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Yiynova msp19u Cintiq Alternative

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Owl
polycounter lvl 6
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Owl polycounter lvl 6
Hey Polycounters!
I have been looking into getting a Yiynova msp19u and am wondering if any of you have experience with them.

I read this article:

http://blog.drawn.ca/post/38741581411/the-yiynova-msp19u-cintiq-alternative-swings-for-the

Which makes it sound pretty great. I have watched the few YouTube videos out there on it and they too seem to be pretty positive.

However I know it's previous version, the msp19 had quite a few known issues.

Just wondering if any of you have tried it out yet.

I am probably going to pick one up in the next month or so unless I find a really good reason not to. If Ido pick one up , I'll definitely let you all know how I feel about it!

Replies

  • XilenceX
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    XilenceX polycounter lvl 8
    I would buy one of those IF I could find a shop that ships it to Europe (at a reasonable price)!
  • Jerc
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    Jerc interpolator
    XilenceX wrote: »
    I would buy one of those IF I could find a shop that ships it to Europe (at a reasonable price)!

    Actually the official website has a Europe store

    http://www.yiynova.eu/shop/index.php?route=product/product&path=2&product_id=3
  • bounchfx
    damn you got me wondering. That review is really positive. My lady here could use a cintiq but 600$ is a hell of a lot more affordable for only a 2 inch smaller screen... it sounds like it has less lag than the cintiq too (so he says). Only downside for me is the resolution (which isn't terrible for that size screen, just not amazing), and the pen needing a battery.

    If anything, I hope this makes Wacom lower their prices, even just a little.

    aha I must be nuts.
  • blankslatejoe
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    blankslatejoe polycounter lvl 14
    Yeah...wtf is up with the pen battery? But yeah, Wacom's had a monopoly for way too long here..
  • aesir
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    aesir polycounter lvl 13
    Yeah...wtf is up with the pen battery? But yeah, Wacom's had a monopoly for way too long here..

    I believe wacom owns the patent on the type of technology that allows pens to be battery-less. That's why. Replacing a battery every few months seems like a small price to pay for saving 1400 bucks.
  • Pabs
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    Pabs polycounter lvl 9
    might just pick up one of these when i get some extra cash
  • r_fletch_r
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    r_fletch_r polycounter lvl 9
    aesir wrote: »
    I believe wacom owns the patent on the type of technology that allows pens to be battery-less. That's why. Replacing a battery every few months seems like a small price to pay for saving 1400 bucks.

    I think they patented using RFID (or certainly induction powered chips)in a tablet pens. Pretty shitty really.
  • Owl
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    Owl polycounter lvl 6
    Well, I will let you know what I think. I just ordered one off of Amazon, but they're not shipping till after the new year so it will be a week or two.

    Here's hoping it will be sweet! I think it will be pretty good. Maybe not quite cintiq quality but I am okay with that with $1400 still in my pocket.
  • blankslatejoe
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    blankslatejoe polycounter lvl 14
    If you don't mind owl, please report back in once you get it--I'd love to hear more impressions!
  • Avanthera
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    Avanthera polycounter lvl 10
    I'm planning on getting one in two weeks, here's hoping that it wont be shit! :)
  • xrg
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    xrg polycounter lvl 10
    Wikipedia entry on Wacom towards the end says their patent for the battery-free pens has expired, but it doesn't seem to say when it did.
  • TNO
    seems to be around the year 2008, Wacom fought with Hanvon,

    so if you want a battery free version I would suggest you look at this one;
    Hanvon SenTIP 1201WD
  • Mask_Salesman
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    Mask_Salesman polycounter lvl 12
    I'd love to see a video comparison of one vs a cintiq, in sensitivity, lag and prescision.
  • Ged
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    Ged interpolator
    yeah please tell us what its like when you get it. I just got a new medium sized wacom bamboo only to find they have made the usb cable so damn short that you will consider paying extra for the wireless kit, thats some mean marketing!
  • mastershokhan
    I'm going to get one too in a couple weeks! I can't wait! I love Wacom but Yiyinova is going to steal me away
  • Entity
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    Entity polycounter lvl 15
    I wouldn't mind testing this out for Polycount if someone could tell me where I could purchase it from Asia.
  • ikken
    Ged wrote: »
    yeah please tell us what its like when you get it. I just got a new medium sized wacom bamboo only to find they have made the usb cable so damn short that you will consider paying extra for the wireless kit, thats some mean marketing!

