Relationships and new jobs (Please come with open minds)
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Alright so...hmm, where do I even start with this
I am realistically (not counting my chickens before they hatch but I still have to set things in motion regardless and think about things) facing a move due to a potential new job (cross your fingers!) It's a great opportunity, a dream come true, and I couldn't be more excited
...it does however, come with a catch that I've only created for myself. This probably will be long, so I apologize in advance
To save time, I won't go into the backstory. Instead, I'll start with the present. I am in a FANTASTIC, WONDERFUL, AMAZING relationship with a beautiful woman who quite simply has ever trait I could ever ask for in a woman. I've had my hardships, I've had my mistakes; I am a very, very passionate person who is more than willing to give anyone the benefit of the doubt and overlook flaws that ultimately would affect me. I know this, because I've been in an unfortunate marriage. However, I've gone into this relationship very skeptical of myself, looking for any signs of "You're not really this great!," and I've been careful every step of the way. She has also been through hard times, and has been very skeptical of herself. This woman is absolutely everything I could want...She loves me in the same way I feel for her, we constantly support each other, have an amazing line of communication, yadda yadda yadda...While I am very passionate about my career and what I do, love, is also very, very important to me. I've always been the romantic, and as a child while others were dreaming of being astronauts and the like, I was dreaming of falling in love (true love, not the fake shit). I truly, 100% believe I have found it in this woman, my soulmate, and it's a dream I've had my entire life. I don't know what the future holds, but she is worth any effort, trial, and hurdles I have to endure.
If you haven't already realized where this is going yet by the subject matter, yes, I am sort of faced with a decision between a life-long dream of love, and a life-long dream of an amazing career.
She has 3 kids, is still somewhat civil with her ex, and they share the kids. I get along very well with her kids. While she wants to come with me, and would not allow me to reject the opportunity(I know this because I told her I would), we don't know how this can realistically work. She is determined to do whatever is in her power to make it work, without it drastically affecting her family, but it could take her anywhere from months, to a year, or more? to get out to the new job location with me. I can't, and I will NOT ask her to leave her kids(I know what she would say anyway, even if I did want to)...I also cannot ask her to rip her children away from her father...I honestly feel like there is no right answer, no solution to this problem, and I never would have thought I would have had to choose between love and career. I feel like no matter what, I have to hurt someone...whether it's myself, her, the kids, their father...how the fuck am I suppose to be able to provide an answer that all parties agree with? I guess just fuck me for falling in love and choosing this career right?
It's so frustrating to know that, before the age of 30, I have practically been presented with two dreams that anyone would kill for, but I can't have both. And people have already made comments to me that they would love to be in my position, but it's an awful, awful position to be in. The amount of guilt and fear I have is stupid, and I know, despite her attempts at being stronger for me, I've caused her a great deal of stress and guilt with this situation too. If I were to pass this up, even if I could GUARANTEE her I would never resent her, she would still feel guilty every waking moment.
I don't expect anyone to give me an answer, that is for me to decide. What I'm looking for is if anyone can relate, and what advice they can give about the situation. I feel like there has to be someone here who can offer some insight.
I am asking that you could please, please, be open minded and think about this before you respond. If you feel "leave her and follow your career idiot, there are tons of women who will S a D" is the option or in ruder words, well I guess that's your opinion and I guess I'm asking for it, but I'm really looking for sincere, relate-able experience.
