Batman shooting........so stupid
polycounter lvl 11
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-18921492
Apparently some guy went on a shooting spree during the dark knight rises, people are really stupid, why would anyone do that, now violent movies and violent video games are going to start taking the blame yet again, all because some idiot thought he would be cool and kill people, GAH!
Edit:
I just found out a few friends of mine that I went to school with were in the theater watching the movie when it happened, luckily they made it out ok but 2 friends of one of their girlfriends were shot, they're in the hospital now so thank God they didn't die, so sad to hear bout the rest of the people....
Apparently some guy went on a shooting spree during the dark knight rises, people are really stupid, why would anyone do that, now violent movies and violent video games are going to start taking the blame yet again, all because some idiot thought he would be cool and kill people, GAH!
Edit:
I just found out a few friends of mine that I went to school with were in the theater watching the movie when it happened, luckily they made it out ok but 2 friends of one of their girlfriends were shot, they're in the hospital now so thank God they didn't die, so sad to hear bout the rest of the people....
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Replies
here (united kingdom) i get searched if i go into a theatre with a backpack... and they're only looking to see if i'm trying to sneak in snacks lol!
i've just done a bit of reading on a UK news site, and apparently one american advocate of tighter gun control is actually speaking some sense... he's not preaching about what changes he wants to see, but actually speaking about how terribly bad the two potential presidents are at even discussing the issue.
link: http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/blog/2012/jul/20/denver-batman-premiere-shooting-live
i think this is probably the most important line in the entire thing:
"But maybe it's time the two people who want to be president of the United States stand up and tell us what they're going to do about it, because this is obviously a problem across the country. And everybody always says: Isn't it tragic?"
and that's probably the most true statement about gun crime i've ever read.
And no, we don't get searched here, even for candy. People would go into frenzy, if some minimum waged teenager was rustling through their personal stuff. Even still, this guy probably would have shot the person that does the inspections.
Bloomberg also used the cops to dismantle Zuchatti park to put down occupy, instead of actually addressing why they where there. "This is making my city unclean and the people who back my campaigns nervous, it must be cleaned... They are incapable of putting up much of a fight, we have the guns..."
I have such a hard time seeing how carrying a gun would be one's right. We are just starting to have problems with guns in southern Sweden. Escalating over the last 5 years, and if it would have been legal to get your self a gun to defend your self, the death number would be near 100 instead of the 20 or whatever it is now.
Something like this would be so much harder to pull of in a country with more strict gun laws. It just takes with nutjob to kill all these people, it's just that he needs a gun first. That gun is so much easier to find illegally in a country like the States, then in a country like Sweden were you get years in prison to just carry a gun without a permit (a hunting rifle can only be carried in the woods, and a pistol can only be carried on a shooting range).
I say make it even harder to have a gun. I don't want that shit around me when I walk home late at night..
Either way, this is fucking terrifying. It's just sad..
[EDIT] I'm assuming this guy would have killed 14 people with a bat?! Just saying...
I'm so worried for my friends man, im not anywhere near colorado but just knowing i have friends that had to go through this kills me, i really hope this doesnt traumatize them or anything, people are just so screwed up nowadays so they have to make everyone else feel like them, if anything this country needs more room in asylums and more doctors to help people like this, it's not just guns, it's people using the guns
it all boils down to this "guns dont kill people, people with guns do"
this has always been "one of those things" i think about in movie theaters, playhouses, etc. you're in an extremely vulnerable position, and its sick that someone actually acted on that.
ugh. Sorry to hear that it hit close to home dpaynter26, scary stuff, glad they're ok and hope for a speedy recovery of their friend.
Even if he would have only been able to kill one person with a bat, would have that made it less horrible? It's a life taken. What disturbs me about that is that the media would probably not even report that if he had taken 1 or 2 lives with a baseball bat. Blaming everything on guns is just not the proper thing to do here in my opinion but I leave it at that now
Thomas P.
I gotta agree with Olsson just a bit. I understand the cultural and philosophical significance of gun rights in america but one guy doesnt stab or club 50 people. It's not the final word on the debate, but this should stand up as a major piece of evidence in favor of significantly tighter gun control in america -- this is the kind of thing that really is unique to gun proliferation. Controlling weapons truly does have an impact, even thought you can never stop them 100% -- You don't see too many public bombings in america, even though they're technically feasible.
No, but a pipe bomb can.
Really? Does the unibomber ring a bell? How about Timothy Mcveigh? Guns are used, because they are more convenient to get access to. If you make it harder, they will just use something else.
People need to keep the gun control issues completely separate, yet I fear this will become bigger news than the actual shootings.
This looks like an attention grabbing stunt by a disturbed man, and not only does it seem to be working it cost many people their lives.
http://abcnews.go.com/US/mass-shooting-colorado-movie-theater-14-people-dead/story?id=16817842#.UAl7srSe6vY
Following that logic, it's silly to think the majority would use something even less convenient such as explosives.