    I believe you can use any $ 10 mini-usb cable? if bamboos have the same kind of cables as intuos 4/5
  • Ged
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    Ged interpolator
    ikken wrote: »
    I believe you can use any $ 10 mini-usb cable? if bamboos have the same kind of cables as intuos 4/5

    I just found that out now, Ive never seen a cable with a head like this but it turns out they are called micro B usb cables and are a lot more common than I thought!
  • Owl
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    Owl polycounter lvl 6
    Here's another helpful review I found on them. I'm getting pretty excited to get my hands on it! :)

    http://www.enupnion.com/forum/?p=48

    Looks like they are now sold out on Amazon! Glad I ordered mine when I did.
  • Isaiah Sherman
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    Isaiah Sherman polycounter lvl 13
    Wow this is awesome! Very positive review, and the major complaint with the Cintiq w/me was the offset cursor and lag.

    Please do tell us how you like it. If it's a winner then I want one!
  • Ged
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    Ged interpolator
    any one got one and can tell us how good this really is?
  • Fomori
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    Fomori polycounter lvl 10
    You know, I was just thinking the same thing earlier today Ged, and considered doing your exact post. Anybody get one?
  • Owl
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    Owl polycounter lvl 6
    I get mine tomorrow! I will test it out over the weekend and let you know what my initial thoughts are. Pretty excited to use it!!! :)
  • Dataday
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    Dataday polycounter lvl 8
    Owl wrote: »
    I get mine tomorrow! I will test it out over the weekend and let you know what my initial thoughts are. Pretty excited to use it!!! :)

    return it.

    I owned a yiynova 19 incher briefly to test its capability compared to my cintiq and sent it back just as fast.

    In the 1st and 2nd quarter of this year, Lenovo is releasing a highly portable LED backlit IPS monitor thats not only touch screen, but has a wacom digitizer in it for pen input (gorillia glass). One is wired, one is wireless.

    It will cost between $250-$350, which will be less than what you paid for that yiynova.

    The only real good screen based pen tech right now is Wacom. With the yiynova, you will be getting a waltrop digitizer if I am not mistaken. The problem with their drivers, and most others is that you cannot have any wacom drivers installed at the same time. The pen also is very springy, which can cause unwanted effects depending on the type of art you are doing.

    [ame=" Lenovo Wireless Screens - CES 2013 - YouTube[/ame]
  • Internet Friend
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    Internet Friend polycounter lvl 9
    The new "U" model of Yiynova panels use UC Logic digitizers, not the jittery Waltrop of the old model. However it still lacks anything but basic features and people report problems with specific software (Illustrator, SAI, Sketchbook).

    I'm not sure that Lenovo is going to be the perfect solution either. It's wired over USB 3.0 or wireless and the digitizer is some kind of low end Wacom with 256 pressure levels, which makes me worry about lag and how accurate the tracking will be. Has anyone used a Lenovo with a Wacom digitizer? I know they've released some hybrid laptops in the past.
  • Zpanzer
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    Zpanzer polycounter lvl 8
    The new "U" model of Yiynova panels use UC Logic digitizers, not the jittery Waltrop of the old model. However it still lacks anything but basic features and people report problems with specific software (Illustrator, SAI, Sketchbook).

    I'm not sure that Lenovo is going to be the perfect solution either. It's wired over USB 3.0 or wireless and the digitizer is some kind of low end Wacom with 256 pressure levels, which makes me worry about lag and how accurate the tracking will be. Has anyone used a Lenovo with a Wacom digitizer? I know they've released some hybrid laptops in the past.

    About the 256 levels, in another thread someone actually pointed out something that I thought was quite thought provoking.
    When we work in 8 bit colorspace, you only have 256 levels of any given value, so wouldn't that neglect any pressure levels above that since you can't have decimal values unless you paint in an 16 or 32 bit environment, which I doubt many people are, and even if you are, do you need the fine control that it grants you?

    Just some thoughts. It seems that high sensitivity levels in digitizers is just some PR stuff to justify a higher price tag. Like people having 32 gigs of ram on a 32 bit system.
  • Internet Friend
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    Internet Friend polycounter lvl 9
    The bigger issue is that if it's a digitizer they're only advertising as 256 levels of pressure, will it also fall short in tracking? I cannot see Wacom providing digitizers of the same quality found in the Cintiq to another company at a price that lets them severely undercut Wacom's own monitor product. On the other hand, if they're using thin Gorilla Glass to reduce parallax that could be an awesome feature.