I am realistically (not counting my chickens before they hatch but I still have to set things in motion regardless and think about things) facing a move due to a potential new job (cross your fingers!) It's a great opportunity, a dream come true, and I couldn't be more excited
...it does however, come with a catch that I've only created for myself. This probably will be long, so I apologize in advance
To save time, I won't go into the backstory. Instead, I'll start with the present. I am in a FANTASTIC, WONDERFUL, AMAZING relationship with a beautiful woman who quite simply has ever trait I could ever ask for in a woman. I've had my hardships, I've had my mistakes; I am a very, very passionate person who is more than willing to give anyone the benefit of the doubt and overlook flaws that ultimately would affect me. I know this, because I've been in an unfortunate marriage. However, I've gone into this relationship very skeptical of myself, looking for any signs of "You're not really this great!," and I've been careful every step of the way. She has also been through hard times, and has been very skeptical of herself. This woman is absolutely everything I could want...She loves me in the same way I feel for her, we constantly support each other, have an amazing line of communication, yadda yadda yadda...While I am very passionate about my career and what I do, love, is also very, very important to me. I've always been the romantic, and as a child while others were dreaming of being astronauts and the like, I was dreaming of falling in love (true love, not the fake shit). I truly, 100% believe I have found it in this woman, my soulmate, and it's a dream I've had my entire life. I don't know what the future holds, but she is worth any effort, trial, and hurdles I have to endure.
If you haven't already realized where this is going yet by the subject matter, yes, I am sort of faced with a decision between a life-long dream of love, and a life-long dream of an amazing career.
She has 3 kids, is still somewhat civil with her ex, and they share the kids. I get along very well with her kids. While she wants to come with me, and would not allow me to reject the opportunity(I know this because I told her I would), we don't know how this can realistically work. She is determined to do whatever is in her power to make it work, without it drastically affecting her family, but it could take her anywhere from months, to a year, or more? to get out to the new job location with me. I can't, and I will NOT ask her to leave her kids(I know what she would say anyway, even if I did want to)...I also cannot ask her to rip her children away from her father...I honestly feel like there is no right answer, no solution to this problem, and I never would have thought I would have had to choose between love and career. I feel like no matter what, I have to hurt someone...whether it's myself, her, the kids, their father...how the fuck am I suppose to be able to provide an answer that all parties agree with? I guess just fuck me for falling in love and choosing this career right?
It's so frustrating to know that, before the age of 30, I have practically been presented with two dreams that anyone would kill for, but I can't have both. And people have already made comments to me that they would love to be in my position, but it's an awful, awful position to be in. The amount of guilt and fear I have is stupid, and I know, despite her attempts at being stronger for me, I've caused her a great deal of stress and guilt with this situation too. If I were to pass this up, even if I could GUARANTEE her I would never resent her, she would still feel guilty every waking moment.
I don't expect anyone to give me an answer, that is for me to decide. What I'm looking for is if anyone can relate, and what advice they can give about the situation. I feel like there has to be someone here who can offer some insight.
I am asking that you could please, please, be open minded and think about this before you respond. If you feel "leave her and follow your career idiot, there are tons of women who will S a D" is the option or in ruder words, well I guess that's your opinion and I guess I'm asking for it, but I'm really looking for sincere, relate-able experience.
Replies
This is seriously melodramatic man. It's just a job.
I am not considering leaving her for the job. I am very firm in believing that I want her/love more than any job or other material good could offer. What I'm afraid of is getting out there, with a realistic knowledge that I have no idea when she would ever be able to make it...this job would be great for my portfolio and really set my career in motion, it's a great opportunity, but at what cost?
I know I can wait for her, entertain myself and wait for her to be able to make it out, but is it really fair of me to expect her to do such a thing? Sometimes you have to sit back and let things happen, but other times action is required. I guess I'm just nervous that her encouragement and support at getting this job is blinding me to make a rational decision. I'm high off the opportunity and her encouragement is just fueling my excitement. I just don't want to make the wrong decision. Of course, if things don't work out, I guess it "wasn't meant to be," but if I decided against this job it would have been different
I'm confident in her, in our relationship, and being able to deal with the distance, it's just, blah!...it's such a difficult situation and I don't even know the proper way to proceed. I want this to work, and I'll do whatever I can, I just don't know what to do. Hell, I don't even know if I should be realistically considering this opportunity...it's so overwhelming and confusing
You can do the same work at home and keep your family.
My advice is based on personal experience in and out of the games industry.
