HAHAHAHA Oh man... I fucking spat out my tea.. you win!!! I remember when the whole spiel was up there in plain sight on the website - and I remember being taken back about it, and it honestly crossed my mind.
Do I want to support this ?
In the end, I didnt care. 3dcoat is a good tool, I use it for what I need to use it for. Regardless of the creators beliefs.
Dude, Justin. You've been more and more antagonistic in threads lately. Whats up man?
Hey, just pointing out his hypocrisy. I'm sure he isn't actually afraid of admitting he's religious and he's got a bunch of laws protecting his rights.
I don't believe in God but I would never push to have it outlawed. If Mormanism was outlawed in the US I would stand up and shout just as loud about how fucked up that is.
and sheesh, you haven't been paying attention, I've held this position on polycount for the last 10 or so years! The last time I was in a discussion like this the thread was locked and a few people rage quit polycount (I was called YSG back then)
The reason a thread like this turns into a gay rights debate is because nobody is going to stand up for the racists, misogynist, anti-semites and the rest. Nobody stood up for Paula Deen even once in this discussion.
Flip it around. Maybe your views are at odds with their views. They still create content for you. Why not? Suck it up, cupcake. This is the world we live in. We all gotta learn to get along.
Flip it around. Maybe your views are at odds with their views. They still create content for you. Why not? Suck it up, cupcake. This is the world we live in. We all gotta learn to get along.
To paraphrase Todd Glass, maybe me standing up for the rights of a LGBT kid was enough to prevent a suicide. At the most, I'm not adding to the body count by by being apathetic or complicit.
But lets move on to other forms of discrimination, and why they are valid opinions that should be respected.
A gross, and unfair oversimplification of the point I was trying to make. (the ends don't justify the means)
Seriously, did something happen to you recently? Kind of touchy.
Nope I've held the same position since before the forums were reset in '04 and I went by YSG. I guess discrimination makes me angry, guilty as charged.
As far as my personal life, it's been pretty amazing, every day has felt like a vacation. You guys are seriously harshing my mellow.
If anything, having this discussion is good, especially if there's an official person involved with rather backwards views.
And we're not talking the "oh he thinks japanese games are shit" kind of views, we're talking views that affects other people, the kind of views that no matter how you put them they'll end up being poisonous for the company.
In the end companies will make sure that people they hire or work with are the kind of people that are accepting towards all people.
Support a product produced by (or in part) by someone you think is a shithead? Why would you? Its an absolute no for me, I'm not going to knowingly fork my cash over to someone that I strongly disagree with on things that are important to me (I say knowingly because I'm sure I've supported many persons/companies that share contrary views, but that's my own ignorance/lack of research).
To everyone saying "but what about the teammmm?" Oh please, like we have some intrinsic obligation to support every project out there simply because someone has a job somewhere. Every economic action or non action we do in life has some potential impact on someone's job. Should I feel bad that I buy Coke instead of Pepsi? But what about the people who work for Pepsi, surely it isn't their fault that Pepsi takes like crap.
Besides, if it makes you feel bad the solution is really simple, buy some other game that is made by a developer that does not offend your sensibilities. Problem solved.
If anything, having this discussion is good, especially if there's an official person involved with rather backwards views.
And we're not talking the "oh he thinks japanese games are shit" kind of views, we're talking views that affects other people, the kind of views that no matter how you put them they'll end up being poisonous for the company.
In the end companies will make sure that people they hire or work with are the kind of people that are accepting towards all people.
Question, at which point is someone actually backwards vs. just bad PR or lack of skills when it comes to communication. The entire "Japanese games are shit" was exactly the type of thing someone who never gave a speech would say, since they don't connote how people would react to public wording like that vs. what close friends would do (EI: make jokes and get the gist of it).
The always on fiasco was another example. Private jokes between two people being put on public display...but then again, apologizing solves alot of issues, especially if one of your comments include making fun of another persons state.
On the other hand, I personally don't have an issue with NOT buying a game if a developer comes out and fires off in quick succession several contrived, ignorant, abusive and flame-baiting comments, while at the same time, not being part of the function they herald to be (EI: I want change, but I don't want to invest the energy into that change, OR, PC games and Mobiles are all doom and gloom, MS made the wrong choices, we're all going to die!).
I mean in a single year alone, we have well over 3,000 games coming out under first licenses...and this was 4 years ago, imagine now, how many games we have in a single year, don't even get me started on the much improved social and flash games we have, I mean I sometimes literally end up playing flash games which last 8 hours, have a story, and are akin to games like Last of Us in a much simpler format.
The thing is, we're saturated in the medium we currently have, so I do have the option of choice, hence why, especially for the overflowing barrel that is the game industry, there is literally zero reason (for me) to tolerate under a 3 strike-metaphor the fits a developer decides to throw, with his latest product a ship for his voice and blog to say absolutely crazy, insane, things.
Then again, I sometimes will end feeling bad for all the artist and programmers that worked on the game, only to have some drama become the only attention on the product, must be slap on the face for them, to have put so much work, and people don't even have the time to 'not like the game', but instead not buy the game because they lead Dev decided to blame everything on everyone instead of admitting they bought cherished Dev team and made them create, with another studio, a shoddy game.
Privilege to feel offended? Maybe, but the gist is simple, either learn how to talk and be as progressive as the game industry on the PC is trying to be with Kickstarters, or I'm not buying your game, I'm pretty sure I can find a Flash version of your game on Newgrounds for free.