    As for the levels, I know I only work in part of the pressure range the pen can detect and I suspect many other people do as well. I'm more comfortable working in the lighter end of the spectrum and setting the maximum response at only maybe 2/3rds the max pressure the pen can detect. Others may like having not a lot of response at the low end and having to press hard to get the max response. That flexibility comes with having a large range of sensitivity and good driver options.
  • oXYnary
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    oXYnary polycounter lvl 16
    Zpanzer wrote: »
    About the 256 levels, in another thread someone actually pointed out something that I thought was quite thought provoking.
    When we work in 8 bit colorspace, you only have 256 levels of any given value, so wouldn't that neglect any pressure levels above that since you can't have decimal values unless you paint in an 16 or 32 bit environment, which I doubt many people are, and even if you are, do you need the fine control that it grants you?

    Just some thoughts. It seems that high sensitivity levels in digitizers is just some PR stuff to justify a higher price tag. Like people having 32 gigs of ram on a 32 bit system.

    But the problem with that argument was it only took into account color.

    You also deal with size. So unless say Ps or sketchup are limited to 256 steps for this in the same stepping pattern as 8 bit color, you are reducing your work fidelity.
  • Owl
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    Owl polycounter lvl 6
    Yes, @Dataday, the updated MSP19U supposedly has taken care of many of the issues that the previous model experienced. There are quite a few really positive reviews on it, if you look them up.

    For example:
    http://frenden.tumblr.com/post/38693256477/yiynovamsp19u
    [ame=" MSP19U Tablet Review - YouTube[/ame]
    http://www.enupnion.com/forum/

    I am aware that it will proabably not be the quality of a Cintiq, but it's also $1400 less. The question is not really whether it competes perfectly with Wacom technology, but rather if it is a good substitute for the price difference.

    Anyways, only one way to know for sure. Which I will, tomorrow. :)

    I'll be honest about my experience with it. If it sucks, I'll let you know.

    I'll post something up either Sunday or Monday so I have a couple days to try different software in it.

    Primarily, I'll be testing it in Photoshop and Zbrush, as those are really all I care about for it. But I may test a couple others as well.

    Any specific questions about it, let me know.
  • Ged
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    Ged interpolator
    Fomori wrote: »
    You know, I was just thinking the same thing earlier today Ged, and considered doing your exact post. Anybody get one?

    great minds eh haha, Owl looking forward to hearing about it.
  • mastershokhan
    I just bought one. I will test mine and report back. So they put 20 up today and they sold out in less than hour. New price is $625 with shipping included...."shipment (100+) by sea in the end of Jan (Or early Feb).
  • Lamont
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    Lamont polycounter lvl 12
    We have been looking into these here at work, I might be the first to take the plunge.
  • JohnnyRaptor
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    JohnnyRaptor polycounter lvl 13
    ooh! cant wait to hear back from ppls! $1400 less is damn good!
  • Dataday
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    Dataday polycounter lvl 8
    Actually you have to be careful regarding the 256 levels of pressure and how it compares to say 2048 or 1024.

    Wacom apparently changed the point at which pens start registering pen pressure lead some to believe that there is a noticeable difference between the pressure levels as opposed to realizing the pen is just different. I have also heard from someone who is generally very knowledgable with pen tablet tech, that the digitizers and pens are not limiting the pressure as much as it is the software drivers used. I suppose this means that no matter what, the pen is normalizing a value between 0-1 and that results in the digitizer giving it a "level of pressure".

    In short, there is probably not as big of a difference between 256 and 1024 as some may think. It is also why I would recommend a 256 level of pressure wacom over some other brand digitizer that markets 1024 and up.
  • Owl
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    Owl polycounter lvl 6
    Hey guys!

    Just doing a quick report! Will put something with a bunch of details together in the next couple days after I've had a little more time to use my new Yiynova MSP19U.

    SO Far....

    I LOVE IT.

    Had a few issues at first with the driver and Photoshop sensitivity. Will explain later.

    But after messing around for a bit, got it to work, and so far, I love it.

    Accuracy and sensitivity are awesome. I have an Asus Ep121 which has a Wacom digitizer, which is what I am used to using.

    The sensitivity on this feels WAY more responsive and sensitive. Also accuracy seems better.

    Anyways, I will tell more soon.

    Here's a few small sketches I did tonight. I've only used if for a few hours tonight, so need to explore more.

    So far, it works in Photoshop CS4 and CS6, Zbrush and Corel Painter as expected.