There's other things you can consider, such as there will be other job opportunities in the future, also job security seems low these days. There are other things to consider on the other side of the coin, such as what if you grow a desire to want kids of your own, but she already has 3 and doesn't want more, how will that work out? The answer I'd point you to is time, there's still plenty of time. Face your own emotions about the current job opportunity and come to terms that there will be more, and then just keep going. Either more opportunities will crop up that will allow you to have both, or you may take a turn in life and drop one of them - but I don't think it's now.
Radiancef0rge puts forth a good option too.
It's honestly the hardest thing I've ever done, but I know it'll be the right decision because I wont regret it later in life when I think "I could have done that".
Just IMO obviously, different people have totally different views.
That isn't meant to sound rude or insensitive, if you're both paralyzed by indecision then you may as well leave it to chance.
I still see no reason why you need to move, you can freelance from home. If the job is really that important to you then just go, things are rarely as painful as we imagine them to be.
I know people who have made it work over different countries so it is definitely doable.
I still have my day job in a different career path, but have gone the freelance route and work remotely on projects. It's a lot more work and frustration. But the goal is eventually turning that into my day job, which means I get to have both. Maybe you can find a studio that will allow you to work remotely, who knows. But don't let your career define your personal life.
To keep quite simple. There's no relationship in long distance relationships. So lets knock that option out of the ballpark. Its really, the matter of stay and dream of the day. Or, pursue your quest and get experience and meet someone new who is the same as this person. If not, BETTER.
When I was with my Ex-GF the mother of 3. It was certainly tough to make calls for myself, because I too had a TON in common with the woman. At the core we were both artists, and she was a great photo artist by nature. Although she was a drawback from many things. Because of custody ties from the kids she had from the ex-husband that lived down the road in town. She couldn't go anywhere, at anytime. I could...
2nd thing I had to look at. Was considering how I myself too would want my own kids one day. This was possible, but only if I would want to work unhappy jobs in a desolated location of no options. Because she already has kids. They too were awesome. But again, at the end of the day...they were not mine and this too was troublesome knowing I had to see the man that was once affiliated to make their lives come true with the woman i was in love with. Its honestly a down-tear in emotion dealing with this stuff. Lets not forget, how awkward it would be to have my own with her and her kids (for my childs sake of having siblings) they would all be very much older than my own kids, and it would grow up potentially alone. Yet the costs would be financially crumbling.
Last but never was the least. This woman was drama. Yeah aren't they all? haha... No, really, if this woman you are presently with is fantastic, and doesn't have a bi-polar disorder, an alcohol addiction, dirty history, etc. Then great for you. This means you have a tougher stance to decide on. Which is ultimately, does she full-fill you in every way you could want a woman for life?
like... Does it matter if she is single as a person, or has kids included?
Does it feel great knowing you can go anywhere in the world with this person? yes, no?
For that one important interview question for the next try at a industry job that asks "can you relocate to our studio?" will that be a answer that puts you in a moment of feeling like you have hemmoroids in your ass. Or can you answer that with confidence and no delays?
In the end, you have options. She doesn't. Does her lack of flexible freedom to choose to do for herself in her life with you. Hinder yours in anyway for any opportunity? If the instant is yes you answer to yourself. You should consider the friendship route with her and move forward. Because this industry will now only hire if you have experience. If it doesn't, its really a gambling chance. To where your art is posted on the front page of cg society. Will you find people then knocking at your door with interest.
I can tell you for myself in my end of routes to having to make a choice. I met someone new who is much more awesome than that of what i came from. She can go anywhere in the world with me and wants to. We can start our own family together whenever we decide to choose to. Overall, its nice not seeing a third member (yeah even if temporary) who my woman once had passion in the next room with. Instead, its all about me and her and its pure.
I've said enough, but hopefully I've painted a picture for you.
If this is REAL love and not just a I hope this is the one and I'm blind (cause this "love" thing/emotion is.) then she should want you to do what you want to do and stand by your side.
On the other hand, usually women in this triangle situation usually spend a nice amount of time with their ex's and are usually doing what they've been doing. (I'll leave it at that.) In other words history has shown to repeat its self.
