[WIP] Orc inspired tower
polycounter lvl 5
Hello Polycount!
The next two weeks (maybe more if I want to continue working on it) I'll attempt to create a tower that is inspired from Orcish architecture. This is for a school project and the goal of the course is to learn the student to implement his/her models into a 3D engine. We should also learn more about lighting and how to use it. We should also learn more about optimizing.
I want to give a try on handpainted textures (It will be hard, I know).
As I said I'll take references from orcish architecture.
This is the concept I have created so far.
The scene will take place in a fantasy world and the tower is a watchtower. The tower also functions as a restingplace for dragons and its rider.
I also want to point out that I'm kind of new when it comes to 3D but I really want to become better, especially when it comes to environment.
I'll come back when I have more to show, I just wanted to make the post now.
The next two weeks (maybe more if I want to continue working on it) I'll attempt to create a tower that is inspired from Orcish architecture. This is for a school project and the goal of the course is to learn the student to implement his/her models into a 3D engine. We should also learn more about lighting and how to use it. We should also learn more about optimizing.
I want to give a try on handpainted textures (It will be hard, I know).
As I said I'll take references from orcish architecture.
This is the concept I have created so far.
The scene will take place in a fantasy world and the tower is a watchtower. The tower also functions as a restingplace for dragons and its rider.
I also want to point out that I'm kind of new when it comes to 3D but I really want to become better, especially when it comes to environment.
I'll come back when I have more to show, I just wanted to make the post now.
Replies
Orcs are primitive. Most of the time, it's a lot of wood, horns, bones, flesh, tearing, architecture "handmade". Your concept look more "medieval", not for orc but more for humans. Your architecture need to be more "agresive". Il you want to make a "cartoon/handpainted" texture, I think you need to make it more "caricatural". It should look nasty
I hope I helped you
I forgot to write in my first post what the tower was suppose to be so I'll write here and edit my first post.
The scene will take place in a fantasy world and the tower is a watchtower. The tower also functions as a restingplace for dragons and its rider.
I've added some more details, is this in the right direction? I like the first one better myself.
I'm not very good at 2D so I'm having a hard time getting the result I want and I don't have time to get stuck at concepting.
I know how important it is with your concept but I need to start modeling soon (I need to be done with my scene the 7th dec) and I don't have much experience in UDK.
Should I switch tower totaly? Or am I going in the right direction with this?
Maybe you can also add a little more interest if it looks like this tower's been attacked or damaged from battle. Since Orcs tend to be fighting a lot I'm sure some structures would not be perfectly intact.
I really need to start modeling, even though I don't have a great concept I need to start because it's a 3D class (: where we should learn 3D engines/optimization/lighting etc.
But I'll keep what you, Shmaba, wrote in mind when I'm modeling. I'm going with my latest picture.
I'm back with a little more. It's not much, I was very tired today.
I've talked with my teachers and they wanted me to write more about the "story" of the orcs, so I will get a more clear vision on how I should do the tower. As I really don't have time to rework my concept, as I should, so I'll write my "story" around the concept I have, hopefully you will understand. So here we go:
I will do the Orcs in a whole new universe. These Orcs are more civilized than most orcs. They still have the same way to build their buildings, though they makes it more structured. This breed has a city they live in and have lived for hundreds of years. This has led to more robust buildings with more structure when they have had the time to build them (unlike, for example, Orcs from World of Warcraft who fled their country and have not had time to structure their buildings as much).
These Orcs are basically warriors but as I said, has become more civilized. They keep trophies, horns etc, from their victories over large animals, such as mammoths and dragons. These trophies are mounted on buildings to show their enemies what they are capable of. They use the skin for as raincover as you can see in my concept. Since these Orcs are very proud and want to show it, there is much flags / banners posted on their buildings.
Now to the model. I don't really know how I should structure it. Is it best to keep everything combined or should I peice by pice (like I have done so far)? I was mostly thinking about the texture size if I kept everything togheter.
On a different note I'll just point out now that I'm not comfortable using zbrush/mudbox right now, I haven't been using it and I don't think I can learn it within these two weeks.
Thank you guys for taking your time with me, it is really helpful.
I've been working on my model and just started on the textures.
This is what it looks like so far. I'm acually really pleased with myself as I belive I'm not that good at 2D nor textures, but I like the result. I'm currently working on the wood twexture and it's not done yet.
Even in the latest concept (that looks a lot closer than what you had previously) there are still a lot of right angles and straight edges and a lot of engineering logic. Especially on the models you have going right now. If you handed something with a straight edge to an orc they would bend it.
They have little regard for building codes (partly because they don't care why buildings fall) so they don't see a problem with building things top heavy or lopsided. They also don't care much for measuring or evenly spacing objects.
Function often overrides common sense and more times than not, the function is just to make the building seem really mean and vicious, which is why they use claws tusks and spikes.
ORC Frequently Asked Question:
Q: Why do they use tusks claws and teeth as building materials? Is it because its stylish and atheistically pleasing?