It really comes down to sentiment vs reason. If we let sentiment rule our actions, no matter what side you are on, it starts to tread dangerous territory as its not necessary tied to purchasing power.
I was a big fan of George R. Martin for example, and I have read the game of thrones many times so far. Then I happened across his blog and saw how he talks to others with views different to his own, his sheer hostility and even irrational behavior regarding stances I was obviously on the opposite side of. While I cannot be a fan now of him as a person, I do still like his stories. I will still buy the books and watch the tv show, but I do so with reason. That reason being I want to encourage and reward more of that kind of product and story I personally enjoy.
I am able to separate the sentiment and based my actions more on reason. I encourage others to do the same.
Replies
HAHAHAHA Oh man... I fucking spat out my tea.. you win!!! I remember when the whole spiel was up there in plain sight on the website - and I remember being taken back about it, and it honestly crossed my mind.
Do I want to support this ?
In the end, I didnt care. 3dcoat is a good tool, I use it for what I need to use it for. Regardless of the creators beliefs.
Must be tough, hiding who you are to avoid persecution.
Hey, just pointing out his hypocrisy. I'm sure he isn't actually afraid of admitting he's religious and he's got a bunch of laws protecting his rights.
I don't believe in God but I would never push to have it outlawed. If Mormanism was outlawed in the US I would stand up and shout just as loud about how fucked up that is.
and sheesh, you haven't been paying attention, I've held this position on polycount for the last 10 or so years! The last time I was in a discussion like this the thread was locked and a few people rage quit polycount (I was called YSG back then)
The reason a thread like this turns into a gay rights debate is because nobody is going to stand up for the racists, misogynist, anti-semites and the rest. Nobody stood up for Paula Deen even once in this discussion.
To paraphrase Todd Glass, maybe me standing up for the rights of a LGBT kid was enough to prevent a suicide. At the most, I'm not adding to the body count by by being apathetic or complicit.
But lets move on to other forms of discrimination, and why they are valid opinions that should be respected.
A gross, and unfair oversimplification of the point I was trying to make. (the ends don't justify the means)
Seriously, did something happen to you recently? Kind of touchy.
Nope I've held the same position since before the forums were reset in '04 and I went by YSG. I guess discrimination makes me angry, guilty as charged.
As far as my personal life, it's been pretty amazing, every day has felt like a vacation. You guys are seriously harshing my mellow.
And we're not talking the "oh he thinks japanese games are shit" kind of views, we're talking views that affects other people, the kind of views that no matter how you put them they'll end up being poisonous for the company.
In the end companies will make sure that people they hire or work with are the kind of people that are accepting towards all people.
To everyone saying "but what about the teammmm?" Oh please, like we have some intrinsic obligation to support every project out there simply because someone has a job somewhere. Every economic action or non action we do in life has some potential impact on someone's job. Should I feel bad that I buy Coke instead of Pepsi? But what about the people who work for Pepsi, surely it isn't their fault that Pepsi takes like crap.
Besides, if it makes you feel bad the solution is really simple, buy some other game that is made by a developer that does not offend your sensibilities. Problem solved.
The always on fiasco was another example. Private jokes between two people being put on public display...but then again, apologizing solves alot of issues, especially if one of your comments include making fun of another persons state.
On the other hand, I personally don't have an issue with NOT buying a game if a developer comes out and fires off in quick succession several contrived, ignorant, abusive and flame-baiting comments, while at the same time, not being part of the function they herald to be (EI: I want change, but I don't want to invest the energy into that change, OR, PC games and Mobiles are all doom and gloom, MS made the wrong choices, we're all going to die!).
I mean in a single year alone, we have well over 3,000 games coming out under first licenses...and this was 4 years ago, imagine now, how many games we have in a single year, don't even get me started on the much improved social and flash games we have, I mean I sometimes literally end up playing flash games which last 8 hours, have a story, and are akin to games like Last of Us in a much simpler format.
The thing is, we're saturated in the medium we currently have, so I do have the option of choice, hence why, especially for the overflowing barrel that is the game industry, there is literally zero reason (for me) to tolerate under a 3 strike-metaphor the fits a developer decides to throw, with his latest product a ship for his voice and blog to say absolutely crazy, insane, things.
Then again, I sometimes will end feeling bad for all the artist and programmers that worked on the game, only to have some drama become the only attention on the product, must be slap on the face for them, to have put so much work, and people don't even have the time to 'not like the game', but instead not buy the game because they lead Dev decided to blame everything on everyone instead of admitting they bought cherished Dev team and made them create, with another studio, a shoddy game.
Privilege to feel offended? Maybe, but the gist is simple, either learn how to talk and be as progressive as the game industry on the PC is trying to be with Kickstarters, or I'm not buying your game, I'm pretty sure I can find a Flash version of your game on Newgrounds for free.
It really comes down to sentiment vs reason. If we let sentiment rule our actions, no matter what side you are on, it starts to tread dangerous territory as its not necessary tied to purchasing power.
I was a big fan of George R. Martin for example, and I have read the game of thrones many times so far. Then I happened across his blog and saw how he talks to others with views different to his own, his sheer hostility and even irrational behavior regarding stances I was obviously on the opposite side of. While I cannot be a fan now of him as a person, I do still like his stories. I will still buy the books and watch the tv show, but I do so with reason. That reason being I want to encourage and reward more of that kind of product and story I personally enjoy.
I am able to separate the sentiment and based my actions more on reason. I encourage others to do the same.