For all I know and from what I've gathered your a good dude, and I am a good dude and I want to say now this is OUR down fall.
I'll just say I've been in a similar situation but mine was with a mom of 1 a distance of 1000 miles from each other, 3 years into It I found out a lot of shocking things. Had their been an opportunity I would have taken It and their was at one point and I did, which would have left me 1 hour away from her instead of 1000 miles away. Had the opportunity been better and not leaving me, leaving the "office" at 4-5 AM to come back around 9 AM the next morning I would have stayed and see how It played out.
I am no longer with that woman and even though the time spent was the most enjoyable I would have went with the money, cause in the end and having a realistic mindset eventually this in the clouds feeling will bring me back down to reality sometime and by then hopefully I didn't put myself in a relationship I wish I'd never been in to begin with.
If you've taken into consideration that these kids will grow up and have a different attitude towards you, (hopefully positive) and this "other man", doesn't decide he wants his women back or vice versa. Then I'd say your in a pretty tough predicament if your still on cloud 9.
As for me looking back I never wanted to be with a woman with a child, let alone 3.
It is a bigger negative to me then a positive because If I'm not making enough to support 2 mouths let alone 5, then I just did It to myself and one or the other of the negatives will still happen. On top of that you both want kids eventually right?
your in a tough spot, but again for me I'd take the job..that is just me though.
dont wake up at 40 and realize you wasted your life working and not living.
Based on what you've said in your other thread the job you're going for means a lot to you. Ultimately you're going to be the only person who can decide on what direction to take. It'd be unwise to allow yourself to be overly swayed by anything that folks have said in this thread.
Id like to clarify again, i was never really looking for an answer, but relateable experience that people could offer based off their own situations...I have definitely got what i was looking for, and jackablade i do agree with you. No one has said anything to sway me, but things to think about most certainly...i have a lot to think about, thank you guys so much for all of this. Feel free to continue the discussion...i'm really no better off than prior to posting haha, but its comforting to be able to relate
Id also like to clarify that no one was offensive, i wanted the blunt input
I have included my wife (anuxinamoon) in all of my jobs / offers / opportunities decisions when moving overseas etc. And if possible we try to sell ourselves as a duo - try to get us both inhouse.
Listen up guys. This is the aftermath of 'oh, trueee love' and people in their mid-twenties sprinting down the aisle and then popping a few babies out cause 'we are in love and will be together forever'. This isn't so much a problem in Europe as it is in America. It's rampant there. And all that its producing is a high divorce rate and a whole generation of fucked up kids. And cheapening the whole concept of marriage to boot.
Some people blame the media for this; they say kids fall for the 'fairytale' they see so often on screen; disney movies and such; I don't really know. Could be that, or it could just be 'something to do' for them. Or it could be, people actually get off on the drama. Again, media could play a part in that.
This romantic notion of 'true love at 21' is probably what got you in this situation in the first place OP (seeing as you're one marriage down already). I read your situation, and it sounds extremely messy. I advise a clean break, there will be less drama in your life because of it. Can I ask how long you are with this girl?
IMO 95% of kids not even in their mid-twenties have absolutely no business getting married and having kids. Of course you do get the odd couple who just work and are very mature and that works out great for them but the vast majority of these cases end up in disaster.
Life is not a damn Disney movie. Relationships are hard work. Go out and live your life; there's plenty of time to get tied town later; might as well do this when you are older and have less energy and strength ;P AND FOR GODS SAKE USE A DAMN RUBBER.
Quick question though....Why do you feel as though you have to move far away? I would start my search locally and keep expanding outward until the distance is to great. Even if the positions around your area are filled you can always work a side job to support the family until you can get in. Plus I am sure there is more then just game studios in Orlando.If 3d modeling is your passion then you can look at other types of industries such as medical, architecture , or military simulations. That way you can build experience and maybe when the kids are older then move?
