trim either) so I'll make some UV space for that, seeing as I've got a load spare at the moment
http://youtu.be/IQodOJ3-dCQ
I will embed a vimeo video in just a little bit
--Jamin
EDIT: I almost fell off my chair when I saw an email in my inbox that had a video of my minecart from Jamin Shoulet
New:
Pretty exhausted from work, I could probably have done a better job but I think its looking better. Would love to have some feedback and suggestions on what I could do better
EDIT: Maybe the dodging is too bright in some areas? Or maybe I'm just not that confident, so I want to make my details less noticeable xD
Also a really big thanks to everyone whose helped me so far, learned more in the last week from Polycounters, than I have from the course I've been on (seriously)
Thanks for your support
(Left is old, right is new)
When I get home, I'll continue the wheel and hopefully show something later.
Always looking for suggestions and feedback
Been working on the wheels, but hugely struggling with seams (making them blend well, or adding edge highlights on UVs not connected) My current plan is to just do what I can and continue. Though if people have solutions or can point out faults with my UV layout, I would hugely appreciate it.
UV layout:
http://quixel.se/
I decided to get the entire model painted quickly, I was having big issues with all the seams on the wheels, and with overlapping UVs, which restricted the lighting detail I could add at certain bits (having highlight edges on opposite sides of the wheel looked strange.. So unfortunately I couldn't add that sort of detail onto the wheels. The plan is to take it into mudbox and paint over the seams to make them blend better, but because of the overlapping UVs it is hard to do highlights etc. Just going to get the seams covered in mudbox then color correct it in PS afterwards and hope I can get away with it.
So yeah its been a while, and I thought I'd continue on with this thread with some of the work I've done over the last month, although I've been bogged down with the Christmas rush at my job, written work etc etc I managed to complete Tyson Murphy's tutorial and work on a new wood texture.
Had some progress but still quite a way to go, would appreciate any comments or criticisms, although at the moment I've got a lot of written work that needs doing, but hopefully I can show some frequent texture updates.
I've just about finished the wood texture for the beams just needs a little more tweaking, and next I've got to do another similar texture for the main overhead beam and some messy iron texture for some metal fittings on the beams.
If anyone has comments, criticisms, feedback or can show me an awesome technique they've picked up, I would greatly appreciate it.
Oh also realised I didn't post a finished shot of the minecart earlier:
It ended up being a little rushed but I learned loads from mistakes I made and the input from the community and I still plan to include it into my final project