More convenient, as I can pick it up and go shooting. I would bet, this guy had planned this out way in advance, like most of these events. He would have had plenty of time to get an explosive device; hell, probably at the same place he got that tear gas.
I'm not even saying that explosives would necessarily replace guns. Toxic gases are another easy option, or driving a vehicle straight into a crowd of people.
My overall point is, you guys seem to think that strict gun control would somehow end this, and it would not.
Very very tragic.
If someone wants to create a massacre, they will. Homemade explosives would of worked just as well.
I'm wondering what was wrong with the shooter, mental issues, social disorders, bullied... It's odd he didn't kill himself, or do suicide by cops.
His plan was immediate.
Gun control only hurts those who are allowed to own and carry.
I agree that this will be a case of a depressed useless guy who did something to make himself famous.
Welcome to America, give us your poor, your wretched , your useless masses....
Now how the hell do I get out of this country?
(That last statement is actually serious)
i agree with 3dLee on this matter (as well as some of you who are on the same page). this guy obviously had the intent to kill people for whatever psychological reasoning that may have made him think it was ok to do so, but restricting guns isnt the answer to that. there are plenty of responsible gun owners out there who are willing to do what is necessary to protect themselves and those around them. in the case of this batman shooting, it wouldve been hard to fight back against that because the guy went in there with the intentions that no one would be able to after setting off the tear gas. but in an example where someone goes in with a gun with the intent to scare and rob, not just shoot up the place.. there are people like this who will respond accordingly
[ame="
It would certainly limit this, and it doesn't have too much of a downside.
I'm not naive enough to think that making one form of weaponry more difficult to obtain would completely stop violence, but it would contribute to lessening these attacks. Our columbines and unibombers would still exist, but a certain percentage of mass murderers would find their weapon of choice out of their hands.
For every guy who schemes and builds a bomb or whatever, there would be one who just grabs a knife instead because it's closest, and hurts 1/10th of the people.
I'm really not sure what the practical drawback of tighter gun control in america is. Rednecks wont feel like they can overthrow the government anymore? We're a little bit past that stage. It isn't 1777. Nobody has the resources of the government.
Fuse -- it's not like kooks who start shooting sprees are typically in with gun running rings.
But it helps.
The United Kingdom has had increasingly strict gun control laws over the past decade, and was also is the nation with the highest incidence of notable terrorist attacks last year (yes, more than Iraq or Afghanistan). The number of deaths was quite low.
Our incidences of shootings have been declining steadily since tightening those laws - and so has the number of deaths. Knife crime and bombings remain at similar levels; they haven't swapped one means for another.
Guns are the single most effective tool when it comes to killing people. They're efficient, reusable, easily concealable, they have a long range, and require minimal training to operate. No other weapon makes these things as easy.
Good for the guy who stopped them and all, and I'm glad nobody died, but -- wouldnt you rather lose your wallet than shoot two people? That's not an attack on this dude -- he had no way to know whether they'd try to kill him or the others, and he did the right thing to protect everyone... But I know I would rather get robbed than see anybody hurt.
You guys seem to think there's this black and white line between law-abiding citizens and some kind of super organized black-hearted completely evil criminal underground. It doesn't work like that. We're all people. An arms race between bad guys and bystanders doesn't sound like such a good thing to me.
thats the thing.. you may not know in a situation like that if they will just take your wallet, or if they'll shoot you. the rule ive learned is to never point a gun at anything unless you intend to pull the trigger.. while others may use it just to scare you, people should think that rule applies in all situations.. so if someone pulls a gun on you, you need to figure that they do intend to shoot you, because you wont know until its too late otherwise
Guns kill, yes. But if you look at how many guns are owned in the US, versus how many of them are used to kill others here... more people are killed with cars *like 300k more a year*. But I don't hear any outsiders saying we should ban them. Looking at us census date from 2009 *couldn't find anything more recent on first glance* and guns do account for the most "murders" but knives, blunt weapons, fire, bare hands add up to more than half of the amount of guns.. so people still kill without them. You just don't see the media quick to jump on them like a flashy mass shooting. And guns are less personal. what about all the people killed up close with a knife dying a slow death. I consider that more horrific to know someone might sit in pain bleeding out for 30 minutes than instantly.
Agree with notman, taking away guns isn't going to solve the problem. Because we take them away and we'll hear in the news.. 2 people stabbed and think its a horrific crime. Eventually people will call for a ban on knives and say.. well if we take away knives they only have their fist. Then after that... 1 man beaten by bare fist.. and so on... Look at prisons here.. people are smart and give time and enough determination, they make weapons out of anything. *prisons are a whole different discussion though*
Plus you have to look at all the positive situations where owning a gun has saved many many peoples lives. Yes, there are plenty of people who own guns that shouldn't, and yes educating people on using them can be poor in some states/counties. But just saying we need to ban them is the cheap way of trying to fix a problems issue that's rooted much deeper.