    More to come soon... :)

    tJkTdUe.jpg
  • Avanthera
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    Avanthera polycounter lvl 10
    Nice! Glad it's working well, I know of a few other peeps who just received theirs and love it too. Now I regret waiting since they're sold out again. ):
  • Ged
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    Ged interpolator
    that sounds very promising, I will have to save money for 6 months to buy this thing but it could be awesome :P tell us more when u have time :)
  • Joseph Silverman
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    Joseph Silverman polycounter lvl 15
    I have a UC logic Monoprice tablet and LOVE IT. If you want to test drive the digitizer and feel of the tablet but not take the 650 dollar plunge, buy yourself the 80 dollar tablet and give it a spin.
  • teaandcigarettes
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    teaandcigarettes polycounter lvl 10
    I would love to get one of these, but unfortunately their EU prices are a bit crazy. The 19-inch version costs $499 in the US and 599€ in Europe. Not cool Yiynova, not cool.

    I guess I will have to wait for these Lenovo screens. I'm not sure how responsive they will be though. The wireless version seems to be slightly laggy, as seen here:

    [ame=" First look at Lenovo's wireless portable monitor - YouTube[/ame]
  • Dataday
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    Dataday polycounter lvl 8
    I would love to get one of these, but unfortunately their EU prices are a bit crazy. The 19-inch version costs $499 in the US and 599€ in Europe. Not cool Yiynova, not cool.

    I guess I will have to wait for these Lenovo screens. I'm not sure how responsive they will be though. The wireless version seems to be slightly laggy, as seen here:

    CES2013: First look at Lenovo's wireless portable monitor - YouTube


    Yep, I dont think there will be any problems lag wise with a wired version.

    Its pretty much a no brainer to put the Lenovo above the yiynova.

    • Lenovo is a known brand (IBM)
    • Surface is scratch resistant gorilla glass
    • touch screen capability like the 24hd cintiq
    • 1,600 x 900 AH-IPS LCD
    • Under 2lbs
    • ONLY $350
    I already have a cintiq but I will be picking one of these up as a secondary monitor for sure.
  • Internet Friend
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    Internet Friend polycounter lvl 9
    I would love to get one of these, but unfortunately their EU prices are a bit crazy. The 19-inch version costs $499 in the US and 599€ in Europe. Not cool Yiynova, not cool.
    The MSP19U is $599 plus shipping in the US. $499 is for the old model.
  • SnowInChina
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    SnowInChina interpolator
    hope someones going to make a review here with the lenovo when its released

    the price looks a little bit too good for the specs (well, people in the eu will have to pay like 500€ anyway...)
  • Dataday
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    Dataday polycounter lvl 8
    hope someones going to make a review here with the lenovo when its released

    the price looks a little bit too good for the specs (well, people in the eu will have to pay like 500€ anyway...)

    Makes sense though. IPS panels are dirt cheap these days, even from good suppliers. They dont need to include any of the computing hardware that would go into a tablet pc or android device. Toss in a basic wacom digitizer and they are still probably making some serious profit.
  • Zpanzer
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    Zpanzer polycounter lvl 8
    Dataday wrote: »
    Yep, I dont think there will be any problems lag wise with a wired version.

    Its pretty much a no brainer to put the Lenovo above the yiynova.

    • Lenovo is a known brand (IBM)
    • Surface is scratch resistant gorilla glass
    • touch screen capability like the 24hd cintiq
    • 1,600 x 900 AH-IPS LCD
    • Under 2lbs
    • ONLY $350
    I already have a cintiq but I will be picking one of these up as a secondary monitor for sure.

    only 1600x900 resolution for a 24"? I would expect atleast 1920x1080. After getting used to working on a 26" at work, I've fallen in love with 1080p or higher for working, the clunky interfaces just doesn't fill anything! Thats why I love what Apple are doing with their retina displays, boosting dat resolution!
  • almighty_gir
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    almighty_gir ngon master
    Zpanzer wrote: »
    Thats why I love what Apple are doing with their retina displays, boosting dat resolution!

    you mean, what apple are buying from the same supplier as LG and Samsung?
  • Zpanzer
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    Zpanzer polycounter lvl 8
    you mean, what apple are buying from the same supplier as LG and Samsung?

    Probably, but then LG and Samsung needs to get their asses moving and give me some high-res laptops/consumer displays.
  • Dataday
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    Dataday polycounter lvl 8
    Zpanzer wrote: »
    only 1600x900 resolution for a 24"? I would expect atleast 1920x1080. After getting used to working on a 26" at work, I've fallen in love with 1080p or higher for working, the clunky interfaces just doesn't fill anything! Thats why I love what Apple are doing with their retina displays, boosting dat resolution!