Really Andreas? You basically came into this thread and spat all over it troll like. You spend more than half your post ranting with your misconceptions about the US before giving any advice to the original poster. It could be said it is admirable he was able to look past the children.
I can't give any advice, as I have never been in such a situation.
Then don't post.
As an addendum OP, I would say that you are going to love many women in your life. This 'the one for me' thing is fairly rare. It's ok that you are a passionate guy, but make sure it is influencing your life in a good way, not a destructive way. What that really means, requires a bit of thought on your part. Good luck.
If not, I suggest trying to see what is something worth to you. I mean everyone can give you all the advice they like, but honestly, it's your decision, not to mention, there will always be that small 'break or make' thing that makes us all tick.
For example, do you worship on the ground she walks because she sneeze's with her eyes open? Something which no one else did, and which made you fall in love with her? Something like that?
At the same time, do you worship the game industry as a Mecca, because it helped you through difficult times, as a medium?
At the same time, would this question be better asked to your close personal friends and family?
I have no real advice to give, other then this; Take a shower and start thinking about your problems and how you can best tackle them. Trust me on this, just do it.
No matter what you think, everthing you do openly in a place like this, will ripple for a long time.
Whether you think it is wise to ask advice upon such a private matter or not is up to you, obviously. I just don't think it is.
Relationships are hard. Work is hard. You need to make decisions to move your life along, though. If you really care about each other and the relationship doesn't have other issues then it can work. If the relationship has other issues, who's to say it won't end.
I'm not saying prioritise work over love or any rubbish, but you shouldn't have to give up either of them. Do you mind if I ask why you say it'll take that long for her to move her life over to your new location?
Don't be tempted to devalue the relationship because blah blah you'll meet other people, love isn't too special etc. That's baloney. The only relationships that don't end up in break-ups are ones where someone dies first. If you don't put value in the relationship while you're in it, you will end up with more break-ups.
Agreed. OP, strangers are not going to know your exact situation. What do you think you'll achieve by asking them for advice? A job is a job; just because its a game job does not mean there are any special considerations to be made that only game artists can help you with. Friends and family will always give you better advice. People who know you, have met this girl, etc.
My opinion is that if it's really the best relationship there is, you should be able to get through anything, even being apart for a long time. My girlfriend still has to graduate before she can move here and by then it will have been 2 years. We just call every day and visit each other at least once a month.
Granted we're young and none of us has kids/divorce so that's kind of different.
I don't even know where to start with this
"while others were dreaming of being astronauts and the like, I was dreaming of falling in love"
What?! Did Disney really hit you that hard?
"She has 3 kids"
Stop right there, having one kid out of wedlock is bad enough; but three? Seriously take the job and run far, far, away. She expects you to pick up the scraps, don't be a garbageman and don't be suckered into taking care other another dude's kids.
This seems like a bad situation that will only get worse.
After I found love, love > everything.
Some of the comments in this thread are really disgusting...
I chose the relationship and whilst we've had our ups and downs i never looked back. Now a year later another career opportunity came up and it's literally next to my house. Girl + career kicks ass
I guess what i'm saying is that there's more jobs that'll be a dream but there might just be one girl, so go for the girl
I would not drop it but do what I could to have my cake and eat it. Best of luck to you dude, it's a shit situation to be in for sure.
I'm surprised you would say this as a man. Losing my kids would destroy me. Not sure civility or sensibility comes into it; no way would I want my kids taken away from me. Especially not over a long distance. 'Every other weekend' or similar is an awful enough 'sentence' for a father; saying that seeing them only during school holidays is 'enough' is something I definitely not agree with. Seems a little cold, no offense ambershee. Kids need their pops and much as they need their mom. Divorce messes with the family system enough without including a huge move in there too. Whenever I hear a story like that it just comes across as being hugely selfish to me; unless of course the ex is a bloody lunatic, then it's probably a rather good idea lol. But if you're doing it just to suit yourself and your new partner...yeah; not hugely impressed with people who make choices like that. They get their way but the kids and the ex that's been left behind suffer.