Either way we go with this.. saying to ban guns.. or allow the govt to watch us more closely puts more restrictions on our freedoms. The world isn't perfect and everyone should always have a right to protect their self. I know it sounds silly, but looking at countries that are having civil wars, conflicts against their govt, you take power away from the people and it lets govt know they have a upper hand in times of crisis.
Words can be powerful ways to protect yourself, but when that fails...what else do you have?
Its also wonderful when you have people who come from a country with 300 million less people than the united states trying to say how we should do things here. They don't have to deal with the level of diversity, and social issues complicated by religion, person opinion and tons of other issues that create a boiling pot of frustration.
Seems like we'll always have this argument with people from other countries since its easy to nitpick when you're not in the trenches. Prohibition didn't do jack back in the day. Taking away guns won't either. Taking away Justin Beiber would be nice though.
</endguncontroltalkinamericaonpolycountthreads>
Hope no one here is affected.
thread is about problem X, which is almost always related to the unsolvable Y
BUT please don't talk about Y because of flames
Which then means we'll never have a reasonable approach to solving problem X
but why hoping someone to bring gun and stop the guy
not everyone want to bring gun or even smallest blade everywhere or see someone bring it in public.
Like social healthcare you mean?
That mythical beast.
Yeah, exactly. We just don't get it.
"it's my right to have 3 jobs to pay my son's treatment. I don't want it to be free. Don't touch ma freedom !"
Americans are affraid by everything with social in it.
They should have called it the "freedom healthcare"
Anyway, there's more info about this guy now.
Apparently he dropped out of medschool recently, and had a degree in neuroscience before. Looks like he was on his way to becoming a doc. Kinda boggles the mind.
And there are corporate interests looking to privatize those socialized programs so they can make money off them like they currently do with the private healthcare sector, which because of their greed is bloated, ineffective and dragging the economy down. Sounds like a sweet deal if you aren't the people paying into and using those programs...
Getting back to gun control, I don't think guns are to blame, people are. Fix the people and you don't have to worry about the guns. The problem is we SUCK at fixing broken people and with the social safety net being set on fire (as mentioned above) we are getting worse at fixing broken people. If you love guns being tucked under every pillow and in every glovebox with no one ever having to use them, then the first step is to make sure we can fix broken people.
Fix the people first, then you can flood the streets with guns and there won't be any problems. So while I believe that every level headed person who wants to own a gun (responsibly) should have access to one, you have to have a functioning society and everyone scared shitless hiding in their closest with their finger on the trigger isn't the way to get there. They just get tired of being scared and charge out of their closet guns blazing...
So what elements of the American culture are creating these type of crimes? What kind of people are susceptible of committing those kinds of crimes, etc. I believe that is where more attention and money should be spent.
Going back to the gun control just wanted to say that a stricter gun control policy would help reduce the killings we have in Mexico. There is evidence that a considerable amount of guns that drug cartels acquire come from the US. We live in a very interconnected world now, so no country it's on it's own. The consequences of the gun control issue are being suffered by Mexico as of this moment.
This whole event is a huge tragedy and while we will publicly damn him, plastering his name, photo, life story, hobbies, etc. it is just going to glorify him to any sick individual that may latch onto his views.
What will fix this beyond anything else is the US fixing its drug-war policy and legalize drugs already. I doubt there would be any more killings in Mexico over this shit if it wasn't illegal. Gun control is really the least of your concern. Especially in a place like Mexico, where anyone could get any gun at any time.
You have countries like Russia, Pakistan and China making a fuckton of guns. Now, I was always a good boy, and never got involved in my country's shady business, but I'm telling you right now that no matter what law you put in place in the US, I can get you any kind of gun you want, cheap.
So to me the whole gun control thing is moot. Anyone that thinks you can stop guns from existing, has never left the US/Eurozone. If you grow up in other parts of the world, you'll quickly see that there's no stopping guns any more so than you can stop car deaths by banning cars (not that I'm comparing the two, I'm just saying you can't stop technology).
Even if you made any kind of gun absolutely illegal with a life-sentence in prison, I could still get you any kind of gun you wanted. How will you stop it? Will you go to war with Russia, Pakistan and China? With what? You don't have any guns...
This goes to almost exactly what I am complaining about. I can't speak to the cultures or education of other countries, but here in America, everyone is told that they are a precious little snow flake at a young age. You can be anything you want. And the fact is, sometimes life doesn't work out that way. And for some people all they want in life is a little bit of recognition. Something that harkens back to when they grew up and were told that they could be a doctor. Or an astronaut. Or a famous actor or musician.
And sometimes you just don't make it. You're not going to get into space, or be in a blockbuster movie, but you can still be famous on the five o clock news.
This whole situation makes me sick. I don't know anyone from that area, but my heart goes out to all the families that are lessened because of these events. It's just incredibly stupid senseless violence.
The one thing that surprised me more than anything else is that the cops captured this guy alive.