    Not sure what you are talking about here. What does 1600x900 have to do with a 24"?

    If you mean the Lenovo, its not 24".

    Apple has no more larger LCD resolutions than anyone else is capable of. They get their LCDs from LG and Samsung.

    The reason many dont go above 150-200 dpi is that depending on the size of the screen, its just wasted.

    Retina Display is more or less a marketing gimmick used by Apple.

    Check out this article: http://www.theverge.com/2012/8/10/3226295/news-flash-surface-pro-has-a-better-retina-display-than-the-ipad
  • teaandcigarettes
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    teaandcigarettes polycounter lvl 10
    The MSP19U is $599 plus shipping in the US. $499 is for the old model.

    I stand corrected. Still, the pricing in the EU seems a bit high, but I guess that's mainly due to the taxes and the fact that it is a niche product.
  • Owl
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    Owl polycounter lvl 6
    Hey Everyone!

    Alright, so I've gotten to sketch and paint around on this bad boy for the last couple nights.

    So I guess I'll just share my experience so far.

    Packaging was very nice. It seemed very secure and nicely protected. It came with a pen, no extra nibs, a pen holder that clips into the back of the monitor, documentation and drivers cds.

    So set up is easy. One VGA cable which has a usb cable split off right at the end and a power cable, so only two cables going into the back of the monitor.

    The stand seems to work nicely. Haven't had any issues and don't anticipate any. It is adjustable so you can lay it nearly flat or almost vertical.

    Anyways, onto to my experience:

    I'm using a four year old computer which has had several wacom tablets installed at some point so I worried I might have issues with the drivers. I uninstalled everything I could find. And installed the Yiynova stuff from the disc.

    Rebooted, launched the tablet preferences and calibrated. It's all pretty straight forward. No real deep options for customization, but thats okay. The pen has a two button clicker on the pen, but they can only be assigned to Left, Right, and middle mouse functions. Kind of a bummer as I sometimes like to assign hotkeys... I should also mention the pen felt a little cheap without the battery in it as several reviews had mentioned. But with the battery in it, feels quite nice and not as cheap. I do wish they would opt for a rechargeable pen as opposed to AAA batteries.

    Okay, so I had issues right off the bat with Photoshop. Pressure sensitivity would not work. I was concerned but assumed it was something with my PC, as every review I had found mentioned Photoshop working....

    Ended up after about an hour and a half of rebooting, trying other programs, and searching google, that I am concluding there must be an issue with 64bit versions of Photoshop and maybe other programs as well. I have yet to confirm. I started up the 32bit version of Photoshop and it has been working perfectly. I plan to contact Yiynova about this and confirm and also request that be updated soon.

    I have tested it mainly in photoshop, as I have just been having a lot of fun painting and sketching, and haven't had a ton of time in each sitting. But I have confirmed that it works perfectly in Zbrush and Corel Painter as well. I plan to do a sculpt in Zbrush very soon with it. :)

    Overall, I am absolutely 100% Satisfied with this tablet. The sensitivity on this is really great. The accuracy, I think out performs the wacom digitizer in my Asus ep121 and the edge accuracy is very good too.

    The screen brightness is great.

    Drawbacks/Cons?
    ~I think the resolution is acceptable and honestly I have been loving this thing so much, I'm not unhappy in the slightest. BUT, I think it would be even nicer with a little more Res.
    ~The screen viewing angle is also a little lacking. This isn't an issue very often, as when you[re working on it, you're generally right on top of it and looking it square on, but from any other angle, it becomes harder to see true colors/brightness.


    Overall? This is absolutely worth every penny. It just does what it's suppose to do and it does it well. For $1400 less than a Cintiq. Those Lenovo Tablets are pretty sweet looking too. And when they come out, we'll have to see how they perform against a Cintiq and the Yiynova.

    For now, the Yiynova MSP19U is pretty amazing for the money. Time will tell if it stands up over a long time period, I suppose, but for now, I'm super happy with it. :)

    I may post back in a week or so, to let you know how it's going. I may do a video review too. We'll see. Any specific questions I didn't mention, let me know.

    Here's a little more painting from it. :)

    vfDgvOy.jpg
  • Fomori
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    Fomori polycounter lvl 10
    Sounds pretty good for the price then!

    I've noticed new 12 inch Cintiqs on Ebay for under £600.
    I'm guessing this is a much better experience though.

    Wish I had the spare cash lying around at the moment as I would probably go for it. Maybe in a couple months...
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