A:
So when you think Orc, think a giant gorilla hopped up on steroids, with an anger issue, the memory of a goldfish (15sec won't help you remember why buildings keep falling down) that has a serious case of little dog syndrome (has to prove how tough it is by constantly posturing and barking at everything) and thinks everything can be solved if you smash it a few more times.
If you get into the warhammer orks, they build stuff that can't actually work and they actually have a decent amount of magic that makes it all work. They paint things red because they believe it goes faster, because they believe that it actually does. Weapons and mechanical things like doors or catapults wouldn't work if a human tried to use it but a ork can operate it just fine because it thinks it works. It might be taken to a ridiculous extreme in warhammer but that actually shows up in a lot of orc lore and is built upon the idea that orc stuff really shouldn't work but somehow it does... It might kill 20-30 of them and fall over tomorrow but it works... most of the time...
TLDR
- Some good art skill, but your design skills are hurting a bit.
- I think you need to expand your visual library a bit, take your inner orc out on a date, let them pick the activities and marinate in what its like to be an orc for a few hours.
- Feng Zu had a really good episode on expanding your visual library, I think you should check it out, you're kind of close to falling into the Disney castle trap that he talks about...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dnflBERf2zMI made some small changes to the model. Hopefully it won't look as stiff as my previous one.
Thank you, Mark! Very informative. I started listining to an audiobook of The Hobbit, as I'm not a fast reader (: Hopefully I will expand my visual library more. I'll start working on expanding my visual library.
Things to think about:
- You roughed up some of the straight lines but none of the ones that effect the silhouette.
One thing that helps when evaluating the silhouette is to apply a 100% black diffuse material and rotate the model around. If you see a lot of straight lines you might need to rough them up also.
- The spikes probably need a way too attach to the building, instead of just clipping into the beams. Figuring out how they attach will help add detail don't leave those kinds of details up to the textures. Think about them now, think about the materials you will apply and how you will unwrap it. Think about how they blend together. Do your orcs chop holes and just stick the spikes in there? Do they use rope or cloth to tie them? Would it help to model some bumpy details to help sell the silhouette of the attachment methods?
Think about that stuff now or it will slow you down and haunt you later.
- The gangway is really thin and straight (might be place holder?)
If not, it needs work. You can use more polys to more accurately describe the thickness and give it some hang as well as show some character.
Remember:
- Where the building supplies came from. Probably salvaged or crudely made planks. Squaring them off and making them look pretty probably loses out to functionality.
- Who will be tromping their big heavy feet up and down it all day, every day.
- What will players focus on, typically that is an entrance, especially if they are coming and going from this building.
This might not be the style you're going for but it highlights the importance of building characteristics into the silhouette of a building.
See how at a distance some of the details hold up and help convey the haphazard construction? You can exaggerate or dial back the haphazardness but you do want to effect the silhouette to some degree.
Don't be timid about throwing some polys into you building so long as they are contributing to the scene, if they aren't they don't need to be there. Over the last 5-7 years poly the hardware hasn't changed much but triangle counts have risen quite a bit.
The next generation of consoles is about to roll out next year. The poly counts have already risen but the players won't see it for another year or so. The counts will continue to climb just like they did for the last generation. When you are doing assignments and building your portfolio you don't want to showcase skills from 1-2 generations ago, but show that you can be a rockstar on the title they are currently working on, which is typically more advanced that what is currently released.
Also don't feel compelled to make these changes if you feel like it goes against the grain of your project, these are just my personal observations and I'm not demanding that you change this stuff. But if it makes sense and is a direction you want to go, have at it.
As I have to turn in the project on this friday (7th) and I don't have much experience in UDK I don't think I have the time to make the changes that you mentioned (I will change the gangway howerever, it looks kind of ridiculous now).
It was very very good suggestions and tips you gave me and I will surely think about/use them in my next project.
I'm kind of scared that I'll use to much polys, so it often end up in the other end. I don't really have a good grasp of what is too much and what is too little.
Once this project is over I'll try to make the scene again, from scratch, but with all the tips and information you all have been giving me. (:
I normally model pretty high poly and don't think too deeply about target triangle counts, it's fairly easy to hit just about any target number through optimization or retopology. I use the modifier stack in max a bit like sub-division layers in zBrush or Mudbox and will go back down the stack to less detailed versions to start the optimization process rolling. The ProOptimize modifier is also really useful as it doesn't butcher the UV's.
I model high enough that I could kick it up a notch or two and bake a normal map from it or take it into a sculpting app and knock in some more details. The model you see was actually nicely and evenly quad'ed and around 2k tris, then I optimized it to get it under 300tris (an imaginary number I pulled out of my ass, by guessing how much I would want to spend on the entrance).
You can also use retopology techniques to make a brand new low poly. It's always easier to go lower but harder to go the other way. As you get used to modeling that way, you start to think about how it would optimize later, which verts would go and which ones should stay, even how the UV's will be laid out and how the smoothing will go.
But to get there you need to go through a few more projects like this and then dissect them after you're done and find ways to improve your workflow. Don't be complacent with how you where shown, there are often more ways to do the same thing but faster or more streamlined.
Anyway, good luck with the tight deadline!