As it happens, my experience in that regard is first-hand as a child in that situation - I didn't just move away, I also moved abroad. Looking back, I'm glad my father saw sense. I had a better quality home life (and life in general) and went to a fantastic school as a result. I wouldn't be a shadow of the person I am today without it.
This, basically.
I would love to reply to each and every person, haha, its really cool to see everyone debate this.
@andreas i was never offended so no worries
We talked a lot last night (id also like to point out that we have talked about this situation a lot), and somehow my weakness gives her strength to be brave, i dont know how she does it...shes still pushing and convincing me to take the job if offered and not to worry...its really hard to know the best path, but i think shes convinced me shes determined to make it work and that i need to do this...shes so proud of me and her support means so much
Anyway, continue discussion
OK, I understand.
Another thing to consider would be that this isn't a tenured desk job OP is heading to. We all know the job security this career has these days; what if this job disappears? And another one can't be found in the same location? The kids are going to be bounced around like yo-yo's. Moving kids out of their school and hometown once is bad, doing it again a year from now is not what I'd call a stable environment.
Just another thing for you to consider SF. :P
Glad you guys are talking through it anyways.
My advice would be, give it a shot. Being in a LDR is vey hard and it's a lot of work. It can be really crappy. but if you give it a go you will find out it's not a black and white case of you can do it or you can't. It's a case of finding out how long you feel comfortable going without seeing each other. How long you are willing to make a LDR work. And what you are willing to compromise to bring yourselves back together. And if it works, it was worth it. If it doesn't, then you should still be able to have a meaningful relationship while it lasted.
WHAT TO EXPECT
So using myself as an example: I can go a week or longer without seeing my partner than she can without me. This isn't a petty dig, it's something that becomes very clear after a few months. We've found that if we don't see each other in two weeks, things get shitty. We both feel like after two years we are reaching the limit of being in a long distance relationship. If it got to 3 years and we hadn't found a way to be together, not only have plans gone awry and I need to take a hard look at my life, but we'd likely have to break up. We've felt like that would be the logical limit for a while now, again, it's something you get a feel of over time and lots of talking. It's important to make plans of how you want to move in together and end the long distance, but this plan will evolve over time. Don't make crazy promises you might not be able to keep. This will be unique to everyone.
ADVICE:
This wil be pretty standard stuff but it's just too true. TALK. regularly. Talk especially if you're arguing, because it's way to easy to let things stew when you're hundreds of miles away. Skype is a godsend, it's so much nicer than the phone. Travel wise, find the cheapest convenient way to get between you and get used to it. Make each other feel at home when you visit, get comfortable around their parents/flatmates/friends so you don't feel away from home when you're with your partner.
I'll probably copy paste this into any other threads that come up like this one. But for now it was just quite cathartic to write after a tough week!
Not sure I can agree with this, I wouldn't want a situation where whoever can establish a new relationship the quickest gets the kids. Following this scenario we'd have to consider that if the father has a partner already we should be saying that the mother should leave the kids with him. Also what happens when the father then enters a relationship with someone, what's best then? The kids then have 2 potential 2-parent households.
It's not some kind of competition
It's all super awesome now but it was really tough at the time. I think the main thing to remember is relationships take hard work and compromise, like anything in life. You've just got to try and be honest with each other and avoid anyone feeling like they got the raw end of the deal (including the kids), bitterness is poisonous.
Good luck with your decision!
If I was ever going to attempt a LDR again (highly doubtful) I would pretty much want to be in an open relationship while we are apart, and if the girl was a badass high confience girl it could work. that would remove the "oh shit is this person lying to me" part of it, you both know you are sleeping with other people but love each other. It depends if you can look at sex as a purley physical thing with other people and a super intimate thing thats different between you and your partner. Most people cant handle that kind of situation though.
my biggest advice would be though if you do go for the LDR, avoid any insane needyness/insecurity/jealousy/suspision. 99% of the time its in your head and it really turns people off and poisons the relationship.
Make sure to get yourself tested in-between companions.